Why Adkins needs 4 years

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Fromola

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I've been thinking about this a lot and it's time we really need to stick with a manager and we know we've got the right one. This is the man who has won promotions from this league and took Southampton all the way to the Prem. He's a master in the lower leagues but this club has lost its winning mentality.

Every team ends up shaped by the manager if they get the time and Adkins is a winner and a positive thinker. Get rid of the losers, stop selling our best players and give him the money in the summer and he'll deliver.

It we cut Adkins lose where we do go from there?
 



Fromola said:
I've been thinking about this a lot and it's time we really need to stick with a manager and we know we've got the right one. This is the man who has won promotions from this league and took Southampton all the way to the Prem. He's a master in the lower leagues but this club has lost its winning mentality.

Every team ends up shaped by the manager if they get the time and Adkins is a winner and a positive thinker. Get rid of the losers, stop selling our best players and give him the money in the summer and he'll deliver.

It we cut Adkins lose where we do go from there?
Click to expand...

I'd agree with you, if he hadn't been so tactically woeful this season.

If we had finished in the top 6 and lost in the play offs or even just outside the play offs and could see progress then I'd agree with you.

But the baffling tactics, team selection, awful interviews, and poor signings aren't doing anything for his case.

Ultimately managers succeed if they have good players, can motivate and have good tactics...

Bassett had good players for the tactics he used and could motivate players.

Warnock finally got good players in 2003 and 2006 and got success through his motivation and tactics he used to suit his players.

Wilson had good players for this level in 2012, he lost those the following year but through good tactics was still in the hunt.

Clough had okay players and was tactically pretty good, otherwise he wouldn't have been able to outwit so many prem teams in the cups and do well on the counter attack. He also knew the limitations of his players. Motivationally, maybe he didn't get it right last year.

Adkins has poor players and has been awful tactically which is why we're 13th. Whether he can motivate is also up for debt ate. If we get better players, maybe we'll see an improvement, but I do worry tactically and also worry if the players just look at him as if he's David Brent.
 
It's no longer a 'give him time' industry. Owners and fans want positive results in the first 12 months or at least a sign things are improving not going backwards.

With the resources and support Adkins has had at his disposal he's a dead man walking. Who would have thought he couldn't outdo negative Nige? Put that on your cv curly
 
Fromola said:
I've been thinking about this a lot and it's time we really need to stick with a manager and we know we've got the right one. This is the man who has won promotions from this league and took Southampton all the way to the Prem. He's a master in the lower leagues but this club has lost its winning mentality.

Every team ends up shaped by the manager if they get the time and Adkins is a winner and a positive thinker. Get rid of the losers, stop selling our best players and give him the money in the summer and he'll deliver.

It we cut Adkins lose where we do go from there?
Click to expand...

The club could build its longer term future around Adkins, but there do need to be interim goals.
 
Borbokisfreekick said:
I'd agree with you, if he hadn't been so tactically woeful this season.

If we had finished in the top 6 and lost in the play offs or even just outside the play offs and could see progress then I'd agree with you.

But the baffling tactics, team selection, awful interviews, and poor signings aren't doing anything for his case.

Ultimately managers succeed if they have good players, can motivate and have good tactics...

Bassett had good players for the tactics he used and could motivate players.

Warnock finally got good players in 2003 and 2006 and got success through his motivation and tactics he used to suit his players.

Wilson had good players for this level in 2012, he lost those the following year but through good tactics was still in the hunt.

Clough had okay players and was tactically pretty good, otherwise he wouldn't have been able to outwit so many prem teams in the cups and do well on the counter attack. He also knew the limitations of his players. Motivationally, maybe he didn't get it right last year.

Adkins has poor players and has been awful tactically which is why we're 13th. Whether he can motivate is also up for debt ate. If we get better players, maybe we'll see an improvement, but I do worry tactically and also worry if the players just look at him as if he's David Brent.
Click to expand...

Stick with Adkins until he's given good enough players to get us up. Just like with Warnock.
 
Give him 4 years and he'll have us firmly established in League 2, whilst still talking about reaching the Premier League and praising Dean Hammond for all his unseen work on the training pitch in his new role as first team coach.
 
Borbokisfreekick said:
I'd agree with you, if he hadn't been so tactically woeful this season.

If we had finished in the top 6 and lost in the play offs or even just outside the play offs and could see progress then I'd agree with you.

But the baffling tactics, team selection, awful interviews, and poor signings aren't doing anything for his case.

Ultimately managers succeed if they have good players, can motivate and have good tactics...

Bassett had good players for the tactics he used and could motivate players.

Warnock finally got good players in 2003 and 2006 and got success through his motivation and tactics he used to suit his players.

Wilson had good players for this level in 2012, he lost those the following year but through good tactics was still in the hunt.

Clough had okay players and was tactically pretty good, otherwise he wouldn't have been able to outwit so many prem teams in the cups and do well on the counter attack. He also knew the limitations of his players. Motivationally, maybe he didn't get it right last year.

