Worst manager in the history of SUFC

[Bladesway]

You'll not be at all surprised that I disagree entirely with that.

He's brought in Collins for Bartley, Doyle for Britton, Mattock for a laugh, Bent to boost his pension and Riise for Ward. Riise might be the business but the others certainly haven't been. Lowry is his one positive so far for me.
It's not ALL his fault by any means but I don't think he's covered himself in glory either AND discipline seems to have gone out of the window with a few sendings off.

In fairness we had the worst record for sendings off in the division before he got here. He has only kept things on an even keel here.

 

[Guesty]

The discipline under Carver was horrendous, though.

Edit: Yeah, what he said.

 

[Highbury_Blade]

Olle, i think Riise will turn out to be a decent loan signing, and he certainly has more crossing ability than Jamie Ward. If we stay up, he might be a useful permanent addition.

If we go down, is Andy Liddell still playing? He'd be alright in League 1.

 

[SteelCity Blade]

You'll not be at all surprised that I disagree entirely with that.

He's brought in Collins for Bartley, Doyle for Britton, Mattock for a laugh, Bent to boost his pension and Riise for Ward. Riise might be the business but the others certainly haven't been. Lowry is his one positive so far for me.
It's not ALL his fault by any means but I don't think he's covered himself in glory either AND discipline seems to have gone out of the window with a few sendings off.

I am not missing the point. You are missing the point. Adams is not making the most out of these resources. Warnock would keep this team up, as would many other managers. Adams inherited a team above the relegation zone with a little comfort. He had the opportunity to sign new players, work with the team and has had a fairly easy run of fixtures. He has completely fucked it up. Yes the board should not have sacked Blackwell after 3 games, but yes the Micky Adams should have won at least 3 of those 11 games (arguably more), that is not to mention signing better players, keeping our best, getting the tactics, subs etc right.

Nothing like a good debate on a Thursday morning

Breaking it down to ins and outs is all well and good chaps but it depends on your opinion of the players that have left. I thought Britton was overrated for example and IMO offers no more than Doyle does. Based on their impact it seems difficult to argue with that. I've said countless times that Micky does have a responsibility to improve our fortunes, he is the paid manager of the football club and a degree of responsibility for present results rests with him. I'm not trying to absolve him of blame.....but there are mitigating circumstances. We have had four managers this season, constantly changing personnel, a number of injuries and changes in playing style/shape all the way through. It is hardly surprising that we are where we are. Micky is no idiot although you would like to suggest that he is.....he's won plenty of football matches in the past and had success with several clubs. Do you honestly think his ability to win games as a football manager would just simply vanish? This team has struggled to pick up points all season, yet its the manager with a respectable cv that is to blame???? Dont think so fellas.

You seem quicker to blame the manager than you do the players. That's the crux of my argument. If by some minor miracle we survive and stay in the division, will you be giving Micky all the credit at the end of the season? It would take a tremendous run to stay up now but if they did it.....would that be down to the players or down to Micky? Surely if he's getting all the stick now then he should receive all the praise if he can get us out of it???? All hypothetical at this stage I know, but that still has to be his goal as manager and what if he can achieve it?

Interested to hear both your thoughts on this.

 

[Micalijo]

Nothing like a good debate on a Thursday morning

Breaking it down to ins and outs is all well and good chaps but it depends on your opinion of the players that have left. I thought Britton was overrated for example and IMO offers no more than Doyle does. Based on their impact it seems difficult to argue with that. I've said countless times that Micky does have a responsibility to improve our fortunes, he is the paid manager of the football club and a degree of responsibility for present results rests with him. I'm not trying to absolve him of blame.....but there are mitigating circumstances. We have had four managers this season, constantly changing personnel, a number of injuries and changes in playing style/shape all the way through. It is hardly surprising that we are where we are. Micky is no idiot although you would like to suggest that he is.....he's won plenty of football matches in the past and had success with several clubs. Do you honestly think his ability to win games as a football manager would just simply vanish? This team has struggled to pick up points all season, yet its the manager with a respectable cv that is to blame???? Dont think so fellas.

