Sander Berge

[Charlieblade]

I think Norwood lacks the pace and mobility required for such a role.

But perhaps it’s a potential role for Berge? He has the pace, mobility and skills required for that job. Just a thought where the team can actually benefit from Berge’s undoubted quality, without him stealing a place he’s clearly not suited to?

 

[itsinyerblood]

Recruiting Berge may be the start of the type of recruitment we'll see during the summer. Given what we know about Wilder's thorough approach to the players he has shown interest in so far, it wouldn't surprise me if a list has already been prepared with prime targets already identified.

 

[CrookesBlade]

Why are we unglamorous and why is Sheffield unattractive? Nicer place to live than Burnley, Watford, Birmingham and most of the country. Why are most Sheffielders so down on their city?

Complaining about anything and everything is part of the mindset and people insist on comparing the retail/cultural offering with urban areas that have 2 or 3 times the population.

 

[Breakingblade]

An interesting post stolen from reddit, by someone who actually knows Berge well:

u/tryling2310h
I wouldn't be surprised if Berge flops.
Discussion
I've watched pretty much every minute of football Sander Berge has played since he made his debut in Norway and I have my doubts he'll come good if United plans on using him the way they have in his first few appearances.

When he first arrived at VIF and played for their 2nd team at 16, the reports weren't universally positive. A technically sound player who could pick a pass and had just learned to use his frame well. On the other hand he was "slow" and "lazy" and people doubted if he'd ever be up to the speed of the Norwegian top flight. The Norwegian U21 manager even used that as a reasoning for not picking him a year later when he had started dominating in the top flight(A few months later he made his debut for the senior team).

Nevertheless he was among the best players on his team. Their best if they had a bad game, top 3 if they had a good game. His role in this team was to get the ball (from friend or foe) and move it to Zahid (Free-roaming playmaker) ASAP. He could also run forward with the ball at his feet if the pass wasn't on. Passes to wing backs bombing down either side also became part of his staple.

He got his move to Genk. Funnily enough the reports there were the exact same. After 2 training sessions people doubted he'd ever play in Belgium, after 2 weeks he made his debut and would've played every minute of every game since if not for injuries. His role in Genk was very similar to his previous role. Get the ball to Pozuelo or Malinovskyi, watch the magic happen. He looked like Moussa Dembele with the style of Busquets. I think it's a shame the Genk team that started their title-winning campaign never got to play CL together, it's the most entertaining team I've ever seen.

As the squad that laid the foundation for Genk's championship fell apart, his role changed slightly. Hagi and Nygren (Replacements for Pozuelo and Malinovskyi) flopped and so he found himself with more offensive responsibilities. While nominally in the same position, he would carry the ball deeper into the opposition's territory and make under lapping down the right and cross. His starting position was never ahead of the ball.

In the interest of saving both of us time I'll skip ahead to when we was re-linked with SU.

It seemed like a good fit to me. The teams results speak for themselves and they had a role in the team he seemed perfect for, currently occupied by Norwood. It also seemed like he had been scouted well over a long time, which is always a positive. When it comes to the possible shortcomings of the player himself I wasn't very worried beyond the fact that absolutely nothing is a sure thing. He didn't look out of place against Liverpool, Napoli or Spain, showing some glimpses of his best.

So the day rolls around, maybe he'll get 10 minutes if he's lucky and the team are a few ahead? Surprise, he's starting! ...As a box-to-box player? Is Lundstram injured and they just need bodies, perhaps? Nah, there he is on the bench, seemingly fit. Since then he's kept the same role and I'm really disappointed. By playing in the role he has so far, you've effectively removed the things from his game that make him truly special. Not that you can't make use of being a good footballer in any role, obviously.

As someone who knows the team better than I do, is there a chance he'll ever play the deep role? Maybe as a part of 2 when playing more dominant teams? Sorry about the rambling, I just care way too much about something I have no real power over Here's to Sheffield United clinching the Champions League spot and Sander Berge turning into prime Pirlo!

TL;DR: Sander Berge is being misused in my opinion and I suspect he won't be a success. Even if he becomes a world-beater box-to-box midfielder I'll miss what has been my favourite player stylistically the last few years.

 

[Nicolaus_Copernicus]

Complaining about anything and everything is part of the mindset and people insist on comparing the retail/cultural offering with urban areas that have 2 or 3 times the population.

Yes & no. Sheffield is the central economic hub of South Yorkshire, which has a population of 1.3m. It should have the appropriate facilities and outlook. Whilst comparison against Manchester is as you say unfair, comparison against Liverpool over the last 70 years isn’t. Both had suffered in WW2, both lost industry and jobs in the 80’s, both suffer the social & economic drag of another major city within 40 miles and both have had leftwing/socialist local authorities.

