Midfield Worries

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The midfield should of been top priority in the window, but wait we had our best window by throwing 18 million at Bournemouth for ramsdale and 10 million at derby for Lowe and Bogle.... 2 players we didn’t need
 



Midfield, zero pace, zero creativity, zero pressing..... might aswell just play 8-0-2
 
I agree the midfield has looked poor but I’m not sure it’s a tear the whole thing down job. I think it’s a single weakness that’s negating the whole thing we lack a competent conductor at this level. Whichever iteration of the three we’ve played it’s been with a conductor in there coutts or Norwood which has allowed us to play through the press and move the ball quickly up the field through the other direct runners either side or in front in midfield or to pick out long diagonals to either wing back. Without coutts to do this first season back in the champ the midfield looked shot after jan and right now the game just seems to be moving to fast physically and mentally for Norwood and it’s no coincidence the midfield looks shot again.
 
I agree the midfield has looked poor but I’m not sure it’s a tear the whole thing down job. I think it’s a single weakness that’s negating the whole thing we lack a competent conductor at this level. Whichever iteration of the three we’ve played it’s been with a conductor in there coutts or Norwood which has allowed us to play through the press and move the ball quickly up the field through the other direct runners either side or in front in midfield or to pick out long diagonals to either wing back. Without coutts to do this first season back in the champ the midfield looked shot after jan and right now the game just seems to be moving to fast physically and mentally for Norwood and it’s no coincidence the midfield looks shot again.

I think the problem is more not having a player like Kante who breaks play up and turns over the ball. Our midfield is so anxious about giving the ball away and being turned over that they all see scared senseless of getting forward or taking a chance on a pass.

I'd look at throwing money on a loan of that kind of player in January. I think it's our most desperate need.
 
I think the problem is more not having a player like Kante who breaks play up and turns over the ball. Our midfield is so anxious about giving the ball away and being turned over that they all see scared senseless of getting forward or taking a chance on a pass.

I'd look at throwing money on a loan of that kind of player in January. I think it's our most desperate need.
I dunno tbh I think for that kind of player to be a difference maker they need to be world class like a Kante where he can break up play like no one else or someone who can do a bit of that but also play and I think that’s what we went for in Berge. It would help calm the nerves in midfield if we had a player who you have complete confidence in not giving the ball away that they’ll just find a man. Under pressure pass to them.
 
We have two CDM ( Berge and Norwood) who do not / cannot tackle
A right sided midfield player ( Lundstram) who does not want to be here
A left sided midfield player ( Fleck) who has lost his confidence after injury

no back up to these
No player who likes a tackle
No player who carries the ball beyond the opposition

all in all no midfield to protect the defence and / or create fir the forwards

much as I like and respect him, CW has put this together, he has spent money in wrong areas of the pitch. Although I would keep him as he will learn from his mistakes and as already illustrated is the right guy to take us up after we get relegated this season. Although I still feel if we could just get one win and the confidence that goes with it and bring in two players in the window we could stay up.
not because we are good but because there are at least two Fulham and West Brom and one of Brighton and Burnley who are also not very good.
 
We never ever control a game. All the good teams dictate play from midfield with a tempo. Knock it about - lose the ball- win it back and dictate again. In all 11 matches the opposition have had the control.
Its painful to watch. Looks extremely tiring running about and never ever controlling.
Bottom line is the team sadly is not good enough.
Lowe Bryan Lunny McBurnie Burke don’t get in any other Prem team.
 
I've said this before, but I do wonder whose signing Berge is. He does look like a Premier League footballer, at times, but he's never looked like a player who fits into how we play. I can't put my finger on it but he just seems to be the wrong kind of player for how we play.
I keep reading this about Berge. I can't help but feel that Sander gets a free pass quite regularly.

Look at the WBA defeat. All emphasis was on whether Ramsdale hadn't been able to see through solid objects where somehow Hendo had that ability. Very little initial reaction focused on how Sander completely fluffed his clearance and played it right into the danger area your clearances are supposed to avoid - something which intimately cost us the game in the same way Fleck's lack of basic ball control did yesterday.

I've also read about how he doesn't fit into how we play. He's played right of a three going forward a little which as a central midfielder is a bit of a luxury operating in a 3 rather than a 2. He's also been deployed in a defensive midfield role too. So if he's not a number 6 and he's not a number 8, then what is he?

20m+ seems an awful lot if his role is to play alongside vastly superior offensive players and just pass the ball to them sideways and allow them to do they tricky stuff especially when you're not showing you can dominate defensively either, even with a build of Yaya Toure.

He needs to contribute far more.

The decline of the rest is inexplicable. They aren't 34, their legs going. They are all 30 or under, arguably at or approaching their prime.

