CONFIRMED Ryan Leonard

[Roygbiv]

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[Chief_Froley]

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Good morning, that's a nice tnetennba.

 

[Tunstall Fred]

I'm not expecting us to pay millions but 5 or 6 hundred thousand is not a lot for a quality midfielder, if he's not quality why are we bothering.

Do you not listen to the many interviews our Manager does and what he says about player valuations,what he is prepared to pay?

 

[davidblade]

Do you not listen to the many interviews our Manager does and what he says about player valuations,what he is prepared to pay?

Yes I listen but he never quotes figures and reality has to come in to play. You never get owt for nowt.

 

[derfblade.3]

Let's knock this chase in the head and go for Sam Morsy.

 

[flashinblade1889]

Let's knock this chase in the head and go for Sam Morsy.

Sam Morsy who dat den

 

[Tunstall Fred]

Yes I listen but he never quotes figures and reality has to come in to play. You never get owt for nowt.

Of course he doesn't quote figures in public,why not give Chris the benefit of the doubt that he actually knows what he is doing ,going on his transfer dealings since he has been with us,he has earnt that trust has he not?

 

[davidblade]

Of course he doesn't quote figures in public,why not give Chris the benefit of the doubt that he actually knows what he is doing ,going on his transfer dealings since he has been with us,he has earnt that trust has he not?

I absolutely trust Chris , but he is an employee of McCabe and will manage within his budget extremely well , but he would have a better team if his budget was bigger. Common sense isn't it.

 

[Tunstall Fred]

I absolutely trust Chris , but he is an employee of McCabe and will manage within his budget extremely well , but he would have a better team if his budget was bigger. Common sense isn't it.

Oh I get it now,it's just a veiled dig at our Chairman,Wednesday not Huddersfield would be in the Premier league if it was all about higher budgets wouldn't they?

Common sense isn't it?

 

[Pinchy]

I have criticised McCabe many a time but I genuinely think this is a Wilder decision. He has a valuation in mind for players and if it goes above that then he thinks we can get better elsewhere for the money. I really don't think Wilder is begging for an extra £200,000 for Leoanard and Holmes

Funnily enough, no other manager in the land is either. Perhaps Tufty has it right.

We Transfers.

 

[Pinchy]

I absolutely trust Chris , but he is an employee of McCabe and will manage within his budget extremely well , but he would have a better team if his budget was bigger. Common sense isn't it.

He says he won't pay more than players are worth. He doesn't mention his budget. That is a given. It dictates the level of spending, not his valuatuon of individual players within the budget.

You are very good at paying over the odds with other people's money. How about your own? Would you like to buy my car?

 

[Gimli]

I absolutely trust Chris , but he is an employee of McCabe and will manage within his budget extremely well , but he would have a better team if his budget was bigger. Common sense isn't it.

Why don't we just bid £3 million for Leonard then? Southend would definitely sell for that much. Enough of the penny pinching, it's common sense isn't it? Who cares that we wouldn't be able to approach any other targets? In fact, what's the point in having a budget at all if it isn't as much as you actually wanted?

 

[Rodley]

Well that's a surprise. I never saw that coming.

Haha.

 

[Cerberus Blade]

I have criticised McCabe many a time but I genuinely think this is a Wilder decision. He has a valuation in mind for players and if it goes above that then he thinks we can get better elsewhere for the money. I really don't think Wilder is begging for an extra £200,000 for Leoanard and Holmes

I suspect you're right. And just for the record, when Wilder was first appointed and spoke about his philosophy on signing players, it raised some concerns for me. To remind you, he said, "The days of Sheffield United spending big money on players has gone". Which sent a shock wave through me - because Sheffield United have never spent big money on players - so I'd really no idea what on earth he was talking about there - and still haven't! I think he was trying to say, "we'll get value for money" - which is fair enough and I totally agree with that. But if he's looking at what we've traditionally spent on players and thinking that this has been "big money" then he is going to limit himself severely in terms of what he can achieve with the club. Not in League 1 obviously, but in the Championship most definitely.

