Wilder got it right today.

[loveWalrusDaveTheBlade]

As I’ve said elsewhere, I will judge based on what I see now, not on what I saw a few years ago. I’ve seen a pattern in how we’ve set up against stronger sides this season (Boro last week being a welcome exception) which hasn’t worked & I don’t rate it. It also fills me with horror at what might happen in the PL next season, if we’re there. So yes, how we set up v Leeds at home will inform my opinions. I have my fears but hope to be pleasantly surprised. My opinion is that we should take the game to Leeds and let them worry about us.

Interesting to see that your position on the influence of selection of the starting 11 vs Leeds has changed from “making a lot of minds up, including mine” to “ informing my opinions”. A more balanced assessment, in my personal opinion. It was your assertion that that sole data point would make up your mind that rankled with me.

Given your stated preference for judging “ based on what I see now”, how would you assess the following, based on your chosen emphasis on recency bias?

Luton (A) : ‘poor’ choice of starting line up. outcome: 3 points.
Most recent trend : 3 points from the most recent match. Back him or sack him?

Middlesboro (H) : ‘ strong’ starting line up. Outcome: 3 points
Most recent trend: 6 points from the last two matches. Back him or sack him?

Portsmouth ( H): ‘ poor’ starting line up. Outcome: 3 points
Most recent trend: 9 points from the last 3 matches. Back him or sack him?

Derby (A): ‘ poor’ starting line up. Outcome : 3 points
Most recent trend : 12 points from 4 matches. Back him or sack him?

Season 23/24: 72 on-field points from 33 matches. Currently the best return of any Manager in the Championship.
Most recent trend : top of the league. Back him or sack him?

You express your concerns about our approach and success rate against the top teams in the division. I share your concerns on this point, but they are largely immaterial with respect to our prospects of promotion. We are not competing in a mini-League of 4 or 6 teams, we are competing in a division of 23 teams ( plus another shambles), and current data show that as of now we are the most effective of the lot.

It “ fills you with horror as to how we might perform in the Premier League next season”. Me too. If we were to use the current squad in the Premier League next season, then we would be served up on toast every week, regardless of the manager, their tactics, or their starting 11. Our prospects for success in the Premier League are entirely disconnected from Wilders choice of starting 11 against Leeds. Our challenge with the current squad is to get promoted from the Championship, not to survive in the Premier League. Attractive, flowing Championship football is no barometer of success in the Premier League. Look at the most recent data - Leicester, Ipswich, Southampton, Burnley, Luton, Sheffield United. Survival in the Premier League depends on an entirely different set of criteria. Those who have done it recently - Forest ( by the skin of their teeth), Bournemouth, Wolves, Brentford etc , have only achieved this through massive cash injections and smart investment decisions - it is these upon which any future success in the Premier League will be determined, in the event that we are able to get there. The questions as to whether Wilder would be the right manager to achieve the task in the Premier League will largely remain uninformed by our performance in the Championship this season. However, they won’t even be relevant questions unless Wilder gets us up this season. To date, he’s making a fantastic fist of that specific job.

I think we all want to see a front foot, attacking line up against Leeds. I doubt that Wilder would want anything different. If he does make a different choice, however, then I hope we respect the fact that he is better informed than any of us in terms of the form in training, the fitness and injury issues, any illness issues etc that are affecting the players available for selection. I don’t for a moment doubt that he would love to put on a from-foot winning performance as much as any of us on this forum, and to do it every week. Life’s not like that.

 

[loveWalrusDaveTheBlade]

Unfortunately not but we can agree he got the first half wrong and rectified it in the second half, and he got the right result - fair I'd say?

I'm far from a Wilder basher... Got huge admiration and gratitude to him and always will for what he's done but he has been making glaringly obvious mistakes lately. Fair enough for him to play Choudhary and Souza together vs Portsmouth - we all saw it didn't work so why try the exact same thing again?

