Wilder transfer window paradox

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He needed a step up in quality and being a typical Sheffielder he can't recognise it, doesn't want it, doesn't understand it and can get by without it.

Sheffield as a city is the same

Demolish a beautiful building, build two cheap eyesores, let them fall into disrepair, create a slum, knock the buildings down again, leave the rubble lying about for years, then build three cheap tacky buildings and start the process all over again.

United's transfer policy works exactly the same way
 

Gannon's perm said:
In the Premier League, we weren't able to buy established Premier League players. Simply couldn't afford them.
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And didn't have the network to shop abroad where they might have been affordable.
 
Chilttheblade said:
You can’t talk about transfer business without talking about sales.
He sold DCL,Ramsdale,Adams and Brooks for peanuts. Didn’t/ couldn’t sell players past there best Fleck ,Norwood ,Clarke Stevens etc etc

Useless ,that’s why he’s gone
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Useless is an absolutely rudiculous thing to say. He gave us 4 of the best years we've ever had. Took us from league 1 to 9th in the prem.
 
Grizzly blade said:
Good to see someone else with some understanding of what happened.
Most in here seem to think Wilder preferred having to buy cheaper players with higher risk and missing out on his top targets.

That exercise in propaganda by the club after Wilder left certainly did the trick for some!

Well we are really reaping the benefits now eh….looking forward to our “expert” owner and his transfer committee bringing in those top players for our new foreign coach.
Everyone thinks “Slav wouldn’t be here if he hadn’t had some assurances on transfers”…well I’m not buying that either…he’s here now, if he walks he gets feck all.

Think we can fully expect a huge battle this season, and a lot of money going back into covering the loans he took out (he had no cash to put up to spend in the premier). It’s about making sure the club doesn’t lose money, which in reality means going backwards.
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"It’s about making sure the club doesn’t lose money, which in reality means going backwards."

Yep, that's what generally a self financing football club means. Our only hope now is that this owner takes the remainder of the prem cash over the next 2 seasons, we somehow establish ourselves in the Championship and he sells us on the cheap, having made his money back and erns a nice tidy profit.

Then hopefully, we can go again?
 
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sonofbruce said:
I dream of us having a scouting network like Brentford. Buy a player from abroad for peanuts. Sell them for a fortune a year later and scout an immediate replacement.
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With all the success they’ve had in that area; i’m amazed nobody has just bought whoever is in charge of the setup and their team?
 
Prem owner needed said:
"It’s about making sure the club doesn’t lose money, which in reality means going backwards."

Yep, that's what generally a self financing football club means. Our only hope now is that this owner takes the remainder of the prem cash over the next 2 seasons, we somehow establish ourselves in the Championship and he sells us on the cheap, having made his money back and erns a nice tidy profit.

Then hopefully, we can go again?
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And as it stands it seems by spending money on loans we are decreasing the value of the club and if we fail to go up…which let’s be honest is likely going to happen, then in 12 months we are in the same boat but with probably even less options and less revenue.

Added to that, by not investing in overseas scouting and facilities we continue to go backwards and risk the shit show that is our transfer committee continuing to fail to find players for the first team.
What a mess
 
Bert said:
Wilder was like a working class lad who never had owt, then won the pools and blew the lot, mostly on rubbish.
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I was going to say something similar Bert. On a shoestring, you’re shopping for bargains, maybe someone a bit older, fallen off the rails, with something to prove, or a complete shot in the dark. With Premier League money, you don’t really need that approach, or at least it shouldn’t be the prominent mindset.
 
Chilttheblade said:
And we are heading back to where he took over.
Do not cry for him,he’s now a multi millionaire
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At least he earned it, unlike some of players we've got ;) .

Don't they talk some rubbish on the TV/Radio,, they all seem to be on about it being a different style of play in the Championship, and that you can't play Premiership type football down here.
So in theory we will need to develop two teams, one that can't play in the Championship in case we get promoted and one that can't play in the premiership to get us promoted.
At least just now we are half way between the two so we must already have a team to play in division 1.... ? ....;)
 
ancientblade said:
wilders transfer policy was abysmal in the last 18 months but just wonder if paul mitchell is getting a free ride here he has to be held partly responsible for this shambles as well
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I want that fat useless cunt out of our club. Him and bald fuck Shieber.
 