I'm pleased to say I am not ITK and would never wish to be. So I've no idea whatsoever about what is going on with these negotiations over Leonard and Holmes. And I'd like to think that it's a case of us playing it smart and holding out for the best deal, in the knowledge that the players themselves want to join us and their clubs stand to lose an awful lot of money if they insist on them staying and playing out their contract. But I also think that sometimes, if you need or want something and it's really worth having, you have to be prepared to push the envelope a bit, to make sure you get it. It's fine line between negotiating hard and getting what you want, or missing out on it because your idea about what constituted "value" wasn't someone else's.

 

[Pinchy]

Nobodies come out with the old 'speculate to accumulate' bollocks yet, though we're getting pretty close with 'pushing the envelope'.

Looks to me like we've got enough envelope pushers who want to "throw money at it" to make a go of this. How about a grand apiece fellas? Come on, no need for penny pinching....

 

[alcoblade]

Nobodies come out with the old 'speculate to accumulate' bollocks yet, though we're getting pretty close with 'pushing the envelope'.

Looks to me like we've got enough envelope pushers who want to "throw money at it" to make a go of this. How about a grand apiece fellas? Come on, no need for penny pinching....

So nobodies said what you want them to say in order for you to have a dig, so you'll read something extra into what's actually been said. We've seen this a few times before

What would you do without those straw men Pinch?

 

[Blade58]

I suspect you're right. And just for the record, when Wilder was first appointed and spoke about his philosophy on signing players, it raised some concerns for me. To remind you, he said, "The days of Sheffield United spending big money on players has gone". Which sent a shock wave through me - because Sheffield United have never spent big money on players - so I'd really no idea what on earth he was talking about there - and still haven't! I think he was trying to say, "we'll get value for money" - which is fair enough and I totally agree with that. But if he's looking at what we've traditionally spent on players and thinking that this has been "big money" then he is going to limit himself severely in terms of what he can achieve with the club. Not in League 1 obviously, but in the Championship most definitely.

I'm pleased to say I am not ITK and would never wish to be. So I've no idea whatsoever about what is going on with these negotiations over Leonard and Holmes. And I'd like to think that it's a case of us playing it smart and holding out for the best deal, in the knowledge that the players themselves want to join us and their clubs stand to lose an awful lot of money if they insist on them staying and playing out their contract. But I also think that sometimes, if you need or want something and it's really worth having, you have to be prepared to push the envelope a bit, to make sure you get it. It's fine line between negotiating hard and getting what you want, or missing out on it because your idea about what constituted "value" wasn't someone else's.

I suspect, or let's say, how I interpret CW's comments as not so much that we won't spend big money on a player, more that we won't pay more than we (CW) thinks a player is worth.

Too many times I think we've overpaid for a bang average player. I would extend that to the silly money we've laid out on loan players, that simply haven't cut it, especially those in recent times.

I still have this unexplained feeling in my bones that when prem clubs announce their 25 man squad there will be a player or two become a target that CW fancies and that he is willing to loosen the purse strings to try and get him. I am hoping that at the moment, CW's signings and targets just haven't warranted the over priced fees that selling clubs are chasing

 

[Bladeinleeds]

I suspect, or let's say, how I interpret CW's comments as not so much that we won't spend big money on a player, more that we won't pay more than we (CW) thinks a player is worth.

Too many times I think we've overpaid for a bang average player. I would extend that to the silly money we've laid out on loan players, that simply haven't cut it, especially those in recent times.

I still have this unexplained feeling in my bones that when prem clubs announce their 25 man squad there will be a player or two become a target that CW fancies and that he is willing to loosen the purse strings to try and get him. I am hoping that at the moment, CW's signings and targets just haven't warranted the over priced fees that selling clubs are chasing

Agree on the last point. Wilder has stated we are likely to 'keep our powder dry' and see what the situation looks like in August.