The definition of insanity is repeating the same mistake and expecting a different outcome. Not for one minute suggesting Wilder is nuts but he can be a stubborn fucker.

I think we can certainly agree that he got the right result, because that’s a fact.
If he wasn’t going to start Choudary, then he was starting one of Peck or Davies. Davies is still getting back up to speed and Peck is knackered and at risk of fatigue injury, so what to do? Do what he did, and get the win without exacerbating any of the previous issues. He also got some more time into Choudry’s legs, in case anything happens to Souza. I doubt he thought we’d be as crap as we were in the first half, but other factors were also at play such as completely misjudging the way in which Luton lined up. The ability to react and adjust in real time during the match is a criticism frequently levelled at Wilder - let’s face the fact that he got that right this time.

 

[Jan Age]

I think we can certainly agree that he got the right result, because that’s a fact.
If he wasn’t going to start Choudary, then he was starting one of Peck or Davies. Davies is still getting back up to speed and Peck is knackered and at risk of fatigue injury, so what to do? Do what he did, and get the win without exacerbating any of the previous issues. He also got some more time into Choudry’s legs, in case anything happens to Souza. I doubt he thought we’d be as crap as we were in the first half, but other factors were also at play such as completely misjudging the way in which Luton lined up. The ability to react and adjust in real time during the match is a criticism frequently levelled at Wilder - let’s face the fact that he got that right this time.

I’m one of his fiercest critics but in short summary he fucked up and changed it … can’t ask for more than that

 

[robbiez666]

Why can he change it at half time?

Is it because he has assembled an excellent squad through a comprehensive rebuild, and is using this to its maximum effect?

Is it because we've got one of the biggest budgets in the league?

 

[GymClassHero]

I think we can certainly agree that he got the right result, because that’s a fact.
If he wasn’t going to start Choudary, then he was starting one of Peck or Davies. Davies is still getting back up to speed and Peck is knackered and at risk of fatigue injury, so what to do? Do what he did, and get the win without exacerbating any of the previous issues. He also got some more time into Choudry’s legs, in case anything happens to Souza. I doubt he thought we’d be as crap as we were in the first half, but other factors were also at play such as completely misjudging the way in which Luton lined up. The ability to react and adjust in real time during the match is a criticism frequently levelled at Wilder - let’s face the fact that he got that right this time.

He must've known how it would pan out re Choudhary and Souza though. Dress it up how you like, he took a risk which could've backfired, but yes credit where it's due for being reactive and making the changes early.

 

[loveWalrusDaveTheBlade]

Is it because we've got one of the biggest budgets in the league?

Well, a budget certainly helps, but, as many frequently point out on here, it depends on what ( or who) you spend it on. That's the art of the game.

 

[loveWalrusDaveTheBlade]

He must've known how it would pan out re Choudhary and Souza though. Dress it up how you like, he took a risk which could've backfired, but yes credit where it's due for being reactive and making the changes early.

I doubt that he knew exactly how it would pan out, but yes he took a risk - I'm not trying to dress it up as anything else. He took a risk because he could see the benefit ( saving the legs of Peck and Davies, while giving Choudary much needed game time to help him get up to speed), and considered it a worthwhile balance. Assessed the situation in real time, made the necessary changes when required, reaped the benefits of his plan, and went home with three points in the bag.

 

[Snake]

I think too many people are getting caught up with the starting 11 and initial set up. Football these days has evolved so much that it is no longer a 90 minute game with your 11 strongest players and a couple of subs. Selection, set up and tactics now are viewed over 2, 3 or even 4 phases of the, invariably, 100 minutes or more of the game with 15/16 used out of 20 match day players selected. Players are rotated, rested, protected from injuries, fatigue etc with a view to which phase they will be used. The fact that this was our 3rd game in 7 days also plays a role in selection.

Wilder started with the 11 to try and nullify what he (correctly) foresaw would happen, ie the initial Luton onslaught. They were hurt and well up for it in a game they probably saw as a free hit where they were expected to lose anyway so had the attitude of fuck it, let's steam in. They pumped ball after ball into our box. We stood up to the test.