Adkins has poor players and has been awful tactically which is why we're 13th. Whether he can motivate is also up for debt ate. If we get better players, maybe we'll see an improvement, but I do worry tactically and also worry if the players just look at him as if he's David Brent.
Click to expand...

Basset was relegated and allowed time to build again in his image.

Warnock took seven years and was relegated from the Prem in his first season.

Wilson had a Championship team in L1 and failed as players were sold out from under him.

Clough inherited chaos which he combated by bringing in as many players as he could at great expense so we could get 10 men behind the ball against better teams and hopefully eek out a narrow win..they didn't have a clue how to win in L1 against 'lesser teams'

Adkins has inherited Clough's poor players who don't want to play for him or SUFC and only seem to be happy trying to eek out draws/narrow victories against better teams on telly...they need getting rid of which is happening.

Who knows if we'll be better next season with Adkins or someone else...one thing is for certain if Adkins remains and does 'fuck up', you can always get a Warnock type in to make em run through brick walls and stay in L1....it's that poor...
 
Fromola said:
I've been thinking about this a lot and it's time we really need to stick with a manager and we know we've got the right one. This is the man who has won promotions from this league and took Southampton all the way to the Prem. He's a master in the lower leagues but this club has lost its winning mentality.

Every team ends up shaped by the manager if they get the time and Adkins is a winner and a positive thinker. Get rid of the losers, stop selling our best players and give him the money in the summer and he'll deliver.

It we cut Adkins lose where we do go from there?
Click to expand...

Bacon anyone?
 
Smirth said:
Give him 4 years and he'll have us firmly established in League 2, whilst still talking about reaching the Premier League and praising Dean Hammond for all his unseen work on the training pitch in his new role as first team coach.
Click to expand...
I think that is optimistic. Give this clown 4 years and we will be in the Vanarama League.
 
We 'know we've got the right one' do we despite overwhelming evidence from this season where he's barely done a single thing right?

Football moves on, managers have good spells just like players do, some managers get very lucky. It looks like Adkins is one of those. Just how long can we witness total incompetence but look at his CV and pretend things will be OK?

The only argument not to sack him is nothing based on his performance. When that's the case with a manager the right thing to do should be to sack him. But the squad's an even bigger problem and do we want to throw away our transfer budget on his pay off? Or would it be worse to let him spend more money and reshape the squad? What a total fucking mess, and a horrible dilemma.
 
Fromola said:
It we cut Adkins lose where we do go from there?
Click to expand...

Freudian slip maybe? :confused:

However, I do feel he should be given more time with a performance target for next season. Playoff position by Christmas or something like that. Then everyone knows where they stand.
 
Deano said:
I think that is optimistic. Give this clown 4 years and we will be in the Vanarama League.
Click to expand...

Yes, let's get Holloway in quick before it's too late.........o_O
 



mosbolad said:
Freudian slip maybe? :confused:

However, I do feel he should be given more time with a performance target for next season. Playoff position by Christmas or something like that. Then everyone knows where they stand.
Click to expand...

I keep advocating performance targets without really being sure what they should be.

The benefit is it's not just a free hand and it sets standards, the drawback is they're often arbitrary, restrictive, and even damaging.

Hit the target. Miss the point.
 
William Henry Foulkes said:
I keep advocating performance targets without really being sure what they should be.

The benefit is it's not just a free hand and it sets standards, the drawback is they're often arbitrary, restrictive, and even damaging.

Hit the target. Miss the point.
Click to expand...

What would this seasons target have been were you or I the Chairman Fatty? I would think the playoffs minimum (if we'd set them at the start of the season)? As it stands we aren't even in the top half of the league.

However, having said that I do feel we ought to keep on with Adkins. He was universally acclaimed when he came here, can't think of any dissenters. Next season though (if he gets there, as I am sure McCabes finger will be on the trigger), I would have firm performance/positional targets in place, maybe playoff position by Christmas.

Then if he fails, not necessarily an automatic sacking but a good look at the prevailing conditions on and off pitch before reaching a decision. Same goes for the end of the season. Easier said than done though as I won't be paying the compo (same goes for all the 'fans' saying get shut).......
 
Fromola said:
I've been thinking about this a lot and it's time we really need to stick with a manager and we know we've got the right one. This is the man who has won promotions from this league and took Southampton all the way to the Prem. He's a master in the lower leagues but this club has lost its winning mentality.

Every team ends up shaped by the manager if they get the time and Adkins is a winner and a positive thinker. Get rid of the losers, stop selling our best players and give him the money in the summer and he'll deliver.

It we cut Adkins lose where we do go from there?
Click to expand...

Great post.
You clearly caught a few morons out with this April fools :D
 
ps - I'd give him life, without parole.
Too harsh?
Don't think so.
One or 2 I'd have given the death penalty, to save others from their destruction.
 
