Johnstones Paint Trophy

[Patrick Suffaux]

No, its a silly competition on top of all the other games. The sensible thing would be to get rid of the JPT and make the league cup a competition for FL teams only with a European place on offer for the winner. It would make the league cup instantly more competitive with teams playing their strongest side as a medium to small sized club would actually see an opportunity to achieve something.

Does that make too much sense?

 

[LoughboroBlade]

I wouldnt play the following, Macdonald, Kitson and Blackman. Said when we played them at home that County will go all out to injure or get these 3 sent off. Cheating dirty sods.

I can understand where you're coming from, but if McDonald doesn't play that immediately reduces the chances of any of the fringe players in forward positions getting the ball enough in decent areas to impress. We're not going to learn anything about the likes of Chappell, McFadzean or Miller if the level of passing to them is poor.

 

[Fiery Blade]

I can understand where you're coming from, but if McDonald doesn't play that immediately reduces the chances of any of the fringe players in forward positions getting the ball enough in decent areas to impress. We're not going to learn anything about the likes of Chappell, McFadzean or Miller if the level of passing to them is poor.

So that means that without MacDonald we will not be able to pass and continually give the ball away to the opposition - on present evidence we do that every week even when MacDonald is playing! - it seems beyond the abilities of the coaching staff to instill into players the art of possession and passing to the same colour shirt!
We should welcome this match as an opportunity to give MacFazdean, Philliskirk, Westlake, Miller and perhaps Ironside to show what they are made of - we have already seen the like of MacAllister, McMahon, Williams, Porter and dare I say it Cofie and to be honest I'm unimpressed!

 

[LA Blade]

No complains here, its on't telly!

English Johnstone Paints Trophy

Wednesday, October 17
20:45 - 22:45

Notts County

vs.

Sheffield United

Live

 

[Jonboy60]

The only reason I can see for giving the youngsters and fringe players a run-out, is to give the first teamers a rest, because even if they were to play well you won't see them again until next years JPT. UTB.

 

[ListerBlade]

I think as many fringe players as we can include in the starting XI should be started, 4? With the rule of 7 from the last league game.

It's not exactly the Champions League, but I don't see why we can't try to win this and think of it as an achievement. It's just like the top Premier League clubs and the League Cup. They don't necessarily 'need' to win it, as the top 4 qualify for Europe anyway, so the incentive is for the fringe top 10 teams to try and get a place, but the top teams still try to win it.

This is my reasoning why I think we should win this, at 24, I've never seen us win any silverware, be nice to see us win something for once. And as posted earlier, be nice to know we don't bottle it at every big occasion.

 

[Pinchy]

How bitterly appropriate it would be for us to finally turn up at the smallest, most insignificant, possible 'big occasion'!

It would be rather like the UK winning the Eurovision [Islands only] Song Contest.

 

[BristolBlade]

All of these negative comments completely frustrates me! I know we shouldn't be in these competitions but we are. Theoretically we are the biggest club in this competition, we will also be the biggest club in the draw for the first round of the FA cup, what I am getting at is this is a great opportunity to get far in these competitions early doors, this will lead to more revenue, we are on sky tomorrow with the victors playing at Coventry on sky again in the next round! May only be small amounts however will be helpful in trying to get players in in the future! (current keeper crisis, however I say stick with Long I have faith)

I will be driving to Meadow Lane from Bristol tomorrow afternoon with great confidence in hopefully seeing some of the youngsters given their chance, the names of Westlake, Philliskirk etc would be great to see! I remember Tonne had a good game at Burton Albion in last years competition and as we know bagged the winner.
Try something different maybe Mcmahon right wing?? People seem to be slagging him off lately but my opinion is he's looked confident the times he has come forward from what I have seen, Westlake at right back.
Miller has to start for sure, I know some have questioned about substitutes this season but Cresswell coming on isn't the way forward, he didn't want to know at the start of the season until he must have realized that not even another club in League 1 wanted him, so accepted a coaching role?? really? must be why he's getting a game.
The substitution of Miller against Coventry was what the game needed and Blackmans equalizer said it all, that's where the pace will come from.
so I hear it might only be 4/500 blades there tomorrow night but lets get behind them and get ready for a great away game at Preston on Saturday. I would love for us to keep Westley quiet!
we might not be scoring for fun but i see great promise in Blackman with Kitson Supporting him, he'll learn more from him than coach Cresswell, yes we are still unbeaten I would love for us to still be when i'm driving back down the M5 on Saturday night with another away win.
However for me a win tomorrow night is another game closer to a date to Wembley! Up the Blades!!!

