(Lack of) Athletic Development...

[N20 Blade]

Absolutely
Speed of thought is what's important

Pace is only a decent attribute if you have a quick footballing brain

The football world is full of speedsters who can't stay onside, can't control a ball, can't pass or cross, and can't get into dangerous positions because their footballing minds are nowhere near as fast as their legs

Burke

 

[IdLiketoRogerMoore]

It was never going to end well making Moose the new club dietician................

Think I've mentioned this anecdote before but after the Brentford game (first one back in the championship) I was in Rajdhani in Dore when in walked Billy with half the team. At the time I thought it was great and a show of team bonding and the down to earth nature of Team Wilder.

Looking back now, it probably shows where we were/are in terms of diet and 'refuelling' compared to the elite in the PL. Fine in the Championship, but once you're up against £100k+ a week athletes, the rules are different,

I remember when I did track hearing stories of how Colin Jackson never went to the cinema as he felt sitting in a chair for 2 hours was bad for his muscles and how Steve Backley had discussed with his dad what he'd do if his dad died the day before a big competition! Used to think that was bonkers, but looking back it's just good organization.

Just read any book on British Cycling/Dave Brailsford and marginal gains. We had Clive Woodward as team lead for one of our bobsleigh trips and the level of prep he did was unbelievable.

Elite sport leave no stone unturned. I'd offer we currently have a lot of stones waiting to be turned if the antics of Mousset/McBurnie are anything to go by...

 

[cooperblade]

At the risk of getting lost in the maelstrom of Lundtram/McBurnie hating posts, one thing stood out tonight...

How leggy and slow we looked. Plus I can't think of one player (maybe Baldock) who you'd look at and say he's an elite level athlete. From a slow front two, to a midfield three that aren't mobile and seem to be outmuscled in every challenge, to a back 3 that look like bambi on ice...

if we're to be critical of Tufty and his coaching this past year, it's that a) we havent bought in better athletes and b) the athletic development of those here has been poor at best/pathetic at worst.

When Tufty talks about poor in both boxes - well that's because our players in both boxes look slow, old and confused.

Case in point - Burke came on and the runs he made stretched the play and opened lanes for Fleck to exploit...

Think Wilder touched on conditioning and athleticism in a recent interview, he said it was one of the biggest lessons we've learnt in the PL. I'd say you can tell we've at least tried to address this in our recruitment. The clearest example of this was Norwood -> Berge, going from someone whose running ability was his weakest point to someone who could cover lots of ground with ease (obviously you could argue he lacks strength, aerial ability etc but you could see the intention). Also Burke who is all about his physical attributes - much quicker and much stronger than the man he replaced. We've also looked to reduce the age of the squad which will help in this regard as well. I wouldn't say Brewster's best attributes are physical but he's at least quicker and younger than Sharp. The same with Lowe - not quick necessarily but quicker than Stevens.

I mentioned it ages ago but I still wonder whether we put in too much work during the first lockdown. As a team who haven't been able to rotate over a period of years, a lot of our players now look knackered. It's easy to say Lundstram's stopped trying but he's also played a lot of games and would've had a break with a bigger squad.

Overall though, even allowing for tiredness, injury to our most PL-like player from a physical point of view in JOC etc, we do look physically small and somewhat lacking in pace and strength as a squad (we have done for seemingly forever - well before CW's time).

It'll be less of an issue next season but will need rectifying when we're back.

 

[The Crab]

Think I've mentioned this anecdote before but after the Brentford game (first one back in the championship) I was in Rajdhani in Dore when in walked Billy with half the team. At the time I thought it was great and a show of team bonding and the down to earth nature of Team Wilder.

Looking back now, it probably shows where we were/are in terms of diet and 'refuelling' compared to the elite in the PL. Fine in the Championship, but once you're up against £100k+ a week athletes, the rules are different,

I remember when I did track hearing stories of how Colin Jackson never went to the cinema as he felt sitting in a chair for 2 hours was bad for his muscles and how Steve Backley had discussed with his dad what he'd do if his dad died the day before a big competition! Used to think that was bonkers, but looking back it's just good organization.

Just read any book on British Cycling/Dave Brailsford and marginal gains. We had Clive Woodward as team lead for one of our bobsleigh trips and the level of prep he did was unbelievable.

Elite sport leave no stone unturned. I'd offer we currently have a lot of stones waiting to be turned if the antics of Mousset/McBurnie are anything to go by...

On the one hand, I can see the benefit of the trip to the Indian in terms of team bonding. But you are correct, at the elite level of sport, the fine margins are important, whether that's a players fitness, or an improvement in an F1 car that buys you a couple of tenths of a second.

 

[ancientblade]

agree with most of the posts on this thread were crying out for physique and pace all over the pitch but mainly midfield and i hope chris rectifies this in the summer

 

[IdLiketoRogerMoore]

On the one hand, I can see the benefit of the trip to the Indian in terms of team bonding. But you are correct, at the elite level of sport, the fine margins are important, whether that's a players fitness, or an improvement in an F1 car that buys you a couple of tenths of a second.

I said so at the time and took pelters, but I don't see Mo Farah or Chris Froome having a curry and beers after a race when they have another in a week's time...

 

[SwissBlade]

Great points mate. I was going to mention age but didn't want it to be an easy cop out for the lack of athleticism, but the two are clearly related.

Again, don't want to be coming across as anti-Wilder but I feel they're valid criticisms. However, he's been at the helm 5 years and we've not seen any sign of a youth player coming through. Right now, more than ever we need that energy that comes from having two or three players that will cover every Blade of grass and kick anything above ankle height.

The top and bottom is, he's tried to buy younger more dynamic players, but he's just bought really really badly and that is what has killed us.

