Doyle...

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metalblade said:
Quite unbelievable this thread, maybe some of the criticism is over the top but I am really astounded that some fans are defending Doyle. A bit bad when the best Doyle's apologists can come up with is Morgan, Santos, Brown, Hodges or any other competitive players past actions, most of which were done in the heat of the moment. Did Santos or Suffo ever play for United after their assaults on other players ? Doyle has always had a nasty streak to his game much like the dirty bastard JJ at Sheffield 6.
I want to see the team play hard but fair.
Doyle is not a hard man just a niggling sneaky shithouse who is ok dishing it out but can't take it back, not as crafty as he thinks he is just as thick as pig shit. How he is still at the club I will never know he must have compromising photo's of our Kev or summat. As for being a captain I suspect he'd struggle to captain a plastic boat in the bath.
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Could not agree more...
 

I am somewhere in the middle on this.

He was a moron yesterday but it is not the first time he has done this (he has been sent off before for nasty reaction/retaliation). He actually was the offender in the one he got cut and his reaction was childish and ridiculous. He cost us any real chance of winning..

Oddly, I think Doyle has been playing well recently and to be honest there have been fair worse players this season despite some people's one sided view. I think likes of Collins, Doyle, Porter, McMahon etc have performed worse.

I believe Clough is a big one for discipline and like his Dad will not tolerate that long term. I think deep down Doyle still may have cost his future at the club long term.

Sadly as much as he sometimes is scapegoated unfairly; I don't buy all this every manager picks him rubbish (look what keeps happening to these managers that make such sound selections!). In reality he is quite an average player but is still a first choice out of the squad we have. That says it all really.

In an ideal world Clough would bring in a real leader and a player who has some substance to his tough guy image. An experienced midfielder who can lead by example and we can dump Doyle immediately. Sadly that is not going to happen. Unless he can do that to the 5 or 6 others that are performing worse than Doyle then unsure why he would be the one who is suddenly jettisoned from the club.

The best cased scenario for me is McGinn and Coady play out of their skin and we move up the league and Doyle does not get back in and is moved on in the summer as we improve but that wont happen. As much as I don't rate him and he has been one part of many pieces in the huge decline in this club that sums up the losing mentality; we probably need him before the end of the season.

The alternative I could live with and we may have to live with; is he comes back after suspension and that he helps up stay up and then Clough moves him on (with some of aforementioned others) and gets better players and genuine leaders as we try and finish nearer the top than bottom next season.
 
Deadbat said:
I am somewhere in the middle on this.

He was a moron yesterday but it is not the first time he has done this (he has been sent off before for nasty reaction/retaliation). He actually was the offender in the one he got cut and his reaction was childish and ridiculous. He cost us any real chance of winning..

Oddly, I think Doyle has been playing well recently and to be honest there have been fair worse players this season despite some people's one sided view. I think likes of Collins, Doyle, Porter, McMahon etc have performed worse.

I believe Clough is a big one for discipline and like his Dad will not tolerate that long term. I think deep down Doyle still may have cost his future at the club long term.

Sadly as much as he sometimes is scapegoated unfairly; I don't buy all this every manager picks him rubbish (look what keeps happening to these managers that make such sound selections!). In reality he is quite an average player but is still a first choice out of the squad we have. That says it all really.

In an ideal world Clough would bring in a real leader and a player who has some substance to his tough guy image. An experienced midfielder who can lead by example and we can dump Doyle immediately. Sadly that is not going to happen. Unless he can do that to the 5 or 6 others that are performing worse than Doyle then unsure why he would be the one who is suddenly jettisoned from the club.

The best cased scenario for me is McGinn and Coady play out of their skin and we move up the league and Doyle does not get back in and is moved on in the summer as we improve but that wont happen. As much as I don't rate him and he has been one part of many pieces in the huge decline in this club that sums up the losing mentality; we probably need him before the end of the season.

The alternative I could live with and we may have to live with; is he comes back after suspension and that he helps up stay up and then Clough moves him on (with some of aforementioned others) and gets better players and genuine leaders as we try and finish nearer the top than bottom next season.
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This is what makes it so frustrating. I did think he was having a poor game yesterday, however I had him as MOM against Stevenage and I thought he had turned the corner. I have relatively kept my mouth shut about Doyle since, however yesterday he let his team down, and now on Wednesday Clough is going to be without him, on top of injuries to Maguire and Porter. I am one of a few who hasn't got cup fever and what happened yesterday with injuries, suspensions and 9 other players running themselves into the ground may cost us on Wednesday.
 
Deadbat said:
Oddly, I think Doyle has been playing well recently and to be honest there have been fair worse players this season despite some people's one sided view.
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I agree, he has indeed improved recently and he was outstanding at Villa Park, was a man possessed and had a cracker of a game.

