Under 23s V Birmingham

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Wagons Roll. We're on our way to Stocksbridge. A 20 nil defeat will see Hull City leapfrog above us. Otherwise the U23s are cemented in fourth place in the table.
Double Header Day as well. The Futures U21 in a Cup Semi Final at 7:45pm, at Shirecliffe, presumably under lights on the plastic.

I'll do team & goal updates on my Twitter
www.twitter.com/ball_sup

And, more detailed reports on my Blog
www.ball-sup.blogspot.com

Tonight's Blog will have a special awards section for best beer palaces of the U23 away season. You lucky people....

As usual, I'll cut n paste updates to this forum thread. One last time .... with feeling.
 
Not so much to report on a game that turned when Birmingham introduced a big guy with 16 on his back. No idea who he was as they did not have a 16 on the team sheets. He took out Stevie Mallon, who was starting to play a bit, and our subs never got a grip of the game against a solid outfit. Mallon's injury looked painful. We also had a keeper playing, Greaves, who had a few rushes of blood to the head, got away with the one in the first half but not the one in the second half.
Typical nothing to play for game at the seasons end and the only pluses were in defence where Graham, Semple and Cantrell got back together again with Doherty in midfield. All had a good first half although Ferguson and Norrington-Davies as wing backs didn't get into the game as much as I expected. The rest struggled against a tight hard defence and in truth Birmingham deserved the win.
So that's it for this season. be interesting to see how we handle our young ones. One things for sure I don't see a lot of talent apart from our regulars although no doubt Travis will have a few Under 18s to bring in
One last thing. A big thanks to the coaches and particular Travis Binion. When I hear that Rangers are about to sign an under 23s coach to rescue them I wonder when Trav. will get a call to manage a side. He would do well in a competitive environment where he would have the luxury of being able to select the best players to get a result.
One other. Thanks to Phil for his reports, I really enjoyed reading them. Not just the football but the beer reports made my mouth water.
 
Baw Heid said:
Not so much to report on a game that turned when Birmingham introduced a big guy with 16 on his back. No idea who he was as they did not have a 16 on the team sheets. He took out Stevie Mallon, who was starting to play a bit, and our subs never got a grip of the game against a solid outfit. Mallon's injury looked painful. We also had a keeper playing, Greaves, who had a few rushes of blood to the head, got away with the one in the first half but not the one in the second half.
Typical nothing to play for game at the seasons end and the only pluses were in defence where Graham, Semple and Cantrell got back together again with Doherty in midfield. All had a good first half although Ferguson and Norrington-Davies as wing backs didn't get into the game as much as I expected. The rest struggled against a tight hard defence and in truth Birmingham deserved the win.
So that's it for this season. be interesting to see how we handle our young ones. One things for sure I don't see a lot of talent apart from our regulars although no doubt Travis will have a few Under 18s to bring in
One last thing. A big thanks to the coaches and particular Travis Binion. When I hear that Rangers are about to sign an under 23s coach to rescue them I wonder when Trav. will get a call to manage a side. He would do well in a competitive environment where he would have the luxury of being able to select the best players to get a result.
One other. Thanks to Phil for his reports, I really enjoyed reading them. Not just the football but the beer reports made my mouth water.
Click to expand...

These young lads were introduced to the crowd on Saturday. I think I may have seen a couple of them in a youth tournament here in Bergen three years ago. Do you (or anyone else) know their names?

Kids.jpg
 
Baw Heid said:
He came on in the second half and in my opinion made no impression on the game in fact the boy doesn't look fit to me.
Click to expand...
Sorry to say as poor a trialist as I can remember and we have seen a few.

Played at Swansea in the cup and today and was very very poor. Looked as though he had never played at this level before.

It is very harsh on the regular 23s when at the business end of a season we keep bringing below par trialists in. It puts an end to ant possibility of silverware.

As a final point, if Gilmour, Smith, Slater, Semple and Graham are not required as a first team squad player then 23s football is not enough for them.

They need to play in men’s football where it is about playing your strongest team to win the match.

If the club doesn’t sort it out it will be a travesty ( sorry about the pun )
 
Bergen Blade said:
These young lads were introduced to the crowd on Saturday. I think I may have seen a couple of them in a youth tournament here in Bergen three years ago. Do you (or anyone else) know their names?

