Is Wilder Really Going To See This Out?

[Flying Duck]

I’ll judge his signings like Brewster, Berge, Ramsdale and McBurnie after a season the Championship. If they’re shit next season then he really has wasted money. If they’re good and we go back up then they’ve paid for themselves. He always said he was signing players with half an eye on the Championship so it’s important that we are strong next season.

I hope he sees it out but I wouldn’t be inclined to give him a transfer kitty if we ever get back up again, that’s where a DoF would make sense.

He's said a lot of things. We all have. That's life. Anyways, are you sure that Berge, Ramsdale and Brewster were signed "with half an eye on the Championship", 'cause I haven't read that anywhere, nor have I got that sense. McBurnie, yes, but the others - definitely not. Berge wasn't bought to play Championship football. Neither were Ramsdale or Brewster. Brewster needed to have some more experience in the Championship, anyway, so that's okay (but the £23k we paid for him hardly isn't.) Ramsdale was supposed to be a prem quality GK. Not comparing him to Henderson, but currently he isn't. It's hard for me to see Berge playing in the Championship, taking into the account his international career and all. Chill out and accept the fact that CW wasted some serious money.

 

[toshack]

Come this far may as well let CW see it out and give him until 5-10 games in Championship see where we are at.

 

[A Storm of Blades]

Come this far may as well let CW see it out and give him until 5-10 games in Championship see where we are at.

Even if he loses the next 19 games??

 

[toshack]

Even if he loses the next 19 games??

We have missed the boat with looking at a replacement to survive. There has been some improvement in the performances which will see us pick up results in the future sadly not enough to keep us up. All about building for next season, Norwich were in a similar situation last season and played the long game, so should we.

 

[A Storm of Blades]

We have missed the boat with looking at a replacement to survive. There has been some improvement in the performances which will see us pick up results in the future sadly not enough to keep us up. All about building for next season, Norwich were in a similar situation last season and played the long game, so should we.

In the last 18 months, do you think Wilder has shown he has what it takes to succeed at this level? I love the guy for what he’s done, but everything I see the top coaches doing, I don’t see in him unfortunately.

 

[Superblades]

I’ll judge his signings like Brewster, Berge, Ramsdale and McBurnie after a season the Championship. If they’re shit next season then he really has wasted money. If they’re good and we go back up then they’ve paid for themselves. He always said he was signing players with half an eye on the Championship so it’s important that we are strong next season.

I hope he sees it out but I wouldn’t be inclined to give him a transfer kitty if we ever get back up again, that’s where a DoF would make sense.

The players you mentioned were brought in to be good enough for the Prem or to make the step up to the Prem and keep us there. Wilder didn’t spend £70+ million on 4 players for them to be good in the Championship should we be relegated.

 

[Robboblade1889]

In the last 18 months, do you think Wilder has shown he has what it takes to succeed at this level? I love the guy for what he’s done, but everything I see the top coaches doing, I don’t see in him unfortunately.

In the last 18 months Chris Wilder got us into the premier league and finished in our highest ever position with largely the same group of players. So yes I and a few other believe he has what it takes to succeed at this level.
What do you gauge as success? You do realise without major investment pretty much the best we can hope for is to survive at this level. He has done that once and failed at it once.

 

[Nine Inch Nalis]

In the last 18 months, do you think Wilder has shown he has what it takes to succeed at this level? I love the guy for what he’s done, but everything I see the top coaches doing, I don’t see in him unfortunately.

Given that 18 months spans the entire first Premier League season in which we achieved our highest position in 45 years and finished above several other "top" coaches, then the answer would have to be a pretty definitive yes.

You don't turn into a bad manager overnight, externalities also come into play.

 

[Half Bond Jls]

He will stay and if it’s championship football next year give him and Alan another go. WHO FUCKING ELSE COULD MANAGE THIS TEAM OR WHO WOULD KNOW THIS CLUB THROUGH AND THROUGH LIKE US. This is just my opinion.

Why you shouting Mike. You're scaring me

 

[Robboblade1889]

The players you mentioned were brought in to be good enough for the Prem or to make the step up to the Prem and keep us there. Wilder didn’t spend £70+ million on 4 players for them to be good in the Championship should we be relegated.

But the players he signed weren’t premier league players. Forget about the money for one second because the price of decent championship players is obscene. The pond we are fishing in is the championship simple as that we have to hope for these players to make the step up very quickly. Unfortunately established PL players cost a lot of money and other clubs more established premier league clubs are more attractive.

