CW to West Brom

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Flatulent_Bob said:
Everton fans would be fuming if they appointed Wilder.
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This is what is funny. They have spent 100s and 100s of millions (a billion?) to be a rich mans Burnley, packed full of solid athletic six foot players playing bog standard 4-4-2 hoping for an attacking set piece that 250k a week Gylfi Siggurdson can knock onto the head of DCL or Michael Keane. They have a bombscare goalie and a rust bucket stadium, the right back is Seamus Coleman or Holgate playing out of position. A couple of injuries to key players (DCL/Rich Arlison) and they could really struggle. They are absolutely miles off where Everton fans think they should be which is top 6, based on having a decent team in the 1950s and 1980s. I would rate Southampton or Villa as a far better project in terms of cracking the top 6/top 4. Ancelotti worked miracles getting them to tenth. CW would have absolutely no idea how to polish them up.
 
Would love it if Wilder got the Everton job he’d do a great job and would deserve it

Says a lot about British managers that of the Wolves/Palace/Everton job howe/Dyche/wilder will likely not get any of those
 
FallowfieldBlade said:
Would love it if Wilder got the Everton job he’d do a great job and would deserve it

Says a lot about British managers that of the Wolves/Palace/Everton job howe/Dyche/wilder will likely not get any of those
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Wilder has no experience of managing top class footballers, he is used to work horses who play a high press game and it worked as it was unique, unexpected and performed at a v high temp with v fit players.
When asked to spend decent money he failed.
When asked to change his team, he failed.
When asked to change formation he failed.

He may suit Burnley, but I doubt very much that he will ever have a place at the top table. Having said that he made a very good fist of getting us to where we were with what we had. It is just that he fell down when being asked to take the next step and would have received much more respect from SUFC supporters and no doubt the rest of the football world if he had changed things or admitted his failings, or not try and deflect blame. But for these reasons I cannot see him ever getting a top team job.
 
Champagneblade said:
I'm not 100% convinced this will happen.

The Everton job is available now too.

They could do worse than appoint him, but the point is that Spurs, Palace and Celtic jobs are still not filled either. Wolves will be managed by another Portuguese.

Why rush into the West Brom job.
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Mouth of the South said:
I'd be surprised if CW lands any of those roles CB - last season's catastrophic performance (which, as much as he may try, he can't transfer blame for onto the Board)
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Champagneblade said:
It's difficult to predict PL chairmen though.
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The thing is, it might just be the case that Sheff Utd is the team with the very good chairman.

In his 30 minute interview with Sky, PA did an absolute (in kind) demolition job on Wilder. He then went about employing our new friend Slav.

Meanwhile... on the WBA forum they are concerned about the inevitability of Wilder, http://westbrom.com/forum/index.php?topic=25852.1325 (and it's a much better read than wendiesonline).

Half of them don't trust Wilder. They understand the relation of Burke vs Robinson. They have seen the video of PA. They think PA is a chairman that is open. The suggestion is, if Wilder cannot work with PA ... then its going to be impossible at WBA.

So far as I'm concerned - for the moment - Wilder is a busted flush. GLTTL!
 
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bertieblade said:
Wilder has no experience of managing top class footballers, he is used to work horses who play a high press game and it worked as it was unique, unexpected and performed at a v high temp with v fit players.
When asked to spend decent money he failed.
When asked to change his team, he failed.
When asked to change formation he failed.

He may suit Burnley, but I doubt very much that he will ever have a place at the top table. Having said that he made a very good fist of getting us to where we were with what we had. It is just that he fell down when being asked to take the next step and would have received much more respect from SUFC supporters and no doubt the rest of the football world if he had changed things or admitted his failings, or not try and deflect blame. But for these reasons I cannot see him ever getting a top team job.
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Wilders interview:

I don't do yoof
I don't do forriners
I do do Peroni and lots of it

Non negotiable lads, take it or leave it otherwise i chuck a tantrum right here on the boardroom floor
 
CW was daft to leave united - should have worked through the issues of the Prince, the club and also the problems he has with himself which has surfaced at other clubs before he took us on. He should have reached a balance. Not convinced he can accept that football has changed and will continue to change and will go further against the principals that CW appears to believe in. Money talks in football and ultimately CW (and his entourage) have failed when given it. It won't have gone unnoticed among the football world. Nigel Adkins star shone brightly at one time.

Some of his mates should have had a word with him before he decided time was up here.