View attachment 39112
Click to expand...
Top left
Del Geary (Deffo)
Not sure
Kyron Gordon (Deffo)
One of Sam or Jake Kelly (I think they may be twins)
Not sure
Harry Boyes (Deffo)
Tom Williams (I think)
Not sure
Bottom left
Not sure
Not sure
Harrison Neal (Deffo)
Angelo Capello (Deffo)
The other Kelly

Best I've got ...
 
Ball_Sup (Phil) said:
Top left
Del Geary (Deffo)
Not sure
Kyron Gordon (Deffo)
One of Sam or Jake Kelly (I think they may be twins)
Not sure
Harry Boyes (Deffo)
Tom Williams (I think)
Not sure
Bottom left
Not sure
Not sure
Harrison Neal (Deffo)
Angelo Capello (Deffo)
The other Kelly

Best I've got ...
Click to expand...

Some of them seem to have played for United Futures U19 yesterday. Are the ones who were at the Lane on Saturday the ones that we are keeping?
 
Redhead said:
Sorry to say as poor a trialist as I can remember and we have seen a few.

Played at Swansea in the cup and today and was very very poor. Looked as though he had never played at this level before.

It is very harsh on the regular 23s when at the business end of a season we keep bringing below par trialists in. It puts an end to ant possibility of silverware.

As a final point, if Gilmour, Smith, Slater, Semple and Graham are not required as a first team squad player then 23s football is not enough for them.

They need to play in men’s football where it is about playing your strongest team to win the match.

If the club doesn’t sort it out it will be a travesty ( sorry about the pun )
Click to expand...
Too right it must be so frustrating when you put a shift in week in week out to then play at the business end of the season with trialists that aren’t anywhere near good enough, we could in fact probably would have won that league had we played the young lads all year , Lavery , Carruthers , Thomas and Ched just tossed it off when they played letting the young lads down but also not setting the best of examples to aspiring young players I’d release or move them all on to be fair. Gilmour I think for sure will go out on loan to further his development, Ty Smith with a good pre season could put himself around the first team, Semple every chance of going out on loan, Slater like Smith needs a good pre season to push the first team or he too most likely go somewhere on loan. Young Reedy has proved at Chesterfield what a good player he is no way is he coming back to play 23’s football his future could well determine Gilmour And Slater’s next steps
 



Bergen Blade said:
Some of them seem to have played for United Futures U19 yesterday. Are the ones who were at the Lane on Saturday the ones that we are keeping?
Click to expand...
The ones in your picture signed their papers to be Academy Scholars on Saturday. That is why they were being paraded. So, yes, they've been signed to the next stage of their Academy career. Is that what you're asking?
 
If I was Slater I would be pissed off. No sooner has he made a first team debut than we go and sign 2 more midfielders just to put him back even more.
Smith needs a loan. He will not get first team football next season.
Semple has come back from 13 months out looking very powerful. Needs a competitive loan without doubt.
Gilmour needs first team competitive loan also.

Today I could see these fours frustration with it. Short tempers with each other and their own team mates.
 
Redhead said:
If I was Slater I would be pissed off. No sooner has he made a first team debut than we go and sign 2 more midfielders just to put him back even more.
Smith needs a loan. He will not get first team football next season.
Semple has come back from 13 months out looking very powerful. Needs a competitive loan without doubt.
Gilmour needs first team competitive loan also.

Today I could see these fours frustration with it. Short tempers with each other and their own team mates.
Click to expand...

Wilder has had stick on here for the quality of those 2 midfielders and one is a full international. Slater looks a good prospect but perhaps Wilder thought he wasn't ready to fill Coutts' boots at 18 years old.
Your point that they were bickering whilst losing an U23 game would perhaps back this up.
 
Sorry. I'm a bit late to the party. But, I had to cram two games & a trip to The Wellington in. Tough day in the dirt. I can confirm, I was bickering with my colleagues after that lot. The U21 Futures easily won their Cup SF. Baw Heid U23 Report is spot on. Anyway, last night's blog has my U23 Report, my Futures Report, The Beer & my U23 Away Trip Best Boozers awards.

http://ball-sup.blogspot.com/2018/05/i-only-human.html
 
EddieColquhoun said:
Wilder has had stick on here for the quality of those 2 midfielders and one is a full international. Slater looks a good prospect but perhaps Wilder thought he wasn't ready to fill Coutts' boots at 18 years old.
Your point that they were bickering whilst losing an U23 game would perhaps back this up.
Click to expand...
Whilst I will always take another opinion on board I will chose to disagree with you.

