Well done England ...

[Bashar Al Asaba]

To most of us England and Blades fans it was a decision made early and the truth to us is you do not end your support with your club through the bad times and it is the same with the nation you choose to support.
So if you were a fan of England and decided to abandon that support because you felt crap about England then that is the point me and many others are making.
To many of us, you may as well have abandoned United though the bad times.

Sheffield United are more important than Engerland.

Get over it.

 

[Bashar Al Asaba]

Can't remember which poster it is but one of ours used to be an ex chesterfield season ticket holder. He turned his back on them due to many of their fans being dickheads. Done a quick search and can't find the thread or member.

TBW57

And I understand where he's coming from, even though I could never do the same.

I don't like most of our fans, but the love is too ingrained for me to ever disassociate from United. Plus if I walked away I'd be letting the pricks win.

 

[Bruce Wayne]

Sheffield United are more important than Engerland.

Get over it.

Sheffield United are more important than any other team fact. But since we are in pre season England are coming a close second. I am enjoying this far more than I expected and I can't wait for Wednesday evening.

 

[Yellarbellyblade]

Sheffield United are more important than Engerland.

Get over it.

Just don’t get why so many think it has to be either or as though supporting England somehow makes you less of a Blade.

Club side = Blades
National side = England

They’ll never play each other what’s the conflict?

 

[Bashar Al Asaba]

Sheffield United are more important than any other team fact. But since we are in pre season England are coming a close second. I am enjoying this far more than I expected and I can't wait for Wednesday evening.

I'm glad you're enjoying it.

In fact I'm glad everyones enjoying it, genuinely.

Unfortunately, some people clearly aren't enjoying it enough because they're bitching and whining that some of us aren't all that bothered instead of getting on with their lives.

 

[Bashar Al Asaba]

Just don’t get why so many think it has to be either or as though supporting England somehow makes you less of a Blade.

Club side = Blades
National side = England

They’ll never play each other what’s the conflict?

There is no conflict.

Some fans are die-hard United and are also fervent England fans. One doesn't have to negate the other.

I'm an incurable, fanatical Unitedite who just happens to be largely indifferent to England and is put off by the attitudes of many of their followers.

 

[Bruce Wayne]

I'm glad you're enjoying it.

In fact I'm glad everyones enjoying it, genuinely.

Unfortunately, some people clearly aren't enjoying it enough because they're bitching and whining that some of us aren't all that bothered instead of getting on with their lives.

You not watching the semi final then?

 

[derfblade.3]

There is no conflict.

Some fans are die-hard United and are also fervent England fans. One doesn't have to negate the other.

I'm an incurable, fanatical Unitedite who just happens to be largely indifferent to England and is put off by the attitudes of many of their followers.

In other words.....a miserable git!

 

[coolhandluke]

" Nationalism is not to be confused with patriotism. Both words are normally used in so vague a way that any definition is liable to be challenged, but one must draw a distinction between them, since two different and even opposing ideas are involved. By ‘patriotism’ I mean devotion to a particular place and a particular way of life, which one believes to be the best in the world but has no wish to force on other people. Patriotism is of its nature defensive, both militarily and culturally. Nationalism, on the other hand, is inseparable from the desire for power. The abiding purpose of every nationalist is to secure more power and more prestige, not for himself but for the nation or other unit in which he has chosen to sink his own individuality. "

I quite like this definition of both patriotism and nationalism . Basically patriotism is defined by a love of one's own country . Nationalism, however is defined by a hatred of others and a desire to subsume them to our will .

I'm an English patriot and proud

 

[Isaw Joeshaw]

PATRIOTISM by. Sir Walter Scott

Breathes there a man with soul so dead
Who never to himself hath said
" This is my own , my native land ! "
Whose heart hath ne'er within him burned
As home his footsteps he hath turned
From wandering on a foreign strand ?
If such there be, go mark him well
For him no Minstrel raptures swell
High though his titles , proud his name
Boundless his wealth as wish can claim
Despite those titles , power and pelf *
The wretch , concentred all in self
Living , shall forfeit fair renown
And doubly dying , shall go down
To the vile dust from where he sprung
Unwept , unhonoured and unsung.

* money , especially when dishonourably earned.

As true today as it was 200 years ago ?

Just asking , for a friend .

 

[Yellarbellyblade]

There is no conflict.

Some fans are die-hard United and are also fervent England fans. One doesn't have to negate the other.

I'm an incurable, fanatical Unitedite who just happens to be largely indifferent to England and is put off by the attitudes of many of their followers.

Fair enough I respect your view (although still take issue with many - minority I would argue but hey ho), there are some on here who are slightly more rabid in their views though, bet you never thought you’d hear that did you?

 

[Bashar Al Asaba]

You not watching the semi final then?

Probably yes. It's football and it's on the telly.

 

[Bruce Wayne]

Probably yes. It's football and it's on the telly.

Got ya Croatia scarf?

 

[Bashar Al Asaba]

Got ya Croatia scarf?

I don't recognise Croatia as a real country.