Then Wilder changed it and we entered the next phase where we gradually wrestled control, got the goal and brought the 3 points home. In the meantime he got game time into players who needed it. He managed to give a little rest to some of the players who will have benefitted from it. And didn't risk a couple of players who may well have aggravated current niggles/injuries and not been available for later games. So, sorry all you amateur football managers, I'll go with what Chris Wilder thinks is best, not only over 1 game, but over 46.

Another 3 points, top of the league, 5 points in front of 3rd place................ that'll do for me!

 

[bertieblade]

The problem that I had with the wilder selection against Luton is the fact that we only had one creative outlet :———— Rak Sakyi who was starved of possession meaning that he only had one meaningful run before he was withdrawn.
He could have rotated Davies, Peck and O’hare as an alternative to one of the two central midfield players who did the same job or gone five at the back and played overlapping fullbacks. Given Brooks a run
It’s easy to be critical but we created nothing in the first half as the team selection and tactics were wrong and allowed them to create chances which they should have taken subsequently proving his ideas for the first half wrong as we just got lucky.

 

[loveWalrusDaveTheBlade]

I think too many people are getting caught up with the starting 11 and initial set up. Football these days has evolved so much that it is no longer a 90 minute game with your 11 strongest players and a couple of subs. Selection, set up and tactics now are viewed over 2, 3 or even 4 phases of the, invariably, 100 minutes or more of the game with 15/16 used out of 20 match day players selected. Players are rotated, rested, protected from injuries, fatigue etc with a view to which phase they will be used. The fact that this was our 3rd game in 7 days also plays a role in selection.

Wilder started with the 11 to try and nullify what he (correctly) foresaw would happen, ie the initial Luton onslaught. They were hurt and well up for it in a game they probably saw as a free hit where they were expected to lose anyway so had the attitude of fuck it, let's steam in. They pumped ball after ball into our box. We stood up to the test.

Then Wilder changed it and we entered the next phase where we gradually wrestled control, got the goal and brought the 3 points home. In the meantime he got game time into players who needed it. He managed to give a little rest to some of the players who will have benefitted from it. And didn't risk a couple of players who may well have aggravated current niggles/injuries and not been available for later games. So, sorry all you amateur football managers, I'll go with what Chris Wilder thinks is best, not only over 1 game, but over 46.

Another 3 points, top of the league, 5 points in front of 3rd place................ that'll do for me!

Well said. Back in the Premier League, we used to piss and whinge about the quality of substitutes that the opposition could bring on during the game. Right now, it's us that can do that to other teams, and we should make the most of that advantage.

 

[GymClassHero]

Well said. Back in the Premier League, we used to piss and whinge about the quality of substitutes that the opposition could bring on during the game. Right now, it's us that can do that to other teams, and we should make the most of that advantage.

The problem with this approach is that eventually our opponents will convert one of the many chances we concede during the 'opening phase', as Snake put it... I'd argue that the starting XI is pretty damn important, hence people getting caught up on it

There is no denying that we rode our luck against Portsmouth and Luton - you only have to look at the recent Hull result as an example of what can happen when you are less fortunate. I fully appreciate the reasoning behind, and benefits of squad rotation, but IMO for it to be effective, like for like changes, or at least a similar balance of attackers - defenders must be used. Wilder completely nullified our creative output on Saturday.

 

[Tazzy]

He was wrong in this game and Portsmouth souza and Chaudry dont work for me

 

[loveWalrusDaveTheBlade]

The problem with this approach is that eventually our opponents will convert one of the many chances we concede during the 'opening phase', as Snake put it... I'd argue that the starting XI is pretty damn important, hence people getting caught up on it

There is no denying that we rode our luck against Portsmouth and Luton - you only have to look at the recent Hull result as an example of what can happen when you are less fortunate. I fully appreciate the reasoning behind, and benefits of squad rotation, but IMO for it to be effective, like for like changes, or at least a similar balance of attackers - defenders must be used. Wilder completely nullified our creative output on Saturday.