 

[Bruce Wayne]

One thing Wilder will have achieved this season when we tamely drop out of the league is a full autograph book. The guy somehow is not only in awe of the opposition week in week out, but he constantly says this in every interview. No wonder our lads feel inferior before they kick a ball.

 

[LONDON_BLADE]

IMHO:

1) Wilder won't be sacked
2) Wilder won't resign
3) He knows the player aren't good enough, but still protects their integrity and won't throw them individually under a bus
4) He'll already be rethinking/preparing for next season
5) He'll know who will be sold / released / retained for next season
6) 1 of the clubs lists of 4 player requirements - which we always prepare apparently (ie: the one for relegation) will be implemented
7) He'll ditch 352 as unworkable at Premier league level and reinvent himself and coaching management with a new system, loosely around his original favourite of 442 or 433 but with 4 as a defensive unit and with full backs that push on. (Bogle and RND is my guess)
8) Players who don't fit the new system and who won't/can't fit it will be ousted or moved on/out - just like when he first joined.
9) It will take possibly 2 years - he starts again with a much better starting base.

10) He won't give in because he is actually one of us and will want to try again and learn from his mistakes and prove some doubters wrong and for me he has the mentality, strength of character and ability to pull it off.

UTB

PS: we'll beat Plymouth because we will play a very very good team against them - he hates to lose in any game, plus: have some of you lot seen the state of the bottom two divisions. Even the championship teams don't punish mistakes like the Prem teams do.

Good post.
For my sanity I hope we have such things actually 'planned' in!

 

[Greasy Chap Butty]

Past caring now, it's obvious HRH had thrown the towel in and has limply accepted relegation without a fight, so if he doesn't care, why should I?

Wilder should have been sacked ages ago whilst it wasn't too late. Seriously, who keeps a manager that cannot get a react or a performance out of HIS team? They've simply stopped listening to him and some of our better players don't try because they know the club will have to sell them in the summer and they go back to the Premier League.

Gutted, dark times returning

I don't think HRH has chucked the towel in, or just accepted it. He's spent all the prem money on players. That's it. He hasn't got a barrel of it himself.

 

[Berlin Blade]

I keep saying it, but what difference does it make if Wilder is the best person to take us back up, if, like most of squad, he too isn’t Premier League quality?

Was he premier league quality this time last year though? How short is your memory? He won LMA manager of the year in 2018 and was runner up in 2019.

It might sound ridiculous to many of you, but I think people need to start thinking of wilder’s reign here as a 15 year reign. He’s creating a legacy here. The ups and downs of that. We should be reflecting after that era of taking us all the way up, having an amazing season in the prem and blowing everyone away (it being the first time he’s ever managed at this level after only having about 3 seasons above league one level in his entire career and only about 7 in league football) followed by a horrendous season and him learning lessons from his own mistakes and using that to take us back up and stabilise and move on to Europe from there. You’ll say ‘but he’s had 50 million quid to spend!!!!11oneone’ because that sounds like a lot of money, when relatively it’s nothing at this level. We’ve got the lowest wage bill of anyone in the league, you’re spoilt by him letting us punch above our weight so much and have come to expect it rather than appreciate it.

This awful season is a blip, a necessary evil in a long and successful reign for Chris wilder at this football club. It’s needed for Wilder to learn the error of his ways and learn from any mistakes he’s made. I’ll admit he’s made some and has been stubborn at times and has frustrated, but progress on the levels we’re talking about takes time.

In terms of wilder pulling the trigger and jumping ship himself, I think that’s equally as unrealistic as saying we should get rid of him. It’s a tailor made fit between us and him. We appoint a pardew or someone similar and take a huge step down. Think about him; where does he go? He goes to a stoke or Birmingham and does this journey all again. No prem team will touch him until he re-establishes us, so it would be equally ill advised for him to leave as it would be for us to fire him in my opinion.

Finally I will say that the vast majority of you need to take a long hard look at yourselves. This time last season, the amount of times I heard ‘he’s god. He could lose every game next season and he’d still be god’. Well, here we are. And what are a lot of you lot doing? Calling for his head. Forgive me for not taking you too seriously now when you’ve proven yourselves for not being men of your word.

Just my opinion, no offence meant.

 

[Robboblade1889]

One thing Wilder will have achieved this season when we tamely drop out of the league is a full autograph book. The guy somehow is not only in awe of the opposition week in week out, but he constantly says this in every interview. No wonder our lads feel inferior before they kick a ball.