Slater showed to be more than capable of holding down an odd place on the bench .... he was never seen as a replacement for Coutts. More a squad covering player. Now with 2 poor signings he isnt even that.

As for bickering at 23s. If you are brought up by your club to care about results, want to be a winner, ambitious and the rest..... you my friend should and would feel let down that when it comes to the business end of the season and we play trialists, u16s in important games.

Hence frustration will surface. Do not see that as immature, more a winners mentality.

Our very own CW has been known to chuck his toys out the pram when frustrated.

I have watched Ched, Heneghan, Caruthers, Lavern, play for the 23s this season and not give a toss about the result or any of the young players in the side.

What does that say about their attitude.... not much really in my book.
 
As usual, I agree with everybody. Winning breeds winners. The Academy should not just be about minutes on the park. It should be (partly) about trophies. For a start, an Academy which has a proven Winning Mentality is more attractive to parents, kids & "rejects" such as David Brooks. I too have been disappointed with the attitude of First Team Squad players dropping down to U23. Alright, it's sometimes little things. At the end of a game, as the whistle goes, the young lads are patting each other on the back, debriefing, pointing & planning & learning. The First Team Big Lad is at the fence, cuddling his son, having selfies done & discussing progress with his agent (all seen with own eyes).
But, there is a reality as well. First team big lads will sometimes need minutes. Trialists from elsewhere will need a kick somewhere. Our own kids will be out on loan in Mesters Football. At the business end of a season, U23 football is at it's most disrupted. Reality.
What does frustrate me is (like the Slater example), a young lad breaks through, just before a transfer window, the club buys players they can't afford, who aren't fit, who need a full pre season, who are worse than what we've already got & no better than the Young Lad - on 20 times his wage.
I know Dominic CL divides opinion. I'm a big fan. He was first team sub one week, then deadline fucking day, and he'd dropped down to U18 the next Saturday. That was the year we bought Messi...

But, I'm afraid I take an - it is what it is - attitude.
 
As usual, I agree with everybody. Winning breeds winners. The Academy should not just be about minutes on the park. It should be (partly) about trophies. For a start, an Academy which has a proven Winning Mentality is more attractive to parents, kids & "rejects" such as David Brooks. I too have been disappointed with the attitude of First Team Squad players dropping down to U23. Alright, it's sometimes little things. At the end of a game, as the whistle goes, the young lads are patting each other on the back, debriefing, pointing & planning & learning. The First Team Big Lad is at the fence, cuddling his son, having selfies done & discussing progress with his agent (all seen with own eyes).
But, there is a reality as well. First team big lads will sometimes need minutes. Trialists from elsewhere will need a kick somewhere. Our own kids will be out on loan in Mesters Football. At the business end of a season, U23 football is at it's most disrupted. Reality.
What does frustrate me is (like the Slater example), a young lad breaks through, just before a transfer window, the club buys players they can't afford, who aren't fit, who need a full pre season, who are worse than what we've already got & no better than the Young Lad - on 20 times his wage.
I know Dominic CL divides opinion. I'm a big fan. He was first team sub one week, then deadline fucking day, and he'd dropped down to U18 the next Saturday. That was the year we bought Messi...

But, I'm afraid I take an - it is what it is - attitude.
 
Redhead said:
Whilst I will always take another opinion on board I will chose to disagree with you.

Slater showed to be more than capable of holding down an odd place on the bench .... he was never seen as a replacement for Coutts. More a squad covering player. Now with 2 poor signings he isnt even that.

As for bickering at 23s. If you are brought up by your club to care about results, want to be a winner, ambitious and the rest..... you my friend should and would feel let down that when it comes to the business end of the season and we play trialists, u16s in important games.

Hence frustration will surface. Do not see that as immature, more a winners mentality.

Our very own CW has been known to chuck his toys out the pram when frustrated.

I have watched Ched, Heneghan, Caruthers, Lavern, play for the 23s this season and not give a toss about the result or any of the young players in the side.

What does that say about their attitude.... not much really in my book.
Click to expand...