You seem quicker to blame the manager than you do the players. That's the crux of my argument. If by some minor miracle we survive and stay in the division, will you be giving Micky all the credit at the end of the season? It would take a tremendous run to stay up now but if they did it.....would that be down to the players or down to Micky? Surely if he's getting all the stick now then he should receive all the praise if he can get us out of it???? All hypothetical at this stage I know, but that still has to be his goal as manager and what if he can achieve it?

Interested to hear both your thoughts on this.

What about my thoughts Steel?:hello:

To say nobody else could have done better is almost beyond belief but of course we will never know. Seriously, I think you've made some pretty forthright comments about the benefits of Micky Mouse when he came in and it's all getting a bit difficult for you now in terms of maintaining a reasonable position. Full marks for effort though, good stuff. Yes, he will deserve credit if he turns it round from here but overall keeping us up - no big deal at all.

 

[Grecian2000]

I blame the players just as much as I do the manager(s). It is simply your assertion that "No-one" could get them to win a game that I don't have any truck with.

He's had 2 months and a transfer window to shape the team more to his liking. In my opinion, and I think results are kind of on my side here, he hasn't improved things one jot. In fact I can see Ollies case (which is far more outspoken than mine) that he has, arguably, made it worse.
He has had eminently winnable fixtures and hasn't won any of them and I suggest that there are a fair few managers who would have won at least one game by now.

I am not saying he is the worse manager we've ever had, which is the title of the thread, but he certainly hasn't pulled up any trees either.

PS. In addition to any debate ongoing now, I refer you to page 21 of this forum and a thread started by Mic about "a black day for all blades" or something to that effect. Check out that thread but most pertinently post #10 from Houso where he quotes a Coventry fan from another forum. Scared me then and seems to be getting truer by the day!

 

[Kenilworth]

-our once respected great club-

Shit.. Must have missed that era and I've been a blade for 40 plus years.

 

[oldblade]

Nothing like a good debate on a Thursday morning

Breaking it down to ins and outs is all well and good chaps but it depends on your opinion of the players that have left. I thought Britton was overrated for example and IMO offers no more than Doyle does. Based on their impact it seems difficult to argue with that. I've said countless times that Micky does have a responsibility to improve our fortunes, he is the paid manager of the football club and a degree of responsibility for present results rests with him. I'm not trying to absolve him of blame.....but there are mitigating circumstances. We have had four managers this season, constantly changing personnel, a number of injuries and changes in playing style/shape all the way through. It is hardly surprising that we are where we are. Micky is no idiot although you would like to suggest that he is.....he's won plenty of football matches in the past and had success with several clubs. Do you honestly think his ability to win games as a football manager would just simply vanish? This team has struggled to pick up points all season, yet its the manager with a respectable cv that is to blame???? Dont think so fellas.

You seem quicker to blame the manager than you do the players. That's the crux of my argument. If by some minor miracle we survive and stay in the division, will you be giving Micky all the credit at the end of the season? It would take a tremendous run to stay up now but if they did it.....would that be down to the players or down to Micky? Surely if he's getting all the stick now then he should receive all the praise if he can get us out of it???? All hypothetical at this stage I know, but that still has to be his goal as manager and what if he can achieve it?

Interested to hear both your thoughts on this.

I'm not for getting rid of Adams, but I don't think you can absolve him of all blame.

There are few who would argue against the view that he has inherited a very poor squad of players. However, they were a squad that was just about keeping us above water. We weren't winning many, but we were winning at regular intervals. Our longest winless run before he came was 4 matches and we were averaging over a point a game.

We have gone all 10 matches under him (plus the two before) without a win and we are now averaging less than half a point per game. There may be trouble in the dressing room, but I don't think it helps to publicly slate your players. That isn't going to get them playing for you.

