The inpact of Coutts article

[Woodwardfan]

Oh dear. Sharks in force on this thread now.

Head for safe land.

Shame about the thread though.

 

[stringer]

Why the snide comment then?

Where?

 

[Woodwardfan]

Where?

Just bail out Blade.

 

[Sean Thornton]

Just bail out Blade.

You don't run this forum. You just Big yourself up on it. Care to explain why you suggested keeping K Wallace rather than Coutts instead of pretending yet again you've got a handle on things?

 

[Pierre's PC]

Oh dear. Sharks in force on this thread now.

Head for safe land.

Shame about the thread though.

Spineless and cowardly.

 

[IdLiketoRogerMoore]

You don't run this forum. You just Big yourself up on it. Care to explain why you suggested keeping K Wallace rather than Coutts instead of pretending yet again you've got a handle on things?

Wouldn't waste your energy buddy.

He's a guy who plays the poster not the post. Even more so when he can't face the fact that someone else has a different opinion...

 

[Bashar Al Asaba]

Oh dear. Sharks in force on this thread now.

Head for safe land.

Shame about the thread though.

IGNOMINY!!!

 

[Bashar Al Asaba]

I dunno, I tend to like players who don't wait 18 months to start actually playing for a professional football club, ah well...

 

[BornOnShorehamStreet]

 

[Hague Blade]

I'm not generally a fan of "cartoons" either, but that one made me smile. Have a like, sir.

 

[Bashar Al Asaba]

I dunno, I tend to like players who don't wait 18 months to start actually playing for a professional football club, ah well...

Wow, spectacular inebriated posting!

 

[Steve Mackan]

“automatic promotion was probably broken along with Coutts’ tibia”

Sickly, but I love a good bit of overstatement. He might as well have written:
"Outside of Coutts there wasn't a member of the squad capable of never giving the ball away, inside of Coutts was a broken bone."

Realistically though, the loss of Coutts always seemed to me like losing a steady goalkeeper. Those players around him, who normally so calm, became less assured - and this probably cost us 7/8 points.

 

[IdLiketoRogerMoore]

Wow, spectacular inebriated posting!

If talking to yourself is a sign of madness, what does posting to yourself in an Internet forum mean?!?!?

 

[Pierre's PC]

If talking to yourself is a sign of madness, what does posting to yourself in an Internet forum mean?!?!?

The greatest posters of our time do it, so he's in good company

 

[Bashar Al Asaba]

If talking to yourself is a sign of madness, what does posting to yourself in an Internet forum mean?!?!?

In my case, being an arsehole

 

[Sean Thornton]

In my case, being an arsehole

You've downgraded yourself from "shithouse"?

 

[IdLiketoRogerMoore]

In my case, being an arsehole

Don't be so harsh. You're a lovely man who does a lot of work charity...

 

[Darthblade]

Attacks have to start somwhere but is it critical?

There lies the $64000 question - do we really miss Coutts? On balance I think we do going forward, largely because possession is king and facilitates overloads, even though the opposition have funnelled back. Is that true? I'm not sure it is or not. Put it this way I think we would have missed Duffy or Clarke or Fleck far more if one of them had broken their leg.

As I said above I think we miss Coutts defensively more than anything and that was hard to phathom. These days though our back 3 seems exposed too often.

I agree mate ...... he had the experience to sit in front of the defence when we were under pressure and close down players outside the box (usually). After we lost him to that reckless lunge we seemed to concede a lot more long range goals due to shooters from midfield not being closed down.

He also had an eye for a defence splitting pass though which comes with experience ........ I'm not slating Lunny & Evans at all .... just that they can learn a LOT from playing with Couttsy.

UTB & FTP

 

[Darthblade]

I dunno, I tend to like players who don't wait 18 months to start actually playing for a professional football club, ah well...

Do you think it (his lack of form) may have been influenced by the wanker managers he was playing for ...... in particular, the car crash that was Adkins.

Along comes Tufty, who wants to play proper football instead of "goose step" ....... and Couttsy blossoms. Its no coincidence imho

UTB & FTP

 

[Bashar Al Asaba]

Do you think it (his lack of form) may have been influenced by the wanker managers he was playing for ...... in particular, the car crash that was Adkins.

Along comes Tufty, who wants to play proper football instead of "goose step" ....... and Couttsy blossoms. Its no coincidence imho

UTB & FTP

I often think that there's too much emphasis on managers for poor individual performance.
To have an obvious level of talent, yet apply none of it for a very long time, leaves me a bit cold if I'm honest.