 

[Bruce Wayne]

I don't recognise Croatia as a real country.

Can you pass that on to FIFA, we might get a bye to the final.

 

[Gimli]

There is no conflict.

Some fans are die-hard United and are also fervent England fans. One doesn't have to negate the other.

I'm an incurable, fanatical Unitedite who just happens to be largely indifferent to England and is put off by the attitudes of many of their followers.

I would broadly agree with some of this, lots of England fans are idiots, stuff like trashing IKEA and jumping through bus stops is just idiotic and childish. But that’s what people do when they have the anonymity of being in a big crowd (one of the positives of social media is that certain twats get spotted doing their twattery on video and get arrested etc)

The beer chucking thing really annoys me, but it doesn’t change the fact I really want England to win - I just invite my mates round or go to a mates house to avoid the idiocy.

Club football fans can be idiots too though, it’s not fair to limit this to just England fans, it’s just for England all the idiots from all the clubs get together!

Lots of club fans do pitch invasions, including Blades, I personally hate it, but it’s not going to stop me going, I’ll just stay on the terraces.

For me, I can’t help but support England, when they score I jump out of my seat, just like when blades score. That kind of reaction only happens for my club and my country.

P.S - I would never associate myself with those who use the English flag to promote racist bigotry, those people are scum.

 

[Ball_Sup (Phil)]

There is no conflict.

Some fans are die-hard United and are also fervent England fans. One doesn't have to negate the other.

I'm an incurable, fanatical Unitedite who just happens to be largely indifferent to England and is put off by the attitudes of many of their followers.

I'll salute a measured reply like that one. Good stuff.
But, I'll pose a question/make a point. Have you had first hand experience of the attitudes of the England followers who actually travel long distances to tournaments? Or, are you really talking about the attitudes of stay at home, get pissed in the pub, thousands of miles from the turnstiles, there's a row on, I'm jumping in followers?
Until I'm blue in the face, I'm trying to expose there is a BIG difference.
Good post though mate.

 

[SouthEssexBlade]

I don't recognise Croatia as a real country.

Ahh, old Yugoslavia, pre-war? Had that war not happened it would've been a team to dominate International football for a few years.

 

[LJBlade]

I'm glad you're enjoying it.

In fact I'm glad everyones enjoying it, genuinely.

Unfortunately, some people clearly aren't enjoying it enough because they're bitching and whining that some of us aren't all that bothered instead of getting on with their lives.

What’s worse, the ones who are bitching and whining about those who (apparently) aren’t bothered or those who like to tell us over and over and over and over just how ‘not bothered’ they really are?

 

[Bashar Al Asaba]

I'll salute a measured reply like that one. Good stuff.
But, I'll pose a question/make a point. Have you had first hand experience of the attitudes of the England followers who actually travel long distances to tournaments? Or, are you really talking about the attitudes of stay at home, get pissed in the pub, thousands of miles from the turnstiles, there's a row on, I'm jumping in followers?
Until I'm blue in the face, I'm trying to expose there is a BIG difference.
Good post though mate.

My problem is with the mentality that seems pervasive and ingrained in the culture of this country.
This overtly aggressive, hostile and arrogant attitude.
From my perspective, once football fans switch into "England" mode they turn into a strange hybrid of Millwall fans and Wednesdayites and it just leaves me cold to be honest.
Fans of other nations are perfectly capable of expressing their enthusiasm for their country. Sadly, for the most part, in Englands case, patriotic fervour and being a supremacist dick are one and the same.

I'll concede that the behaviour of England supporters in Russia has been impeccable as far as I know. Then again the reduced numbers and potentially dangerous environment have probably informed that.

 

[Ball_Sup (Phil)]

My problem is with the mentality that seems pervasive and ingrained in the culture of this country.
This overtly aggressive, hostile and arrogant attitude.
From my perspective, once football fans switch into "England" mode they turn into a strange hybrid of Millwall fans and Wednesdayites and it just leaves me cold to be honest.
Fans of other nations are perfectly capable of expressing their enthusiasm for their country. Sadly, for the most part, in Englands case, patriotic fervour and being a supremacist dick are one and the same.

I'll concede that the behaviour of England supporters in Russia has been impeccable as far as I know. Then again the reduced numbers and potentially dangerous environment have probably informed that.

I keep chipping in because I find the debate about who is & who isn't a fan & the dynamics of fandom genuinely fascinating. I like to hear & contemplate other people's views. To hear things the other way around. Of course I can understand how you/people would think loons wearing replica kit in (for eg) Croydon, misbehaving while chanting about England - are England fans, it's self identification.
But, myself, having been around the block a few times, I naturally do not see them as England fans, I see them as loons from (for eg) Croydon.
It's all back to how you define "fan". It really intrigues me.

 

[sitwell]

My problem is with the mentality that seems pervasive and ingrained in the culture of this country.
This overtly aggressive, hostile and arrogant attitude.
From my perspective, once football fans switch into "England" mode they turn into a strange hybrid of Millwall fans and Wednesdayites and it just leaves me cold to be honest.
Fans of other nations are perfectly capable of expressing their enthusiasm for their country. Sadly, for the most part, in Englands case, patriotic fervour and being a supremacist dick are one and the same.