Hopefully next season, the likes of Brewster/Bogle/Bryan/RND/Burke will change all of that....

I don’t think we’ve bought badly. I actually still think the young athletic signings have been right... just perhaps not at the right time.

I think we moved too fast as a club, found ourselves in the top division and then found that to keep with our sustainable model we had to buy young raw players - like Berge, Bogle, Brewster...

Should we have gone for a 30 year old experienced Premier league striker? Possibly. But the price tag was too high for us as well as wages

We’ve stretched our young players and the old ones to their limits. the young lads are at the limit of their current experience, the old guard limits of their physicality

Sadly for the youngsters it takes time for things to work, Ramsdale our only ever present is only just showing his value

 

[IdLiketoRogerMoore]

I don’t think we’ve bought badly. I actually still think the young athletic signings have been right... just perhaps not at the right time.

I think we moved too fast as a club, found ourselves in the top division and then found that to keep with our sustainable model we had to buy young raw players - like Berge, Bogle, Brewster...

Should we have gone for a 30 year old experienced Premier league striker? Possibly. But the price tag was too high for us as well as wages

We’ve stretched our young players and the old ones to their limits. the young lads are at the limit of their current experience, the old guard limits of their physicality

Sadly for the youngsters it takes time for things to work, Ramsdale our only ever present is only just showing his value

You're right (again). The pace of our evolution has outstripped the entire infrastructure of the club (salary structure, training ground, youth set up).

However, I'm not convinced we couldn't have made a better fist in those areas and I'm looking at the lack off youth players and thinking that's one big area we need to quickly get sorted.

I'd slightly disagree about the signings. Throughout his career with us Tufty has been hit and miss in the transfer market. It took Ryan Leonard and Lee Evans before we ended up with Norwood... Ricky Holmes and Carruthers before we got to McGoldrick. Don't get me wrong a 1 in 3/1 in 4 ratio is still fantastic. However, when we're dropping £20m on players that ratio suddenly because expensive and high profile.

There's arguments to be had over our crop of £20m players and compared to the £40m on Joelinton / £40m on Eke / £80m on Maguire - none of them have been total busts. However, for the level we're operating at the margin for error is significantly smaller. We/Chris needed more from Ramsdale/Berge/McBurnie/Brewster and we simply haven't. Which is the main reason we're back to Norwood, Sharp, McGoldrick...

Fingers crossed we can reset in the summer, add some athleticism, and the guys above can be the core around which we build.

 

[EddieColquhoun]

Just read any book on British Cycling/Dave Brailsford and marginal gains.

Not all the gains are marginal.

 

[IdLiketoRogerMoore]

Not all the gains are marginal.

None are at the elite end of sport mate. I know first hand exactly how it works....

 

[BanderSerge]

At the risk of getting lost in the maelstrom of Lundtram/McBurnie hating posts, one thing stood out tonight...

How leggy and slow we looked. Plus I can't think of one player (maybe Baldock) who you'd look at and say he's an elite level athlete. From a slow front two, to a midfield three that aren't mobile and seem to be outmuscled in every challenge, to a back 3 that look like bambi on ice...

if we're to be critical of Tufty and his coaching this past year, it's that a) we havent bought in better athletes and b) the athletic development of those here has been poor at best/pathetic at worst.

When Tufty talks about poor in both boxes - well that's because our players in both boxes look slow, old and confused.

Case in point - Burke came on and the runs he made stretched the play and opened lanes for Fleck to exploit...

Good point. But we did have 7 players out.

 

[IdLiketoRogerMoore]

Good point. But we did have 7 players out.

Which is a valid excuse for a drop off in quality and technical ability but not energy levels and athleticism...

 

[BanderSerge]

Which is a valid excuse for a drop off in quality and technical ability but not energy levels and athleticism...

So JoC, Berge, Mouss, Bogle, Bash, wouldn’t have added energy and athleticism?

 

[IdLiketoRogerMoore]

So JoC, Berge, Mouss, Bogle, Bash, wouldn’t have added energy and athleticism?

Based on a sample size of the last 30+ games, I'd say not wouldn't you?

 

[Sharrow Snuff Mill]

Think Wilder touched on conditioning and athleticism in a recent interview, he said it was one of the biggest lessons we've learnt in the PL. I'd say you can tell we've at least tried to address this in our recruitment. The clearest example of this was Norwood -> Berge, going from someone whose running ability was his weakest point to someone who could cover lots of ground with ease (obviously you could argue he lacks strength, aerial ability etc but you could see the intention). Also Burke who is all about his physical attributes - much quicker and much stronger than the man he replaced. We've also looked to reduce the age of the squad which will help in this regard as well. I wouldn't say Brewster's best attributes are physical but he's at least quicker and younger than Sharp. The same with Lowe - not quick necessarily but quicker than Stevens.

I mentioned it ages ago but I still wonder whether we put in too much work during the first lockdown. As a team who haven't been able to rotate over a period of years, a lot of our players now look knackered. It's easy to say Lundstram's stopped trying but he's also played a lot of games and would've had a break with a bigger squad.

Overall though, even allowing for tiredness, injury to our most PL-like player from a physical point of view in JOC etc, we do look physically small and somewhat lacking in pace and strength as a squad (we have done for seemingly forever - well before CW's time).

It'll be less of an issue next season but will need rectifying when we're back.

Yes, I think we did do too much work during the first lockdown. Evidently it was very challenging over a long period of time.

I think we saw the effects, after the resumption, in many of the performances. This has carried on into the crowded schedule of this season.

Obviously injuries have not helped, nor have we had the best of luck in a number of games, but a fresher more rested squad might have fared better.