I take your point - better teams would have exploited our defensive frailties, but we got away with it ( which, more often than not we will do, and have done) against lower end teams in the Championship. Everything is calculated risk, but I still believe that to be worth it if the benefits are sufficiently large ( which I think they were).
I agree that we were largely nullified in the first half in terms of attacking threat - the starting line up gave us problems, and these were exacerbated by poor performance from those charged with creating forward threat, but I felt that we improved in that regard significantly once Wilder rang the in-game changes to address our problems, and to nullify the threats that Luton posed from their unanticipated starting formation.

 

[KiwiBlabe]

The problem with this approach is that eventually our opponents will convert one of the many chances we concede during the 'opening phase', as Snake put it... I'd argue that the starting XI is pretty damn important, hence people getting caught up on it

There is no denying that we rode our luck against Portsmouth and Luton - you only have to look at the recent Hull result as an example of what can happen when you are less fortunate. I fully appreciate the reasoning behind, and benefits of squad rotation, but IMO for it to be effective, like for like changes, or at least a similar balance of attackers - defenders must be used. Wilder completely nullified our creative output on Saturday.

Watch Benjamin Bloom. He clearly states, teams that consistently win tight games are not lucky, they are good at winning tight games. He makes it clear that he thinks Blades are more likely than Burnley because of this. He sees this ability as a major positive.

 

[finlaytheblade]

He must've known how it would pan out re Choudhary and Souza though. Dress it up how you like, he took a risk which could've backfired, but yes credit where it's due for being reactive and making the changes early.

What's not being taken into consideration in all this Wilder bashing!
We have a medical team and Wilder and the players have to take on board there views and advice , most players want to play even if carrying an injury or running on empty (Peck) they carry a lot of weight these days with the demanding level of fitness required.
Wilder does give us an insight into this but doesn't dwell on it too much even though they have a big say in team selection these days.

 

[vas borbokis]

The anti Wilder bullshit on this site and this thread is getting pretty tedious.

We get it. A few folk think he's the devil incarnate, since he had to walk away from a toxic situation last time he was here, and because you think he took more money out of the club than he deserved.
You hate him.
I get that, but...
He's pulling off a miracle this season to rebuild us from the carnage he walked back into last season.
Add that to his previous promotions with us, with a100 points and 100 goal season to boot.
7 wins in the last 8 games.
But it's not sexy football!!

Just give your heads an examination. Full frontal labotomy needed for some of you! If the cap fits...
UTB & FTP

 

[SE1Blade]

Yes, I think the approach v Leeds is going to make a lot of minds up, including mine.

The approach shouldn’t count for anything, only the result.

If we set up very defensively and win 1-0 I’ll take that all day long over setting up attacking from all angles and drawing 3-3.

 

[GymClassHero]

The anti Wilder bullshit on this site and this thread is getting pretty tedious.

We get it. A few folk think he's the devil incarnate, since he had to walk away from a toxic situation last time he was here, and because you think he took more money out of the club than he deserved.
You hate him.
I get that, but...
He's pulling off a miracle this season to rebuild us from the carnage he walked back into last season.
Add that to his previous promotions with us, with a100 points and 100 goal season to boot.
7 wins in the last 8 games.
But it's not sexy football!!

Just give your heads an examination. Full frontal labotomy needed for some of you! If the cap fits...
UTB & FTP

No Wilder bashing here mate. Fully appreciate what he's done for this club and tbh with regard to his exit previously, I didn't hold it against Wilder and still don't. I think it's naive to take any sides there as ultimately the two people that know fully the ins and outs of it are CW and HRH.

Back to Wilder bashing, as I was saying I love having him as our manager, to have a die hard blade at the helm is special and his years with the Blades will always stand out in the history books.