New view of Lane re-development

[Silent Blade]

Cheers old boy! I do like how you pop up randomly with tit bits of information, facts and figures! Any idea what became of Woolhouse in the end?

Which camp are you in then Silent, rebuild the Kop or extend at the back.....?

Last time I read news of Woolhouse when the Star published a photo of him getting into a car in Australia a few years later. There are claims that he attended matches at the Lane in disguise!

As for the Kop, don't know whether we should rebuild or extend

 

[blade too long]

I've already explained to you that Villa didn't face the environmental costs that would be applicable today.

So what are these heavily restrictive costs 20 pound a shovel full would be restrictive .But has it stopped all building projects ..no. Are you implying it would add millions to the bill may be if 85 per cent was radio active .but its 99 per cent 100 year old rubble

 

[Kozzy_is_my_Dad]

I like the illustrations shown by the OP. Looks like an impressive stadium but key, retains the S2 location which is absolutely essential. I wouldn't want to move. Your JJB stadiums on a retail park, moving to MK, squatting at Wembley and moving to Emirates can piss right off. I love the Lane and want to stay there. Then combine this with making the away end insignificant, move them into a corner or sumat. Continue to build the imposing Blade atmosphere.

 

[ChipButtyBlade]

After a quick neb on the net it looks like Arsenal demolished their old North Bank & rebuilt a 12,400 seat two tier stand inside 12 months. Ground capacity was reduced for them down to 29,000 for a full season. Guessing our capacity would be around 20-21,000 if we went down that route, add to that the extra cost of a state of the art (ahem) new build as opposed to an extension I can only see it going one way.

Think Palace did the same too.

 

[LoughboroBlade]

There are claims that he attended matches at the Lane in disguise!

I’ve heard rumours that he posts on this very messageboard...

 

[Sean Thornton]

Last time I read news of Woolhouse when the Star published a photo of him getting into a car in Australia a few years later. There are claims that he attended matches at the Lane in disguise!

As for the Kop, don't know whether we should rebuild or extend

TunstallFred is Paul Woolhouse. FACT!

 

[Sean Thornton]

So what are these heavily restrictive costs 20 pound a shovel full would be restrictive .But has it stopped all building projects ..no. Are you implying it would add millions to the bill may be if 85 per cent was radio active .but its 99 per cent 100 year old rubble

Yes there was nothing hazardous 100 years ago. Everything was built using thistles and acorn shells.

 

[Silent Blade]

TunstallFred is Paul Woolhouse. FACT!

Ha ha!

I have met TunstallFred a few times!

 

[I should coco]

I’ve heard rumours that he posts on this very messageboard...

I don't!


PW

 

[Eddiecolquhounsleg]

Not read the entire thread so this may have already been covered, but wouldn't it be best to redevelop the Bramall Lane end first? Land was cleared to allow for a dual carriageway years ago, but this will never happen, so why not move the existing line of Bramall Lane 20 yards towards London Road then extend the stand backwards. The loss of seats for home fans would be far fewer than redeveloping the Kop first. You would only have to allow a nominal amount of away fans so give them the Westfield corner.

Once the stand was complete you could move the existing Kop season ticket holders into the new stand then close and redevelop the Kop

Or, If Bramall Lane cannot be moved, why not extend over it, in it's current position and make it a tunnel?

You would then end up with a ground with two massive ends rather than the rather steep and truncated Bramall Lane stand.

 

[Sheffsteel]

View attachment 32413

This is what the current development proposal for The Kop is.
Extending at the back, rather than rebuilding, presumably for the reasons that people have stated.
If they’re going to do that at least make it worth while with a few thousand extra seats rather than what looks like a few hundred.
No more bloody Business Centres in the corners where (future) seats should be either!

The propose Kop design in that picture does provide about 3,200 extra seats, there is to be another 300 seats in the executive boxes in the corner stand.

There’s a limit to practically how far we can build back, otherwise the players will look like ants for people right at the back.

My view is just removing the pillars and providing new much larger (undercover) kiosk/ toilet areas will provide a massive and welcome improvement.

Also the site of a packed 14,000 capacity Kop will look really impressive and intimidating. The acoustics will be improved too, it will really add to the atmosphere.

 

[Sean Thornton]

Ha ha!

I have met TunstallFred a few times!

 

[Boxer Blade]

Yes there was nothing hazardous 100 years ago. Everything was built using thistles and acorn shells.