I'll concede that the behaviour of England supporters in Russia has been impeccable as far as I know. Then again the reduced numbers and potentially dangerous environment have probably informed that.

Its the same with Sheff Utd ,just go on the concourse at any away game at half time. Full of low lifes who completely mis represent the likes of you and me. Only happy when they've got numbers behind them ,Russia is well out of their comfort zone.

 

[Numpty's Dusty Ruts.]

Sheffield United are more important than Engerland.

Get over it.

Couldn't agree more! UTB, FTP!

 

[SUFC Handsworth]

My problem is with the mentality that seems pervasive and ingrained in the culture of this country.
This overtly aggressive, hostile and arrogant attitude.

It's what saw off der Kaiser (in '18), der Fuhrer (in '45) and der Kaiser again (in '66)

 

[Bashar Al Asaba]

I keep chipping in because I find the debate about who is & who isn't a fan & the dynamics of fandom genuinely fascinating. I like to hear & contemplate other people's views. To hear things the other way around. Of course I can understand how you/people would think loons wearing replica kit in (for eg) Croydon, misbehaving while chanting about England - are England fans, it's self identification.
But, myself, having been around the block a few times, I naturally do not see them as England fans, I see them as loons from (for eg) Croydon.
It's all back to how you define "fan". It really intrigues me.

A similar argument has been made in the past about Uniteds "unsavoury" element. It's been said that they aren't real fans whenever they kick off and cause trouble.

That might be a comforting notion, to separate the decent "real" fans from the thuggish tag-alongs but it's not something I can subscribe to.

Truth is, the arseholes who taint club and/or country with their antics could just as easily be fans as anyone else. The England yobs who caused havoc in Ireland in 1995 or France in 1998 for example still paid their money and went to the games. Furthermore, in the past 4 years I've watched United probably more than at any other point in my life home and away. I've seen the same faces acting up and causing bollocks many times.

Like me, they consider United to be their club and so they must logically be regarded as supporters. Unfortunately they express that support by dragging our name through the dirt.

 

[Davalon]

More racists...

Fascist scum.

 

[boo radley]

I'm glad you're enjoying it.

In fact I'm glad everyones enjoying it, genuinely.

Unfortunately, some people clearly aren't enjoying it enough because they're bitching and whining that some of us aren't all that bothered instead of getting on with their lives.

Really!
No you are not glad everyone is enjoying it. Because it contrasts too much with your stance. So much so that you have to keep coming back to this thread and clearly cannot get on with your own life because of it.

There is no conflict.

Some fans are die-hard United and are also fervent England fans. One doesn't have to negate the other.

I'm an incurable, fanatical Unitedite who just happens to be largely indifferent to England and is put off by the attitudes of many of their followers.

Indifferent. Bollocks. You'd love England to lose and if they do in the semi it will give you great internal pleasure.

In the meantime. Moscow to bed. Working later

 

[Tynemouth Blade]

 

[Ball_Sup (Phil)]

A similar argument has been made in the past about Uniteds "unsavoury" element. It's been said that they aren't real fans whenever they kick off and cause trouble.

That might be a comforting notion, to separate the decent "real" fans from the thuggish tag-alongs but it's not something I can subscribe to.

Truth is, the arseholes who taint club and/or country with their antics could just as easily be fans as anyone else. The England yobs who caused havoc in Ireland in 1995 or France in 1998 for example still paid their money and went to the games. Furthermore, in the past 4 years I've watched United probably more than at any other point in my life home and away. I've seen the same faces acting up and causing bollocks many times.

Like me, they consider United to be their club and so they must logically be regarded as supporters. Unfortunately they express that support by dragging our name through the dirt.

But there is a different dynamic. Ireland 95, France 98 were twenty years ago. And the trouble was in the stadium, in the city, in the country where the game was. United's "unsavoury" element are kicking off & causing havoc on the concourse, in the Wetherspoons, in the city were the game is.
They are clearly fans of England/SUFC by any sensible definition.
But, that is not happening now, in The Luzhniki, in Samara, in Russia. The bollocks that is upsetting you is happening thousands of miles away.

 

[The Crab]

My ten pennorth.

I have said in the past on here, and I stand by it, that I just don't "feel" it nationally like I used to. But what I will say is this, England have done really well so far. A manager that many of us (including me) saw as a safe, underwhelming choice, has got the team to gel and build momentum.

The Ikea knobheads, and the ambulance smashers are utterly shameful. But the fact the World Cup is on, is just a flag of convenience to these fuckers, they'd look for any excuse to kick off. Better I think, to focus on the majority, focus on the feelgood factor that us doing well gives. In a world that is heading to Hell in a handcart, where shit happens every day, where's the harm in embracing a crumb of good news? The World Cup will soon be over, and it will be situation normal as we lurch on to the latest crisis.