Yesterday he struggled early doors and regardless of the situation it was stupid of an experienced player and captain to react in that way. Sometimes, you do need players who are a little bit snidey and wind their man up/put them off their game, football is littered with them, but the successful ones do it in the "right" way. If he was going to give him some and had decided it was acceptable, it was far, far too obvious and the wrong way to go about it.
 
Deadbat said:
I am somewhere in the middle on this.

He was a moron yesterday but it is not the first time he has done this (he has been sent off before for nasty reaction/retaliation). He actually was the offender in the one he got cut and his reaction was childish and ridiculous. He cost us any real chance of winning..

Oddly, I think Doyle has been playing well recently and to be honest there have been fair worse players this season despite some people's one sided view. I think likes of Collins, Doyle, Porter, McMahon etc have performed worse.

I believe Clough is a big one for discipline and like his Dad will not tolerate that long term. I think deep down Doyle still may have cost his future at the club long term.

Sadly as much as he sometimes is scapegoated unfairly; I don't buy all this every manager picks him rubbish (look what keeps happening to these managers that make such sound selections!). In reality he is quite an average player but is still a first choice out of the squad we have. That says it all really.

In an ideal world Clough would bring in a real leader and a player who has some substance to his tough guy image. An experienced midfielder who can lead by example and we can dump Doyle immediately. Sadly that is not going to happen. Unless he can do that to the 5 or 6 others that are performing worse than Doyle then unsure why he would be the one who is suddenly jettisoned from the club.

The best cased scenario for me is McGinn and Coady play out of their skin and we move up the league and Doyle does not get back in and is moved on in the summer as we improve but that wont happen. As much as I don't rate him and he has been one part of many pieces in the huge decline in this club that sums up the losing mentality; we probably need him before the end of the season.

The alternative I could live with and we may have to live with; is he comes back after suspension and that he helps up stay up and then Clough moves him on (with some of aforementioned others) and gets better players and genuine leaders as we try and finish nearer the top than bottom next season.
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Bang on apart from the "Every Manager picks him". He may be the tallest dwarf but Danny Wilson and Nigel Clough are all footballing people (I missed out Weir, Morgan and Adams because I don't think their opinion carrys as much weight) but you cannot say that it doesn't matter. Their opinion in fact is the only one that matters. Yes Wilson met his demise but only his biggest detractor (and yes they are out there) can say with any conviction he was anything other than unlucky. By the way, almost all Managers get sacked at some point so does that make them all failures?
 
Just a quick reminder chaps, please keep your differences in opinion respectful ;)
 
sheffielder said:
Doyle and people defending him are in a no win position here from now on. If we win the next 3 games and look better for it, it will show that he should have been dropped along time ago. If we get worse, then because of his fucking stupidity losing those games will put us in the shit.

From what I have seen of Clough, he's already given him a pass. I would love to know what Doyle has on the club.
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Heres another classic. We are fans of the same football team (apparently). If Doyle is out and we win all the games, we all win don't we? Or have I missed something here as well?
 
Deadbat said:
I am somewhere in the middle on this.

He was a moron yesterday but it is not the first time he has done this (he has been sent off before for nasty reaction/retaliation). He actually was the offender in the one he got cut and his reaction was childish and ridiculous. He cost us any real chance of winning..

Oddly, I think Doyle has been playing well recently and to be honest there have been fair worse players this season despite some people's one sided view. I think likes of Collins, Doyle, Porter, McMahon etc have performed worse.

I believe Clough is a big one for discipline and like his Dad will not tolerate that long term. I think deep down Doyle still may have cost his future at the club long term.

Sadly as much as he sometimes is scapegoated unfairly; I don't buy all this every manager picks him rubbish (look what keeps happening to these managers that make such sound selections!). In reality he is quite an average player but is still a first choice out of the squad we have. That says it all really.

In an ideal world Clough would bring in a real leader and a player who has some substance to his tough guy image. An experienced midfielder who can lead by example and we can dump Doyle immediately. Sadly that is not going to happen. Unless he can do that to the 5 or 6 others that are performing worse than Doyle then unsure why he would be the one who is suddenly jettisoned from the club.

The best cased scenario for me is McGinn and Coady play out of their skin and we move up the league and Doyle does not get back in and is moved on in the summer as we improve but that wont happen. As much as I don't rate him and he has been one part of many pieces in the huge decline in this club that sums up the losing mentality; we probably need him before the end of the season.