 

[LoughboroBlade]

"poorest manager in our history" is an interesting phrase to read. At this stage, I wouldn't even say he was the poorest in the near-20 years I've been a fan. It was a rubbish team when he came in and it's still a rubbish team currently. A bit different from someone rebuilding a team so catastrophically badly after coming into a promising situation - e.g. Robson or Heath to take simply two. Steve Bruce, given the squad he had, should have done far far better too - we didn't even make the playoffs that year (and didn't look like doing so at any point in the season).

Come back to me if he's had a season of woe in League 1 next year and I might change my mind.

 

[SwissBlade]

This is Good Ollie/ Mic! You two are back to your best on this one

Sorry to say this with such sarcasm, because I think that Mic and Ollie often make some good points, but I find it amusing that these two are in any position to talk about "Worst managers" now, when apparently Blackwell was the worst manager in the history of United!

The pair were amongst the first to push the "Blackwell Out" rhetoric way before the majority did. Of course we all know the storyy from there on in. The irony of Blackwell getting sacked after 2 games against Table toppers QPR and Promotion chasers Cardiff isn't lost here!

Of course Mic was in his element at the departure of Blackwell, the circumstances largely irrelevant, the key being that Blackwell had gone!

So now its all Micky's fault, we're back to the "sack the manager" rhetoric. Well done lads, let the stats work for you, results, league positions and signings thats the key, it tells us immediately that he's a bad manager. So lets get rid. Smart moves lads, smart moves indeed.

So its a results business, we all know that, I expected more from the last three games, 5 points would've been about right, but there was a lot of panic about "Vital February" which I was lambasted for suggesting that I didn't think we needed to go for it and build up the month, it was must win here, must win there. Complete Bollocks.

We didn't need to win at Palace or Scunny. We needed not to lose, A boring draw in those two games would've been fine. It would've kept us within touching distance of an escape

Its very simple to make a sweeping statement of "he's a crap manager". He's actually gone out and tried to get us playing the way we wanted.

The problem for me are:

I actually think he's trying too hard to get a win, 4-4-2 away, 4-4-2 at home... gone are the days where we set ourselves up Not to lose.
He's trying to fix all problems at once. When we keep it tight we don't score, when we play expansively, we score but we concede.
Discipline - Has been a problem all season 8 red cards this season, how many pens have we conceded?
Set pieces - awful in the defending, awful in the attack.

Micky is far from a bad manager, he's trying to make things work. He's bringing players in, but two have left because they saw the chance to get out.

We're hit with new injuries every week, new suspensions and are forced to change things week in week out. Thats not an excuse, thats reality of the situation.

Right now. Micky would do very well to pick up the United phone directory and look Mr K. Blackwell...

 

[frechyblade]

I can feel the splinters from sitting on the fence, I don't know which way to fall!

I agree with some of what Ollie is saying. What you expect from any boss in any field is leadership, determination, motivation, an ability to problem solve and work out a solution, get value for money from the resources available and achieve results. I don'tthink MA has demonstrated enough of any of those.

His teams have shown more commitment and hard work than under the previous regime but you can work as hard as you want if when you win the ball you then give it straight back to the opposition it's pointless. So we now have effort and commitment but no quality.

MA obviously wants to see effort and commitment, not just on match days but also in training during the week, Boggy, like Bartley and Ward, is a poor trainer but displays some flashes of quality in games, where as Cresswell is the opposite works tirelessly during the week, it's probably part of the reason he looks knackered on a Saturday! MA knows what he is going to get from Cresswell.

Is MA the right man for the job, honestly I really don't know. I see the positive impact he had on the work ethic, on the other hand I also heard him say that the job was bigger than he thought! I'm fearful that MY team is going to be relegated, as a blade I'm used to being kicked in the guts, Wigan, Walsall, Chelsea etc. Times are a lot different now the gulf between the haves and have nots is massive and the lower down the league pyramid you go the wider the gulf becomes. As much as I enjoyed the season in the fourth division I don't want to see us down there again, I enjoy 20k in BDTBL making lots of noise. I hope and pray that MA is going to find the formula because I know he is trying, whether that is good enough I really don't know. My head says no my heart hopes I'm wrong.

