Scouting in Europe

[Dutch Blade]

Are we still only scouting in the UK? Obviously we have the finances now to set up a European scouting system, or at least target a few specific competitions.

 

[Bladeinleeds]

Are we still only scouting in the UK? Obviously we have the finances now to set up a European scouting system, or at least target a few specific competitions.

We really should be looking at expanding the network to increase the talent pool we’re looking at.... We have the finances where say a £5m investment (similar to the academy under warnock) could have some dramatic long term impact on our success.

It’s a must from me. Wilder is good with sports science and the like so I can see him being keen to try and gain an edge here too. It can only help us

Leicester won the league in the strength of picking up marez and Kante for absolute peanuts. Combined for Less than the cost of an average championship player.

 

[SouthEssexBlade]

We really should be looking at expanding the network to increase the talent pool we’re looking at.... We have the finances where say a £5m investment (similar to the academy under warnock) could have some dramatic long term impact on our success.

It’s a must from me. Wilder is good with sports science and the like so I can see him being keen to try and gain an edge here too. It can only help us

Leicester won the league in the strength of picking up marez and Kante for absolute peanuts. Combined for Less than the cost of an average championship player.

A detailed scouting network like Leicester had/have in Europe takes a few years to establish. Initial outlay yields little return unless you're very lucky and the detailed background dossier that Wilder deems essential (character, personality, fit with the ethos etc.) is more difficult to accurately acquire. Worth the long term investment, but wont add anything this season.

 

[Berkshire Blade]

The head scout was on that alan biggs sheffield live show a few months back and said he has been looking overseas. This was before promotion was in our own hands.

 

[BushBlade]

The head scout was on that alan biggs sheffield live show a few months back and said he has been looking overseas. This was before promotion was in our own hands.

Yes, we’ve also signed a couple of kids from overseas for the academy I think. Recruiting from abroad can be very successful if it’s done properly. If it isn’t, you end up like Norwich a couple of years ago with the likes of Ricky Van Wolfswinkel and get relegated.

 

[YES Blade]

Yes, we’ve also signed a couple of kids from overseas for the academy I think. Recruiting from abroad can be very successful if it’s done properly. If it isn’t, you end up like Norwich a couple of years ago with the likes of Ricky Van Wolfswinkel and get relegated.

No different to recruiting from the UK then, signing crap players will get you relegated.

At least foreign mistakes are generally cheaper mistakes.

 

[Bladezz]

I would stay British for now. Look at Burnley compared to Brighton. Brighton spending millions on these foreigners and are behind Burnley.

I’m not against bringing the odd one in if we find someone abroad but to stay mainly English for us I feel would be the best.

If we want to go foreign it usually means a foreign manager.

 

[Nicolaus_Copernicus]

A detailed scouting network like Leicester had/have in Europe takes a few years to establish. Initial outlay yields little return unless you're very lucky and the detailed background dossier that Wilder deems essential (character, personality, fit with the ethos etc.) is more difficult to accurately acquire. Worth the long term investment, but wont add anything this season.

I think that a lot of it is down to luck tbh. Steve Walsh was the chief scout at Leicester who identified Kante, Vardy & Mahrez and was suddenly seen as a genius in his field. He was poached by Everton and promptly spent £180m of their money on a fair amount of rubbish and was later relieved of his duties. It later emerged that Kante only arrived as a last minute stop gap after Gueye turned the Foxes down in favour of Aston Villa. and Mahrez was discovered by accident while scouting his Le Havre teammate Ryan Mendes, who went to Forest and was meh. Plenty of teams had scouted Vardy, and it was off field issues that people saw a risk.

A similar story with Graham Carr at Newcastle United. He had a fantastic run of identifying players like Ben Arfa, Cbayae, Tiote and Cisse, was hailed as the club's savior and then identified a load of crap and was fired.

 

[mattbianco1]

I would stay British for now. Look at Burnley compared to Brighton. Brighton spending millions on these foreigners and are behind Burnley.

I’m not against bringing the odd one in if we find someone abroad but to stay mainly English for us I feel would be the best.

If we want to go foreign it usually means a foreign manager.

