The corner has been turned

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jono_t2000 said:
Let me state some facts.

Under Hecky we only conceded 4+ goals in 3 games.

That also included 3 close losses to man city, man utd and Tottenham 2-1 where we fell in the dying moments.

Wilder has already been tonked by conceding 4+ goals in 6 games.

Not saying Wilder is worse or better than Hecky but to say a corner has been turned is purely fantasy and recency bias.

(Hecky also didn't have BBD which has increased our attacking threat considerably)

Like I said the proof will be in the pudding next season... but to say we've definitely turned a corner is wishful thinking at best.
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I agree, it's perhaps a poor choice of phrase to say we've turned a corner when we've just lost the last two conceding 4 in each game, 7 points this year, our lasty win was away at Luton in Feb.

But there have been some chinks of light appearing since Wilder returned.

Under Hecky, we ran many teams closer until that Newcastle game and the Arsenal game that followed soon after. The squad back then, whilst looking less fit and less organised and less positive in their play, managed to stay in games more. We just couldn't get goals.

Since Wilder came in, he initially got us playing more positively and we got some good results or were unlucky... But we were getting goals, looked more organised and positive until we played at home and just got smashed off the park by anyone we played.

In terms of turning corners, we're looking better against shit sides at staying in games for longer. We're perhaps approaching the corner but we're not there yet.

We still make terrible unforgivable mistakes, we still allow teams to shoot from distance, knowing that every side has someone capable of hitting a worldie from there.

Last night was encouraging in that we twice led in the game and didn't let the heads go down until their 3rd.

There are mitigating circumstances in so many respects for why this season has been such a failure, most have been talked to death.

But you're bang right. We have to now write this season off, next season and how we start the season after the summer to prepare will tell us if we're turning the corner.

Lots needs to change.
 

jono_t2000 said:
Let me state some facts.

Under Hecky we only conceded 4+ goals in 3 games.

That also included 3 close losses to man city, man utd and Tottenham 2-1 where we fell in the dying moments.

Wilder has already been tonked by conceding 4+ goals in 6 games.

Not saying Wilder is worse or better than Hecky but to say a corner has been turned is purely fantasy and recency bias.

(Hecky also didn't have BBD which has increased our attacking threat considerably)

Like I said the proof will be in the pudding next season... but to say we've definitely turned a corner is wishful thinking at best.
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This is the absolute truth. We look more competitive and look like scoring, which equals more entertainment!


In the 14 games under Hecky we scored 11 goals.
In the last 14 games we have scored 18 goals.
 
gordoncharles said:
I appreciate a sunny outlook as much as the next optimist but I'm afraid that anyone who thinks things are really any better, post managerial change, is exhibiting worrying Wednesdayesque tendencies.

The only metric that mattered was the goals conceded column and that, as you have pointed out, has not only got worse (Hecky's included the infamous Newcastle game) but we look even more like conceding now than ever.

Last night I was actually laughing the laugh of the damned because every single time Manchester United attacked it looked like they would score. In fact, had Foderingham not been on top form we would have conceded at least four goals in the first half alone,.

You cannot expect to pick up points with such abysmal, statuesque defending which is, without question, the worst I've ever seen from a professional club, not only at this level, but probably any level. This means the whole team, by the way, not just the back line and Souza.

It's ludicrous to say that the players we have, as slow and shell-shocked as they are, could not have been better drilled. There are literally dozens of coaches in Europe who would have made a much better job of that and at least given us a chance in games.

And yes, we do look like we have a little more purpose when we move forward in the 20% of time we actually have the ball, which is very welcome, but completely futile when it's at the expense of keeping the ball out of our own net. Of course, a large part of the forward improvement, most of it, is down to Brereton-Diaz, who won't be with us next season.

I'd like to see our xG too. It must be horrendous.
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I think we can all see that defensively we're pathetic and nothing has really changed, that doesn't mean you just ignore the other end of the pitch and the fact that we actually tend to be in games, does it?

Don't get me wrong, it's still utter bobbar, but it's better than it was when we were on track for the worst points total and goals scored ever, AS WELL AS the worst goals against total ever?
 
crazyblade1889 said:
This attitude is the reason we haven’t won a carrot in most people’s lifetimes. Let’s keep clapping despite the current shit show being served up by a manager who’s completely out of his depth.
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Ou think the views of fans has an influence on how the club is run ?!!!!!
 
Working Class Hero said:
I think we can all see that defensively we're pathetic and nothing has really changed, that doesn't mean you just ignore the other end of the pitch and the fact that we actually tend to be in games, does it?