 

[KeyffSmyff]

I think we'll change how we play next season

I think that a change will start happening sooner than next season. My guess is that the next phase/style development will be when we play against bus parking opposition this season as part of a a "plan B" .

 

[Grizzly blade]

There’s no way Berge has been brought in to play right side of a three.
He’s going to take over from Norwood at some point.

At the moment they just want him playing, and I’m wondering if Lunny is playing silly beggars with the contract talks so they are making a point.

For Reading, let's rest Norwood and put Berge in the middle. Treat it as if Norwood is injured. Play Fleck and Lunny alongside him.

keep the defensive shape, maybe play Osborn for Enda if he’s struggling with a strain. Retsos perhaps to get a game to see how he would fit in when needed, Bash rested or maybe JOC?

Up front...well maybe it’s time to see what Zachario can do? Alongside Mousset perhaps so the pace is a serious problem for Reading.

The point of making a few changes is to not risk crucial players and also see what options you have should you get an injury to one of them.
The cup game is an idea opportunity against a half decent side with the pressure and expectation on us to get a result.

 

[CrookesBlade]

Yes & no. Sheffield is the central economic hub of South Yorkshire, which has a population of 1.3m. It should have the appropriate facilities and outlook. Whilst comparison against Manchester is as you say unfair, comparison against Liverpool over the last 70 years isn’t. Both had suffered in WW2, both lost industry and jobs in the 80’s, both suffer the social & economic drag of another major city within 40 miles and both have had leftwing/socialist local authorities.

The comparison with Liverpool is a good one. No doubt Liverpool has made a far better stab at regenerating the city centre and you can’t fail to be impressed when visiting. I’d argue though that it’s got some of the most impressive architecture in the country, the cultural capital of the Beatles and LFC/EFC to trade off plus it’s legacy as a major port.

Liverpool also never had a Meadowhall equivalent. Sticking a massive shopping centre with free parking 3 miles closer to the rest of South Yorkshire, with only Chesterfield to the South and open countryside to the West was always going to kill the concept of Sheffield being the hub of the local area.

Sheffield could be a lot better but people writing it off as “wank” because it doesn’t have a Harvey Nichols is lazy. There is also loads beyond the city centre that never seems to enter the equation. I always find that incomers seem to value the city as a whole far more than people born and brought up here.

I’m sure Sander won’t be too disappointed anyway plus if he wants to buy some overpriced shite or the restaurants aren’t suitably Instagramable then Leeds is only half an hour away.

 

[bertieblade]

He is no doubt a good footballer who will get better as he improves his fitness and understands our system. At the moment he does not understand his role and is seemingly like a fish out of water in that he does not provide sufficient cover in front of Baldock or takes up good positions to receive the ball from Baldock or Basham.
He is however in my opinion not suited to that role even when fit and understands it. He is apparently used to playing behind the ball, I.e. not receiving passes as an over lapping player, he is not fast, he does not get into the box and is not of the suitable physique to perform the job that lundstram has done so well for the majority of the season. We look a much better “team” when lundstram is involved and will continue to as Berge is not suited to the role.
Which means that he can only be here to replace Norwood, yet I have to date not seen him hit any pass over five yards indeed, Egan and O’Connell hit longer diagonal passes. I would have expected our next midfield player to have been similar to Bissouma the Brighton no 8. Quick feet, quick player, ability to take the ball beyond people, create and get into the box.
In short even when up to speed and fulfilling his undoubted potential i do hit see where Berge fits in unless we change our style of play next season.

 

[FMBlade1]

If he is to play, and if we are struggling to break teams down, I would either have:

--- Berge--- Norwood

----- Fleck ---------

or

------ Berge------------

Norwood------- Fleck

Both of which are significant tactical changes which I'm not sure we are ready for

 

[Kevincarterversion2.0]

There's a player in there no doubt.

However I think he needs bedding in and getting used to the system, regardless of what we've paid for him. His short passing is nice but he's not been particularly threatening, which is understandable of course.

Lunny has his flaws but he has the knack of being in the right place at the right time and right now that's exactly what we need.

Agreed - Berge looks class, but he isnt quite ready - and looks to me more like a Norwood-type. I'd bring Lunny back - we have missed his drive and runs into the box.

 

[Niceguyeddie]

What did lundstram do yesterday to convince so many he should start ?