However, three of Burnley's biggest signings are Wood (£15m), Vydra (£10m) & Defour (£8m)

 

[DifferentClass]

A similar story with Graham Carr at Newcastle United. He had a fantastic run of identifying players like Ben Arfa, Cbayae, Tiote and Cisse, was hailed as the club's savior and then identified a load of crap and was fired.

Now he's back to being best known for fathering Alan.

 

[Fulwood Blade]

Why can't we continue with what has been successful up to now?

Continued presence in the Prem may rely on a European network, but for now we could cherry pick players that have seen to take to the British game with other clubs perhaps at end of contract.

UTB

 

[BushBlade]

No different to recruiting from the UK then, signing crap players will get you relegated.

At least foreign mistakes are generally cheaper mistakes.

It is different though. It’s much harder to do proper due diligence on foreign players so it can be a bigger gamble. We don’t have any pulling power abroad so the players are only coming for the money, or to try to get a move to a bigger PL club. Therefore you need to ensure they have the right character and attitude, that they’re prepared to roll their sleeves up and get stuck in. That can be hard to establish if they’re coming from Ligue 2 or the Eriedivisie etc.

I’m not saying don’t sign foreign players, I’m saying make sure we’ve got scouts we can trust, with proper contacts and scout our targets properly, over a number of games, whilst checking up on their character.

 

[BushBlade]

However, three of Burnley's biggest signings are Wood (£15m), Vydra (£10m) & Defour (£8m)

They didn’t sign Wood and Vydra from abroad though. They signed them from the championship.

Wilder isn’t a xenophobe. He’s looking for players that are proven, which Vydra and Wood are. It’s much easier to find people he knows that know them and can give him the heads up on what they’re like, whether they’d fit in etc.

 

[mattbianco1]

They didn’t sign Wood and Vydra from abroad though. They signed them from the championship.

Wilder isn’t a xenophobe. He’s looking for players that are proven, which Vydra and Wood are. It’s much easier to find people he knows that know them and can give him the heads up on what they’re like, whether they’d fit in etc.

Yes but my response was to a comment saying that Burnley buy British, not Foreigners. My comment was to show that three of their biggest 6 signings are foreign... regardless of where they were purchased from

 

[BushBlade]

Yes but my response was to a comment saying that Burnley buy British, not Foreigners. My comment was to show that three of their biggest 6 signings are foreign... regardless of where they were purchased from

She didn’t actually say Burnley only buy British. It’s a fair comparison, Brighton have signed mainly players from abroad, Burnley have signed mainly players from this country.

 

[Akinbiyi]

We are ‘looking’ abroad but there’s no heavy presence. The majority of our scout network is still very much in this country and I don’t expect a single first teaser from abroad from what I’ve been told.

 

[YES Blade]

We are ‘looking’ abroad but there’s no heavy presence. The majority of our scout network is still very much in this country and I don’t expect a single first teaser from abroad from what I’ve been told.

What are we looking at then? One or Two big money signing from the Championship supplemented by free transfers and loans?

I'd like to think we might gamble on a couple of cheap foreign players who'll stand a half decent chance of making the first team.

 

[Boxer Blade]

The head scout was on that alan biggs sheffield live show a few months back and said he has been looking overseas. This was before promotion was in our own hands.

Yes he was in Cork and Dublin

 

[Blade56]

The head scout was on that alan biggs sheffield live show a few months back and said he has been looking overseas. This was before promotion was in our own hands.

It might take years to build an overseas network but I thought that was RipVanWinkles area of expertise. Are we not using him or just 50% using him?

 

[HeCanDoMagic]

We are ‘looking’ abroad but there’s no heavy presence. The majority of our scout network is still very much in this country and I don’t expect a single first teaser from abroad from what I’ve been told.

What have you been told?

 

[Akinbiyi]

What are we looking at then? One or Two big money signing from the Championship supplemented by free transfers and loans?

I'd like to think we might gamble on a couple of cheap foreign players who'll stand a half decent chance of making the first team.

What have you been told?