Fuck me, you really do learn something new every day, might use that in my pub quiz tonight

 

[blade too long]

Yes there was nothing hazardous 100 years ago. Everything was built using thistles and acorn shells.

My point being its unlikely to add 1 million to the cost of removing it and considering how budgets over run it's not really a deal buster. When they rebuilt Wembley it went from 380 m to 960m but barely any of it was down to hazardous waste. The original cost if say was 20m to rebuild our loo has even doubled over 10 years to 40m 2 seasons in the Orem would clear it

 

[GaryHamsonsLeftBootLace]

There's no way the residents on Shoreham Street will allow the planning permission. They refused with a much scaled down previous design. No way are they going to allow those three mobile phone masts to be build on their houses, the ones with the numbers at the bottom.

 

[snootyfenooty]

So what are these heavily restrictive costs 20 pound a shovel full would be restrictive .But has it stopped all building projects ..no. Are you implying it would add millions to the bill may be if 85 per cent was radio active .but its 99 per cent 100 year old rubble

Look, I'm just giving the benefit of my experience to reply to concerns and queries of other forum members, not pick a stupid argument and embark on a point scoring exercise. If you think you know better, fine, leave it at that.

 

[LoughboroBlade]

My view is just removing the pillars and providing new much larger (undercover) kiosk/ toilet areas will provide a massive and welcome improvement.

That’s the bare minimum – we can, and should, do better than that. Just adding to the current structure would also do nothing to address the issues exiting the stand. Developing the space beneath the stand would allow a stand with multiple gangways to safely exit. We’re lucky we’ve never had an emergency that’s needed to quickly evacuate the stadium, because there’s bugger all chance of that happening with the Kop as it’s currently designed. Adding extra seating to the existing design would just exacerbate the problem.

 

[Working Class Hero]

A 14,000 seater proper Kop with no pillars would be very impressive and in keeping with the Bramall Lane we all know and love. Anything with multiple tiers or boxes would spoil the feel of the stadium and that's why I'm all for an extension to the current stand.

We all know if they started from scratch it would cost a fortune, half of it would be corporate, it wouldn't hold nearly as many and the prices would go up. Why bother?

 

[Lawrence]

Think the original deal for all the property was around £25m and remember talk of an option for the FC. To buy it back when finances permitted. At the moment it's highly unlikely the FC could finance any major improvements let alone buy the ground back as well as running the club and giving CW a decent budget.

Think CW doesn’t need anything like a decent budget in the premiership, he is a genius

 

[The Crab]

That's looks suspiciously like a business centre in the corner to me! I wonder why we need another one? I think, in time, these business centres at opposite corners of the ground will expand and start to take up more and more seats, until the whole stadium has gone and we just have one big joined-up business centre. You won't need a season ticket or loyalty points to watch a game, you'll just need to book a meeting room and sit behind glass windows that don't open, drinking weak coffee out of polystyrene cups. We're doomed I'm tellin' yer!

Royal Doulton all the way at Crab Industries meetings. Big Vern got it from a "source".

 

[The Crab]

Last time I read news of Woolhouse when the Star published a photo of him getting into a car in Australia a few years later. There are claims that he attended matches at the Lane in disguise!

As for the Kop, don't know whether we should rebuild or extend

A "PW" is a regular client of Crab Fancy Dress Hire (a division of Crab Industries). He was at the last home game but all we had left was a Pantomine Horse. Luckily, Mike McDonald was present so we had an ideal Horses Arse.

 

[The Crab]

Yes there was nothing hazardous 100 years ago. Everything was built using thistles and acorn shells.

Still is when you buy a house from Crab Estates, a division of Crab Industries.

 

[Fulwood Blade]

Ok mate nevermind, interesting input you have nonetheless. Levelling it sounds more feasible now!

Wasn't Woolhouse on the run by 92/93??

And Real Madrid et al would probably say "Dis Coop stand of yours, very flat, no?"

I seem to recall (although could be wrong) that Woolhouse sanctioned this. I also seem to recall that he proposed John street doing immediately after this and joining them up round the corner too.

Perhaps he sanctioned this then disappeared. He lived up our end and after all the interpol interest, I believe he sold his pad to a mate and that he lived at the bottom of the garden!!

