Against ‘Park the Bus’

[dc_blade]

Like it was under Bassett but with passing.

I'd wear that on a t-shirt.

 

[PokerBlade]

It's great how patient we are in the build up and how confident we are in our approach, and even last night against what, in all fairness, was an outstanding Wednesday defensive performance (granted, done at the cost of any attacking intent) we had the chance that should have (and would have) won the game the majority of the time. The problem is that sometimes patience becomes predictability.

All we had last night was put it out wide, look down the line, get closed down, go back up the line, try again.

And, and this is the big problem, the few times we did try to force a cross, we made it abundantly clear why we focus on creating perfect crossing opportunities - a lot of our crossing isn't very good.

It's absolutely fine that the approach we took last night is "plan A". What we need to do is be able to mix it up just enough that we aren't so predictable vs. tight defences. Add a few shots from range, add a few early crosses.

I honestly can't see how we do that without improving the personnel. And the type of player that would improve us is probably out of our price range. So I don't know what more we can really do.

Fact is, Wednesday's defence held out last night but most games they won't. There are clear weaknesses in our team but without either money or Wilder pulling off another couple of miracle signings, we're stuck with them. I don't think there's any more we can get out of this group of players.

In case that last part sounds a bit negative, I'll just say that we're still miles ahead of where I expected us to be and we're playing the kind of football I always prayed a United side would. Results like last night, even ignoring that it was a derby, are incredibly frustrating but shouldn't get in the way of saying what a superb footballing team we are.

 

[GRUMPY BLADE]

Unless we get a non league side at home in the cup, no side will play like that against us this season. Our issue isn't breaking down teams as such , it's about taking the chances we do create and having a better final ball.

Last night was farcical in how deep Wednesday were and it was only the importance of the occasion that saw them through. In more "normal" games the opposition will eventually cave.

A better Prem team [Arsenal/Man U/Watford/Everton] at The Lane would make a great 3rd round FA Cup tie.

 

[Eric Cartman]

It's great how patient we are in the build up and how confident we are in our approach, and even last night against what, in all fairness, was an outstanding Wednesday defensive performance (granted, done at the cost of any attacking intent) we had the chance that should have (and would have) won the game the majority of the time. The problem is that sometimes patience becomes predictability.

All we had last night was put it out wide, look down the line, get closed down, go back up the line, try again.

And, and this is the big problem, the few times we did try to force a cross, we made it abundantly clear why we focus on creating perfect crossing opportunities - a lot of our crossing isn't very good.

It's absolutely fine that the approach we took last night is "plan A". What we need to do is be able to mix it up just enough that we aren't so predictable vs. tight defences. Add a few shots from range, add a few early crosses.

I honestly can't see how we do that without improving the personnel. And the type of player that would improve us is probably out of our price range. So I don't know what more we can really do.

Fact is, Wednesday's defence held out last night but most games they won't. There are clear weaknesses in our team but without either money or Wilder pulling off another couple of miracle signings, we're stuck with them. I don't think there's any more we can get out of this group of players.

In case that last part sounds a bit negative, I'll just say that we're still miles ahead of where I expected us to be and we're playing the kind of football I always prayed a United side would. Results like last night, even ignoring that it was a derby, are incredibly frustrating but shouldn't get in the way of saying what a superb footballing team we are.

Couldn’t agree more. But there were times we could’ve really tested them.

After that defence splitting pass from Norwood to Basham he should’ve took a touch and crossed it but instead ended up passing backwards

 

[Beans]

It's annoying, and we definitely could have done better, but we've been near-flawless against crap teams so far this season so I'm willing to put this down as "one of those days" rather than a trend.

Looking at the bottom 10 of the table we've played the teams in 16th, 17th, 18th, 21st, 22nd and 23rd and picked up 16 points from a possible 18, scoring 14 goals in the process. We've been great at brushing these teams aside so far this season (way moreso than last year, so far at least), just frustrating that it didn't happen on Friday.

 

[coaxingstar71]

I can see both sides of the argument, I'm all for keeping hold of the ball (if the opposition don't have it, they can't play), but I do feel we need to mix it up a bit, especially against the tactics employed by our neighbours. Wilder even alluded to it in his post match interview that at times we could have got the ball in the box quicker. There were a number of times where we were playing one or two passes too many.

 

[Torrix1889]

What things can we do right now to improve instantly against sides like yesterday that put 10, 11 at times behind the ball and have no interest in coming out? It’s still another 2 months till the transfer window opens so we’re certain to face another few of them yet.

For me yesterday we didn’t quicken the play up nearly enough. When we had a few breaks after their ‘attacks’ that was the time we could’ve made them pay but we didn’t capitalise or made the wrong decision. By the time we’d got into a dangerous area it was too late because they’d got everyone back.

Another for Freeman and Stevens - stop, fucking, cutting, inside. Cutting inside, pasing to Fleck, Fleck runs forward passes to JOC, back to Stevens, Duffy gets involved, it goes back to Stevens - by the time they’ve done all this Wednesday have got everyone and their dog back in the box so the perfect cross is nigh on impossible. A first time cross is by far the best option in this scenario, not our usual 10 pass interplay and overlapping on the side of the box. I know this is designed to pull the defence about a bit but against that tactic it won’t work as there’s too many men back.