Grizzly blade said:
And as it stands it seems by spending money on loans we are decreasing the value of the club and if we fail to go up…which let’s be honest is likely going to happen, then in 12 months we are in the same boat but with probably even less options and less revenue.

Added to that, by not investing in overseas scouting and facilities we continue to go backwards and risk the shit show that is our transfer committee continuing to fail to find players for the first team.
What a mess
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Deja vu, have we not been through this kind of progression before under the McCabe family??
 
Chilttheblade said:
You can’t talk about transfer business without talking about sales.
He sold DCL,Ramsdale,Adams and Brooks for peanuts. Didn’t/ couldn’t sell players past there best Fleck ,Norwood ,Clarke Stevens etc etc

Useless ,that’s why he’s gone
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Who sold Ramsdale? This type of inaccurate finger-pointing serves no other purpose than to validate the infantile mythology that only emphasises that some supporters will say anything in order to prove a point. It's a buyer's market when you're a club who rely on sales to balance the books. Until we are owned by someone whose pockets are deep, someone probably a lifelong Blade, we'll always struggle to compete in the way that many of us would love to happen.....until then, just ain't gonna happen.
 
itsinyerblood said:
Who sold Ramsdale? This type of inaccurate finger-pointing serves no other purpose than to validate the infantile mythology that only emphasises that some supporters will say anything in order to prove a point. It's a buyer's market when you're a club who rely on sales to balance the books. Until we are owned by someone whose pockets are deep, someone probably a lifelong Blade, we'll always struggle to compete in the way that many of us would love to happen.....until then, just ain't gonna happen.
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Last thing we need is another "No bigger Blade than me Seth"

The two richest Blades on the planet are probably Sean Bean and Joe Elliott, and neither of them has as anywhere near as much as McCabe or the Prince
 
JJBlade said:
Last thing we need is another "No bigger Blade than me Seth"

The two richest Blades on the planet are probably Sean Bean and Joe Elliott, and neither of them has as anywhere near as much as McCabe or the Prince
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You miss my point. To attract someone with the necessary wealth was never going to be easy. London, Manchester, or Liverpool, yes, but Sheffield is a different kettle of fish, so probably it would need someone rooted in the Blades to want to take control.

I agree, someone whose affinity isn't matched by the resources required only repeats our recent past. Otherwise I'd like to know what suggestions anyone has for attracting a prospective new owner to want to take control.
 

My biggest disappointment was that Mr Wilder walked,
I never took him for a quitter, I thought he was the kind of bloke who if, and it was bound to happen sooner or later we hit that bad patch he would see it through and come bouncing back,
I'm sure most of the fans would have backed him to the hilt for another shot at the Championship, and if it didn't happen for him again I understand that he may have gotten the bullet sooner or later, but to walk away like that, without being pushed and leave the mess for someone else to clean up was very disappointing....
 
itsinyerblood said:
Who sold Ramsdale? This type of inaccurate finger-pointing serves no other purpose than to validate the infantile mythology that only emphasises that some supporters will say anything in order to prove a point. It's a buyer's market when you're a club who rely on sales to balance the books. Until we are owned by someone whose pockets are deep, someone probably a lifelong Blade, we'll always struggle to compete in the way that many of us would love to happen.....until then, just ain't gonna happen.
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I see where your coming from but £1,000,000 for Ramsdale,similar for DC L and £2,000,000 for Adams was crazy ? They got £10,000,000 for the Kyles. Brooks was worth triple what we got for him a season later.
Wilder just didn’t like young players ,just didn’t seem to trust them,just could not see talent when it was there.
Once a lower Division manager always a lower Division Manager, once a player with little skill you can’t see someone who has some
 
Chilttheblade said:
Wilder just didn’t like young players ,just didn’t seem to trust them,just could not see talent when it was there
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Well that certainly explains why he took Dominic Calvert-Lewin on loan to Northampton, played Brooks 30 times in the Championship, re-signed Ramsdale as soon as he possibly could (to replace Dean Henderson, signed on loan aged 21) and made a 20 year old our record signing.