 

[Sean Thornton]

I agree mate ...... he had the experience to sit in front of the defence when we were under pressure and close down players outside the box (usually). After we lost him to that reckless lunge we seemed to concede a lot more long range goals due to shooters from midfield not being closed down.

He also had an eye for a defence splitting pass though which comes with experience ........ I'm not slating Lunny & Evans at all .... just that they can learn a LOT from playing with Couttsy.

UTB & FTP

Coutts is mildly criticised for "lack of assists" but youre right, he has a great eye for that killer pass. It tends to be finding the player in space who makes the assist more often than directly to a scorer. No one in the side has his speed of thought, quick feet and ball control. He gave other players confidence with his precise play.

 

[Grizzly blade]

I often think that there's too much emphasis on managers for poor individual performance.
To have an obvious level of talent, yet apply none of it for a very long time, leaves me a bit cold if I'm honest.

But you have no idea what his instructions were from that manager and how he was being used. Of course a manager should have the emphasis on him for quality players not performing, it’s their job to get the most from the talen they have. Adkins particularly had a fully fit Coutts and failed on that.
Look at Jose....is he responsible for failing to get the most from Pogba..a player who had been one of the best in the world for a couple of seasons? Of course he is. It’s his tactics and players around him that impact on individuals.

If you were talking about lack of effort in training or poor attitude then fair enough, but Wilder was clear that was never an issue and even went on record praising Coutts and Freeman in that regard.

 

[Revolution]

I often think that there's too much emphasis on managers for poor individual performance.
To have an obvious level of talent, yet apply none of it for a very long time, leaves me a bit cold if I'm honest.

Coutts' United career:

2014-15 - signed at end of January. More or less ever present after that. Displayed what Deadbat memorably described as "neat and tidy nothingness".

2015-16 - injured and missed first 7 weeks of season. More or less ever present after that in the least creative midfield in living memory, playing as he did in 2015-16

Has said subsequently in interviews that he did not give 100% in his first 2 years for fear of getting injured again.

2016-17: transfer listed by Wilder in pre-season. Comes on in Southend debacle as Wilder is desperate and has no one else to turn to. Retains place after busy performance. Comes out of his shell gradually during Gillingham game (the pivotal game in Wilder's reign IMHO) and is comfortable in new formation. Goes from strength to strength and has excellent season, showing movement, bite and passing range never previous exhibited. Misses only one further league game.

2017-8: carries on in excellent form from the season before, and misses only one game before his serious injury 17 games in.

I am intrigued to see what next season has in store for Coutts. Which version will show up?

 

[finlaytheblade]

Coutts' United career:

2014-15 - signed at end of January. More or less ever present after that. Displayed what Deadbat memorably described as "neat and tidy nothingness".

2015-16 - injured and missed first 7 weeks of season. More or less ever present after that in the least creative midfield in living memory, playing as he did in 2015-16

Has said subsequently in interviews that he did not give 100% in his first 2 years for fear of getting injured again.

2016-17: transfer listed by Wilder in pre-season. Comes on in Southend debacle as Wilder is desperate and has no one else to turn to. Retains place after busy performance. Comes out of his shell gradually during Gillingham game (the pivotal game in Wilder's reign IMHO) and is comfortable in new formation. Goes from strength to strength and has excellent season, showing movement, bite and passing range never previous exhibited. Misses only one further league game.

2017-8: carries on in excellent form from the season before, and misses only one game before his serious injury 17 games in.

I am intrigued to see what next season has in store for Coutts. Which version will show up?

In the last year of his contract with a young family (twins) he will be playing to earn a new contract ,I think that might answer your question

 

[Bashar Al Asaba]

But you have no idea what his instructions were from that manager and how he was being used. Of course a manager should have the emphasis on him for quality players not performing, it’s their job to get the most from the talen they have. Adkins particularly had a fully fit Coutts and failed on that.
Look at Jose....is he responsible for failing to get the most from Pogba..a player who had been one of the best in the world for a couple of seasons? Of course he is. It’s his tactics and players around him that impact on individuals.

If you were talking about lack of effort in training or poor attitude then fair enough, but Wilder was clear that was never an issue and even went on record praising Coutts and Freeman in that regard.