All I know is what I said the other week that we've identified the championships 'best 5' according to stats, the coaching staff and Mitchell and co and we're working from that list
Unless things have changed dramatically in the past few weeks then I still expect that to be the case

That's not to say we definitely won't 'punt' on a couple of randomers abroad for a million a pop but I just can't see it

 

[YES Blade]

All I know is what I said the other week that we've identified the championships 'best 5' according to stats, the coaching staff and Mitchell and co and we're working from that list
Unless things have changed dramatically in the past few weeks then I still expect that to be the case

That's not to say we definitely won't 'punt' on a couple of randomers abroad for a million a pop but I just can't see it

The chances of us being able to attract all of those 5 players listed have got to be very small and even if we did that's got to be £50m minimum in transfer fees and it's highly unlikely we'll spend that much.

I can see us signing 2 of our 5 main targets for £15m-£20m with the rest being loans, free transfers and cheap punts from abroad.

 

[Akinbiyi]

The chances of us being able to attract all of those 5 players listed have got to be very small and even if we did that's got to be £50m minimum in transfer fees and it's highly unlikely we'll spend that much.

I can see us signing 2 of our 5 main targets for £15m-£20m with the rest being loans, free transfers and cheap punts from abroad.

The best 5 in each position sorry, not the best 5 altogether

Don't know the names but I'd say McBurnie, Maupay, Assombalonga, Rodriguez and Adams (maybe, maybe not due to if WIlder liked him last time around) and we'll go for 1 or 2 of them. We definitely are on the hunt for 2 strikers.

But that's just a guess. I just asked my 'source' what our transfer strategy was, I try not to pry too much and have no interest in being 'itk'

 

[8lade]

Continued presence in the Prem may rely on a European network, but for now we could cherry pick players that have seen to take to the British game with other clubs perhaps at end of contract.

Fair enough but this is what Burnley already do, definitely with forwards which is where our significant shortfall is at present.

 

[8lade]

Yes he was in Cork and Dublin

Argentina if I remember correctly

 

[St Annington]

Why Town blueprint is inspiration for Sheffield United

Chris Wilder will sign players he knows and trusts

www.examinerlive.co.uk

Wilder's squad is made up of entirely British and Irish players and the 51-year-old, who was named the League Managers' Association Manager of the Year, does not envisage change as he prepares to embark on the biggest challenge of his career.

"These are the players I know the best," said Wilder, who has won promotion to all four divisions in the English Football League.

"We've not dipped into the foreign market and that's not to say that down the line I wouldn't.

"But I trust this group of players and I trust my own eye in terms of the players we'll bring in. It's worked for us.

"Nuno (Espirito Santo) at Wolves signs Portuguese players, David Wagner at Huddersfield signed German players. I don't think I'm bucking the trend in any way, it's just players I know and trust."

 

[Fulwood Blade]

Fair enough but this is what Burnley already do, definitely with forwards which is where our significant shortfall is at present.

yes, I agree. Don't mind following the Burnley model - I am a great admirer of their manager.

I believe what a lot are expecting us to do is go and scout players from abroad that have never played in the UK before. That takes time to develop, money and a network of NEW scouts that aren't giving us 2nd choice of players after offering to lets say Watford/Newcastle etc. We are way behind other clubs already. I recall a story of Mahrez when he was in the French 2nd division - had 30 scouts turning up each game before he was signed.

I'm not convinced we can, even at this late stage, gatecrash the party.

We have to do things differently and reckon CW would find his own unique way.

UTB

 

[8lade]

Not sure whether identifying foreign players is do-able without much investment but I wondered what Warnock had seen in Sala. (I thought that) Warnock was the first manager to search the lower leagues with a starting point of looking at each teams POTY I noticed this when he signed Chris Armstrong and Simon Francis. Bearing this in mind I tried to establish what his criteria for picking Sala up were so briefly looking at the facts:
He was playing in a top tier foreign league (Argentine in France).
He was established; it was his third season in this league and he was scoring about a goal in 2 to 3 games.
Obviously you then have to have the player watched just to give you confidence he is decent but you already know he's previously been scouted, what return you are looking for and you aren't buying a one season wonder. FWIW I think he would have saved Cardiff

 

[AdamSufc1997]

Can we afford the scouting system Brentford have and just do that lol