To me that suggest we'll hold back some of our budget and see if we can't get a last one or two over the line then - when squads have started to shape up.

 

[Booker4]

I suspect you're right. And just for the record, when Wilder was first appointed and spoke about his philosophy on signing players, it raised some concerns for me. To remind you, he said, "The days of Sheffield United spending big money on players has gone". Which sent a shock wave through me - because Sheffield United have never spent big money on players - so I'd really no idea what on earth he was talking about there - and still haven't! I think he was trying to say, "we'll get value for money" - which is fair enough and I totally agree with that. But if he's looking at what we've traditionally spent on players and thinking that this has been "big money" then he is going to limit himself severely in terms of what he can achieve with the club. Not in League 1 obviously, but in the Championship most definitely.

I'm pleased to say I am not ITK and would never wish to be. So I've no idea whatsoever about what is going on with these negotiations over Leonard and Holmes. And I'd like to think that it's a case of us playing it smart and holding out for the best deal, in the knowledge that the players themselves want to join us and their clubs stand to lose an awful lot of money if they insist on them staying and playing out their contract. But I also think that sometimes, if you need or want something and it's really worth having, you have to be prepared to push the envelope a bit, to make sure you get it. It's fine line between negotiating hard and getting what you want, or missing out on it because your idea about what constituted "value" wasn't someone else's.

My guess is that Wilder is referring to the over the odd transfer fees we've had in recent years. The Clough signings seemed to all come for decent wages and decent transfer fees. Saying that we got some decent players too but they may well have still come but we seemed to not try for a decent deal as much as we are now.

 

[Weasel]

Looks to me like we've got enough envelope pushers who want to "throw money at it" to make a go of this. How about a grand apiece fellas? Come on, no need for penny pinching....

Don't recall anyone on here posting that they think Utd should 'throw money at it' ?? Perhaps you can point out where this has been posted?

What I have read though are a few sensible posts which are saying that if Utd really think that the current targets are potentially vital players for our team next season then Utd should be prepared to pay that little bit extra if necessary to help secure that vital player. Hypothetically if it is a case of paying a couple of hundred grand extra to secure a big player for us then it should be paid. We aren't talking big money here in the grand scheme of things for the championship.

As for your comment about supporters each chucking a 'grand a piece' in each to fund this 'couple of hundred grand' which may be required to get a deal done....well if I had a £100m in wealth and was chairman of a championship club then I would probably be prepared to stump up an extra £400k if the manager needed it for an important player or two. That would equate to 0.4% of my wealth. If I'm worth 150k and I put the same 0.4% of my wealth into the pot then i would be paying £600. Probably the price of a couple of season tickets...so people have already put in their share. Its all relative isn't it?

I would be chuffed to bits if I was rich enough to be a chairman of a championship football club like SUFC....but then on the downside i would also expect to have to put a few bob in for the privilege when necessary. It comes with the territory and is the price to be paid for the prestige of being a football club chairman and for the networking and contacts that are made in the boardrooms. And yes I know McCabe and the Prince already put in substantial funds each year to cover the annual financial deficits.

We could of course not bother to pay a little bit extra now and try and 'get by'....which could mean results next season aren't as good...which could lead to us struggling to stay up or even getting relegated. It will cost the club a lot more in the long run if that was to happen or if we had to urgently bring in reinforcements in January cos we were in the shit and other clubs knew we were desperate. Alternatively we could pay a little bit more now and invest sensibly in the playing staff so that it helps CW get his first choice targets and we do all we can to protect our hard earned championship status. Seems sensible to me, and something i would be prepared to do if I was in McCabes position. Maybe McCabe has already told CW that the extra money is there...and maybe it is CW that is holding back as he doesn't want to pay over what he thinks is the players value...either way sometimes you have to be prepared to pay a little bit more for something if you really want it.