I can see the case for the prosecution and the defence so I'd ask him one question to decide his fate.....do you intend to sign Hammond on a permanent.... if he does he should be sacked as it's clear he's gone at the game and it's a 'mates decision'
 
And if he got 4 years, where does the OP think we should be?

Still fucking about in the 3rd division?
A stable championship side?
Premier league?
4th division?

What do we get for our 4 year investment in David Brent?
 
Ricky said:
We 'know we've got the right one' do we despite overwhelming evidence from this season where he's barely done a single thing right?

Football moves on, managers have good spells just like players do, some managers get very lucky. It looks like Adkins is one of those. Just how long can we witness total incompetence but look at his CV and pretend things will be OK?

The only argument not to sack him is nothing based on his performance. When that's the case with a manager the right thing to do should be to sack him. But the squad's an even bigger problem and do we want to throw away our transfer budget on his pay off? Or would it be worse to let him spend more money and reshape the squad? What a total fucking mess, and a horrible dilemma.
Click to expand...
A dilemma indeed, but deep down you know there is only one way we have to go.
 
mosbolad said:
What would this seasons target have been were you or I the Chairman Fatty? I would think the playoffs minimum (if we'd set them at the start of the season)? As it stands we aren't even in the top half of the league.

However, having said that I do feel we ought to keep on with Adkins. He was universally acclaimed when he came here, can't think of any dissenters. Next season though (if he gets there, as I am sure McCabes finger will be on the trigger), I would have firm performance/positional targets in place, maybe playoff position by Christmas.

Then if he fails, not necessarily an automatic sacking but a good look at the prevailing conditions on and off pitch before reaching a decision. Same goes for the end of the season. Easier said than done though as I won't be paying the compo (same goes for all the 'fans' saying get shut).......
Click to expand...

This season the short term and long term goals have been in conflict.

It's very hard to write off a season from the outset so play-offs would've been a minimum.

The other side of this is what if we're 10th at Christmas next season but playing good football, creating chances, and not putting them away.

The number of very good chances we've created and missed recently is getting ridiculous.

As it stands we're not a million miles from wins at Rochdale, Fleetwood(?), Southend, and a 4-0 at half time 6-0 at full time hammering of Crewe.

Any target too specific and you might shoot yourself in the foot but no targets at all and you can get away with murder.

Short answer: Don't know :-)
 
Fromola said:
I've been thinking about this a lot and it's time we really need to stick with a manager and we know we've got the right one. This is the man who has won promotions from this league and took Southampton all the way to the Prem. He's a master in the lower leagues but this club has lost its winning mentality.

Every team ends up shaped by the manager if they get the time and Adkins is a winner and a positive thinker. Get rid of the losers, stop selling our best players and give him the money in the summer and he'll deliver.

It we cut Adkins lose where we do go from there?
Click to expand...
 
Fromola said:
I've been thinking about this a lot and it's time we really need to stick with a manager and we know we've got the right one. This is the man who has won promotions from this league and took Southampton all the way to the Prem. He's a master in the lower leagues but this club has lost its winning mentality.

Every team ends up shaped by the manager if they get the time and Adkins is a winner and a positive thinker. Get rid of the losers, stop selling our best players and give him the money in the summer and he'll deliver.

It we cut Adkins lose where we do go from there?
Click to expand...
What a foolish man you are
 
William Henry Foulkes said:
This season the short term and long term goals have been in conflict.

It's very hard to write off a season from the outset so play-offs would've been a minimum.

The other side of this is what if we're 10th at Christmas next season but playing good football, creating chances, and not putting them away.

The number of very good chances we've created and missed recently is getting ridiculous.

As it stands we're not a million miles from wins at Rochdale, Fleetwood(?), Southend, and a 4-0 at half time 6-0 at full time hammering of Crewe.

Any target too specific and you might shoot yourself in the foot but no targets at all and you can get away with murder.

Short answer: Don't know :)
Click to expand...
First paragraph. I should have included this in my list of problems. Our goals are too many, too diverse and, as you say, conflicting.

It seems that since we've been in L1 our goals have been;

Get promoted quickly.
Play 'good' football.
Bring youth team players through.

Whilst it isn't impossible to get promotion playing good football and developing young players it tends to take time and a club that's well run from top to bottom.

We've stood somewhere between trying to go up quickly whilst wanting to play attractive football and develop youth players and struggled to get the balance right. Either Adkins or his replacement should have one goal - get us up. If that means a Warnock style team of journeymen keeping it tight at the back and getting it into the mixer, so be it. We can only have one priority and that's promotion.
 



He won't get 4 years, no manager gets 4 years unless we are talking prison sentences.

2-3 years, yes I think he deserves that time to build his squad.

Or we sack him now and get someone else in who if they don't hit the ground running will be sacked at the end of next season and keep repeating that process til we wing promotion.
 
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