I am seething with the referee

[stringer]

Red or yellow, he's got a 3 match ban and that could well signal the end of his time at United. Things like that can destroy an entire season and Wilder will be livid.

Of more concern to me was towards the end of the game, Brentford were charging through our middle with Billy in hot pursuit of their player who had the ball. Obviously, a fat lad from Sheffield wasn't going to catch their bloke, so he tried to clip his ankles. If he'd brought him down, it could well have been a straight red - far more worrying than Madine's sending-off.

I noticed that as well, really stupid thing for Billy to do, especially in the circumstances. We really dodged a bullet there and I hope Billy is aware of it. UTB

Absolutely no way on this earth that’d have been a red. A yellow certainly, one of those professional ‘taking one for the team’ fouls you see to stop a dangerous player breaking at pace. In the end he couldn’t even catch him to foul him, which is no disgrace - their lad (the sub #7 it was) was absolutely rapid.

 

[Shalalalafenoughty]

On TV I thought “that could be a red” from the way Madine dived in from behind.

A good test is whether there is a “gasp” from the crowd and there most certainly was.

It was borderline between yellow and red but it didn’t surprise me to see him sent off and I certainly don’t think it was a wrong decision.

 

[cooperblade]

Think the only people in the ground with a better view of the incident than me were the Brentford bench who barely reacted. Think back to Bristol City and Fleck's tackle for an illustration of how a bench reacts when they see what they think is a bad tackle in front of them.

I think what's confusing people is that there were almost two separate actions which, from certain angles, might have looked like one.

For me, Madine was annoyed by the ridiculous play acting by Konsa a few moments earlier and had decided to leave a bit on him as a warning / reminder / bit of revenge. He initially went in with one foot which missed the player and ball by some distance, then from a position where he was almost laid motionless on the floor, he raised his other foot and put his studs into the back of the player's calf.

Studs up - yes. High foot - yes. But absolutely zero force, absolutely zero chance of injury, not reckless, not dangerous, not out of control.

When the ref ran over, I was annoyed that Madine had wasted a yellow and would have to spend the rest of the game being overly cautious in challenges.

I was shocked when the red came out.

 

[sheffielder]

I think a lot of people missed it. To make life easier

Yellow comes out of the top pocket
Red out of the back pocket

 

[1889]

Absolutely no way on this earth that’d have been a red. A yellow certainly, one of those professional ‘taking one for the team’ fouls you see to stop a dangerous player breaking at pace. In the end he couldn’t even catch him to foul him, which is no disgrace - their lad (the sub #7 it was) was absolutely rapid.

But would you be happy to potentially jeopardise Uniteds run in, on the basis of a referees interpretation or decision making process, because I wouldn’t. I agree it was a stupid thing to do and its lucky he missed him.

Interesting though, that this morning cheating, is seen as ‘taking one for the team’ (See ‘Hutchinson cheat’ thread for alternative views)

 

[Pinchy]

From my view on the Kop is was yellow at the very worst. Basham’s tackle on the edge of the box, which he got a yellow card for, was worse, I was worried he’d get a red for that.

Then we could have hurled vitriol and venom at him.

 

[grafikhaus]

Absolutely no way on this earth that’d have been a red. A yellow certainly, one of those professional ‘taking one for the team’ fouls you see to stop a dangerous player breaking at pace. In the end he couldn’t even catch him to foul him, which is no disgrace - their lad (the sub #7 it was) was absolutely rapid.

Not so sure, Danny. The refs. at this level are nothing if not inconsistent. Sure Canos is quick and it's hardly as if Billy was the last man between their man and the goal - and Madine's foul could hardly have been in a more non-threatening position - but Sharp was an absolute whisker away from 'clipping' him and a red wouldn't have surprised me. Billy was wrestled to the ground earlier and the ref. didn't even give a free kick. The ref. - though being nearer to our penalty incident than assistant - wasn't going to give the pen.

 

[The Crab]

Dived in from behind, player was between him and the ball before he lunged in... Red. No argument.