I can't tell if you're pork or just a moron.
 
Disappointing is a massive understatement...he’s gone from a potential statue and lifelong adulation to the idiot.who brought all these expensive duds and flops to the club....
We got lucky with Ramsdale ...and to get more than we allegedly paid is great business. I can guarantee we won’t get anything like it for the rest of the rubbish ....and don’t get me started on Brewster...
 
Chilttheblade said:
I see where your coming from but £1,000,000 for Ramsdale,similar for DC L and £2,000,000 for Adams was crazy ? They got £10,000,000 for the Kyles. Brooks was worth triple what we got for him a season later.
Wilder just didn’t like young players ,just didn’t seem to trust them,just could not see talent when it was there.
Once a lower Division manager always a lower Division Manager, once a player with little skill you can’t see someone who has some
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At that time Ramsdale was 3rd choice 'keeper. The fact that B'mouth took him, were in a position to make him their first choice was what made the difference, not whether Wilder was incapable of recognising talent. I suspect that DCL's move to Everton, under the eye of a player like Ferguson, was what made the difference to his improvement. To employ a case of if's and only's, in effect distorting the events of the past, is unhelpful and inaccurate. I agree, Wilder made mistakes, they just weren't the ones you describe.
 
Pretty much all of Wilder's windows were decent apart from the disasterous summer window of 2020. That window killed us and we are still reeling from it now.
 
itsinyerblood said:
At that time Ramsdale was 3rd choice 'keeper. The fact that B'mouth took him, were in a position to make him their first choice was what made the difference, not whether Wilder was incapable of recognising talent. I suspect that DCL's move to Everton, under the eye of a player like Ferguson, was what made the difference to his improvement. To employ a case of if's and only's, in effect distorting the events of the past, is unhelpful and inaccurate. I agree, Wilder made mistakes, they just weren't the ones you describe.
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No ,I respect your view ,but to me too many coincidences/ examples. What about his transfers in? Paying fortunes for very poor players tells me he just had no idea of player talent and their values.
He just didn’t have the skills,he should have stayed at Halifax ,that’s his level
 
DeanLearner'sCat said:
Well that certainly explains why he took Dominic Calvert-Lewin on loan to Northampton, played Brooks 30 times in the Championship, re-signed Ramsdale as soon as he possibly could (to replace Dean Henderson, signed on loan aged 21) and made a 20 year old our record signing.

I can't tell if you're pork or just a moron.
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I don’t mind getting into a debate with you but no need for insults
 
Chilttheblade said:
No ,I respect your view ,but to me too many coincidences/ examples. What about his transfers in? Paying fortunes for very poor players tells me he just had no idea of player talent and their values.
He just didn’t have the skills,he should have stayed at Halifax ,that’s his level
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You're not doing yourself any favours. To omit our rise from almost bottom of Div1 to gain promotion to the Premiership was a wonderful achievement. We also lost one of our best midfield players, Paul Coutts whose influence should never be underestimated. These are just a few of the gaps that you've failed to address.

Maybe Wilder wasn't equipped for the top division, but if I recall we had a pretty decent final position in our first season back in the Prem, or was that merely incidental?
Many of our problems occurred via a boardroom that was, and still is, barely able to muster the type of financial clout necessary to compete at mid-Prem level. Before you begin blaming Wilder for all our ills try and recall why we ended up in the Prem.
 
itsinyerblood said:
You're not doing yourself any favours. To omit our rise from almost bottom of Div1 to gain promotion to the Premiership was a wonderful achievement. We also lost one of our best midfield players, Paul Coutts whose influence should never be underestimated. These are just a few of the gaps that you've failed to address.

Maybe Wilder wasn't equipped for the top division, but if I recall we had a pretty decent final position in our first season back in the Prem, or was that merely incidental?
Many of our problems occurred via a boardroom that was, and still is, barely able to muster the type of financial clout necessary to compete at mid-Prem level. Before you begin blaming Wilder for all our ills try and recall why we ended up in the Prem.
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I agree the board are ultimately responsible but I got the impression he could do what he wanted unchallenged.
I think Wilder was lucky and brought success which was great. But getting to the Premiership for one or two years has been done before,by us,Barnsley,Oldham,Swindon Hull,Blackpool just from memory.
My frustration I suppose is that he/we/the club were not able to build on it and here we are back where we started.
 
