The difference between Blades and Owls?

[dublin 10 blade]

Have the vile gone tits up then don't want to hear bout what they got in prem what are we going to start talking about next how they won at wembley and got into europe and we never did cause we did'nt beat brum and everton pipped us at the post, lets talk bout how debt free they are and we are up to our oxsters in debt. think we'll win on saturday and could go into 1 of auto spots as a result.U.T.B AND F.T.V. with a vengance

 

[Darren]

Cherry picking - yes - but you've just done the same. To compare us straight after relegation with them after writing off a mountain of debt and coming under new (half) ambitious ownership is "reverse cherry picking"...

UTB

Ok clever, explain 2003-04, the biggest contrast in fortunes between the two clubs in recent years and still they get bigger crowds

 

[metalblade]

Ok clever, explain 2003-04, the biggest contrast in fortunes between the two clubs in recent years and still they get bigger crowds

Colin ?

 

[dublin 10 blade]

some of my posts on here, may seem a bit rabid against the vile, and i'll give my 2 resons why! 1. having to go toe to toe as a young un, on our kop v them . The game Curran scored agin us[ think it was im] and 2. As a young un I used to travel over to see our beloved club from Ireland, used to get the boat over every two weeks,[used to stay in Halfway] for home games, Arriving in Midland train station with my green jacket on, and with a Blades badge sewn on the chest, was bushwacked by a gang of the vile,managed to smack one over the head with my duty free bottle of bacardi, but got a hiding, and vowed never, to have anything to do with them agin even though i knew 1 or 2 of there boys, at the time mid 80's, so compare figures all you want but my posts will ALWAYS be against em. BEEFFY Dublin 10 Blade.

 

[judge]

Wether or not the pigs get bigger crowds than us is irrelevant , they think they're massive we don't but yet they can't average over 30k in a season and we can

The point is they are not as big as they like to convince themselves they are

 

[oldblade]

I think that's interesting in that (all delusions aside) Wednesday have generally have a slightly bigger support base than us. I think the incontrovertible proof of that was last season. The 2 clubs were neck and neck going for promoition in the same division all season and they had the bigger crowds.

I think the 2 30K's that we got was due to (a) the excitement of the exceptional early 70;s team in 71-72 and (b) us being the only Sheffield club to have been in the PL since PL crowds have been at their highest.

I have little doubt that if Wednesday got into the PL now they would get an average of 30K +

Burn the heretic!

That does tend to suggest you are right, but I don't think it's "incontrovertible". I have no doubt that our season ticket sales were hit quite badly by the exceptionally poor previous relegation season. I believe we set a new record for home matches lost by the club in one season, beating even the ignominious 1975-6 season (albeit playing two extra home games).

 

[oldblade]

Wether or not the pigs get bigger crowds than us is irrelevant , they think they're massive we don't but yet they can't average over 30k in a season and we can

The point is they are not as big as they like to convince themselves they are

In support of your point, the all time league table of English League attendances has them averaging 21,285 and us on 19,939. In other words only a difference 1,346.

http://forums.electronicarts.co.uk/...l-time-english-league-attendance-records.html

 

[oldblade]

Cherry picking - yes - but you've just done the same. To compare us straight after relegation with them after writing off a mountain of debt and coming under new (half) ambitious ownership is "reverse cherry picking"...

UTB

They did average more than us, but that figure of 2,500 was inflated by the final game of the season when they got around 38,000 to celebrate a promotion that was pretty much already sealed. Had it been us celebrating promotion we would not have been able to get a crowd of 38,000 as our ground doesn't hold that many.

 

[Caveblade]

Wether or not the pigs get bigger crowds than us is irrelevant , they think they're massive we don't but yet they can't average over 30k in a season and we can

The point is they are not as big as they like to convince themselves they are

I didn't really mean this to degenerate into the old crowd argument, but I think that your point is dot on Judge, the numbers are irrelevant, its the fact that they think they are a massive powerhouse within English football when in reality they have done no more than the likes of Luton Town which is win a cup and have a couple of years in the top flight and been managed by David Pleat.

 

[yorkshirecoast]

Straws and cluthcing at spring to mind but in the 10 seasons mentioned of the 3 plum fixtures you mentioned we had the following number at home

2003 0
2004 1
2005 0
2006 3
2007 3
2008 2
2009 0
2010 0
2011 1
2012 1

So we have had 11 of those games at home to Wednesday's 19, I hardly think that 8 game discrepancy will make much difference (and anyway, if you are not playing for anything the last game of the season is likely to give you a lower than average attendance anyway)

So much effort to big up the pigs. Bizarre.

 

[oldblade]

Look at 2004.

They had just been relegated, did nowt promotion wise and ended up finishing lower mid table in the 3rd division.

We had just had the Triple Assualt season and challenged for promotion to the PL all season.

Yet still they got bigger crowds.

