Sothall_Blade
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1999 to May 2006=7 years what ever way you look at it.
5.5 years to build the team. 6.5 years to get promotion.
West Ham and Tevez, also culpable.
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5.5 years to build the team. 6.5 years to get promotion.
4 out of them 5 achievements were all in one season.Lets see what he did in the other 5 seasons,achievement wise.
P
pommpey
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Is it so difficult for people to see this?
Okay - so some games he was baffling in his team selections. His post match etiquette left things to be desired. He was moderately (to some) embarrassing stood on the touchline ranting at the lino.
But if you scooped up all the woeful excuses for managers since (bar Cluff, as he has to fulfil his potential) you would not even equal thirty per cent of what Sheffield United got out of Neil Warnock. Go on ... tell me I am wrong. Robson, Blackwell, Adams, Wilson, Weir ... look at their output both on and off the pitch and how we played, and compare that to the seasons at BDTBL where we actually looked and played in the manner of a team from one of the nation's biggest cities. Before him you have to go back to Spackman to even garner any comparison with a team worthy of a place in the top flight.
It's time people recognised Warnock and his place in the Blades history with some respect and favour, rather than singling out areas of his stewardship that pale in comparison to Weir's cluelessness, Kendall and Robson's drinky-drinky, Agent Wilson's ability to produce bland, colourless football, Blackwell's puzzling uselessness and Adams patent punch-above-weight lack of ability.
pommpey
Ok,what i will add before we carry on is,i do support the idea of giving the manager time to succeed,so don't think i didn't appreciate what he built,i was just trying to get some points or facts out.
LSF
Active Member
Angering me?? LOL, fair question but if you are a Blade surely I don't have to point out the good years we enjoyed under him! Lasting value? Not sure of your angle here but personally I still get a warm glow thinking about some of the great nights ( and days) we enjoyed.
Compare that to some of the shite immediately preceding and succeding him.
If you can't acknowledge that then I can't go.
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pommpey
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Warnock must have been equally laughing his cock off and silently shedding a tear since May 2007 and his departure. He is laughing because this bellend of a chairman, who he never saw eye to eye, has consistently appointed a string of ever-worsening managers, resulting in us sinking into the swamp, and then not having the energy to haul ourselves out. Under Warnock, at least the team had a fairly decent shape, some pretty capable players either brought in or brought through and the ability to make Sheffield United a topic of conversation rather than make us ignored, reviled and insignificant. Hopefully that feeling is back after us being under the guidance of a series of underachievers, and wasting countless pounds on shit players.
pommpey
pommpey
Silent Blade
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obviously you didnt read NOTW's back page in the morning of the Wigan game. I remember clearly that he was moaning about not been offered a new contract by the SUFC board. On reading the news "I knew" that we would lose to Wigan later in the day. It was very stupid of him to cause negative vibes when preparing for an important match and I was right about that. I did believe Man U would easily beat West Ham but unforunately they didnt
nowtfancy
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I'm 41, in my lifetime we've had 3 episodes or eras of achievement, under Porterfield Basset and Warnock. I'll always be grateful to them for providing the memorable highs. Hopefully Clough can make that 4, I certainly enjoyed the last half of last season and am more optimistic than I've been for a while.
I never took to spackman at the time, and I think that's borne out by his subsequent record.
UTB
Sothall_Blade
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I didn't read it but If it was in the News of The World it must be true.
Do you think it's possible that Warnock wasn't behind such an article being published on the day of the match?
Could it have been the NOTW trying to sell newspapers by raking up old interviews and create a bit of a stir?
I wonder if any West Ham fans worked for the London-based downmarket tabloid?
metalblade
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I can't deny Warnock was a great manager for us although I don't think the team he inherited from Heath was as bad as the league position suggested. When he took over crowds were down in the low teens and he slowly built crowds up to 30,000 every game by the time he left us. By 2003 and the triple assault season everyone wanted to be a Blade, if you walked down the street with a Blades shirt on cars would beep and young ladies would give you a wave there was only one team in Sheffield. Where did it all go wrong ? maybe at the Millennium stadium with the pre match shenanigans and our subsequent no show. Good for SUFC yes but always a bit of an embarrassment too, always moaning at the ref or linesmen little wonder we got so few penalties awarded. It soon became obvious the officials were never going to give us anything that wasn't a nailed on cert while Warnock was our boss. If he wasn't falling out with the ref's it was other managers (although I'd like shake his hand for chinning Stan Ternent). The thing is with Colin he has to be the centre of attention and in doing so he brought a lot of bad feeling down on the club which he supposedly loves, big Blade my arse. A day before a Sheffield derby he was talking to Portsmouth about becoming their manager all to try and lever a better deal for himself at the lane, same again before the crucial Wigan game all he was bleating on about was his contract.
Warnocks up an at em style was ok at the time but that can only take you so far, he was never going to be a success in the Premiership he wasted shit loads of money on some of his transfer dealings he was far better shopping in the bargain basement. Good times but they could and should have been a lot better had it not been for Colin's ego and me me me attitude.