He either changes where ever he goes, or he'll fail again.

For certain, he gained an awful lot of credit very quickly at United - unless he hits the ground running, other fans will not be as charitable.

UTB
 
i think the modern game certainly at the top level has done for chris and such as alladyce and hodgson and possibly even dyche its a global game thesedays employing footballers from all over the globe and i dont say that willingly i still prefer the english game as it used to be played in the 60s 70s and 80s i can see chris ending up back in league 1 possibly sunderland at some stage
 
Wilders petulance in the last few months coupled with PA's public explanation would be a huge red flag for any Chairman and Board.

That said, his excellent record of success in the EFL would mean his stock is still high at, say, a PNE or Derby County.
 
Said it before but I still reckon CW's best move would be Middlesbrough. Good, supportive Chairman, good facilities and backing. Warnock could step aside at any stage and not be overly bothered. I'm surprised Gibson hasn't gone hell for leather to get him in. He'd be a perfect fit and I'm not sure CW will get, or deserves to get, anything better or bigger.
Good move all round I reckon.
utb
 
Rudders said:
This is what is funny. They have spent 100s and 100s of millions (a billion?) to be a rich mans Burnley, packed full of solid athletic six foot players playing bog standard 4-4-2 hoping for an attacking set piece that 250k a week Gylfi Siggurdson can knock onto the head of DCL or Michael Keane. They have a bombscare goalie and a rust bucket stadium, the right back is Seamus Coleman or Holgate playing out of position. A couple of injuries to key players (DCL/Rich Arlison) and they could really struggle. They are absolutely miles off where Everton fans think they should be which is top 6, based on having a decent team in the 1950s and 1980s. I would rate Southampton or Villa as a far better project in terms of cracking the top 6/top 4. Ancelotti worked miracles getting them to tenth. CW would have absolutely no idea how to polish them up.
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Going on last 12 months CW has no idea period!
 
FredZeppelin said:
Said it before but I still reckon CW's best move would be Middlesbrough. Good, supportive Chairman, good facilities and backing. Warnock could step aside at any stage and not be overly bothered. I'm surprised Gibson hasn't gone hell for leather to get him in. He'd be a perfect fit and I'm not sure CW will get, or deserves to get, anything better or bigger.
Good move all round I reckon.
utb
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Be a big move to replace the Master NW
 

Wilder has blown his spunk.. If any Prem team. takes him they want looking at. As for wba, why? He's proved his arse falls out the floor at the first sign of a battle, and next season will be a battle royale for top 2.
He's washed up. Done. Wouldn't even bother me if he went to pigsboro.
 
FredZeppelin said:
Said it before but I still reckon CW's best move would be Middlesbrough. Good, supportive Chairman, good facilities and backing. Warnock could step aside at any stage and not be overly bothered. I'm surprised Gibson hasn't gone hell for leather to get him in. He'd be a perfect fit and I'm not sure CW will get, or deserves to get, anything better or bigger.
Good move all round I reckon.
utb
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I think if you asked most boro fans they would keep Warnock over Wilder
 
Champagneblade said:
I'm not 100% convinced this will happen.

The Everton job is available now too.

They could do worse than appoint him, but the point is that Spurs, Palace and Celtic jobs are still not filled either. Wolves will be managed by another Portuguese.

Why rush into the West Brom job. Nuno was lined up by Palace. If he goes to Everton instead that means Palace have to reconsider. Howe has turned down the Celtic job and there is talk that Aussie manage Ange Postecoglou lacks the required badges. Chris must be in the top 5 of a few of those jobs.

Once others get rules out he may be in with a shot. If Palace got for Dyche for instance then he would be a favorite for Burnley.

I can see some twists on this one.
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I think you're right about Wolves. The favourite for that one seems to be Bruno Lage (sp) who had a pretty unremarkable spell with Benfica
 
184blade said:
I can see wilder having a similar career to warnock, brought in to get teams to the top flight but not trusted to continue the job once there.
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I just hope he dosent turn out like warnock geeing is teams fans up when he comes to lane else he will quickly turn from a legend into Judas.
 
Fulwood Blade said:
CW was daft to leave united - should have worked through the issues of the Prince, the club and also the problems he has with himself which has surfaced at other clubs before he took us on. He should have reached a balance. Not convinced he can accept that football has changed and will continue to change and will go further against the principals that CW appears to believe in. Money talks in football and ultimately CW (and his entourage) have failed when given it. It won't have gone unnoticed among the football world. Nigel Adkins star shone brightly at one time.