UTB

 

[Micalijo]

This is Good Ollie/ Mic! You two are back to your best on this one

Sorry to say this with such sarcasm, because I think that Mic and Ollie often make some good points, but I find it amusing that these two are in any position to talk about "Worst managers" now, when apparently Blackwell was the worst manager in the history of United!

The pair were amongst the first to push the "Blackwell Out" rhetoric way before the majority did. Of course we all know the storyy from there on in. The irony of Blackwell getting sacked after 2 games against Table toppers QPR and Promotion chasers Cardiff isn't lost here!

Of course Mic was in his element at the departure of Blackwell, the circumstances largely irrelevant, the key being that Blackwell had gone!

So now its all Micky's fault, we're back to the "sack the manager" rhetoric. Well done lads, let the stats work for you, results, league positions and signings thats the key, it tells us immediately that he's a bad manager. So lets get rid. Smart moves lads, smart moves indeed.

So its a results business, we all know that, I expected more from the last three games, 5 points would've been about right, but there was a lot of panic about "Vital February" which I was lambasted for suggesting that I didn't think we needed to go for it and build up the month, it was must win here, must win there. Complete Bollocks.

We didn't need to win at Palace or Scunny. We needed not to lose, A boring draw in those two games would've been fine. It would've kept us within touching distance of an escape

Its very simple to make a sweeping statement of "he's a crap manager". He's actually gone out and tried to get us playing the way we wanted.

The problem for me are:

I actually think he's trying too hard to get a win, 4-4-2 away, 4-4-2 at home... gone are the days where we set ourselves up Not to lose.
He's trying to fix all problems at once. When we keep it tight we don't score, when we play expansively, we score but we concede.
Discipline - Has been a problem all season 8 red cards this season, how many pens have we conceded?
Set pieces - awful in the defending, awful in the attack.

Micky is far from a bad manager, he's trying to make things work. He's bringing players in, but two have left because they saw the chance to get out.

We're hit with new injuries every week, new suspensions and are forced to change things week in week out. Thats not an excuse, thats reality of the situation.

Right now. Micky would do very well to pick up the United phone directory and look Mr K. Blackwell...

I'm quite offended by that Swiss, I was definitely the first in the Blackwell Out camp.

Comaprisons are irrelevant (ignoring the title of this string) Blackwell was hopeless unless working with a squad which my Auntie Winnie could get results with and is also an utter tosspot, Adams appears to be just hopeless. There's no inconsistencies or ironies Swiss - the exact opposite.

 

[raul]

We didn't need to win at Palace or Scunny. We needed not to lose

Can someone break the news gently to him....?

 

[Grecian2000]

So we didn't need to win the games playing against our nearest rivals? I would have thought that playing against teams that have, throughout the course of the season, proved to be as bad as we are, this would give us our best chance of winning games. Or am I missing something? Do we perform so much better against the top sides that we can target these as better opportunities for gaining points?

Which are the games amongst the last 13 that you think we need to win, presuming you think we actually need to win any of them.

 

[SteelCity Blade]

What about my thoughts Steel?:hello:

To say nobody else could have done better is almost beyond belief but of course we will never know. Seriously, I think you've made some pretty forthright comments about the benefits of Micky Mouse when he came in and it's all getting a bit difficult for you now in terms of maintaining a reasonable position. Full marks for effort though, good stuff. Yes, he will deserve credit if he turns it round from here but overall keeping us up - no big deal at all.

Always good to hear from my sparring partner mic

Beyond belief? With this squad of players? I can half understand the notion that "surely someone" could have done better because but looking at our piss poor squad of apathetic players it is hardly beyond belief that any other suitor would have done just as badly. As for my "position" on this issue, it is simply that I dont feel Micky Adams is responsible for where we are.....winless run or not! I've felt deep down the we would be relegated since the back end of last year and I think we will be regardless of who the manager is or could have been.

You're already playing down the possible achievement of keeping us up. Not that you need to because its looking rather unlikely at this stage.....but if keeping us in the division from this position is "no big deal" how is his winless run a big deal? Cant have it both ways mic. Surely if he keeps us up he's done well? Especially considering the fairly unanimous admission that our squad is crap.