 

[Trafford]

Berge is improving game by game and shows the potential to be a good player when he adjusts to the speed of the Premiership, my biggest issue at the moment is his lack of awareness when defending. That’s twice now that players have ghosted past him and scored - the defensive coaches need to be working hard on that aspect with him.

 

[Lawrence]

Berge is improving game by game and shows the potential to be a good player when he adjusts to the speed of the Premiership, my biggest issue at the moment is his lack of awareness when defending. That’s twice now that players have ghosted past him and scored - the defensive coaches need to be working hard on that aspect with him.

I admire you optimism over Burge, but Looking at our position, we have been playing well and winning games and my fear is by trying to keep Burge in the starting 11, at the expense of Didzy and Lundy is a mistake. We need to keep winning games and chancing Burge who we all no and acknowledged is not up to speed is a mistake! If Manure and Wolves win today (which they will) then we will drop down the table? and in a few week could drop out of contention, I’m sure Burge will be a good player but now is not the time to experiment with him, I fear he could be the difference between top 6 or not.

 

[stringer]

If we are serious about going for Europe, Lunny has to start.

Sentences you never thought you’d see 1/2 years ago!

 

[FredZeppelin]

What did lundstram do yesterday to convince so many he should start ?

Ridiculous argument as he had 10 minutes, probably reduced to about 5 'actual' football minutes due to Brighton's time-wasting.

Lunny probably deserved to be dropped for the Palace game after his form wained but he has been excellent in the cameos he's produced since.

Sentences you never thought you’d see 1/2 years ago!

I know, pal. I hesitated to think before typing it, myself. Nobody is more proud than me, and if we did decide not to pursue Europe this season I'd totally understand.

Heady, proud times.

UTB

 

[Niceguyeddie]

Ridiculous argument as he had 10 minutes, probably reduced to about 5 'actual' football minutes due to Brighton's time-wasting.

Lunny probably deserved to be dropped for the Palace game after his form wained but he has been excellent in the cameos he's produced since.



I know, pal. I hesitated to think before typing it, myself. Nobody is more proud than me, and if we did decide not to pursue Europe this season I'd totally understand.

Heady, proud times.

UTB

Its not an argument its a question ,one which you seem unable to answer

 

[Shoreham_Bhoys]

He's quality but ideally needs a defensive roll, that's his game screening our defence and having that good 1st outlet ball to start attacks.

We're a regular goalscorer away from being a genuinely dangerous opponent for anyone.

 

[Deadbat]

Imo he has improved each game - which is really all you can ask for.

At the moment I think he is still not 100% with the system. Particularly when interchanging with baldock - it will take a little time to work out when and where to run for the releases of the ball in this system. I can only see him improving with more time and we have the luxury of helping acclimatise before a full preseason.
We have to remember he only came into the county 3 weeks ago.

I disagree. Thought he did quite well against Palace...Then was ordinary v Bournemouth and at fault for their goal. Yesterday I thought he was pretty much anonymous. For me hd has regressed albeit in a small sample size.

He did one bit if nice skill early but then gave it away twice and was never in the game. Defensively on throws/set plays he goes not pick up his man. He was very safe when he had it and rarely played a forward pass.

He is very slow and poor in the air but clearly us a decent footballer with a good touch. He is neat and tidy but so far that is all I can say.

I think it's fair to say he has had minimal impact so far. I'd go as far to say he's been our poorest player in the last two home games. It is very early and he needs time to adapt/ get used to the pace but I had expected much more I have to say for all the hype around this signing. I have not seem many mlnrnts where I think 'What a player!' nor has he really excited me so far. I am not sure his position is really either. He is struggling on the right of the 3 but lacks the dynamism and mobility to play in the central/pivot role.

Hope he can improve in the coming weeks and no doubt this signing is for the long term.

 

[Deadbat]

It won't be a disaster for Berge if Lundstram starts vs Norwich. First half we chose to go down the left hand side a lot more than the right. As a team I don't think we're quite as confident going down our right at the moment. Norwegian TV again said Berge had covered the most ground on the pitch first half, but he tends to do a lot of running without getting near the ball. He gets into the box a lot, but may be a bit surprised to see that we often don't cross if it's not right, preferring to recycle possession going back or switching sides.

The way we attack, with a lot of neat triangles and movement, requires a lot of great relations between players. Being new to the country, the league, the teammates and not least the role, it's a very tough ask to adapt immediately. Individually Basham and Baldock aren't the most composed players at this level, although Lundstram is. Those three know each other and our system inside out though. Together they can be a force. Lundstram only became a regular this season, but the formation change and the RCM role has been ideal for him, given his physical progress. Berge is known to be calm on the ball, but he's used to having a lot more time and space.

