LITTLE WEE JIMMY

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Nicolaus_Copernicus said:
I'll leave Norwood to one side, as his is a closer argument, but neither Fleck nor Berge offer enough anywhere on the pitch for long enough periods, to be picked ahead of more mobile (arguable less technical) CM's now. It's time to grasp the nettle. If we roll out a midfield trio of Norwood, Berge & Fleck for the remaining games, we'll not get promoted either automatically or via the Play Offs.

I would also proffer that despite his ability to win defensive headers, McBurnie isn't mobile enough to lead the line and pressure the opposition's defensive line repeatedly.

A bulked up CM of Brooks, Doyle and Coulibaly (with Baldock & Osborn either side), with McAtee in front & Ndiaye up top would offer more solidity and mobility away from home. Doyle in the DCM role offers a lot more protection for our CB's than Norwood.
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Tin hat on

Imo

That midfield trio would get us near relegated - not promoted

Oh my
 
I think that we should let up on the players. Hecky says they are suffering from emotional fatigue.
 
Nicesheffielder said:
Fair comment bud but I believe Doyle in my eyes offers more commitment, and has a better engine than both Berg & Fleck,with respect to wee Jimmy he has been fantastic in the PAST for us but he's yesterday's man and he just can't hack it at this level, and as for Berg I'm sick of hearing he's world class which world? The premier manager's know a world class player,1 Good game in 4 don't cut it .
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I don’t hear any saying Berge is world class. He never has been with us, but he still retains the ball and passes it better than most of our players and can get round the back of defences better than most.
Doyle played well against Spurs, but otherwise adds little by way of creativity. He is competent but has had several anonymous games.
 
Bell4 said:
I was referring to the proposal of Doyle - Brooks - Coulibaly

As proposed by the poster I was responding to
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Apologies I misunderstood.
I agree that trio would get no team anywhere !
 
Bell4 said:
No probs

I don’t understand myself much anyway
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Well first off all, we're on 64 points with 12 to play, so although relegation isn't mathematically impossible, it's highly improbable, so i'll treat your initial comment with the seriousness that it deserves.

Secondly, that trio, with McAtee in front, with Baldock & Osborn and the shape I suggested dealt with a midfield 4 of Hojbjerg, Sarr, Porro & Perisic v. Spurs. That's against a premier league team & £74m of talent. We looked mobile, offered cover, had legs and engaged Spurs all over the pitch. The lack of Norwood meant that he didn't sit deep in our half and we didn't resort to Hollywood balls or aimless square 5 yarders. I'm not claiming that Brooks is the second coming of christ, i'm saying give him his a start and be brave. The same with Coulibaly. If both were good enough to start against Spurs without fear of embarrassment, then there are good enough to start v. Reading.

I've watched Norwood sit 5 yards off our back four for 80 mins, and point for the remaining 10 mins because he can't move about too long the second half of this season, I've seen Berge be as much use a fart in a cullender for 90% of the games he's played this season and I'm watching the death throws of Fleck's career in this country at this level.

All three can't move rapidly from one end of the pitch to another, they offer little screen/protection for our back 3. Our midfield has cried out for a better balance, more mobility, physicality and menace for the best part of 18 months, and now the chickens are coming home to roost.

Our Rolls Royce of a midfield got bullied, out fought, out thought and out tried by Buckley, Travis and Szmodics on saturday, and by Shackleton, Saville & Flemming against Millwall, and the same thing will happen on saturday v. Luton. These are team that we'll meet if we drop into the play offs.

Even Hecky appears to be growing tied of watching Berge casually arse about the field like it's a non contact sport. He stands 6ft 4 in his sock feet and jumps 5ft 8. Fleck is running off vapours and trading off the good will accrued up until & including the 19/20 season. It ain't working, and i'll be brutally honest, Fleck, Norwood & Berge; i wouldn't shed a tear if two of those three never wore a United shirt again.
 