Warnocks up an at em style was ok at the time but that can only take you so far, he was never going to be a success in the Premiership he wasted shit loads of money on some of his transfer dealings he was far better shopping in the bargain basement. Good times but they could and should have been a lot better had it not been for Colin's ego and me me me attitude.
I'm not saying you're right or wrong on whether Warnock did or did not say he was bothered about his contract before the Wigan game.What i will say though is why should we all believe what Warnock has put in his book over the NOTW.There is such a thing as fiction.I didn't read it but If it was in the News of The World it must be true.
Do you think it's possible that Warnock wasn't behind such an article being published on the day of the match?
Could it have been the NOTW trying to sell newspapers by raking up old interviews and create a bit of a stir?
I wonder if any West Ham fans worked for the London-based downmarket tabloid?
alcoblade
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An argument with a modicum of merit in 2007, that feels like the punchline to a joke 7 years later in our 4th year of 3rd division football.
UTB
metalblade
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I've read all the arguments for and against in this thread and I have only 5 words to contribute...
'Sir' Neil Warnock - Blades Bellend!
Fixed !
Sothall_Blade
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Well we could examine which scenario is most likely:-
1) A NOTW reporter who is paid to come up with interesting, contentious stories that will sell newspapers, decides to dig out a few old quotes and go with the "Warnock unhappy about contract" angle on the big match of the day.
2) Warnock decides that instead of preparing for the most important match of his career, he'll ring up the NOTW and ask them to do a big splash about his contract situation. After all, when the story appears just a few hours before the match, it's bound to make McCabe immediately come running to his door with a better contract offer.
Either way, it's a moot point. Does anybody seriously believe that the NOTW's back page caused the team to lose against Wigan? Was Webber fretting about Warnock's pay grade when his shot hit the post instead of going in? If he'd scored, none of this nonsense would ever have been dragged up.
grafikhaus
Kraft durch Freude
Quite right, too. Can't go hurting Spam and their 'fans' can we? Their future is secure. Flog Upton Park for squillions and move for free into the Olympic stadium to get Lord 'Legacy' Coe out of the shit with his multi-billion pound sports day.
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pommpey
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Thing is, Metal, your argument cancels itself out somewhat. You are saying that when Warnock was in charge, the whole Sheffield United machine was massive and fearful, and most of Sheffield was upholding the team. That is kind of how I recall it, even 220 miles away on the south coast. But look at Chelsea with Mourinho. Look at Arsenhole with Wenger. ManUre with Ferguson. You don't get that return without personality and ego. Warnock was all ego. He also buoyed the team along with it - just watch that documentary and it is clear to see, when they fucked up, he let them have it ... when they won, they were all in his back garden pissing up and eating from his barbecue. I like that kind of leadership because as he used to stand on that touchline in front of the south stand, everything that was coming from his right, and behind him, and in front of him mattered a lot and if it was jubilation, you could see him dancing along with it. I had a backstage with him in 2000 when we played Huddersfield in a night match and we played fucking awful, but won one nil. He was furious, but said, "Vic, it's three points. We won. What do they want?" Which is totally true. I didn't see any of that human factor with Robson, nothing but billy-bollocks from Blackwell (who was, without a doubt, the best assistant we had at BDTBL) and precious little else to speak about from Wilson, and the rest. He was - and still is - a big Blade but I doubt he will be back. The Palace fans (those who like him) will be similarly rubbing their hands now because since Holloway, they have had little personality and spice in the club which, like us, should be punching way above its weight given its location and support. I know that Cluff is our talisman here and I know that everyone knows it as well and expects this club to do it's cyclic upturn now we have a manger of calibre in charge. Cluff isn't an egotist, but he is nobody's fool either, and this board would do better than to learn from the mistakes with Warnock the last time we were on an upturn (and Bassett, and Harris before that) and entertain his plans for building the squad based upon what I assume was part of his 'come and manage our club' pitch by McCabe and his team.
pommpey
oldblade
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Could have sworn we were looking like relegation certainties with half the season gone when he came along, and yet we avoided relegation with several games to spare. Is that not an achievement? Obviously not if you happen to be Neil Warnock.
Looking at what has happened over the last 7 years, I would say it would seem to be a pretty tangible achievement. We are now in our fourth consecutive season in the third division, which shows that subsequent managers have had some difficulty getting us out that division, let alone keeping us out of it.
He also achieved promotion to the premier league, which is something I haven't seen any of the managers following him achieve, even though some of them actually had a higher wage bill in the championship than Warnock had for the premier league season.
During the 2005-6 promotion season, Warnock's wage bill was less than that for the side relegated to the third division in 2010-11. And it was only just over half what Robson and Blackwell had in seasons 2007-8 and 2008-9. Both failed to do what Warnock did.