My take on it too I'm afraid. Silly and needless challenge. Red for me

 

[stringer]

Not so sure, Danny. The refs. at this level are nothing if not inconsistent. Sure Canos is quick and it's hardly as if Billy was the last man between their man and the goal - and Madine's foul could hardly have been in a more non-threatening position - but Sharp was an absolute whisker away from 'clipping' him and a red wouldn't have surprised me. Billy was wrestled to the ground earlier and the ref. didn't even give a free kick. The ref. - though being nearer to our penalty incident than assistant - wasn't going to give the pen.

But would you be happy to potentially jeopardise Uniteds run in, on the basis of a referees interpretation or decision making process, because I wouldn’t. I agree it was a stupid thing to do and its lucky he missed him.

Interesting though, that this morning cheating, is seen as ‘taking one for the team’ (See ‘Hutchinson cheat’ thread for alternative views)

What would have made it a red card?

• denying the opposing team a goal or an obvious goal-scoring opportunity by deliberately handling the ball (except a goalkeeper within their penalty area)
• denying a goal or an obvious goal-scoring opportunity to an opponent whose overall movement is towards the offender's goal by an offence punishable by a free kick (unless as outlined below)
• serious foul play
• biting or spitting atsomeone
• violent conduct
• using offensive, insulting or abusive language and/or gestures
• receiving a second caution in the same match
• entering the video operation room (VOR)

 

[Sean Thornton]

Definite red in today's football, in my younger days It wouldn't have even been a free kick

How can it not be at least a free kick whatever era? He got the man and never touched the ball.

Jumpers for goalposts.

 

[Tray]

Red or yellow, he's got a 3 match ban and that could well signal the end of his time at United. Things like that can destroy an entire season and Wilder will be livid.

Of more concern to me was towards the end of the game, Brentford were charging through our middle with Billy in hot pursuit of their player who had the ball. Obviously, a fat lad from Sheffield wasn't going to catch their bloke, so he tried to clip his ankles. If he'd brought him down, it could well have been a straight red - far more worrying than Madine's sending-off.

He had about 3 goes at it and all Wouldn't have been a red, but a daft yellow to take!

 

[stringer]

Think the only people in the ground with a better view of the incident than me were the Brentford bench who barely reacted. Think back to Bristol City and Fleck's tackle for an illustration of how a bench reacts when they see what they think is a bad tackle in front of them.

I think what's confusing people is that there were almost two separate actions which, from certain angles, might have looked like one.

For me, Madine was annoyed by the ridiculous play acting by Konsa a few moments earlier and had decided to leave a bit on him as a warning / reminder / bit of revenge. He initially went in with one foot which missed the player and ball by some distance, then from a position where he was almost laid motionless on the floor, he raised his other foot and put his studs into the back of the player's calf.

Studs up - yes. High foot - yes. But absolutely zero force, absolutely zero chance of injury, not reckless, not dangerous, not out of control.

When the ref ran over, I was annoyed that Madine had wasted a yellow and would have to spend the rest of the game being overly cautious in challenges.

I was shocked when the red came out.

Not reckless? Not dangerous? Zero force? Is this another tackle we’re talking about?
On a serious note, did you think Vaulks deserved a red on Saturday?

 

[cooperblade]

Yes. Yes. Yes. No. Yes.

 

[BushBlade]

How can it not be at least a free kick whatever era? He got the man and never touched the ball.

Jumpers for goalposts.

In the 70s, involving Leeds, after Bremner had delivered an envelope from Revie to the ref.

 

[RedandWhite]

I don't believe the actual contact was a red card I doubt it was even a yellow, but the way he jumped in with two feet nonetheless it was a red for sure.

 

[Beans]

• entering the video operation room (VOR)

I really want to see a player do this.

 

[stringer]

I really want to see a player do this.

That did make me chuckle

 

[stringer]

Yes. Yes. Yes. No. Yes.

Did/do you think Vaulks was more ‘in control’ than Madine was?

 

[LoughboroBlade]

I really want to see a player do this.