 

[SwissBlade]

So we didn't need to win the games playing against our nearest rivals? I would have thought that playing against teams that have, throughout the course of the season, proved to be as bad as we are, this would give us our best chance of winning games. Or am I missing something? Do we perform so much better against the top sides that we can target these as better opportunities for gaining points?

Which are the games amongst the last 13 that you think we need to win, presuming you think we actually need to win any of them.

No we didn't have to win these games, they weren't must wins. They were must not lose games.

What we needed to do was maintain the pace with those around us in the league. Seeing as though nobody around us is picking up points and we had the added disadvantage of being away from home, then its a big risk to go gungho and try to get 6 points when 2 would've been a reasonable and relatively risk free strategy. I'm not saying to play for a draw, but playing not to lose was more important.

We could've then gone on with less pressure on us, perhaps scraping further points against teams like Derby, Watford, Bristol or Barnsley. Instead those games are now 3 pointers, nothing less will do.

Instead, now we're in a much worse position, 5 points off 4th bottom and 2 off 3rd bottom (with Scunny having 2 games in hand).

The key (in my opinion) in relegation battles is not to get maximum points, but its to keep up with the teams around you, chipping away at their points tally's.

With injuries and suspensions, games coming Tues/ Sat/ Tues throughout this period it was never realistic to think we'd travel and pick up max points at our relegation rivals.

 

[SteelCity Blade]

We didn't need to win at Palace or Scunny. We needed not to lose, A boring draw in those two games would've been fine.

Everyone knows where I stand but this statement is just silly.....even from my point of view!

I can't understand you there at all Swiss. We certainly did need to win those games and we've lost both of them.....which has given us a mountain to climb because its taken the situation well out of our hands. We are now playing catch up. Draws would have been better certainly but now we are in a position where we HAVE to go out and win our next game and that will remain the case until we have overtaken 3rd bottom. Apart from that, good post!

At the end of the day, it is the collective responsibilty of the players, manager and coaching staff to get us out of this.....because whether they've been here all season or not its now their problem. The blame game wont change that fact.

 

[SwissBlade]

Everyone knows where I stand but this statement is just silly.....even from my point of view!

I can't understand you there at all Swiss. We certainly did need to win those games and we've lost both of them.....which has given us a mountain to climb because its taken the situation well out of our hands. We are now playing catch up. Draws would have been better certainly but now we are in a position where we HAVE to go out and win our next game and that will remain the case until we have overtaken 3rd bottom. Apart from that, good post!

At the end of the day, it is the collective responsibilty of the players, manager and coaching staff to get us out of this.....because whether they've been here all season or not its now their problem. The blame game wont change that fact.

So in essence then you agree that they weren't must win, but musn't lose games, which was what I said.

 

[oldblade]

With injuries and suspensions, games coming Tues/ Sat/ Tues throughout this period it was never realistic to think we'd travel and pick up max points at our relegation rivals.

If you can't pick up maximum points against the worst teams in the league it isn't very likely you'll pick them up against the better teams.

As was discussed on another thread. This month was vital, pivotal, whatever you want to call it. Very, very important. we had to gbet a reasonable haul of points . We haven't and we will go down. If we can't win at home to Leicester, Millwall or Reading we're not going to beat Cardiff, Leeds or Forest. And if we can't get anything from Scunthorpe or palace, we're not likely to do so from Portsmouth or Watford.

 

[sheffielder]

Have you ever ever ever admitted to being wrong Swiss?

 

[SwissBlade]

If you can't pick up maximum points against the worst teams in the league it isn't very likely you'll pick them up against the better teams.

As was discussed on another thread. This month was vital, pivotal, whatever you want to call it. Very, very important. we had to gbet a reasonable haul of points . We haven't and we will go down. If we can't win at home to Leicester, Millwall or Reading we're not going to beat Cardiff, Leeds or Forest. And if we can't get anything from Scunthorpe or palace, we're not likely to do so from Portsmouth or Watford.