For myself I would say he also produced sides that actually entertained. Generally Bramall Lane was a good place to be, and other sides (even premier league sides) feared going there. Usually there was something worth watching. Not every game was great, but then that was the same under Bassett, and even under John Harris we were poor sometimes.
But, hey ho, Warnock was a tactical numpty who achieved nothing, and took far too long to achieve nothing.
Z
Zanzibar
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Well, I've upset some posters obviously.
Achievements are those things which enter the archives as solid goals won....not memories as some suggest.
I too remember 2002/3 as a good season like many others, but they are memories not archiveable achievements....unless finishing second in some competitions that year, as well as we played, is important.
Yes, promotion to the Premiers is listed as fact but as Wizardry has said it took seven years to get there and the finishing positions in each of those years are factual and traceable.
Of course the other thing which is factual is instant relegation after being ten points ahead of West Ham and beating them 3-0.
Memories are fine and football is full of them but each of us can get several different of them out of the same match.
Winner write history and I'm afraid in my United lifetime we have won very little worth recording on the big stage.
Hope springs eternal though, although the sands of time are ruthless.
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pommpey
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So, Warnock aside ... apart from a fourth division championship title two generations ago ... what have we won anyway? We reached semi finals outside Warnock's tenure, and jumped and fell at other opportunities and in a manner way below what we'd expect.
Warnock gave us seven bloody good years and we should be grateful for that, just as much as we are for Harry and John Harris. Everyone else outside this subset should be open to more examination, in particular the recent clutch of non-achievers.
pommpey
Re Chinning Ternent....According to Ternent's autobiography he chinned Blackwell but is now mates with him but he can't stand Warnock
As you say ypurself winners write history and seen as we have won fuck all for the best part of a century promotions and doubling the attendance figures are achievemnts
Some would say basset was better thats debateable , the rise in attendance figures sides overwhelmingly with warnock , john harris didnt win anything neither did spackman kendall and only porterfield has (the 4th division championship ) which begs the question who was a good manager then ?
Cyprus Blade
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Achievements are relative I suspect - my father (in his nineties) was 3 months old when we last won the cup. In my lifetime we have had a few promotions (usually as runner-up), play-off's (which we are crap at) and semi-finals ( I almost forgot the dizzying heights of the Watney cup final - which we lost on penalties) - still pondering why we both support United - guess its in the gene's, because we do and because we still have hope. UTB
oldblade
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Glad you are dictating to us what an achievement is. Here's my take on it.
An achievement is something that is accomplished or performed successfully. It does not have to be something that enters the archives. It can be anything that anyone considers to have been a successfully accomplished task, whether tangible or intangible.
Doubling our attendances is an achievement. Securing our second division status, when we looked relegation certainties is an achievement, just as a promotion is an achievement.
Every victory in any game is an achievement and getting through several rounds of two cup competitions often against opposition from a higher league are achievements.
And , yes, making people feel good about going to Bramall Lane is an achievement, just as giving thousands of people many, many good memories is most definitely an achievement.
Warnocks greatest achievement was making us the top team in yorkshire elavating us over the pigs and leeds , 2 clubs who had treated us like a laughing stock in my lifetime
It was nice while it lasted
It was nice while it lasted
Greenwich Blade
Hitch-Hike General
Who was manager when we last won the County Cup?
This thread really is beyond me. Dave Bassett and Neil Warnock gave me my best moments as a Unitedite, and if I had been a bit older than just 5 when I went to my first game in 1971 I would have appreciated the Harris Years also.
Bassett and Warnock also gave me some of the worst moments (Stamford Bridge 1994, Wigan at home 2007), but then as the song goes, "I beg your pardon, I never promised you a rose garden."
I too will define achievements for myself thanks, and 2002/03 for example was full of them, including winning 4-2 at Brighton when we were 2-0 down and playing crap.
Heath's squad wasn't that bad? Neither was Clough's last season, but they looked the worst squad since 1981 before Christmas. January to May last season was also some achievement, and you know what? I enjoyed it more than any season (including the promotion season) since the Triple Assault.
Right, back to the cricket - come on Yorkshire! Achieve something!
This thread really is beyond me. Dave Bassett and Neil Warnock gave me my best moments as a Unitedite, and if I had been a bit older than just 5 when I went to my first game in 1971 I would have appreciated the Harris Years also.
Bassett and Warnock also gave me some of the worst moments (Stamford Bridge 1994, Wigan at home 2007), but then as the song goes, "I beg your pardon, I never promised you a rose garden."
I too will define achievements for myself thanks, and 2002/03 for example was full of them, including winning 4-2 at Brighton when we were 2-0 down and playing crap.
Heath's squad wasn't that bad? Neither was Clough's last season, but they looked the worst squad since 1981 before Christmas. January to May last season was also some achievement, and you know what? I enjoyed it more than any season (including the promotion season) since the Triple Assault.
Right, back to the cricket - come on Yorkshire! Achieve something!
Silent Blade
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YES WE LOST!!
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