Some of his mates should have had a word with him before he decided time was up here.

He either changes where ever he goes, or he'll fail again.

For certain, he gained an awful lot of credit very quickly at United - unless he hits the ground running, other fans will not be as charitable.

UTB
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Thing is Fulwood, we don't know is side of the story yet, we don't know how much of a problem the situation at United was becoming. I do suspect that Wilder felt he could no longer bring in who he wanted to, either for wage reasons or Van Winckel/the board wanting different choices. So it came to a head. We also don't know how hard it is for a manager to work for the Prince, only time will tell.

I don't think Wilder's principles mean that he's from a past era, his football was certainly refreshing and no one could figure it out, it only stopped working when JOC got injured and the midfield wasn't playing anywhere near the same levels as the season before. If the Albion chairman I'd appoint him today. Your last point on fans patience applies to the appointment of any manager.

In my view it failed at United because Wilder couldn't bring in players he wanted to due to the lower wage structure here. I'm not saying that we should have blown the wage structure either, but it's very difficult to succeed when your wage budget is the lowest in the league, lower than the newly promoted clubs. Hence most of our players came from the Championship or players who weren't playing for other Prem teams, one or two did ok/well in the first season, most struggled. This idea that Wilder spent millions is only one side, because as we all know it's wages that attract good players the transfer fee is just for the club, a bit for the agent, but the player isn't interested in that, he just wants his wages and ours are too low for PL survival.

Also Wilder was a victim of his own success in a way. There's no way in the first place that on our budget we should have got promoted over Derby, Leeds and Villa, only the last one got promoted in the season we went up. When we got promoted we couldn't sign players better than what we had on our budget, at least not from these shores, hence why the Prince wanted to shop abroad more. In this regard Wilder needed to look abroad more, that was a mistake, but again we need to hear Wilder's side of it.

Wilder is stubborn and appears to want things his way, but that's understandable also. Yes he may need to bend on some of his control in the future, but he's still an in demand manager for any Champ club I'm sure if they change manager.
 
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Also for those that think Wilder's yesterday's news and his principles mean he's not going to get a decent job, can we just remember where we were and what he's done for us, not because of gratitude, but because what he did for us is leave us one division higher than where he started (I'll not say two because we were always going to be relegated when he left) and with three years of parachute payments, which puts us in a massively better place than where we were when he started and over the whole entire Championship, even Albion and Fulham, plus the best football we've seen since the Currie days. Yes it ended awfully, he didn't change his team, the football was negative this season, but without Wilder just where would we be? I doubt we'd be favourites for promotion next season and able to attract a manager of Jokanovic's calibre. I think most on here have very short memories and totally underestimate how hard it is to get promoted out of the Champ without parachute payments, we're in a great position now BECAUSE of Chris Wilder.

Also gave us the best season we've had since the Currie days and even with this season I'd have taken that over several years in the Champ like so many, and just look at Derby, Wednesday, Sunderland, Ipswich, Charlton, Birmingham, Portsmouth, Forest for comparisons to what we could be now. Then there's the likes of Reading, Stoke, Middlesborough who face years of Championship football at best because of the strength of teams coming down with parachute money.
 
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Booker4 said:
Thing is Fulwood, we don't know is side of the story yet, we don't know how much of a problem the situation at United was becoming. I do suspect that Wilder felt he could no longer bring in who he wanted to, either for wage reasons or Van Winckel/the board wanting different choices. So it came to a head. We also don't know how hard it is for a manager to work for the Prince, only time will tell.

I don't think Wilder's principles mean that he's from a past era, his football was certainly refreshing and no one could figure it out, it only stopped working when JOC got injured and the midfield wasn't playing anywhere near the same levels as the season before. If the Albion chairman I'd appoint him today. Your last point on fans patience applies to the appointment of any manager.

In my view it failed at United because Wilder couldn't bring in players he wanted to due to the lower wage structure here. I'm not saying that we should have blown the wage structure either, but it's very difficult to succeed when your wage budget is the lowest in the league, lower than the newly promoted clubs. Hence most of our players came from the Championship or players who weren't playing for other Prem teams, one or two did ok/well in the first season, most struggled. This idea that Wilder spent millions is only one side, because as we all know it's wages that attract good players the transfer fee is just for the club, a bit for the agent, but the player isn't interested in that, he just wants his wages and ours are too low for PL survival.