But its not about wins is it? Its about points and ending the season with more points than 3 other teams in the league.

I agree to an extent that it was important to get a reasonable amount of points, but were we ever going to get max points against our two relegation rivals in the space of 4 days? Of course not. And we all know that playing teams fighting for their lives are more difficult to play.

Have you ever ever ever admitted to being wrong Swiss?

Yes, have I been wrong or do I just have a different point of view?

 

[Micalijo]

Always good to hear from my sparring partner mic

Beyond belief? With this squad of players? I can half understand the notion that "surely someone" could have done better because but looking at our piss poor squad of apathetic players it is hardly beyond belief that any other suitor would have done just as badly. As for my "position" on this issue, it is simply that I dont feel Micky Adams is responsible for where we are.....winless run or not! I've felt deep down the we would be relegated since the back end of last year and I think we will be regardless of who the manager is or could have been.

You're already playing down the possible achievement of keeping us up. Not that you need to because its looking rather unlikely at this stage.....but if keeping us in the division from this position is "no big deal" how is his winless run a big deal? Cant have it both ways mic. Surely if he keeps us up he's done well? Especially considering the fairly unanimous admission that our squad is crap.

Both ways? When we came we were not in bottom 3 therefore no big deal at all if he keeps us up. If however he stumbles across the right mix and keeps us up from 5 points behind then yes he'll deserve some credit obviously but I don't think he should be held as some kind of mircale worker if he does it.

 

[SteelCity Blade]

So in essence then you agree that they weren't must win, but musn't lose games, which was what I said.

No what I'm saying is draws would have been better than what we got - nothing.

It doesnt take away from the fact that we did HAVE to win them. There is no doubt about that because the odds are now stacked largely against us as we knew they would be and we didnt want to end up in this situation.....no one would.

They were must wins in the sense that we needed the points to put the situation in our own hands. Now not only are we desperate to find promotion form.....on top of that we have to rely on other teams losing, a few of whom are starting to pull themselves together:-

Scunthorpe - 2 wins in the last 3
Palace - Unbeaten in 5 prior to Tuesday night
Middlesbrough - 3 wins and 3 draws in their last 8

When the sides above and around you are improving like that, you need to beat them - no two ways about it.

 

[dkc Blade]

Criticise Adams' management all you like, but don't personally abuse him. People won't take a post seriously if it contains personal abuse. I'd like to say that Blades are above that, especially when the manager is one of us, but I am of course wrong.

 

[SwissBlade]

No what I'm saying is draws would have been better than what we got - nothing.

It doesnt take away from the fact that we did HAVE to win them. There is no doubt about that because the odds are now stacked largely against us as we knew they would be and we didnt want to end up in this situation.....no one would.

They were must wins in the sense that we needed the points to put the situation in our own hands. Now not only are we desperate to find promotion form.....on top of that we have to rely on other teams losing, a few of whom are starting to pull themselves together:-

Scunthorpe - 2 wins in the last 3
Palace - Unbeaten in 5 prior to Tuesday night
Middlesbrough - 3 wins and 3 draws in their last 8

When the sides above and around you are improving like that, you need to beat them - no two ways about it.

When the sides above you are improving it also makes it less likely that you'll get the win against them

 

[sheffielder]

When the sides above you are improving it also makes it less likely that you'll get the win against them

and we are getting worse

 

[oldblade]

But its not about wins is it? Its about points and ending the season with more points than 3 other teams in the league.

I agree to an extent that it was important to get a reasonable amount of points, but were we ever going to get max points against our two relegation rivals in the space of 4 days? Of course not. And we all know that playing teams fighting for their lives are more difficult to play.

Well we are supposedly fighting for our lives, but we're not very difficult to beat.

I know it's unlikely we'd win both games (against Palace and Scunthorpe), but one win out of the two games wouldn't have been unrealistic. The fact that we won none and returned with no points suggests to me that playing teams higher up the league away from home is likely to be fruitless as well.

Many of the teams that we've got left to play are playing for automatic promotion places or play off places. I would suggest that if you think teams fighting for their lives are going to be difficult for us to beat, then we've absolutely no chance against sides like QPR, Forest, Swansea, Cardiff, Leeds, Reading or Watford.

