Big Sam's 'Tevez' perspective

[wizadry]

We were a newly promoted side and our wage bill was less than the vast majority of our competitors, and yet we got 38 points - the same as the team that finished one place above us. We went down on goal difference.

We competed in some very entertaining matches that season and won matches that we were probably expected to lose as well as losing some matches that we might have expected to win.

We had a bad run after opening up a substantial cushion. But if you look at the fixtures we had during that bad run it was obvious we would need that cushion. We would not really have been expected to get many points from those matches.

I think 'inept' when describing Warnock's tactics is an exaggeration. We were probably a little too negative away from home, but then had we been more adventurous we may have received far more heavier defeats. That is something we can discuss but will never ever know for sure.

A manager who puts together a side that gets 38 points in the premier league on a lower wage bill than nearly all it's competitors and then only gets relegated on goal difference is not 'inept'.

In my opinion we were probably undone as much by individual errors in the matches at home to Everton and Portsmouth as by any allegedly poor tactical judgements by our manager.

Good post oldblade ,but i'll repeat it again,its just my opinion.

He could have been inept pure and simply because he hasn't had enough experience at the top level,a bit amateurish at the top,both these things fall under the word i use.

 

[Patrick Suffaux]

Warnock got us relegated ? What a load of shit !

Depends whether or not you acknowledge his surrender tactics away from home.

 

[oldblade]

Depends whether or not you acknowledge his surrender tactics away from home.

Probably a bit too negative in some away matches, but in others the tactics may have saved us from a few heavy defeats. He was probably calculating (rightly) that goal difference could be important.

 

[judge]

Depends whether or not you acknowledge his surrender tactics away from home.

Do they exist or did you just make them up ? I went to quite a few away games that season can you name me a game warnock surrendered ? I know he played a weakened side at old trafford , perhaps that isnwhat you mean or plYing one up front against villa .do you think if we had played two up front that a very good villa side celebrate ing their European cup anniversary with a full house and a far superior team than us would have buckled under the pressure ? Maybe you mean at bolton where we hit the bar and davies scored late on perhaps we should have gone all out attack for the full 90 or at man city where we held out for a 0-0 draw maybe a more adventurous manager would have gone their all guns blazing against a team full of internationals

 

[Greenwich Blade]

Do they exist or did you just make them up ? I went to quite a few away games that season can you name me a game warnock surrendered ? I know he played a weakened side at old trafford , perhaps that isnwhat you mean or plYing one up front against villa .do you think if we had played two up front that a very good villa side celebrate ing their European cup anniversary with a full house and a far superior team than us would have buckled under the pressure ? Maybe you mean at bolton where we hit the bar and davies scored late on perhaps we should have gone all out attack for the full 90 or at man city where we held out for a 0-0 draw maybe a more adventurous manager would have gone their all guns blazing against a team full of internationals

Ssshh, don't say that about a weakened side at Old Trafford - Fat Samuel might be reading!

 

[Patrick Suffaux]

We held out for a 0-0 draw at City?! Were you there? I was and City were there for the taking in the second half.

 

[judge]

We held out for a 0-0 draw a City?! Were you there? I was and City were there for the taking in the second half.

I saw the game on al jazaera thought both sides cancelled each other out

 

[Elsecar_Blade]

I'd suggest that the phrase "tactically inept" in the Premier League did sort of apply to Warnock. More often than not at home, we did well particularly against the big 5 that season. We beat two of the top five (Arse, Spurs), drew with Liverpool and were unlucky to not win, scared the hell out of Man. United and only really got beat easily against Chelsea. However, I think these results came from United just having a go at these teams and being roared on by the BL crowd. Many commented that season on the atmosphere inside the Lane and one of these games - Arsenal - is my personal favourite in terms of support from the Blades fans. I get hairs standing on the back of my neck thinking about the roaring against Arsenal when Jags was in goal. Amazing. Was that a brilliant tactician though? Not for me.

The home form was 15th - well clear of the bottom 3. However, considering the results vs. the top 5, it was results against mid-table opposition that cost us. Defeats to Newcastle, Manchester City and Reading and disappointing draws - in the end - with Bolton, Blackburn and even Everton cost us. A tactician would have got results against these teams or would have taken more points away from home against those around us (West Ham, Fulham, 'Boro and Villa spring to mind).