Nicolaus_Copernicus said:
Well first off all, we're on 64 points with 12 to play, so although relegation isn't mathematically impossible, it's highly improbable, so i'll treat your initial comment with the seriousness that it deserves.

Secondly, that trio, with McAtee in front, with Baldock & Osborn and the shape I suggested dealt with a midfield 4 of Hojbjerg, Sarr, Porro & Perisic v. Spurs. That's against a premier league team & £74m of talent. We looked mobile, offered cover, had legs and engaged Spurs all over the pitch. The lack of Norwood meant that he didn't sit deep in our half and we didn't resort to Hollywood balls or aimless square 5 yarders. I'm not claiming that Brooks is the second coming of christ, i'm saying give him his a start and be brave. The same with Coulibaly. If both were good enough to start against Spurs without fear of embarrassment, then there are good enough to start v. Reading.

I've watched Norwood sit 5 yards off our back four for 80 mins, and point for the remaining 10 mins because he can't move about too long the second half of this season, I've seen Berge be as much use a fart in a cullender for 90% of the games he's played this season and I'm watching the death throws of Fleck's career in this country at this level.

All three can't move rapidly from one end of the pitch to another, they offer little screen/protection for our back 3. Our midfield has cried out for a better balance, more mobility, physicality and menace for the best part of 18 months, and now the chickens are coming home to roost.

Our Rolls Royce of a midfield got bullied, out fought, out thought and out tried by Buckley, Travis and Szmodics on saturday, and by Shackleton, Saville & Flemming against Millwall, and the same thing will happen on saturday v. Luton. These are team that we'll meet if we drop into the play offs.

Even Hecky appears to be growing tied of watching Berge casually arse about the field like it's a non contact sport. He stands 6ft 4 in his sock feet and jumps 5ft 8. Fleck is running off vapours and trading off the good will accrued up until & including the 19/20 season. It ain't working, and i'll be brutally honest, Fleck, Norwood & Berge; i wouldn't shed a tear if two of those three never wore a United shirt again.
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I think your bang on re Fleck,Norwood and Berg bud
 
Bladesman said:
For the 100th time. Fleck is just a solid substitute these days as he was in the Watford game.

He isn't a starter anymore. Same goes for Basham.
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I'm not sure he's even a solid sub anymore. You rarely want a sub to come on and have zero impact other than jockeying space and being about two yards off the pace. Was really good for us, time has caught up with him. Happens to everyone.
 



Nicolaus_Copernicus said:
Well first off all, we're on 64 points with 12 to play, so although relegation isn't mathematically impossible, it's highly improbable, so i'll treat your initial comment with the seriousness that it deserves.

Secondly, that trio, with McAtee in front, with Baldock & Osborn and the shape I suggested dealt with a midfield 4 of Hojbjerg, Sarr, Porro & Perisic v. Spurs. That's against a premier league team & £74m of talent. We looked mobile, offered cover, had legs and engaged Spurs all over the pitch. The lack of Norwood meant that he didn't sit deep in our half and we didn't resort to Hollywood balls or aimless square 5 yarders. I'm not claiming that Brooks is the second coming of christ, i'm saying give him his a start and be brave. The same with Coulibaly. If both were good enough to start against Spurs without fear of embarrassment, then there are good enough to start v. Reading.

I've watched Norwood sit 5 yards off our back four for 80 mins, and point for the remaining 10 mins because he can't move about too long the second half of this season, I've seen Berge be as much use a fart in a cullender for 90% of the games he's played this season and I'm watching the death throws of Fleck's career in this country at this level.

All three can't move rapidly from one end of the pitch to another, they offer little screen/protection for our back 3. Our midfield has cried out for a better balance, more mobility, physicality and menace for the best part of 18 months, and now the chickens are coming home to roost.

Our Rolls Royce of a midfield got bullied, out fought, out thought and out tried by Buckley, Travis and Szmodics on saturday, and by Shackleton, Saville & Flemming against Millwall, and the same thing will happen on saturday v. Luton. These are team that we'll meet if we drop into the play offs.