But footballers aren't automatons, of course there's no denying the impact a manager can have as Wilder's tenure has shown, but when you run out onto the field you have a level of personal accountability and there's far too much of a chasm between Coutts' level of ability and his performances for almost two years to simply explained by man-management in my view.

 

[Woodwardfan]

In terms of providing for the family, being transfer-listed and no clubs interested must have been a major shock to the lad.

For a year before he had looked like trouble and it doesn't go un-noticed.

Wider's instinct was spot on and the player stepped up as indeed he had to or be unemployed. That is an exaggeration but Burton on peanuts was beckoning.

 

[nopigfansintown]

I don't think people can contextualise Paul Coutts' United career without having read the below article.In effect he was a gamble by Clough that took until Coutts third season to pay off for United. By that stage Clough and Adkins had gone, in part due to the lack of quality in the middle of the park and the wages tied up in the likes of Coutts, James Wallace and Florent Cuvelier.


In United's matchday program for the league game against Walsall (29th November 2016), Paul Coutts participated in the Q and A (pages 20-25).Gives a great insight into Coutts pre Wilder, and hopefully banishes a few myths and misapprehensions:

Q: Did being transfer-listed in the summer give you added motivation to prove yourself to the new manager?

A: It was something I relished to be honest, I knew I just needed to get my head down and work hard. The gaffer is honest and straight talking, there aren't any grey areas with him and he phoned me on his first day in the job and told me what was happening; he had to make a mark on the squad I suppose. He let me train with the lads and give me a chance to prove myself and I've been rewarded. I've never been left out in the cold and I'll always be grateful for being given the opportunity.

Q: Would it be fair to say that you are currently playing your best football?

A:I would say so. It was my first full pre-season in three years in the summer so that was a massive help because I know from experience that you simply can't catch up once you've missed a pre-season. In the last two campaigns I was playing with painkillers and having injections for my knee.That means you can't train hard enough or frequently enough because painkillers are so bad for your insides, so you are never getting that level of fitness that you need to play to your optimum level.

Q: Do you feel your best form has coincided with your fitness, having previously suffered a career threatening injury at Derby County?

A: Yes. It took me a lot longer than I and a lot of other people anticipated following a knee injury that saw me on the sidelines for around 15 months.I couldn't train enough to get fit enough and it showed, I could feel it and people could see it.I was only able to coast through games at times, because I was way of breaking down, but now I'm able to try and influence games an it all comes down to fitness.

Q: You've struck up a very good partnership with John Fleck in the engine room, what do you put that down to?

A: Myself and Flecky compliment each other and we're doing well together, but we've also got 'Bash' who can slot in and Ben (Whiteman) and 'Reedy' are pushing hard too. I know John from our days together in the Scotland youth teams and we know each other's games inside out and that certainly give you a good start.We both like the ball and are comfortable receiving it from the defenders.That helps because if some teams drop a striker of to nullify one of us, the other one is able to dictate play.

Q: Since coming into the team at Millwall back in August, you've been a near ever-present, how important has consistency in team selection been to the current unbeaten run and allowing several players the chance to find and maintain their best form?

A: The manager said from day one he would reward hard work and graft and that's what's happened. We've all had to work extremely hard to get the shirt but once you have it you know your performances will determine whether you keep it and thankfully we've been doing very well, but you're only as good as your last game.We train how we want to play, we don't switch of and that shows when we come to play on a Saturday or Tuesday.

Q: Just how different is this season to last, there seems to be a genuine connection between the team and supporters this term?

A: The fans have always backed us in fantastic numbers and they are never afraid to vent their opinions It was boring to play last season, so it must have been boring and even more frustrating to watch from the terraces. We didn't have any options within the team, we didn't play with any identity or energy and we were sluggish throughout.We got stuck in a rut and never got out of it. Teams now fear coming to Bramall Lane, last season's opponents enjoyed coming here and fancied themselves to get something.

Q: You moved to Sheffield in the summer and were blessed with the arrival of twins, how are you adopting to parenthood?

A: It's been hectic away from football to say the least. But it's certainly given me an extra drive, I feel that extra responsibility to perform an be as successful as I can in a bid to support my family.Coming to work is like a rest. Being a new parent is fantastic but tough, especially having twins, but myself and Vicki support each other as much as we can and the lads sometimes pop round to lend a hand!

Edit: should add this isn't the complete QA. Left a few, now largely irrelevant questions out. Original thread here: https://www.s24su.com/forum/index.php?threads/paul-coutts-a-key-yet-often-overlooked-q-and-a.59632/