Don't get me wrong, it's still utter bobbar, but it's better than it was when we were on track for the worst points total and goals scored ever, AS WELL AS the worst goals against total ever?
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We're not in games until the defence is sorted

I can't work out why so many fans can't seem to grasp that.

It doesn't mean you can't counter-attack as well.
 
gordoncharles said:
I'd like to see our xG too. It must be horrendous.
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Presuming you mean the whole season then using fbref (source data from Opta) we've got the second worst xGA record after Luton. The numbers below exclude own goals as they're not measured.

1714042767931.png

Look at the difference between our expected GD and the actual. That is frankly ridiculous. We can't defend, we don't keep shots out and we can't take our chances.
 
jono_t2000 said:
Let me state some facts.

Under Hecky we only conceded 4+ goals in 3 games.

That also included 3 close losses to man city, man utd and Tottenham 2-1 where we fell in the dying moments.

Wilder has already been tonked by conceding 4+ goals in 6 games.

Not saying Wilder is worse or better than Hecky but to say a corner has been turned is purely fantasy and recency bias.

(Hecky also didn't have BBD which has increased our attacking threat considerably)

Like I said the proof will be in the pudding next season... but to say we've definitely turned a corner is wishful thinking at best.
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To say we've turned the corner is absolutely laughable, it's a shit show from top to bottom which anybody whats been watching this fucking shambles cannot find an argument!
 
gordoncharles said:
We're not in games until the defence is sorted

I can't work out why so many fans can't seem to grasp that.

It doesn't mean you can't counter-attack as well.
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We have lost over 50% of our defence and we have no cover: Egan, Robbo, Basham, RND, Lowe, Baldock are all done. The injuries have totally crippled any glimmer we had ages ago.

We must be top of the injury table after last night since McBurnie and Macca are on the injury list.
 
From the pig end said:
We gave one of the biggest clubs in the world a huge scare.
Going forward we look brave and sharp again. This is far away from a Wilder team player-wise but the attitude and desire is almost back.
Only certain types of fans can deny that.
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Let's see how we cope against a club bigger than Man Utd next season
 
SouthStandGBlock said:
I can't say we've been any different since he replaced Hecky.

With Hecky we defended better but never looked like scoring.

With Wilder it's the polar opposite.

He made some good decisions today, dropping T-Rex and making Arblaster Captain were good decisions.

Bringing the immobile Norwood in next to the largely immobile Souza wasn't.

We played well tonight, and I enjoyed the game. But we conceded 4 again, and look leggy after 70 minutes.

Not sure anyone can get a tune out of some of these players
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It doesn't help when teams can roll out a handful of 30/40m players from the bench just as we're running out of legs
 
Balham Blade said:
Presuming you mean the whole season then using fbref (source data from Opta) we've got the second worst xGA record after Luton. The numbers below exclude own goals as they're not measured.



Look at the difference between our expected GD and the actual. That is frankly ridiculous. We can't defend, we don't keep shots out and we can't take our chances.
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Thank you for posting, that is a perfect illustration of what any realist can see with their own eyes.

The underperforming in xG scored is forgivable, but the xG against is ludicrous
 
From the pig end said:
We gave one of the biggest clubs in the world a huge scare.
Going forward we look brave and sharp again. This is far away from a Wilder team player-wise but the attitude and desire is almost back.
Only certain types of fans can deny that.
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Where was the desire against Brentford and Burnley?! What about Brighton and Arsenal?! What about the defensive desire last night, where was that?!

People see what they want to see, we were in the game for 80 mins against Man Utd, it’s better than the alternative with Grbic in goal, where we’d have been 3-0 down in 30 mins, but we’ve far from turned the corner.
 

Houston_Blade said:
Where was the desire against Brentford and Burnley?! What about Brighton and Arsenal?! What about the defensive desire last night, where was that?!

People see what they want to see, we were in the game for 80 mins against Man Utd, it’s better than the alternative with Grbic in goal, where we’d have been 3-0 down in 30 mins, but we’ve far from turned the corner.
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Against Burnley? Most of the first half mate. Desire and attitude doesn't help your keeper being a clown. We came out on fire in the second half two, just doesn't mean you can defend either.
18 shots and 11 on target, we didnt get mauled like the score suggests.
 
From the pig end said:
Against Burnley? Most of the first half mate. Desire and attitude doesn't help your keeper being a clown. We came out on fire in the second half two, just doesn't mean you can defend either.
18 shots and 11 on target, we didnt get mauled like the score suggests.
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We lost 4-1 against a Championship side in waiting, it doesn’t matter how you spin the game, we’ve conceded 9 in 2 games against a team who 7 seasons out of 10 would be rock bottom in the PL.