Even Hecky appears to be growing tied of watching Berge casually arse about the field like it's a non contact sport. He stands 6ft 4 in his sock feet and jumps 5ft 8. Fleck is running off vapours and trading off the good will accrued up until & including the 19/20 season. It ain't working, and i'll be brutally honest, Fleck, Norwood & Berge; i wouldn't shed a tear if two of those three never wore a United shirt again.
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This 1000%. These misty eyed, Rolls Royce loving fan boys really are hard of thinking and even harder of viewing.

It's like the emperor's New clothes watching Berge jog back and frequently not show for the ball whilst Norwood sits next to Egan and pass it sideways. I just don't see it.

As well as they've done, you're only as good as your last game(s).

Whats the definition of insanity? Doing the same over and over again yet expecting a different outcome. We're there...
 
Nicolaus_Copernicus said:
Well first off all, we're on 64 points with 12 to play, so although relegation isn't mathematically impossible, it's highly improbable, so i'll treat your initial comment with the seriousness that it deserves.

Secondly, that trio, with McAtee in front, with Baldock & Osborn and the shape I suggested dealt with a midfield 4 of Hojbjerg, Sarr, Porro & Perisic v. Spurs. That's against a premier league team & £74m of talent. We looked mobile, offered cover, had legs and engaged Spurs all over the pitch. The lack of Norwood meant that he didn't sit deep in our half and we didn't resort to Hollywood balls or aimless square 5 yarders. I'm not claiming that Brooks is the second coming of christ, i'm saying give him his a start and be brave. The same with Coulibaly. If both were good enough to start against Spurs without fear of embarrassment, then there are good enough to start v. Reading.

I've watched Norwood sit 5 yards off our back four for 80 mins, and point for the remaining 10 mins because he can't move about too long the second half of this season, I've seen Berge be as much use a fart in a cullender for 90% of the games he's played this season and I'm watching the death throws of Fleck's career in this country at this level.

All three can't move rapidly from one end of the pitch to another, they offer little screen/protection for our back 3. Our midfield has cried out for a better balance, more mobility, physicality and menace for the best part of 18 months, and now the chickens are coming home to roost.

Our Rolls Royce of a midfield got bullied, out fought, out thought and out tried by Buckley, Travis and Szmodics on saturday, and by Shackleton, Saville & Flemming against Millwall, and the same thing will happen on saturday v. Luton. These are team that we'll meet if we drop into the play offs.

Even Hecky appears to be growing tied of watching Berge casually arse about the field like it's a non contact sport. He stands 6ft 4 in his sock feet and jumps 5ft 8. Fleck is running off vapours and trading off the good will accrued up until & including the 19/20 season. It ain't working, and i'll be brutally honest, Fleck, Norwood & Berge; i wouldn't shed a tear if two of those three never wore a United shirt again.
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Not disagreeing that our current set up is good enough

I’m saying the other two lads aren’t the answer either and imo would be worse . They offered very little v spurs tbh but our tactics was to soak up - defend with a good back 5 and then bring on the so called bigger hitters to finish off the job

The result v spurs was nothing to do with the two young lads / they were ok but nothing more .

It was to do with a superb back 5 with Doyle having his game of the season - when we brought on fleck - sander and IN we had more to attack then with and dud he job

The two young guys were virtually anonymous tbh
 
Bell4 said:
Not disagreeing that our current set up is good enough

I’m saying the other two lads aren’t the answer either and imo would be worse . They offered very little v spurs tbh but our tactics was to soak up - defend with a good back 5 and then bring on the so called bigger hitters to finish off the job

The result v spurs was nothing to do with the two young lads / they were ok but nothing more .

It was to do with a superb back 5 with Doyle having his game of the season - when we brought on fleck - sander and IN we had more to attack then with and dud he job

The two young guys were virtually anonymous tbh
Click to expand...