Norwood has gone from the PL's long range passmaster and ping expert to a guy who can't beat the first man for love not money in dead balls and just disappears in the midfield.

Lundstram has gone from substandard back up to box to box goalscoring maestro to always choosing the wrong option when facing goal.

Fleck has always been a slow starter. He's never been the liability he was yesterday and at one point last season he looked every bit a top 6 midfield player with 20m being bandied around. Funny thing is, we would have probably been daft enough to turn it down!

Whether the pre-season was too short and they just got no time to recover and came back behind, I've no idea but I look at that midfield and I find myself thinking of ways to not pick any of them! Could Ampadu sit in front of the back 4 to give them more protection? Could McGoldrick drop into the hole behind a front two? Who could we loan in to make a third option?

Just seems so much inexplicably wrong with the team right now.
 
Time to take a few risks as we have nothing to lose. The main issue being we are being out played in midfield in every game. Berge is a decent player but the current formation means he gets swamped and DCM. And since our other midfielders aren't playing as well as last season we need to change formation. I would go for 4 5 1. Osborn left. Fleck inside him. Ampadu DCM Berge to his right and Lundstram on the right. Berge or Fleck can attack more without leaving big holes behind them. Plus we need to pressure the opposition midfield more.
It doesn't mean we are all defensive if we get it right. But let's get a few bodies in their and get a foot on the ball.
 
Norwood would make a brilliant rugby player as he only ever seems to pass sideways or backwards these days
 
We needed a midfielder in the summer, irrespective of the Lundstram situation. Lundstram was actually our best midfielder yesterday, but it was a poor showing across the board in the middle of the pitch.
 
Could we recall Freeman in Jan ? Fleck played at his best when he knew Freeman was ready to slot in if he dipped in form.
 
We weren't a strong team of individuals last year. We performed based on a unique system with players fitting in like a glove, momentum and nothing to lose, players playing out of their skin, having a 12th man at the lane being lucky with injuries. Most fans won't believe last year was a perfect storm and unsustainable, akin to Leicester winning the league, but those dreaming of Europe this year were kidding themselves. Whilst our start has been garbage, in reality we have been a few 'big moments' away from being a relegation battle and not adrift (penalties / red cards / defensive errors / missed chances). For me that was always going to be our season this year.

This year we have lost everything which made us great. System is no longer a surprise to other teams, we don't have the fans giving that extra 5%, we're hampered by injuries and players aren't firing on all cylinders. We've also lost our two most important and best players from last year in JOC & Henderson.

When we aren't gelling and at our absolute best and playing as greater than the sum of its parts we revert back to mostly a team of Championship standard players. As per this thread, particularly looking at our midfield we are woefully short of Premier league class.
 



The midfield is a connumdrum. Yesterday with Berge, Ampadu and Fleck you knew it was a containment job. When that went south, should we have brought on Lundstram? We are desparate for a No 10 role in midfield. Then you could play Berge and Ampadu. Sorry to say it we never replaced Duffy.
 
We weren't a strong team of individuals last year. We performed based on a unique system with players fitting in like a glove, momentum and nothing to lose, players playing out of their skin, having a 12th man at the lane being lucky with injuries. Most fans won't believe last year was a perfect storm and unsustainable, akin to Leicester winning the league, but those dreaming of Europe this year were kidding themselves. Whilst our start has been garbage, in reality we have been a few 'big moments' away from being a relegation battle and not adrift (penalties / red cards / defensive errors / missed chances). For me that was always going to be our season this year.

This year we have lost everything which made us great. System is no longer a surprise to other teams, we don't have the fans giving that extra 5%, we're hampered by injuries and players aren't firing on all cylinders. We've also lost our two most important and best players from last year in JOC & Henderson.

When we aren't gelling and at our absolute best and playing as greater than the sum of its parts we revert back to mostly a team of Championship standard players. As per this thread, particularly looking at our midfield we are woefully short of Premier league class.
Absolutely spot on. I reckon though that we are woefully short of PL class anywhere in the squad - JOC hopefully excepted, if and when he returns.
 
Fleck is playing like someone nearing the end of his career - slow in thought and deed. I’d assumed he was early/mid 30s so I just checked: 29! I can only assume he’s had a very hard life.
 
Fleck is playing like someone nearing the end of his career - slow in thought and deed. I’d assumed he was early/mid 30s so I just checked: 29! I can only assume he’s had a very hard life.
hes definetly missed joc pushing up with him maybe showing his limitations can see us having a completely different midfield next season whichever league were in
 
This really has never been addressed.

Back then it was:

Berge
Lunny
Norwood
Fleck
Osborn
Rodwell

and now it is

Berge
Doyle
Norwood
Fleck
Osborn
Couilibally
McAtee
 

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