By your logic, Preston, Middlesbro, Bristol City, Portsmouth and Derby will also be very difficult to beat as they are all still fighting for their lives. That only leaves Barnsley. And that's a local derby!

---------- Post added at 04:32 PM ---------- Previous post was at 04:29 PM ----------

When the sides above you are improving it also makes it less likely that you'll get the win against them

But if our closest rivals are improving and therefore picking up points, it makes it all the more vital that we do pick up the odd win or two against them. Otherwise we won't make up any ground. We didn't and consequently we haven't.

 

[SwissBlade]

Well we are supposedly fighting for our lives, but we're not very difficult to beat.

I know it's unlikely we'd win both games (against Palace and Scunthorpe), but one win out of the two games wouldn't have been unrealistic. The fact that we won none and returned with no points suggests to me that playing teams higher up the league away from home is likely to be fruitless as well.

Many of the teams that we've got left to play are playing for automatic promotion places or play off places. I would suggest that if you think teams fighting for their lives are going to be difficult for us to beat, then we've absolutely no chance against sides like QPR, Forest, Swansea, Cardiff, Leeds, Reading or Watford.

By your logic, Preston, Middlesbro, Bristol City, Portsmouth and Derby will also be very difficult to beat as they are all still fighting for their lives. That only leaves Barnsley. And that's a local derby!

---------- Post added at 04:32 PM ---------- Previous post was at 04:29 PM ----------




But if our closest rivals are improving and therefore picking up points, it makes it all the more vital that we do pick up the odd win or two against them. Otherwise we won't make up any ground. We didn't and consequently we haven't.

I get your point and in an ideal world I'd hope that we'd get 6 points out of 6, but its always been said that when teams come to the lane that they often set themselves up to be difficult to beat. In fact last season we did that when we went away from home and often it worked.

For me it wasn't as important to jump above Palace in these two games, but to keep in touch. I didn't go to either game so can't really comment too much on if we were too gungho etc, but it sounded like we set ourselves up with an unusually attacking 4-4-2 line up in both games (unusual for us in the past 2-3 years). When we know what we're like at the back for conceding. And lest face it, on the road we've not won since Nov! Why would these two games be any different?

I actually see the games at home, against Boro, Derby, Bristol as more winnable than these two, recovery time is longer, we may get teams coming at us and leaving themselves more open at the back, we could possibly face Cardiff during their annual dip in form...

 

[oldblade]

Or we may get teams coming at us because they know we are rubbish, and scoring a hatful! I have a feeling we could be on the end of a real pasting before too long.

 

[Ollessendro]

Nothing like a good debate on a Thursday morning

Breaking it down to ins and outs is all well and good chaps but it depends on your opinion of the players that have left. I thought Britton was overrated for example and IMO offers no more than Doyle does. Based on their impact it seems difficult to argue with that. I've said countless times that Micky does have a responsibility to improve our fortunes, he is the paid manager of the football club and a degree of responsibility for present results rests with him. I'm not trying to absolve him of blame.....but there are mitigating circumstances. We have had four managers this season, constantly changing personnel, a number of injuries and changes in playing style/shape all the way through. It is hardly surprising that we are where we are. Micky is no idiot although you would like to suggest that he is.....he's won plenty of football matches in the past and had success with several clubs. Do you honestly think his ability to win games as a football manager would just simply vanish? This team has struggled to pick up points all season, yet its the manager with a respectable cv that is to blame???? Dont think so fellas.

You seem quicker to blame the manager than you do the players. That's the crux of my argument. If by some minor miracle we survive and stay in the division, will you be giving Micky all the credit at the end of the season? It would take a tremendous run to stay up now but if they did it.....would that be down to the players or down to Micky? Surely if he's getting all the stick now then he should receive all the praise if he can get us out of it???? All hypothetical at this stage I know, but that still has to be his goal as manager and what if he can achieve it?

Interested to hear both your thoughts on this.