But surely it's much easier to defend when you've got energy and agility in front of you?
 
Nicesheffielder said:
Let's all give thanks for the return of our little smiling jock.
Massive sorry to use that word improvement in our form NOT,it's bad enough carrying that world class midfielder Beefburger,but to have them both in same team doesn't help the team much rather have Doyle in. Like or lump it that's my 2p's worth
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Whatever you think of his current form, the level of language used against our players makes this a wanker post imo.
That's my 2p worth.
 
Greasy Chap Butty said:
Whatever you think of his current form, the level of language used against our players makes this a wanker post imo.
That's my 2p worth.
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Yep. Classless pork like post. The lad has produced some great moments for the club. The winner at Northampton; the opener on a day not 2-4 get. Burnley at home in the first prem season. Mega consistently good in our drive up the leagues with our Chris.
Yeah father time catches up with us all but let's not have the bile eh?
 
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Rudders said:
Yep. Classless pork like post. The lad has produced some great moments for the club. The winner at Northampton; the opener on a day not 2-4 forget. Burnley at home in the first prem season. Mega consistently good in our drive up the leagues with our Chris.
Yeah father time catches up with us all but let's not have the bile eh?
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Northampton away 8th April 2017
Burnley home 2nd November 2019
Last goal v. Peterborough home 11th September 2021. 43 league appearances ago.

If people honestly think that John Fleck is the answer, then they’re asking the wrong question.
 
Nicolaus_Copernicus said:
Northampton away 8th April 2017
Burnley home 2nd November 2019
Last goal v. Peterborough home 11th September 2021. 43 league appearances ago.

If people honestly think that John Fleck is the answer, then they’re asking the wrong question.
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A good question to ask would be why haven't we invested in permanent signings for our midfield since 2019 and whose fault is that instead of berating fleck or wondering why we have to play aging players...
Presume the loan fees and wages for Khadra and Ciaran Clark this season could have amounted to a modest transfer fee. Same goes for money chucked down the drain last year on Olsen, Charlie Goode etc. Some blame for Mitchell, Slav, Hecky, Bettis, HRH etc...
 
Dougie said:
I'm enjoying how many are seeing Brooks as the answer based on one (admittedly impressive) game. Along with Coulibaly 🤣 🤣
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I'd say he didn't let himself down, although one stray backwards pass was nearly fatal.

To suggest he's anywhere near supplanting some of the more established players is optimistic in the extreme.
 
If we play Fleck, Norwood and Berge we have a slow ponderous midfield who have no ability to run past players with the exception of Berge who does it sometimes but not enough. Fleck is a liability in my opinion no pace, no height and anonymous in the match on saturday
 
Snowflake said:
I don’t hear any saying Berge is world class. He never has been with us, but he still retains the ball and passes it better than most of our players and can get round the back of defences better than most.
Doyle played well against Spurs, but otherwise adds little by way of creativity. He is competent but has had several anonymous games.
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At Cardiff Doyle actually topped the stats table for most big chances created per minute played across the whole league i believe.
 
Nicolaus_Copernicus said:
Jesus Christ, it was Millwall away not Real Madrid.

Jesus Christ, it was Blackburn away not Real Madrid.

Jesus Christ, it was................
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We absolutely do not need to be stacking the midfield with ‘solidity’ players, especially ones who have barely played a game of men’s football.

We’re second because we’re one of the best teams in the league. We pick our creative players, we go to Reading and we do them.
 



Sheff de party said:
We absolutely do not need to be stacking the midfield with ‘solidity’ players, especially ones who have barely played a game of men’s football.

We’re second because we’re one of the best teams in the league. We pick our creative players, we go to Reading and we do them.
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You do realise Reading are one of the top 5 teams in the league regarding home form right...

Theyv'e only lost 3 at home all season, better than Blackburn and the same as us...

look what happened when we went to other teams whose home form was right up there.

Disrespect their home form at our own peril.

1678150882812.png
 
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