Seriously what do you want him to say? It’s a fact these clubs and teams are so far in front of us it unreal. Do you want him to say “we should be beating these”? The money we spent which people keep banging on about is a pittance compared to what the vast majority of teams in this league are worth. Spurs has one single player in the bench who costs more than our entire team put together and is being paid nearly as much as what our entire team is being paid.
I get that it’s hurting how poorly we are doing but the gap is so big we are trying to close we just aren’t good enough simple as that. The problem is people think the money we have spent should be making us compete.

 

[A Storm of Blades]

In the last 18 months Chris Wilder got us into the premier league and finished in our highest ever position with largely the same group of players. So yes I and a few other believe he has what it takes to succeed at this level.
What do you gauge as success? You do realise without major investment pretty much the best we can hope for is to survive at this level. He has done that once and failed at it once.

• Elite class tactical knowledge; and
• Ability to motivate, inspire and lead; and
• Flexibility and agility to respond in real-time to events unfolding on the field and tactically counter; and
• Recognition of the need to adapt and grow when things are going wrong; and
• Ability to foreshadow where things could go wrong and have a Plan B, C, D ready; and
• Well thought through contingency planning both on the field, and wider squad.
• Eye for talent, and balanced recruitment; and
• Strength of character to believe in a set of principles but never allowing ego to override that which is ultimately good for the team; and
• A willingness to accept alternative views and embrace dissenting voices.

Outside of Wilder barely displaying much, if any of this in the last 18 months, our record breaking, history making poor form is probably an indication that he might be out of his depth.

 

[Robboblade1889]

Was he premier league quality this time last year though? How short is your memory? He won LMA manager of the year in 2018 and was runner up in 2019.

It might sound ridiculous to many of you, but I think people need to start thinking of wilder’s reign here as a 15 year reign. He’s creating a legacy here. The ups and downs of that. We should be reflecting after that era of taking us all the way up, having an amazing season in the prem and blowing everyone away (it being the first time he’s ever managed at this level after only having about 3 seasons above league one level in his entire career and only about 7 in league football) followed by a horrendous season and him learning lessons from his own mistakes and using that to take us back up and stabilise and move on to Europe from there. You’ll say ‘but he’s had 50 million quid to spend!!!!11oneone’ because that sounds like a lot of money, when relatively it’s nothing at this level. We’ve got the lowest wage bill of anyone in the league, you’re spoilt by him letting us punch above our weight so much and have come to expect it rather than appreciate it.

This awful season is a blip, a necessary evil in a long and successful reign for Chris wilder at this football club. It’s needed for Wilder to learn the error of his ways and learn from any mistakes he’s made. I’ll admit he’s made some and has been stubborn at times and has frustrated, but progress on the levels we’re talking about takes time.

In terms of wilder pulling the trigger and jumping ship himself, I think that’s equally as unrealistic as saying we should get rid of him. It’s a tailor made fit between us and him. We appoint a pardew or someone similar and take a huge step down. Think about him; where does he go? He goes to a stoke or Birmingham and does this journey all again. No prem team will touch him until he re-establishes us, so it would be equally ill advised for him to leave as it would be for us to fire him in my opinion.

Finally I will say that the vast majority of you need to take a long hard look at yourselves. This time last season, the amount of times I heard ‘he’s god. He could lose every game next season and he’d still be god’. Well, here we are. And what are a lot of you lot doing? Calling for his head. Forgive me for not taking you too seriously now when you’ve proven yourselves for not being men of your word.

Just my opinion, no offence meant.

Great post.

 

[Bruce Wayne]

Seriously what do you want him to say? It’s a fact these clubs and teams are so far in front of us it unreal. Do you want him to say “we should be beating these”? The money we spent which people keep banging on about is a pittance compared to what the vast majority of teams in this league are worth. Spurs has one single player in the bench who costs more than our entire team put together and is being paid nearly as much as what our entire team is being paid.
I get that it’s hurting how poorly we are doing but the gap is so big we are trying to close we just aren’t good enough simple as that. The problem is people think the money we have spent should be making us compete.

I want him to stop being a wet fart by talking more about how good the opposition is than his own team.

 

[LONDON_BLADE]

So sign less of the squad players/ for the future and have more funds available for wages. He wasted the most money any United manager has ever had. Terrible.

To be fair he probably hasn't.

People must consider the relative value of players in the Prem. Yes - it sounds a lot on paper, but it isn't in real terms. Also, the recent splurge doesn't make up for having a weak squad (in prem terms) from promotion.

Though with the value of hindsight they have not been great signings.... so far! Who knows we may blast the Championship next season!!?