If Adams keeps us up he will deserve credit. Sure. That goes without saying. I think fans will find this awful run hard to forget, but I would forgive him if he keeps us up. Even just showing the signs of being difficult to beat, winning a few games, really scrapping and fighting would go some way. Ultimately results matters and this is the worse start to a SUFC managers career ever. That speaks volumes. You can account for differences in ability in playing staff, but the fact that 3 others (who were all lame) have done better with the same team doesn't look good on Micky.

I am a little mythed as yo why Adams is doing so badly. I always thought he was a hoof-meister, but I have been shocked as to how he has fucked this up.Perhaps it is pressure, it being his boyhood club, new surroudings, coming into a sinking ship. I have no idea. His CV is not that bad, but that doesn't stop him from being the worst manager in our history.

This is Good Ollie/ Mic! You two are back to your best on this one

Sorry to say this with such sarcasm, because I think that Mic and Ollie often make some good points, but I find it amusing that these two are in any position to talk about "Worst managers" now, when apparently Blackwell was the worst manager in the history of United!

The pair were amongst the first to push the "Blackwell Out" rhetoric way before the majority did. Of course we all know the storyy from there on in. The irony of Blackwell getting sacked after 2 games against Table toppers QPR and Promotion chasers Cardiff isn't lost here!

Of course Mic was in his element at the departure of Blackwell, the circumstances largely irrelevant, the key being that Blackwell had gone!

So now its all Micky's fault, we're back to the "sack the manager" rhetoric. Well done lads, let the stats work for you, results, league positions and signings thats the key, it tells us immediately that he's a bad manager. So lets get rid. Smart moves lads, smart moves indeed.

So its a results business, we all know that, I expected more from the last three games, 5 points would've been about right, but there was a lot of panic about "Vital February" which I was lambasted for suggesting that I didn't think we needed to go for it and build up the month, it was must win here, must win there. Complete Bollocks.

We didn't need to win at Palace or Scunny. We needed not to lose, A boring draw in those two games would've been fine. It would've kept us within touching distance of an escape

Its very simple to make a sweeping statement of "he's a crap manager". He's actually gone out and tried to get us playing the way we wanted.

The problem for me are:

I actually think he's trying too hard to get a win, 4-4-2 away, 4-4-2 at home... gone are the days where we set ourselves up Not to lose.
He's trying to fix all problems at once. When we keep it tight we don't score, when we play expansively, we score but we concede.
Discipline - Has been a problem all season 8 red cards this season, how many pens have we conceded?
Set pieces - awful in the defending, awful in the attack.

Micky is far from a bad manager, he's trying to make things work. He's bringing players in, but two have left because they saw the chance to get out.

We're hit with new injuries every week, new suspensions and are forced to change things week in week out. Thats not an excuse, thats reality of the situation.

Right now. Micky would do very well to pick up the United phone directory and look Mr K. Blackwell...

Welcome back Swiss. Being burying your head in the sand I see. I am not surprised with comments like the one below. I see you are tying yourself in knots again and then trying to bore people into submission with tediously long e-mails.

I called for Blackwell as he needed to go. An awful manager (not the worst in our history - but someone who sent us backwards years) that stayed in the job too long. Had a decent team, fucked it up, gradually dismantled it and then was fooked off (way too late). Anwyay, we digress. Are you seriously defending Adams after this 11 game run without a defeat? After letting our 3 best players go and bringing in 6 clowns? After horrendous tactical decisions, poor team choices, inadequate substitutions and generally looking like a rabbit in the headlights? OI wanted him to stand up and be a man. Unfortunately he has managed like a little girl.

No we didn't have to win these games, they weren't must wins. They were must not lose games.

Criticise Adams' management all you like, but don't personally abuse him. People won't take a post seriously if it contains personal abuse. I'd like to say that Blades are above that, especially when the manager is one of us, but I am of course wrong.

No personal insults on here owd cock. Ale house Micky is merely a descriptove way of saying he is a pub manager. Hoofy, pub manager etc are merely affectionate names. I could think of a lot worse.