That was our problem, IMO. Not enough points at home against the mid table sides and too many defeats away to the sides in and around us. These were the close games were a tactician would have made his money and Warnock JUST fell short. The stand out games for me were Newcastle (h) and Villa (a) - whilst the Wigan game will always be the stand-out, these were games we should have done better in and it cost us. When we levelled vs. Newcastle, we should have took at least a point and the Villa performance was limp for a side supposedly fighting for their lives.

Warnock in 06/07 - not bad but not quite good enough.

Mind you, we did have some terrible luck too!

 

[axel smeets]

Anyway, back to the point, am I alone in not being hugely concerned about tomorrow's game and much more interested in Saturday next?

Absolutely not. Waste of time. United should have refused an allocation rather than put a penny in those publically funded dildo sellers pockets. PNE away is 25x more important than a game against a team whose fans make gas noises and mock the holocaust.

 

[Pinchy]

Absolutely not. Waste of time. United should have refused an allocation rather than put a penny in those publically funded dildo sellers pockets. PNE away is 25x more important than a game against a team whose fans make gas noises and mock the holocaust.

I didn't know about the latter but I do know them to have a deeply unpleasant element.

 

[oldblade]

The home form was 15th - well clear of the bottom 3. However, considering the results vs. the top 5, it was results against mid-table opposition that cost us. Defeats to Newcastle, Manchester City and Reading and disappointing draws - in the end - with Bolton, Blackburn and even Everton cost us. A tactician would have got results against these teams or would have taken more points away from home against those around us (West Ham, Fulham, 'Boro and Villa spring to mind).

When we played Bolton at home they were flying pretty high. They seemed to be a team of giants and were muscling us out of the game. At 2-0 down Warnock made changes and there followed several minutes of mayhem as we scored twice and then held on for an unlikely point.

Against Newcastle I grant you we didn't play very well, but looked set for a point until uncharacteristically Lucketti (who had been pretty sound until then) made an error and just didn't seem to jump with his man when the ball came across from a corner.

There was nothing at all wrong with the tactics at home to Everton. We were 1-0 up and the better side until Kenny inexplicably dropped the ball at Johnson's feet and then made things worse by diving at his feet and fouling him. That was two points thrown away by an individual error. Nothing whatsoever to do with tactics.

We failed to beat Blackburn because we failed to convert two penalties, not because of our tactics.

 

[axel smeets]

I didn't know about the latter but I do know them to have a deeply unpleasant element.

Last season at White Hart Lane, Pinchy. Singing 'He's coming for you, he's coming for you, Adolf Hitler, he's coming for you.' Followed by copious amounts of hissing/gas noises.

 

[Cyprus Blade]

Whilst I agree that the Preston game is far more important I really do hope we turn the irons over. My reasons are purely personal - I was working in the West Ham area when the Tevez thing and our relegation went down. Practically everyone was a west ham supporter. Needless to say I got it in the ear for absolutely frigging months - not one west ham supporter ( even the more decent sensible ones) would accept that they had cheated and that were it not for Brooking's influence they probably would have lost points and been relegated.

I was in Sheffield for the Wigan game and then away on holiday. I got back to work and the b******ds had got into my computer and as soon as I switched on I was greeted by this - .

They thought it was really clever. I went mental at them.

Even now none of them accept that they did wrong and got off lightly and they still call us for being chiselers for them having to pay us the compensation. I really do hate West Ham.

 

[mattbianco1]

Warnock got us relegated ? What a load of shit !

Signing Luton Shelton, Ahmed Fathi and Matt Kilgallon (and not playing him) - yes Warnock did get us relegated. That along with Rob styles (for that penalty), Andy Johnson (for his ease of going down), Paddy Kenny (for thinking he can outrun Obafemi Martins), Hulse & Unsworth (for missing penalties against Blackburn), Paddy Kenny again (for thinking that Morten Gamst Pederson wasn't going to curl it into the top corner in stoppage time when every fan at the away end could see where he was going to put it), Jagielka (for hand balling it), whoever the ref was at Upton Park for cancelling the goal and potentially Danny Webber (for missing vs. Wigan).

If any of those hadn't happened, we would've stayed up. Fuck West Ham - we only have ourselves to blame!

 

[Esablade]

IMO.

We had two 'end of season games' at home against Man City and Everton. Neither of whom were particularly 'up for it'

We lost 2-1 to City and drew with Everton( I think)..think Paddy might have chucked one in in one of them games also...I said to me mates we were down after that...