 

[blade too long]

I dont want to go down the sesquipedalian route
Loquaciousness leads to garralous behaviour

 

[Pinchy]

I dont want to go down the sesquipedalian route
Loquaciousness leads to garralous behaviour

I agree. It is anathema to those of us who suffer from hippopotomonstrosesquipedaliophobia.

 

[blade too long]

palavorous comments like that tend to lead to to supererogatory arguments

 

[Bergen Blade]

Sounds like there may be a couple of youngsters getting some playing time tomorrow:

"These games are ideal for younger players, but I understand why the selection rules are in place to ensure the competition doesn't become a mockery.


"We need to look at these lads in a first-team environment, you can play as many games as you like in training or in the U21s, but nothing can replicate first-team action.



"We can use it to benefit us and progress the youngsters, but make no mistake we want to be in the next round and beyond."

Good to see Wilson commenting that first team action is a way to develop youngsters.

 

[alcoblade]

Good to see Wilson commenting that first team action is a way to develop youngsters.

With the added (and more important) benefit of not derailing your season if they aren't up to it. Heaven knows, we'd also send some out on loan if we had a bigger squad.

Rocket science, it isn't.



UTB

 

[Fiery Blade]

All of these negative comments completely frustrates me! I know we shouldn't be in these competitions but we are. Theoretically we are the biggest club in this competition, we will also be the biggest club in the draw for the first round of the FA cup, what I am getting at is this is a great opportunity to get far in these competitions early doors, this will lead to more revenue, we are on sky tomorrow with the victors playing at Coventry on sky again in the next round! May only be small amounts however will be helpful in trying to get players in in the future! (current keeper crisis, however I say stick with Long I have faith)

I will be driving to Meadow Lane from Bristol tomorrow afternoon with great confidence in hopefully seeing some of the youngsters given their chance, the names of Westlake, Philliskirk etc would be great to see! I remember Tonne had a good game at Burton Albion in last years competition and as we know bagged the winner.
Try something different maybe Mcmahon right wing?? People seem to be slagging him off lately but my opinion is he's looked confident the times he has come forward from what I have seen, Westlake at right back.
Miller has to start for sure, I know some have questioned about substitutes this season but Cresswell coming on isn't the way forward, he didn't want to know at the start of the season until he must have realized that not even another club in League 1 wanted him, so accepted a coaching role?? really? must be why he's getting a game.
The substitution of Miller against Coventry was what the game needed and Blackmans equalizer said it all, that's where the pace will come from.
so I hear it might only be 4/500 blades there tomorrow night but lets get behind them and get ready for a great away game at Preston on Saturday. I would love for us to keep Westley quiet!
we might not be scoring for fun but i see great promise in Blackman with Kitson Supporting him, he'll learn more from him than coach Cresswell, yes we are still unbeaten I would love for us to still be when i'm driving back down the M5 on Saturday night with another away win.
However for me a win tomorrow night is another game closer to a date to Wembley! Up the Blades!!!

Top Stuff Bristol Blade!

 

[BladeFisher]

What's the point of this cup? As I understand it all crowds (except for the final) are small and I wouldnt be surprised if clubs actually lost money on staging pre-final games when you take into account the overheads they incur. Add to that the risk of injury to players and you have to think why?

I suppose I may be looking at this from the point of view of the "biggest club" in the competition (perhaps the way Man Utd see the Europa League - we would be delirious to be in that) and maybe it looks different from the point of view of Accrington or Morecambe...

Darren if SUFC had the pedigree of a 'big club' I could agree with you. But we don't. Our record is truly and utterly shocking (perhaps you could do some research here on crowd size v success and I sespect we are THE most underperforming team by a mile or a few kms! ) It hurts. Am fed up with it. But, look at previous winners of mickey mouse cups. It has given these teams the ability to be WINNERS not only the competition itself but also at other games. Just treating this cup like sod all is I argue part of the rotten core of the club, why people like me don't expect to win anything because we don't win anything. Change it. Get a winning mentality. I bet you it pays off.

Birmingham, Bristol City are examples that come to mind. Bristol were certs to go last year, but they got out of it. They are still nothing special I grant you, but they have won something. Another stat for you. Could you display the teams that last won a cup and when (cups include FA, League, Full Members, Assoc Members and forebears not Anglo Italian Watney etc) I bet we are back with the dead men at 1925!!

Brum went on to win the League Cuo the other year and they were once pretty much a bridesmaid club. We must get that belief back and continually giving up is in the long run counter productive.

Mind I like the League Cup suggestion posted above though.

 

[BusheyBlade]

Brum went on to win the League Cuo the other year and they were once pretty much a bridesmaid club. We must get that belief back and continually giving up is in the long run counter productive.

But then Brum also got relegated that same season and being in Europe last year hardly helped their promotion push.

Not saying I disagree with you though, I think we should try to win this and instil some optimism.