The alternative I could live with and we may have to live with; is he comes back after suspension and that he helps up stay up and then Clough moves him on (with some of aforementioned others) and gets better players and genuine leaders as we try and finish nearer the top than bottom next season.
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I wouldn't discount Scougall either ,between the 3 of them they have a huge carrot in the next 3 games ,hopefully they will grasp it.Doyle has a big part to play still this season ,he has hardly missed a minute for 3 years now ,maybe the rest will do him god.
 
sheffielder said:
This is what makes it so frustrating. I did think he was having a poor game yesterday, however I had him as MOM against Stevenage and I thought he had turned the corner. I have relatively kept my mouth shut about Doyle since, however yesterday he let his team down, and now on Wednesday Clough is going to be without him, on top of injuries to Maguire and Porter. I am one of a few who hasn't got cup fever and what happened yesterday with injuries, suspensions and 9 other players running themselves into the ground may cost us on Wednesday.
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Now that I 100% agree with.
 
Bladesway said:
Heres another classic. We are fans of the same football team (apparently). If Doyle is out and we win all the games, we all win don't we? Or have I missed something here as well?
Click to expand...

And if we lose you will come back and say that we missed him? Yet, it was because of his stupidity that he missed these games. It is a allowed for us not to like the same players apparently, however it's really grinding my gears that people are defending him today. Wait till he does something to deserve it.
 
sitwell said:
Why don't we just get rid of everyone ? sack sack sack that's the answer eh ?
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Shows what progress we've made recently.

Apart from Maguire and Long most wanted 'em all sacked.

Now we got a manager to keep and players we want
Add to Maguire and Long
Scougal
Baxter
Murphy
Flynn

And one we'd like to sign
Brayford
 
sheffielder said:
And if we lose you will come back and say that we missed him? Yet, it was because of his stupidity that he missed these games. It is a allowed for us not to like the same players apparently, however it's really grinding my gears that people are defending him today. Wait till he does something to deserve it.
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It is far easier teaching fish to talk than explaining the basic fact that no one is defending his actions because they were stupid and selfish, ultimately he will probably be the biggest loser out of all of this. But it isn't crime of the century.

Now I give up but please tell me you get the basic premise that not a single soul here as I can see it defends his actions, but equally some of us are staggered by the overreaction.
 

Bladesway said:
It is far easier teaching fish to talk than explaining the basic fact that no one is defending his actions because they were stupid and selfish, ultimately he will probably be the biggest loser out of all of this. But it isn't crime of the century.

Now I give up but please tell me you get the basic premise that not a single soul here as I can see it defends his actions, but equally some of us are staggered by the overreaction.
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For most who can't stand Doyle and everything he doesn't bring to the club, you will find this is the chance they were looking for to be vindicated. The same over reaction to when Doyle scored the winner against Port Vale.
 
Those 'most' have never played football at a decent level. Clough ,Weir ,Adams, Morgan ,Wilson all have at a very high level ,so glad for your vindication.
 
sitwell said:
Those 'most' have never played football at a decent level. Clough ,Weir ,Adams, Morgan ,Wilson all have at a very high level ,so glad for your vindication.
Click to expand...

I never said myself Sitters, do keep up, however your point does make me wonder what all them bar Adams see in Hill then? Or how about how Clough is sticking by Long, your latest pin dummy. Always glad of your input.
 
Houso said:
So many positives today, and one of them is definitely that we'll see a new central pairing for the next three games.
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Looking forward to that, starting tomorrow.
boo radley said:
MICHAEL DOYLE.
YOU LET LEAGUE 1 DOWN.
YOU LET THE CLUB DOWN
YOU LET YOUR MANAGER DOWN
YOU LET YOUR TEAM MATES DOWN
AND MOST OF ALL (ALTHOUGH YOU MAY NOT SEE US LIKE THIS) YOU LET US THE MOST IMPORTANT PEOPLE ASSOCIATED WITH THE CLUB DOWN - US THE SUPPORTERS AND FANS.
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Owt to say Mr Doyle?
 
sitwell said:
Those 'most' have never played football at a decent level. Clough ,Weir ,Adams, Morgan ,Wilson all have at a very high level ,so glad for your vindication.
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Uh oh, not played football, can't have an opinion klaxon.
 
The next 3 games without him will be interesting. I would make Hill captain, I think he could lead by example better then Doyle ever has.
 
bartman said:
Agree that Doyle deserved to go yesterday and treated the same as Brandy. However, if a 'favourite' player had done this (e.g. Morgan, Maguire, Santos-remember the Johnson tackle) rather than a scapegoat (for want of a better word) would have there been a similar reaction ?
,
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no obviously not.. if you do a better job for the team the fans will cut you some slack in times like this. however Doyle has no credits in the bank because he underperforms week in week out and people like me can't wait to point this out because we see the opportunity to be rid
 
super_pig said:
he underperforms week in week out
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No he doesn't and has certainly performed consistently better than other players who have been in our squad this season..

But he does seem to be the player that some fans like to blame for all the team's ills(when they can't blame Collins,Hill,Flynn,Murphy etc)
 
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