 

[Weasel]

Just a further thought. Our beloved porky neighbours are just about to bring in the lad Boyd from Burnley on a 'free' transfer. No doubt they are giving the lad and his agent a hefty signing on fee and bonus, and are probably adding to their ever growing list of players on over £30k wages a week.

If so, not withstanding the signing on fees, in just over 6 weeks time they will have paid this lad nearly £200k. Meanwhile this could potentially be a deal breaking amount of money to us. Not saying we have to emulate the pork (far from it as i think it will all end in tears for them with their ever spiralling wage bill) but we should get real and know that £200k is a trifling amount of money in the championship.

 

[davidblade]

Just a further thought. Our beloved porky neighbours are just about to bring in the lad Boyd from Burnley on a 'free' transfer. No doubt they are giving the lad and his agent a hefty signing on fee and bonus, and are probably adding to their ever growing list of players on over £30k wages a week.

If so, not withstanding the signing on fees, in just over 6 weeks time they will have paid this lad nearly £200k. Meanwhile this could potentially be a deal breaking amount of money to us. Not saying we have to emulate the pork (far from it as i think it will all end in tears for them with their ever spiralling wage bill) but we should get real and know that £200k is a trifling amount of money in the championship.

And wouldn't it be fucking hilarious if we go up having spent peanuts

 

[Maidenhead]

Don't recall anyone on here posting that they think Utd should 'throw money at it' ?? Perhaps you can point out where this has been posted?

You've just done it yourself, unless you don't consider a mere £400k to be "throwing money at it"

What I have read though are a few sensible posts which are saying that if Utd really think that the current targets are potentially vital players for our team next season then Utd should be prepared to pay that little bit extra if necessary to help secure that vital player. Hypothetically if it is a case of paying a couple of hundred grand extra to secure a big player for us then it should be paid.

Also

As for your comment about supporters each chucking a 'grand a piece' in each to fund this 'couple of hundred grand' which may be required to get a deal done....well if I had a £100m in wealth and was chairman of a championship club then I would probably be prepared to stump up an extra £400k if the manager needed it for an important player or two. That would equate to 0.4% of my wealth. If I'm worth 150k and I put the same 0.4% of my wealth into the pot then i would be paying £600. Probably the price of a couple of season tickets...so people have already put in their share. Its all relative isn't it?

I would be chuffed to bits if I was rich enough to be a chairman of a championship football club like SUFC....but then on the downside i would also expect to have to put a few bob in for the privilege when necessary. It comes with the territory and is the price to be paid for the prestige of being a football club chairman and for the networking and contacts that are made in the boardrooms. And yes I know McCabe and the Prince already put in substantial funds each year to cover the annual financial deficits.

£100 m in wealth does not equate to £100m in the bank.

Some will be in property but the vast majority of it will be the value of his shares in his companies.

Maybe he should sell some to fund the football club?

 

[MobileBlade]

Southends latest account show that they lost £30k a week, are paying £400k a week in rent and owe their parent company £14 million. They get £625k a season in season ticket sales and £1.5m in matchday income. For all their wanting to hold out, they will sell because they have to. Interest alone is costing them £3k a week. That loss includes £1.4 million in player sales.

 

[Enigmatic]

Southends latest account show that they lost £30k a week, are paying £400k a week in rent and owe their parent company £14 million. They get £625k a season in season ticket sales and £1.5m in matchday income. For all their wanting to hold out, they will sell because they have to. Interest alone is costing them £3k a week. That loss includes £1.4 million in player sales.

Sounds like a lot of bluster from their chairman in an attempt to drive the price up. Can't blame him. Ultimately, they will have to sell based on those figures. Wilder knows this, and he's willing to wait to ensure we get the best deal.

 

[Pinchy]

Sounds like a lot of bluster from their chairman in an attempt to drive the price up. Can't blame him. Ultimately, they will have to sell based on those figures. Wilder knows this, and he's willing to wait to ensure we get the best deal.

It is indeed. Most on here fall for it though. All other clubs do things perfectly and speak the truth, except us.