A bit harsh to call Lee Evans a poor signing and it's early to write Leonard off. If Wilder thought Slater deserved a place on the bench he would put him there. Matt Lowton didn't get his start until he was 20. If Slater is good enough, in time he will force his way in. You're going to have Pinchy on if you're not careful!
If the club wanted to prioritize U23 trophies they perhaps wouldn't have let Jordan Hallam or Sam Graham go out on loan, but they're trying to improve these players.
As for the players with poor attitudes, it's no surprise that they can't make the first team squad either.

Not having a pop, pal - I really enjoy you're posts!
 
Ball_Sup (Phil) said:
Sorry. I'm a bit late to the party. But, I had to cram two games & a trip to The Wellington in. Tough day in the dirt. I can confirm, I was bickering with my colleagues after that lot. The U21 Futures easily won their Cup SF. Baw Heid U23 Report is spot on. Anyway, last night's blog has my U23 Report, my Futures Report, The Beer & my U23 Away Trip Best Boozers awards.

http://ball-sup.blogspot.com/2018/05/i-only-human.html
Click to expand...
Thanks again Phil Fine report and now you can take a well earned rest. Just one little comment, if that was a marginally better performance from the trialist than at Swansea, then I'm glad I missed that. OK play him against Birmingham but in a cup semi final?
 
EddieColquhoun said:
A bit harsh to call Lee Evans a poor signing and it's early to write Leonard off. If Wilder thought Slater deserved a place on the bench he would put him there. Matt Lowton didn't get his start until he was 20. If Slater is good enough, in time he will force his way in. You're going to have Pinchy on if you're not careful!
If the club wanted to prioritize U23 trophies they perhaps wouldn't have let Jordan Hallam or Sam Graham go out on loan, but they're trying to improve these players.
As for the players with poor attitudes, it's no surprise that they can't make the first team squad either.

Not having a pop, pal - I really enjoy you're posts!
Click to expand...
No problem at all pal.

My thoughts were more along the lines of Holmes.

When the players at 23s want to win trophies and get into a position to do so only for the club to take a different approach, then I can see where the frustration for the players comes in.
 
Bergen Blade said:
These young lads were introduced to the crowd on Saturday. I think I may have seen a couple of them in a youth tournament here in Bergen three years ago. Do you (or anyone else) know their names?

View attachment 39112
Click to expand...

Lovely to see Derek Geary picking up his first pro contract. Needs to grow a bit though if he’s got any chance making it as a defender.
 
Just as an aside. The beast who came on at half time and went through Mallon was Luke Maxwell and Birmingham's report on the game praised him for making his presence felt. He was signed from Kidderminster for £75k and was on loan to Grimsby for a season. Looked like Mallon took a bad injury, nothing he could do as the beast took him out from the back. It was a red card in a senior match.
 
Stevie Mallon is alright saw him Thursday night walking about no problem, it’s a kick up the arse he needs or all that talent and ability will go to waste, sorry Phil I know you have a soft spot for Mallon and Hallam for me next year is make or break for both of them, if there was a player of the year award for 23’s mine would be Harvey Gilmour gives his all every game even when he might not be having the best of games he always shows for the ball and never hides which can’t be said of them all
 



Ihadadream said:
Stevie Mallon is alright saw him Thursday night walking about no problem, it’s a kick up the arse he needs or all that talent and ability will go to waste, sorry Phil I know you have a soft spot for Mallon and Hallam for me next year is make or break for both of them, if there was a player of the year award for 23’s mine would be Harvey Gilmour gives his all every game even when he might not be having the best of games he always shows for the ball and never hides which can’t be said of them all
Click to expand...
Ihadadream I think we're probably on roughly the same page about Mallon & Hallam.
Mallon needs to find a way of getting in the game, not being peripheral. At times, it's just too fleeting. Potentially, he's a dangerous player - but he doesn't make things happen, he doesn't hurt teams enough.
I always say the same thing about Hallam - he'll play League football, just not with Utd. He's versatile - channel runner, fox in the box, great with dead balls - more than one string to his bow.
Gilmour is an intelligent & committed player. It's telling how much the coaches trust him & pass their instructions to/through him. At Bristol City away he got clattered & subbed. He sat on the bench with an ice pack & was basically Binnion's Assistant Coach for the second half.
Great comments Ihadadream
 
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