 

[Robboblade1889]

• Elite class tactical knowledge; and
• Ability to motivate, inspire and lead; and
• Flexibility and agility to respond in real-time to events unfolding on the field and tactically counter; and
• Recognition of the need to adapt and grow when things are going wrong; and
• Ability to foreshadow where things could go wrong and have a Plan B, C, D ready; and
• Well thought through contingency planning both on the field, and wider squad.
• Eye for talent, and balanced recruitment; and
• Strength of character to believe in a set of principles but never allowing ego to override that which is ultimately good for the team; and
• A willingness to accept alternative views and embrace dissenting voices.

Outside of Wilder barely displaying much, if any of this in the last 18 months, our record breaking, history making poor form is probably an indication that he might be out of his depth.

I will repeat this man who you say have non of these attributes got us to the top 10 in the premier league in the last 18 months. He has shown all these ateibutes and more during his reign here. You do realise though he is managing Sheffield United though don’t you and we have a ceiling at the moment? The problem is this man has smashed through this ceiling and has become a victim of his own success.

Come on storm I know it’s not great but don’t try to dilute the incredible job this man has done.

 

[A Storm of Blades]

Was he premier league quality this time last year though? How short is your memory? He won LMA manager of the year in 2018 and was runner up in 2019.

It might sound ridiculous to many of you, but I think people need to start thinking of wilder’s reign here as a 15 year reign. He’s creating a legacy here. The ups and downs of that. We should be reflecting after that era of taking us all the way up, having an amazing season in the prem and blowing everyone away (it being the first time he’s ever managed at this level after only having about 3 seasons above league one level in his entire career and only about 7 in league football) followed by a horrendous season and him learning lessons from his own mistakes and using that to take us back up and stabilise and move on to Europe from there. You’ll say ‘but he’s had 50 million quid to spend!!!!11oneone’ because that sounds like a lot of money, when relatively it’s nothing at this level. We’ve got the lowest wage bill of anyone in the league, you’re spoilt by him letting us punch above our weight so much and have come to expect it rather than appreciate it.

This awful season is a blip, a necessary evil in a long and successful reign for Chris wilder at this football club. It’s needed for Wilder to learn the error of his ways and learn from any mistakes he’s made. I’ll admit he’s made some and has been stubborn at times and has frustrated, but progress on the levels we’re talking about takes time.

In terms of wilder pulling the trigger and jumping ship himself, I think that’s equally as unrealistic as saying we should get rid of him. It’s a tailor made fit between us and him. We appoint a pardew or someone similar and take a huge step down. Think about him; where does he go? He goes to a stoke or Birmingham and does this journey all again. No prem team will touch him until he re-establishes us, so it would be equally ill advised for him to leave as it would be for us to fire him in my opinion.

Finally I will say that the vast majority of you need to take a long hard look at yourselves. This time last season, the amount of times I heard ‘he’s god. He could lose every game next season and he’d still be god’. Well, here we are. And what are a lot of you lot doing? Calling for his head. Forgive me for not taking you too seriously now when you’ve proven yourselves for not being men of your word.

Just my opinion, no offence meant.

Quite a tirade, but I never said any of the things you mentioned, last season. I’ve always hated the flat 3, and argued that ditching the 10 would prove to be a mistake. Last year was a success built on fine margins, and a tight defence, but the colossal mistakes made in the last 12 months, as well as some of the football served up has me at breaking point.

The progressive, snarling, go for the throat Wilder has long since gone. We all wish he hadn’t but he has. We can talk about the players’ ability at this level, but there’s no denying Wilder has lost his bottle against sides we used to be willing to poke in the eye. He had his loyalty, 89 football league managers wouldn’t have made it passed November.

 

[McGrath]

Wilders main fault is being too good and massively over achieving with this group of players. At the moment they are playing like what they are, a bunch Championship and League One journeymen and Bosmans.

People forget we were talking about Europe 8 months ago. Who the hell do they think got then there.

Hopefully Wilder stays and the idiot 'knee jerk reactionary' brigade keep their gobs shut.

 

[Robboblade1889]

Quite a tirade, but I never said any of the things you mentioned, last season. I’ve always hated the flat 3, and argued that ditching the 10 would prove to be a mistake. Last year was a success built on fine margins, and a tight defence, but the colossal mistakes made in the last 12 months, as well as some of the football served up has me at breaking point.