Anything else that we could improve on right now against sides like that? We can’t keep dropping points against them.

We haven't got the pace to hurt teams on the break, simple as that. Washington would have been a better substitution than Clarke from that viewpoint.

 

[Eric Cartman]

We haven't got the pace to hurt teams on the break, simple as that. Washington would have been a better substitution than Clarke from that viewpoint.

You don’t need pace necessarily. Not like Wednesday are fast is it? The ball moves a lot quicker than the fastest bloke on earth.

 

[Hamburg Blade]

You don’t need pace necessarily. Not like Wednesday are fast is it? The ball moves a lot quicker than the fastest bloke on earth.

It didn't move faster than Adrian Littlejohn. He was so fast, he often left the ball behind.

 

[Nicolaus_Copernicus]

It didn't move faster than Adrian Littlejohn. He was so fast, he often left the ball behind.

Don't diss 'the john'. As a 22 yr old, he scored 8 goals in 27 premier league games in 92/93, if he did that today, he'd more than likely win an England call up.

 

[Torrix1889]

You don’t need pace necessarily. Not like Wednesday are fast is it? The ball moves a lot quicker than the fastest bloke on earth.

But if the bloke cannot run fast enough to get to where the ball is played.......

 

[Dnblade]

I thought we tried to move the ball quickly, which was the right thing to do, but they had 3 or 4 in wide positions trying to stop us working the space to cross, plus another 4 or 5 in the box... On the odd time we did get behind them we took the wrong option or overshit crosses, or they got a block in.
We played some great stuff though, but they made it hard to breakdown.
Another thing is we don't often capitalise on breakaways and lack pace up top, plus don"t shoot enough or have enough threat from distance.
If McG scores the Pen though, I think we could have won 3 or 4.

 

[Bellypork]

There's a fair chance that other teams, having seen what Wednesday did, will come to the Lane and do likewise.

Which is why I floated the question earlier about United employing similar tactics away from home too.

That is, the club may drop points at the Lane in future, yet glean more on the road.

Wilder is limited in what he can do really, because the forwards which would have unlocked Wednesday's defence on Friday cost a fortune.

This is why Tufty is always banging on about Wednesday's expenditure on lock-pickers like Forestieri and Hooper.

Those comments aren't aimed at Wednesday, as Owls fans think, but rather at his own board.

United really need to score first in scenarios like Friday's.

McGoldrick needed to score that penalty, big time.

 

[PeterNdlovu081]

Quality teams don't struggle when the opposition park the bus.

Quality teams dispatch them with ease.

Friday night yet again proved that if you let us have the ball we can't do anything with it.

 

[Beans]

Quality teams don't struggle when the opposition park the bus.

Quality teams dispatch them with ease.

Friday night yet again proved that if you let us have the ball we can't do anything with it.

Go on, I'm curious. What other games have we been allowed to have the ball and not done anything with it?

 

[PeterNdlovu081]

Go on, I'm curious. What other games have we been allowed to have the ball and not done anything with it?

Too many to mention from last season and it's creeping in again this season.

 

[GRUMPY BLADE]

Quality teams don't struggle when the opposition park the bus.

Quality teams dispatch them with ease.

Friday night yet again proved that if you let us have the ball we can't do anything with it.

4th in the Championship doing fuck all with the ball, must be some other shit in the leaguge as well as the pigs.

 

[Beans]

Too many to mention from last season and it's creeping in again this season.

So none so far this season? Well, one if we include a game where we had a penalty and 18 other shots.

 

[PeterNdlovu081]

So none so far this season? Well, one if we include a game where we had a penalty and 18 other shots.

How many chances did we create? One?

 

[Agreasychipbutty]

In short, nothing. If there was some method to eliminate really strong defence then every game of football would end in a rugby score. Even top Premier League sides struggle at times against sides that park the bus. What we need is to accept that we can't make perfect chances against teams like that. I'm not saying just lump in any old ball but we need to test the keeper a bit more with a few long shots and put in a few more crosses, get them nervous and hopefully get a first goal. After we have 1 then more will come as they're forced to come out. But I think in general we are going to have to accept a few draws as teams who can't afford to lose play a back 11. Teams respecting how powerful we can be itsn't the worst problem to have..

UTB

 

[tomtheblade]

Breaking the deadlock is difficult, and slick passing football doesn't always get you there.

Look at the world cup final. France had an embarrassment of attacking options at their disposal but still required an own goal from a dodgy free kick and a questionable penalty to edge in front not just once but twice.

I want us to keep on playing the great football we have shown but we need to realise that we need to break the deadlock first before we can rely on flowing football to open up the opposition who now need to attack.

Look at some of our games this season for example:

Win vs Norwich, opening goal Egan header from a corner
Win vs Villa, opening goal JOC header from free kick
Win vs Hull opening goal McG pen
Draw vs Stoke, opening goal Clarke rebound from fk
Win vs Wigan, opening goal own goal by Wigan defender

Not downplaying the quality of any of these goals. Free kicks still need a good delivery, and the movement and reaction from the scorer still has to be spot on. The fact remains though that they didn't directly come from slick passing play.

There are examples of that as well, but basically all this illustrates that we do sometimes rely on more direct or scrappy means to make the breakthrough, so we shouldn't be afraid of also playing in a way that maximises our chances of doing that.