 

[LSF]

Anyway LSF ,what happened to Doyle as your avator?

Came across an old photo I'd not seen for years so I thought I'd retire Michael for a while. Darth and Sheffielder will be pleased

 

[Hollinsend]

Came across an old photo I'd not seen for years so I thought I'd retire Michael for a while. Darth and Sheffielder will be pleased

Retire for a while. Great idea. I'll ask my employer if I can do that tomorrow.

 

[wizadry]

Came across an old photo I'd not seen for years so I thought I'd retire Michael for a while. Darth and Sheffielder will be pleased

Iv'e got to admit i'm not a fan of Doyle on the pitch myself,but Darthblade takes it to another level.You can just tell when he's about to arrive on the forum,it's like magic,although i do agree with him as to regards Doyle,i just don't show it as much,plus he always says it kindly

 

[LSF]

Iv'e got to admit i'm not a fan of Doyle on the pitch myself,but Darthblade takes it to another level.You can just tell when he's about to arrive on the forum,it's like magic,although i do agree with him as to regards Doyle,i just don't show it as much,plus he always says it kindly

Bit like Marmite is Doyle and whilst i recognise his limitations, he does his job capably and industriously.
At this moment we are better with him than without.

 

[wizadry]

Bit like Marmite is Doyle and whilst i recognise his limitations, he does his job capably and industriously.
At this moment we are better with him than without.

As much as i'd like to disagree, i can't at the minute because results would tell me otherwise,although i do think Clough will bring Wallace in for him when fit as he is a Cloughy signing.

 

[judge]

Signing Luton Shelton, Ahmed Fathi and Matt Kilgallon (and not playing him) - yes Warnock did get us relegated. That along with Rob styles (for that penalty), Andy Johnson (for his ease of going down), Paddy Kenny (for thinking he can outrun Obafemi Martins), Hulse & Unsworth (for missing penalties against Blackburn), Paddy Kenny again (for thinking that Morten Gamst Pederson wasn't going to curl it into the top corner in stoppage time when every fan at the away end could see where he was going to put it), Jagielka (for hand balling it), whoever the ref was at Upton Park for cancelling the goal and potentially Danny Webber (for missing vs. Wigan).

If any of those hadn't happened, we would've stayed up. Fuck West Ham - we only have ourselves to blame!

No warnock didnt get us relegated and yoive stated a dozen reasons in your post

 

[GRUMPY BLADE]

Of the 19 seasons where there have been 20 teams in the PL a point tally of 38 and GD of -23 would have been enough to stay up in 14 seasons.* Since we went down only one team out of 21 has gone down with 38 points or more (Birmingham with 39 in 2011).

So in other words, what NW got would have been enough to stay up in around 75% of seasons. As I say, I think most of us would have taken that in Aug 06.

* In 1996 Man City went down with 38 points and a GD of -25

But then they got an arab in and look where they are now.

Patience.

 

[Patrick Suffaux]

I saw the game on al jazaera thought both sides cancelled each other out

Different perspectives I suppose. Looked like an opportunity missed to me at the time but then again you're caught up in the atmosphere when you're there.

 

[mattbianco1]

No warnock didnt get us relegated and yoive stated a dozen reasons in your post

So you don't think his January transfer window signings had anything to do with it?

 

[bartman]

So you don't think his January transfer window signings had anything to do with it?

and not having a recall clause for Geoff Horsfield( a proven top league striker)

 

[judge]

So you don't think his January transfer window signings had anything to do with it?

He wanted to bring in players like mcarthy ,warnock and andy reid but they were on 5 times what we would pay ,whats the guy supposed to do ?

 

[judge]

and not having a recall clause for Geoff Horsfield( a proven top league striker)

Eh ?

 

[SouthEssexBlade]

We got ourselves relegated and the FA and PL made sure that West Ham didn't instead.

 

[Northyorksblade]

When do you think we'll get the "West Ham Fan In Peace" posting? I've got me guitar ready for a Blades Vs Hammers remix of Come By Ya.

Never were a boy scout Greenwich were you

 

[oldblade]

We got ourselves relegated and the FA and PL made sure that West Ham didn't instead.

So in the 1988 Olympic 100 metres final did Karl Lewis only have himself to blame for finishing second, or might the fact that Ben Johnson cheated have affected where Lewis finished?