 

[Grizzly blade]

Don't recall anyone on here posting that they think Utd should 'throw money at it' ?? Perhaps you can point out where this has been posted?

What I have read though are a few sensible posts which are saying that if Utd really think that the current targets are potentially vital players for our team next season then Utd should be prepared to pay that little bit extra if necessary to help secure that vital player. Hypothetically if it is a case of paying a couple of hundred grand extra to secure a big player for us then it should be paid. We aren't talking big money here in the grand scheme of things for the championship.

As for your comment about supporters each chucking a 'grand a piece' in each to fund this 'couple of hundred grand' which may be required to get a deal done....well if I had a £100m in wealth and was chairman of a championship club then I would probably be prepared to stump up an extra £400k if the manager needed it for an important player or two. That would equate to 0.4% of my wealth. If I'm worth 150k and I put the same 0.4% of my wealth into the pot then i would be paying £600. Probably the price of a couple of season tickets...so people have already put in their share. Its all relative isn't it?

I would be chuffed to bits if I was rich enough to be a chairman of a championship football club like SUFC....but then on the downside i would also expect to have to put a few bob in for the privilege when necessary. It comes with the territory and is the price to be paid for the prestige of being a football club chairman and for the networking and contacts that are made in the boardrooms. And yes I know McCabe and the Prince already put in substantial funds each year to cover the annual financial deficits.

We could of course not bother to pay a little bit extra now and try and 'get by'....which could mean results next season aren't as good...which could lead to us struggling to stay up or even getting relegated. It will cost the club a lot more in the long run if that was to happen or if we had to urgently bring in reinforcements in January cos we were in the shit and other clubs knew we were desperate. Alternatively we could pay a little bit more now and invest sensibly in the playing staff so that it helps CW get his first choice targets and we do all we can to protect our hard earned championship status. Seems sensible to me, and something i would be prepared to do if I was in McCabes position. Maybe McCabe has already told CW that the extra money is there...and maybe it is CW that is holding back as he doesn't want to pay over what he thinks is the players value...either way sometimes you have to be prepared to pay a little bit more for something if you really want it.

If you say yes every time a manager wants an extra 400k I'm saying you won't be rich enough to be a championship club owner for long in your hypothetical scenario.

Just say we do chuck an extra 400k in now....and then come August a player comes available the manager identifies as being a stand out player and immediate first choice pick for a position we have been looking to recruit but we can't quite stretch to. That 400k would be handy eh?
There's a longer game to play here, and thankfully our manager has it about spot on.

As for not spending big money....it's all relative.
If we got up to the premier league I would expect Wilder to be paying fees in the millions...which last season would be unthinkable and considered huge money. And I certainly won't be surprised to see us stump up a million plus this summer if the right player comes along.

 

[Grizzly blade]

Southends latest account show that they lost £30k a week, are paying £400k a week in rent and owe their parent company £14 million. They get £625k a season in season ticket sales and £1.5m in matchday income. For all their wanting to hold out, they will sell because they have to. Interest alone is costing them £3k a week. That loss includes £1.4 million in player sales.

Best post in the thread. Factual and makes my point and that of others perfectly without saying anything else.
He's desperate for more money in the best interests of his club, while we want to pay as little as possible in the best interests of our club.

 

[Pinchy]

So nobodies said what you want them to say in order for you to have a dig, so you'll read something extra into what's actually been said. We've seen this a few times before

What would you do without those straw men Pinch?

The digs are almost otiose at the moment, mate. They're falling over themselves to talk the most nonsense and see who can twist the truth the tightest.

And the cap-doffing is close to an all-time high. Southend and Barnsley are amongst the most absurd recent examples.

 

[Weasel]

The digs are almost otiose at the moment, mate. They're falling over themselves to talk the most nonsense and see who can twist the truth the tightest.

And the cap-doffing is close to an all-time high. Southend and Barnsley are amongst the most absurd recent examples.

Yawn.