You can also be cautioned for “excessively using the ‘review’ (TV screen) signal”. I’d quite like to see that done in the Championship as a passive aggressive criticism of a refereeing decision.

 

[finlaytheblade]

Sorry but that is a red card 100%. And a stupid one at that. Best-case scenario there Madine wins us a throw-in on halfway. Just absolutely unnecessary.

It was a challenge he didn't need to make .,unfortunately slightly late and got the man not the ball,always chance of a red in them circumstances.He was unlucky really as a lot of refs would have seen yellow not red.Only a few weeks ago Fleck went in late after a foul had been given to us,he got yellow,I thought it was more dangerous than Madines.Gone now we move on to a massive game.

 

[cooperblade]

Did/do you think Vaulks was more ‘in control’ than Madine was?

No, Vaulks wasn't in control. He flew in and could've seriously injured Baldock.

 

[stringer]

No, Vaulks wasn't in control. He flew in and could've seriously injured Baldock.

Neither was Madine, and Konsa could have been seriously injured too

 

[Davalon]

Yes. Yes. Yes. No. Yes.

Seeing as you sit very close to me, an eye test wouldn't go amiss imho

 

[cooperblade]

Neither was Madine, and Konsa could have been seriously injured too

And obviously this is where we disagree. I believe the first motion put Madine on the floor and the second motion was the 'kick' on Konsa's calf. He didn't fly through the air like Vaulks. It was more of a land and then a kick.

As I've said, I think Madine wanted to give him something to think about and was clumsy in his execution and unfortunate in the outcome.

It was more of "that was silly" rather than a "what the fuck's he doing?". Vaulks' challenge was the latter.

 

[1889]

What would have made it a red card?

• denying the opposing team a goal or an obvious goal-scoring opportunity by deliberately handling the ball (except a goalkeeper within their penalty area)
• denying a goal or an obvious goal-scoring opportunity to an opponent whose overall movement is towards the offender's goal by an offence punishable by a free kick (unless as outlined below)
• serious foul play
• biting or spitting atsomeone
• violent conduct
• using offensive, insulting or abusive language and/or gestures
• receiving a second caution in the same match
• entering the video operation room (VOR)

I understand what you’re saying, but I’m working on the skewed rationale peculiar to many referees, they can always make something fit the crime.

I’d say violent conduct would be a possibility, I agree with you, but, was it worth the risk?

 

[LoughboroBlade]

It was more of "that was silly" rather than a "what the fuck's he doing?". Vaulks' challenge was the latter.

A clear difference was that in the case of the Vaulks challenge we were breaking, Baldock had just raced to pick up the ball, and had turned inside to beat the incoming challenge. It was potentially a dangerous attack, and Baldock’s skill there contributed to the red happening. A challenge did have to be made in that position – Vaulks just made an awful one. In contrast, a challenge didn’t need to be made at all yesterday and Madine made an awful one anyway.

 

[stringer]

I understand what you’re saying, but I’m working on the skewed rationale peculiar to many referees, they can always make something fit the crime.

I’d say violent conduct would be a possibility, I agree with you, but, was it worth the risk?

Yes, at the time United were under the cosh and Sharp had a chance to slow down the break, take the sting out the attack for the sake of a nailed-on booking. You see it almost every game.
I understand where you were coming from with poor referees but if a ref sends him off for that, he’d never ref again

 

[1889]

Yes, at the time United were under the cosh and Sharp had a chance to slow down the break, take the sting out the attack for the sake of a nailed-on booking. You see it almost every game.
I understand where you were coming from with poor referees but if a ref sends him off for that, he’d never ref again

I give you, Keith Stroud.................?

 

[stringer]

I give you, Keith Stroud.................?

Who did he send off for a clip of the heels near the halfway line?

 

[SUFC Handsworth]

If that is red for Madine, then sorry we might as well all pack in with football, close the game down and restart it as fannyball ... decisions such as last nights, and there are many other examples in virtually every game played on any other given day, just highlights what a snowflake generation we now live in. That's a foul yesterday and a yellow only, at worst.