UTB

 

[ShockingBadBuy]

This is what the current development proposal for The Kop is.
Extending at the back, rather than rebuilding, presumably for the reasons that people have stated.
If they’re going to do that at least make it worth while with a few thousand extra seats rather than what looks like a few hundred.
No more bloody Business Centres in the corners where (future) seats should be either!

Does the image given here imply that the plans are to engineer out the current overlap of the South by the right hand end of the kop, or is it a trick of the perspective taken in the artist's impression ?

Given that the existing overlap regularly figures in debates on here about what is and isn't desirable, or viable, in any rebuild or add-ons to the existing stand, it might be an interesting question to resolve.

 

[Sothall_Blade]

Does the image given here imply that the plans are to engineer out the current overlap of the South by the right hand end of the kop, or is it a trick of the perspective taken in the artist's impression ?

Given that the existing overlap regularly figures in debates on here about what is and isn't desirable, or viable, in any rebuild or add-ons to the existing stand, it might be an interesting question to resolve.

I find it very hard to believe that there is no possible way of filling that corner with seats (or even boxes) at some point in the future.
What on earth is the point of building a Business Centre on that corner when there is so much other spare land available?
Regardless of whether The Kop should be extended or rebuilt, surely we can all agree that a Business Centre shouldn't be built there?

 

[BushBlade]

I find it very hard to believe that there is no possible way of filling that corner with seats (or even boxes) at some point in the future.
What on earth is the point of building a Business Centre on that corner when there is so much other spare land available?
Regardless of whether The Kop should be extended or rebuilt, surely we can all agree that a Business Centre shouldn't be built there?

If you look at the number of windows compared with the actual business centre it suggests that they're corporate boxes, probably with restaurant, bar etc behind them.

 

[vorpal blade]

yes, and I think that part of the reason Bramall Lane has the capacity it does it because the perimeter around the pitch is quite a bit longer than at most grounds.

To make adequate corner stands at BDTBL, you really do have to demolish bits at the sides of the existing stands - a reluctance to do this led to the nonsensical infill between the Kop and the John St. stand. - but, it inhibits capacity if you aren't prepared to go UP with the stand or indeed DOWN by digging extra rows of seats and lowering the pitch BUT, its right down near the water-table anyway if the River Sheaf is anything to go by?

For me the best solution to rebuilding the kop would be to nudge the whole thing towards Shoreham Street thus allowing more room at the Bramall Lane end for future developments, allowing an adequate solution to the Kop and the John St. corner too with less demolition of the John Street Stand to enable the curved geometries to meet than if you did not re-site the Kop slightly. The movement ALSO gives more room to adequately (in time) put another tier on the South Stand because if you look at the current proposals, the hotel gets in the way of this new tier and stops it running the whole length of the stand/pitch I think.

OK, moving the kop puts the back of it nearer the houses on Shoreham Street, so I would design the front onto this street as a landscaped park or something.

At the moment, the stadium makes little positive contribution to the surrounding streets, it's easily done. But you have to engage GOOD architects, Kevin never has done. (I am in position to advise on this, if he's reading)

Incidentally, I tried to find an image of the 1980's plan for an athletics track at Bramall Lane, it was published in the newspaper that SUFC used to print at the time. I don't want a running track there BUT it was interesting for the façade it presented to Shoreham Street, a sort of mini Colosseum (if that's not an oxymoron) .... this is the only picture I did find .....

 

[I should coco]

If you look at the number of windows compared with the actual business centre it suggests that they're corporate boxes, probably with restaurant, bar etc behind them.

I don't think many people would want a corporate box that faced the Kop. Most of them look directly onto the seats rather than the pitch. Not much room to sit outside either.

I respectfully suggest that you may have called this one wrong BushBlade. Don't worry though, even wonder posters like myself have made the odd minor slip......

 

[BushBlade]

I don't think many people would want a corporate box that faced the Kop. Most of them look directly onto the seats rather than the pitch. Not much room to sit outside either.

I respectfully suggest that you may have called this one wrong BushBlade. Don't worry though, even wonder posters like myself have made the odd minor slip......

I'm just basing it on what Fulham have done, which is exactly that.

 

[Harrisblade]

There's no way the residents on Shoreham Street will allow the planning permission. They refused with a much scaled down previous design. No way are they going to allow those three mobile phone masts to be build on their houses, the ones with the numbers at the bottom.

Residents don't grant planning permission, they can only write to the council with any objections they may have.
The Planning Committee then make a decision.
I'm sure that the Councillors who are true Blades will..........................................Oh!