Today Berge played a couple of passes to Baldock and Basham and they were good passes, but they were in front of them, into space. So they had to run on to them, which they did, but it struck me that those passes were different to what we normally do, which is more to feet. On another occasion Berge tried to pass the ball backwards to a teammate, but it happened to be McBurnie, who looked to have decided to make his way into the box, and didn't expect to get the ball on that occasion, so it set up a counter attack for Brighton. Things like that will take a while to get right, and it could be an idea to let Berge and Lundstram share the starts towards the end of the season.

I can see Berge being an effective sub in some games if they are a bit stretched and players are starting to tire. We may see his pace and running on the ball being a lot more effective then. So far when games have opened up a little Berge has also become tired, partly due to running up and down to little avail. I'm confident he'll be a great player for us, but it'll take time.

Interesting you cite his pace being an asset. So far he looks very slow to my naked eye.

 

[HodgysBrokenThumb]

What did lundstram do yesterday to convince so many he should start ?

Not an argument for saying he must start, but in a few minutes on the pitch he put in a crunching tackle, was involved in a smart free kick routine where his cross was blocked, and got into a great position in the box for the McBurnie miss - if it had been laid back to him, he would probably have scored (all happened fast, so no surprise that McBurnie didn’t see him). He imposed himself on the game, which is what you want from a sub.

 

[Niceguyeddie]

Not an argument for saying he must start, but in a few minutes on the pitch he put in a crunching tackle, was involved in a smart free kick routine where his cross was blocked, and got into a great position in the box for the McBurnie miss - if it had been laid back to him, he would probably have scored (all happened fast, so no surprise that McBurnie didn’t see him). He imposed himself on the game, which is what you want from a sub.

He could easily have seen red for the crunching tackle though

 

[HodgysBrokenThumb]

He could easily have seen red for the crunching tackle though

Agreed, though it would have been a tad harsh. Wanted the ball, I think, and Wilder wants players to tackle hard, and won’t have a go at them if they genuinely get one wrong. Fleck is a case in point- he is encouraged to tackle hard.

 

[Hillsboro Blade]

Just need to give the lad time. From what I’ve seen so far, he looks a great prospect. Lovely balance, plays it simple and yes, he was in great positions yesterday but the pass didn’t come to him. Needs to work on his defensive duties but this will be worked on by the management. Napoli, Liverpool were interested so he’s got something about him. I’ve always thought it takes a minimum of four months to bed in, new system, new teammates etc. I for one think he’ll be outstanding next season.

 

[FredZeppelin]

Its not an argument its a question ,one which you seem unable to answer

I did answer it. I said he only had 10 mins ('actual 5'). Maybe you should read it again.

I'll reverse your question. What has Berge done in the three games he's played to warrant keeping his place? Or are you advocating Besic for the role?

 

[Deaneandagana]

He’s made a very underwhelming start, the facts are that in the last 2 home games he has cost us 2 goals - gave away possession for the Bournemouth goal & failed to pick up Maupay yesterday even though he looked at Maupay in the build up to the goal.

Agree with the view that so far he has failed to live up to the price tag & hype.

Hope he improves - quickly.

 

[Niceguyeddie]

I did answer it. I said he only had 10 mins ('actual 5'). Maybe you should read it again.

I'll reverse your question. What has Berge done in the three games he's played to warrant keeping his place? Or are you advocating Besic for the role?

So him having ten minutes means he should start next game

 

[FredZeppelin]

If you read my post I also said that he'd looked good in the cameo's as well. On top of the fact that he's clearly had an outstanding season, yes, I'm saying he should start in place of Berge.

Will you be answering my question and giving a reason, one way or another?

 

[Nick Jansky]

Hope he’s given the time to properly bed in & improve, and I’m sure he will.
All that mattered this season was staying up and we’ve done that. If we can now use the rest of the season to bring the new signings up to speed whilst winning as many games as possible I’m all for that. It will stand us in better stead for the long term than going all out for a European place that we might not get. Europe will still be there in future seasons, this is a long term project.

 

[Bergen Blade]

Interesting you cite his pace being an asset. So far he looks very slow to my naked eye.

Fastest player at Genk, 40 meter record of 4,7. His size and running style makes him look slower than he really is, but players will struggle to keep up with him if he gets some space to run into. So far games have been a bit tight in midfield, so not much chance for him to stretch his legs.

These were the 40 meter sprint times that Mark Duffy shared:



Don't know if the above list includes reaction times. For footballers I think it's common to let the clock start when the player starts, thus eliminating differences in reaction.