I don't know when we last got bigger crowds then them when they finished higher in the league, but I bet it was a long time ago. It's a fairly common occurence for Wednesday.

I don't think it has happened this side of the second world war.

 

[Balham]

They did average more than us, but that figure of 2,500 was inflated by the final game of the season when they got around 38,000 to celebrate a promotion that was pretty much already sealed. Had it been us celebrating promotion we would not have been able to get a crowd of 38,000 as our ground doesn't hold that many.

Assuming that we'd have sold out if the positions had been reversed, the extra 6,000 tickets sold added under 300 to their average. They'd still have averaged over 2,000 more than us.

Why bother arguing about attendances? Let's all get behind our team and let 250,000 of them watch their side implode this season. What was it? 14 games unbeaten for Dave Jones? Sounds like it's time for 14 without a win

 

[yorkshirecoast]

Assuming that we'd have sold out if the positions had been reversed, the extra 6,000 tickets sold added under 300 to their average. They'd still have averaged over 2,000 more than us./quote]



Last year the pigs were on the up & we we were in a downward spiral. You'd expect them to average more. The size of the Sty & bigger away end also helped them. But as posted elsewhere, we have averaged more over the last 10 years. And we averaged over 30k in the Premiership despite being relegated - they couldn't even manage that when qualifying for Europe.

 

[alcoblade]

Ok clever, explain 2003-04, the biggest contrast in fortunes between the two clubs in recent years and still they get bigger crowds

I think that would have been a fair point - it's a shame you didn't use it.....

Over the years Wendy hve been a bit more successful and had, on average, slighty bigger crowds. Nothing that a sway in fortunes over a few year spell can't cure. Which leaves us as the only one of the two to average 30,000 in a season since the last time WE did it, 40 (ish) years earlier. If you listened to the pork, they are ManUre waiting to happen. In reality, they're mo differemt to us.

Both teams get very good support given the size of surrounding area, competition for support, and distinct lack of success. That's especially true for us.

UTB

 

[PeterNdlovu081]

I like the fact they have more fans than us. There's more of them to laugh at every week when they fuck up.

 

[alcoblade]

I like the fact they have more fans than us. There's more of them to laugh at every week when they fuck up.

Not always so easy. There are many areas where there aren't that many of them. In fact I'd put money on there being more Blades than Owls within Sheffield. They have a big following around Dingleland (you should know....) .

They're nicknmed South Barnsley for a reason....D

UTB

 

[metalblade]

The best they could manage in their last season in the Premiership was 39k a large proportion who were Man U fans, so not a sell out. This for a pig team full of expensive internationals and for part of that season managed by a certain Danny Wilson.

 

[Tuns]

The best they could manage in their last season in the Premiership was 39k a large proportion who were Man U fans, so not a sell out. This for a pig team full of expensive internationals and for part of that season managed by a certain Danny Wilson.

If you discount away fans at both grounds I think you'll find United and pigs crowds are even closer than the historical 1,300 gap.

They are certainly a big club, no argument about that. But this idea they are as big or bigger than Man City, Villa, Newcastle etc does not seemed to be based on reality.

 

[beightonblade]

They know they want to be us............ Blades are cool always have been.

 

[Darren]

I think that would have been a fair point - it's a shame you didn't use it.....

Over the years Wendy hve been a bit more successful and had, on average, slighty bigger crowds. Nothing that a sway in fortunes over a few year spell can't cure. Which leaves us as the only one of the two to average 30,000 in a season since the last time WE did it, 40 (ish) years earlier. If you listened to the pork, they are ManUre waiting to happen. In reality, they're mo differemt to us.

Both teams get very good support given the size of surrounding area, competition for support, and distinct lack of success. That's especially true for us.

UTB

Oh, I don't deny that Wednesdat are not a huge club and that the difference in support between the two teams is not that huge either.

However, the reality is that all the facts show that Wednesday have a somewhat larger fan base than us and to argue otherwise just makes us look daft.

But as other people have said, who cares? If Wednesday averaged 25K every season and United averaged 5K, we would still support United.

 

[Kenilworth]

But as other people have said, who cares? If Wednesday averaged 25K every season and United averaged 5K, we would still support United.

Oh dear, oh dear. I would have thought that logic and reasoning were an integral part of your profession Dazzler but that last statement is well and truly on dodgy ground. If United averaged 5k then a lot of people on here probably would not be Blades - and don't give me a hogwash argument that they may be but fewer turn up due to poor performances or some such nonsense. Crowd figures are reflective of support, there is no question of that being untrue. Forest and County is an example to use - I'll bet there are a hell of a lot more people who support Forest than County - it just stnad to reason if you look at their respective crowd figures and it's plainly evident that you can extrapolate from there.