Talk about desire and to me that means desire to keep the ball out the back of the net, Norwood must think he’s Harry Potter or something because he tried a magic spell with Peter Pointer last night instead of closing Fernandes down, desire would be to go and actually stop him shooting.

Holgate gave up on Maguire for their first goal.

There’s 4 or 5 players showing desire not to lose in this team, the rest are just showing desire to leave at the earliest opportunity.
 
Most premier league goals scored this season and we are a massive contributing factor to that with the amount we have conceded how many managers would survive but Wilders a catch 22 and might just sort us out in the championship
 
s4-blade said:
Last 8ish games we’ve been a decent competitive football team again. It was always going to take time to repair the damage, but we’re now on the road to recovery.

The proper blades with a brain and eyes stood and sand Chris wilders name for 5 minutes after the game today. No other manager could do what he’s doing.

Idiots that hold a grudge and can’t see past the end of your own nose go and cry about it. Argue with yourselves.
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Competitive ? Are you a retard.
 
Russtheblade said:
It doesn't help when teams can roll out a handful of 30/40m players from the bench just as we're running out of legs
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Do be fair Russ, last night Manchester United had their Under 18s on the bench, and they'd played a bloody Cup Final the night before
 
s4-blade said:
Last 8ish games we’ve been a decent competitive football team again. It was always going to take time to repair the damage, but we’re now on the road to recovery.

The proper blades with a brain and eyes stood and sand Chris wilders name for 5 minutes after the game today. No other manager could do what he’s doing.

Idiots that hold a grudge and can’t see past the end of your own nose go and cry about it. Argue with yourselves.
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Last 8ish games we've conceded 26 goals, that doesn't seem very competitive does it?
 
s4-blade said:
Last 8ish games we’ve been a decent competitive football team again. It was always going to take time to repair the damage, but we’re now on the road to recovery.

The proper blades with a brain and eyes stood and sand Chris wilders name for 5 minutes after the game today. No other manager could do what he’s doing.

Idiots that hold a grudge and can’t see past the end of your own nose go and cry about it. Argue with yourselves.
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We just lost 4 1 at home to Burnley
 
crazyblade1889 said:
This attitude is the reason we haven’t won a carrot in most people’s lifetimes. Let’s keep clapping despite the current shit show being served up by a manager who’s completely out of his depth.
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I'm sure if we'd have booed Wilder from his first game back we'd have at least won the FA Cup this season. The players will only play like they're 100x better than they are and win stuff if we demand they do and spit our dummies out otherwise.
 
Tony Currie said:
This is the absolute truth. We look more competitive and look like scoring, which equals more entertainment!


In the 14 games under Hecky we scored 11 goals.
In the last 14 games we have scored 18 goals.
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If you take out the five goals BBD has scored (Heck'y didn't have him) that would leave us on 13 goals, not much different to Heck'ys record, although i think we have improved our overall play under CW, as someone has said next season will be the proof of the pudding
 
crazyblade1889 said:
This attitude is the reason we haven’t won a carrot in most people’s lifetimes. Let’s keep clapping despite the current shit show being served up by a manager who’s completely out of his depth.
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Pig.
 
Russtheblade said:
It doesn't help when teams can roll out a handful of 30/40m players from the bench just as we're running out of legs
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100%

The 5 subs rule is very unfair and has made a big difference. Being able to change half your team favours the big clubs with larger squads.
 
gordoncharles said:
There are literally dozens of coaches in Europe who would have made a much better job of that and at least given us a chance in games.

.
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agreed

Man for man are 9 points worse than Luton
Or 9-1 worse than Burnley

CW has brought back some attacking threat by bringing in BBD, but then nullified it with Grbic.

Hate to say it, but them cunts are sadly showing what a decent young manager can do with the same players mid season change
 
What concerns me is whose gonna score regularly as a striker next season..bbd off..two crocks and two still developing doesn't fill me with optimism.
 

Bladedog said:
What concerns me is whose gonna score regularly as a striker next season..bbd off..two crocks and two still developing doesn't fill me with optimism.
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Most important role to fill I think.

With injuries back, our defence should be more solid and anel and trusty are both proven at championship level.

Our midfield with our youth players is actually has potential (again, at championship level)

We can't rely on osula and jebbo (if he stays) it's not fair on them or anyone else.

Browser is basically our new mascot now captn blade is marooned on a desert island somewhere.

It's probably the right time now to let mcburnie go
 
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