Chilttheblade said:
I agree the board are ultimately responsible but I got the impression he could do what he wanted unchallenged.
I think Wilder was lucky and brought success which was great. But getting to the Premiership for one or two years has been done before,by us,Barnsley,Oldham,Swindon Hull,Blackpool just from memory.
My frustration I suppose is that he/we/the club were not able to build on it and here we are back where we started.
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Again, reflect on the facts. First season back and we excelled playing the football we'd become accustomed to. Wilder submitted a list of players he felt could strengthen us for the following season. To a man they went to clubs who paid better wages (Cash to Villa being one if I recall?), this is where frustration happened and where we failed to add better quality. Mystifyingly, we never learnt from this and failed to strengthen at the beginning of the following season. Don't know about you, but it makes me wonder about the Board and in particular the Prince.

The Prince took over in a heated dispute with McCabe, this club is now the Prince's, yet having got to the holy land, what happens? We rely on a squad that was aging, still with a few players who, with better additions, might have delivered results that might have meant we'd have remained a Prem club. We'll never know now, but these were decisions of the poorest level. Being a Prem club has so much pull for players who are ambitious. As for your poor appreciation of Wilder, again, we'll never know whether support from the Board would have given him the belief that this club had ambition. I don't mean winning the League, but maybe a cup run, or a season where we gradually improved on the previous season? In all of this I'm also not forgetting the contributions of Knill.

As for where things started to go wrong, maybe internal politics were at the root, maybe strong individuals didn't see eye to eye, and the consequence was the club became a casualty. Rather than grandstand about who did or didn't fuck up I'd prefer to ask those now in power what their intentions are for this club, which assumes they have the ability to answer truthfully and candidly. Treating supporters like adults would be a good start, rather than assuming that they'll follow this club with blind faith.
 

itsinyerblood said:
Again, reflect on the facts. First season back and we excelled playing the football we'd become accustomed to. Wilder submitted a list of players he felt could strengthen us for the following season. To a man they went to clubs who paid better wages (Cash to Villa being one if I recall?), this is where frustration happened and where we failed to add better quality. Mystifyingly, we never learnt from this and failed to strengthen at the beginning of the following season. Don't know about you, but it makes me wonder about the Board and in particular the Prince.

The Prince took over in a heated dispute with McCabe, this club is now the Prince's, yet having got to the holy land, what happens? We rely on a squad that was aging, still with a few players who, with better additions, might have delivered results that might have meant we'd have remained a Prem club. We'll never know now, but these were decisions of the poorest level. Being a Prem club has so much pull for players who are ambitious. As for your poor appreciation of Wilder, again, we'll never know whether support from the Board would have given him the belief that this club had ambition. I don't mean winning the League, but maybe a cup run, or a season where we gradually improved on the previous season? In all of this I'm also not forgetting the contributions of Knill.

As for where things started to go wrong, maybe internal politics were at the root, maybe strong individuals didn't see eye to eye, and the consequence was the club became a casualty. Rather than grandstand about who did or didn't fuck up I'd prefer to ask those now in power what their intentions are for this club, which assumes they have the ability to answer truthfully and candidly. Treating supporters like adults would be a good start, rather than assuming that they'll follow this club with blind faith.
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I can agree with a lot of this.
I think the Prince wanted control to flip the club (and probably McCabe fought him to do the same thing). As he doesn’t know anything about football he gave Wilder his head as he was having success on the field.
This is where I think things started to go wrong. My contention is that Wilder just didn’t and doesn’t have the managerial tools for long term success at this level,the board realised this but before they could take back control from him the damage has been done . The poor decisions on the transfer front merely confirmed what I suspected,that Wilder had just ridden his luck and it just ran out.
I think the future is uncertain,but I hope Slav somehow gathers the strands and the club at least stabilises.
 
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