 

[axel smeets]

Oh dear, oh dear. I would have thought that logic and reasoning were an integral part of your profession Dazzler but that last statement is well and truly on dodgy ground. If United averaged 5k then a lot of people on here probably would not be Blades - and don't give me a hogwash argument that they may be but fewer turn up due to poor performances or some such nonsense. Crowd figures are reflective of support, there is no question of that being untrue. Forest and County is an example to use - I'll bet there are a hell of a lot more people who support Forest than County - it just stnad to reason if you look at their respective crowd figures and it's plainly evident that you can extrapolate from there.

I would argue that the comparison between the two Nottingham clubs is slightly unfair. There are bound to be more Forest supporters than County - winning the League title and League Cup followed by back to back European Cups and another League Cup probably saw to that.

 

[metalblade]

Sheffield Council of Pigs even routed the supertram to Middlwood so the snortbeasts could get to games easier, I mean what other purpose is there to go to that end of town or Malin Bridge for that matter ? if the tram served Parson Cross I could understand it. First group even drag the bus drivers out of bed on Boxing day to get pigs to the sty, no such luck if we are at home on Boxing day it's get the car out or walk you feckers.

 

[metalblade]

Another thing too, take this weekend we have at home the local teams of ........................
Sheffield Utd
Rotherham Utd
Barnsley
Chesterfield
Huddersfield

Next weekend will see the pigs at home along with Doncaster seems like they are sure to pick up the floating support, this happens time and time again over the years.

 

[Kenilworth]

I would argue that the comparison between the two Nottingham clubs is slightly unfair. There are bound to be more Forest supporters than County - winning the League title and League Cup followed by back to back European Cups and another League Cup probably saw to that.

Hence the difference in average gates - my point being that if our average gate was as low as 5k then there would be fewer Blades fans in the first place because match attendance figures are indicative of the level of support a team has. So, in fact, not unfair at all but a reasoned and suitable comparator.

 

[Kenilworth]

Sheffield Council of Pigs even routed the supertram to Middlwood so the snortbeasts could get to games easier, I mean what other purpose is there to go to that end of town or Malin Bridge for that matter ? if the tram served Parson Cross I could understand it. First group even drag the bus drivers out of bed on Boxing day to get pigs to the sty, no such luck if we are at home on Boxing day it's get the car out or walk you feckers.

Another thing too, take this weekend we have at home the local teams of ........................
Sheffield Utd
Rotherham Utd
Barnsley
Chesterfield
Huddersfield

Next weekend will see the pigs at home along with Doncaster seems like they are sure to pick up the floating support, this happens time and time again over the years.

Very good points, well put, Metal.

 

[georgebernardshaw]

Quality, not quantity.

George

 

[Balham]

Sheffield Council of Pigs even routed the supertram to Middlwood so the snortbeasts could get to games easier, I mean what other purpose is there to go to that end of town or Malin Bridge for that matter ? if the tram served Parson Cross I could understand it. First group even drag the bus drivers out of bed on Boxing day to get pigs to the sty, no such luck if we are at home on Boxing day it's get the car out or walk you feckers.

Where would you put the tram then Metal? It goes up past Granville Road which isn't that far from the Lane; there isn't much down Queens Road to justify putting the tram in and London Road is too narrow.

Another thing too, take this weekend we have at home the local teams of ........................
Sheffield Utd
Rotherham Utd
Barnsley
Chesterfield
Huddersfield

Next weekend will see the pigs at home along with Doncaster seems like they are sure to pick up the floating support, this happens time and time again over the years.

I'm not sure there is much "floating" support. How many people are going to decide to go and see second or third tier football at £25+ a ticket on a whim?

You've also missed Leeds off your list of "local" teams. The combined attendances at Leeds, Wednesday and Doncaster's last home games was 56,800. The combined home attendance of United, Rotherham, Barnsley, Chestervegas and Huddersfield was 58,783 which suggests that the Police have their advice about right. I'm surprised that Chesterfield aren't on an opposite cycle to Rotherham but they only get 5k crowds.

 

[Bradford Blade]

All the above simply tells me I made the right decision about 24 years back to be Blade and not a Fowl!

UTB

 

[metalblade]

Where would you put the tram then Metal? It goes up past Granville Road which isn't that far from the Lane; there isn't much down Queens Road to justify putting the tram in and London Road is too narrow.
Well there is the wide open space of The Moor when they move the rag tag stalls and London Road is no more narrow than Middlewood road through Pigsbrough corner



I'm not sure there is much "floating" support. How many people are going to decide to go and see second or third tier football at £25+ a ticket on a whim?

You've also missed Leeds off your list of "local" teams. The combined attendances at Leeds, Wednesday and Doncaster's last home games was 56,800. The combined home attendance of United, Rotherham, Barnsley, Chestervegas and Huddersfield was 58,783 which suggests that the Police have their advice about right. I'm surprised that Chesterfield aren't on an opposite cycle to Rotherham but they only get 5k crowds.

I don't consider L**ds to be local anymore than Nottingham or Derby, Huddersfield on the other hand is a comparable distance from the pig sty as what Doncaster is.