Also Wilder was a victim of his own success in a way. There's no way in the first place that on our budget we should have got promoted over Derby, Leeds and Villa, only the last one got promoted in the season we went up. When we got promoted we couldn't sign players better than what we had on our budget, at least not from these shores, hence why the Prince wanted to shop abroad more. In this regard Wilder needed to look abroad more, that was a mistake, but again we need to hear Wilder's side of it.

Wilder is stubborn and appears to want things his way, but that's understandable also. Yes he may need to bend on some of his control in the future, but he's still an in demand manager for any Champ club I'm sure if they change manager.
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If that were true he would already have got another PL job. The due diligence others do for £billion businesses covers such in-depth research.
The only concern is when December came, why didn't HRH take the resignation.Had we done so Thomas Tuchel was free at the time....
 
tincan said:
If that were true he would already have got another PL job. The due diligence others do for £billion businesses covers such in-depth research.
The only concern is when December came, why didn't HRH take the resignation.Had we done so Thomas Tuchel was free at the time....
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He's not gonna get a PL job because of last season and he's 53 and English, which doesn't help. I take it the last line is a joke!?
 

Booker4 said:
Thing is Fulwood, we don't know is side of the story yet, we don't know how much of a problem the situation at United was becoming. I do suspect that Wilder felt he could no longer bring in who he wanted to, either for wage reasons or Van Winckel/the board wanting different choices. So it came to a head. We also don't know how hard it is for a manager to work for the Prince, only time will tell.

I don't think Wilder's principles mean that he's from a past era, his football was certainly refreshing and no one could figure it out, it only stopped working when JOC got injured and the midfield wasn't playing anywhere near the same levels as the season before. If the Albion chairman I'd appoint him today. Your last point on fans patience applies to the appointment of any manager.

In my view it failed at United because Wilder couldn't bring in players he wanted to due to the lower wage structure here. I'm not saying that we should have blown the wage structure either, but it's very difficult to succeed when your wage budget is the lowest in the league, lower than the newly promoted clubs. Hence most of our players came from the Championship or players who weren't playing for other Prem teams, one or two did ok/well in the first season, most struggled. This idea that Wilder spent millions is only one side, because as we all know it's wages that attract good players the transfer fee is just for the club, a bit for the agent, but the player isn't interested in that, he just wants his wages and ours are too low for PL survival.

Also Wilder was a victim of his own success in a way. There's no way in the first place that on our budget we should have got promoted over Derby, Leeds and Villa, only the last one got promoted in the season we went up. When we got promoted we couldn't sign players better than what we had on our budget, at least not from these shores, hence why the Prince wanted to shop abroad more. In this regard Wilder needed to look abroad more, that was a mistake, but again we need to hear Wilder's side of it.

Wilder is stubborn and appears to want things his way, but that's understandable also. Yes he may need to bend on some of his control in the future, but he's still an in demand manager for any Champ club I'm sure if they change manager.
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Wilder had removed his right to choose players given that his recruitment after we got to the Premier League was:
C Robinson - out on loan after 6 months
Freeman - out on loan after a year
Mousset - huge question marks over fitness, application and attitude
McBurnie - jury definitely out
Rodwell - two appearances in 18 months including getting a contract extension last summer
J Robinson - will be decent backup in the Championship
Foderingham - League One Wes. On a three year deal. This was the one which set the alarm bells ringing for me
Ramsdale - coming good and in retrospect £13.5m isn't too bad
Lowe - unproven. Smells a bit like a deal with Derby to avoid a sell-on fee for Bogle*
Bogle - exciting prospect
Brewster - jury definitely out
Burke - just an awful footballer

I'm excluding Verrips and Berge as those were clearly not Wilder's choice. Same goes for the players signed for the 23s.

Why would any chairman in the top two divisions take a chance on him given his record in the transfer market and in developing players over the last two years? Add to that the absolute abomination of a season that we've just had and it's clearly a more difficult decision than the one you're portraying.

On the point about wages - I would be amazed if we couldn't have signed better players than the 12 above had Wilder allowed recruitment from overseas. West Ham signed Soucek and Coufal for a combined £25m. They're not going to be on mad money and in any case we'd have been able to comfortably exceed their Slavia salaries.

*bit like Spurs signing Davies and Vorm from Swansea for a combined £10m which conveniently worked out at £10m for Davies (no sell-on) and £0 for Vorm (25% sell-on)
 
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