The progressive, snarling, go for the throat Wilder has long since gone. We all wish he hadn’t but he has. We can talk about the players’ ability at this level, but there’s no denying Wilder has lost his bottle against sides we used to be willing to poke in the eye. He had his loyalty, 89 football league managers wouldn’t have made it passed November.

You should take up a managers job by the sounds of it storm you make it sound so easy.

He hasn’t lost any bottle at all what he has lost is players through injuries, players with loss of form and confidence and a fantastic fan base which a lot of the time got the players going and kept them going. All this he’s not the same man is complete bollocks maybe look at some of the reasons we aren’t the same team instead of the usual lazy cliches.
He seems incredibly frustrated the players aren’t doing what they were doing last season he has said this numerous times.

 

[A Storm of Blades]

I will repeat this man who you say have non of these attributes got us to the top 10 in the premier league in the last 18 months. He has shown all these ateibutes and more during his reign here. You do realise though he is managing Sheffield United though don’t you and we have a ceiling at the moment? The problem is this man has smashed through this ceiling and has become a victim of his own success.

Come on storm I know it’s not great but don’t try to dilute the incredible job this man has done.

I don’t have to dilute anything. The Chris Wilder of old has gone. We’re terrified of every side we play against. We’ve recruited terribly, but spent a relative fortune. We’re defensive and aimlessly hoofy. We can’t create. We can’t score, and there’s no effort. Post match interviews lack any responsibility. We suffer petulant acts like not naming a full bench. We have pundits calling us out to an audience of millions, as splineless and shit.

And on top of that we’re seeming setting a record a week for how bad we are.

 

[Robboblade1889]

He had his loyalty, 89 football league managers wouldn’t have made it passed November.

He has this loyalty because thankfully most people see the bigger picture. They see a man who brought this club kicking and screaming into the premier league. They then saw him remarkably get a group of players who had no right to even be in the league into the top 10.
Does that give him a pass forever no it doesn’t but I believe it gives him the opportunity to get this club back up and hopefully more equipped next time.

 

[A Storm of Blades]

You should take up a managers job by the sounds of it storm you make it sound so easy.

He hasn’t lost any bottle at all what he has lost is players through injuries, players with loss of form and confidence and a fantastic fan base which a lot of the time got the players going and kept them going. All this he’s not the same man is complete bollocks maybe look at some of the reasons we aren’t the same team instead of the usual lazy cliches.
He seems incredibly frustrated the players aren’t doing what they were doing last season he has said this numerous times.

I don’t make it sound easy at all. I’ve listed attributes there that 99% of the population barely have one of. That’s why it’s ELITE level sport. If we have no problem saying most of the squad aren’t Premier League class, why do you pout so much when those of us say maybe the manager isn’t either?

 

[Houston_Blade]

The players you mentioned were brought in to be good enough for the Prem or to make the step up to the Prem and keep us there. Wilder didn’t spend £70+ million on 4 players for them to be good in the Championship should we be relegated.

They were definitely bought for the PL but I’m not writing them all off as disasters until they are shit next season. If they get us promoted again they’re worth the cash.

 

[Robboblade1889]

I don’t have to dilute anything. The Chris Wilder of old has gone. We’re terrified of every side we play against. We’ve recruited terribly, but spent a relative fortune. We’re defensive and aimlessly hoofy. We can’t create. We can’t score, and there’s no effort. Post match interviews lack any responsibility. We suffer petulant acts like not naming a full bench. We have pundits calling us out to an audience of millions, as splineless and shit.

And on top of that we’re seeming setting a record a week for how bad we are.

The Chris Wilder of old has gone nowhere and I believe you and a few others will eat their words next season. We will agree to disagree pal you can’t change my mind and I can’t change yours.

 

[A Storm of Blades]

He has this loyalty because thankfully most people see the bigger picture. They see a man who brought this club kicking and screaming into the premier league. They then saw him remarkably get a group of players who had no right to even be in the league into the top 10.
Does that give him a pass forever no it doesn’t but I believe it gives him the opportunity to get this club back up and hopefully more equipped next time.

I’ve seen enough of your white knighting on this topic to know, I’m wasting my time here. So I’ll leave it there.

 

[Bruce Wayne]

He has this loyalty because thankfully most people see the bigger picture. They see a man who brought this club kicking and screaming into the premier league. They then saw him remarkably get a group of players who had no right to even be in the league into the top 10.
Does that give him a pass forever no it doesn’t but I believe it gives him the opportunity to get this club back up and hopefully more equipped next time.

We were better equipped last season. After his best window ever we have been embarrassing yet he never blames himself, not once.