 

[Darren]

Darren if SUFC had the pedigree of a 'big club' I could agree with you. But we don't. Our record is truly and utterly shocking (perhaps you could do some research here on crowd size v success and I sespect we are THE most underperforming team by a mile or a few kms! ) It hurts. Am fed up with it. But, look at previous winners of mickey mouse cups. It has given these teams the ability to be WINNERS not only the competition itself but also at other games. Just treating this cup like sod all is I argue part of the rotten core of the club, why people like me don't expect to win anything because we don't win anything. Change it. Get a winning mentality. I bet you it pays off.

Birmingham, Bristol City are examples that come to mind. Bristol were certs to go last year, but they got out of it. They are still nothing special I grant you, but they have won something. Another stat for you. Could you display the teams that last won a cup and when (cups include FA, League, Full Members, Assoc Members and forebears not Anglo Italian Watney etc) I bet we are back with the dead men at 1925!!

Brum went on to win the League Cuo the other year and they were once pretty much a bridesmaid club. We must get that belief back and continually giving up is in the long run counter productive.

Mind I like the League Cup suggestion posted above though.

I once did as exactly as you suggested. From memory, of all the clubs that have won a major trophy only 4 (Barnsley 1912, Brandford City 1911, Bury 1903 and Notts County 1894) have done it further back in the mists of time than United.

But winning the JPT would not be winning a major trophy. It would be equivalent to be being 3rd division champions in teh same way as the FA Cup winner is equivalent to the PL champions. I don't think anyone would count winning the 3rd Division as winning a major trophy.

 

[Eskimo]

Hmm. I have no doubt at about 7-30. I'll head out to find a pub showing the game.....near Huddersfield though. Can I bear the ignomy?

 

[Fiery Blade]

I once did as exactly as you suggested. From memory, of all the clubs that have won a major trophy only 4 (Barnsley 1912, Brandford City 1911, Bury 1903 and Notts County 1894) have done it further back in the mists of time than United.

But winning the JPT would not be winning a major trophy. It would be equivalent to be being 3rd division champions in teh same way as the FA Cup winner is equivalent to the PL champions. I don't think anyone would count winning the 3rd Division as winning a major trophy.

But Darren, we have never won the third division, in my lifetime we have only ever won the Fourth Division we always got promotion from the second and third divisions by being runners up!
For a major club (from history and crowd size) we have underperformed big style, last winning anything of note in 1925 - 87 long long years ago!!!

 

[Darren]

But Darren, we have never won the third division, in my lifetime we have only ever won the Fourth Division we always got promotion from the second and third divisions by being runners up!
For a major club (from history and crowd size) we have underperformed big style, last winning anything of note in 1925 - 87 long long years ago!!!

Oh I agree with that.

Mind you, we did win the Yorkshire and Humberside Cup in 1988 and as that included all teams in the region in 2nd to 4th divisions, that was arguably a greater acheievement than winning the JPT would be

 

[Fiery Blade]

It doesn't really matter if we don't win - I don't expect us to - but I do expect us to take it seriously and perhapsblood one or two youngsters that Wilsons seems reticent to play in league games even when the only other option is to player 'First Teamers' out of position.
Cresswell is really struggling up front this year so who can see him being the answer to our problems in midfield!

 

[Sothall_Blade]

Assuming we can only change 4 players from Saturday's starting line-up, this would be my team:-

Long
WESTLAKE Maguire Hill Williams
CHAPPELL McDonald Doyle Flynn
MILLER PORTER
Subs:- Willis, Kennedy, McAllister, Harriott, Tonne, Philliskirk, Ironside

I'd be tempted to do a Megson as well and substitute/rest another couple of senior players early doors.
He did it last year and got away it, so the precedent has been set.

 

[Kenilworth]

Sad fact that the only coverage we get is when we are in the Johnstone's Paint Trophy.
Can't see us being good enough to take the lid off this competition and iIf we get knocked out then who will carry the can?
My guess is that we will get brushed aside this evening, as my old man always tells me - "it's all in the preparation, son" but I am not sure we have the right spirit to clean up. Squad likely to be thinner than normal by all accounts.

 

[Bergen Blade]

I thought five changes were allowed? I also thought that if a player has been involved in 70ish percent of the matches so far, he won't count as a change? This may possibly enable McAllister to come in as well?

 

[blade too long]

are we going for a whitewash or a gloss finish tonight

Danny Wilson won this competition with Bristol City, hes due another win

 

[broomhillblade]

are we going for a whitewash or a gloss finish tonight

We'll just brush them aside...

 

[Grecian2000]

We should have enough up front to apply the finish.

Dick splash!

 

[Sothall_Blade]

I thought five changes were allowed? I also thought that if a player has been involved in 70ish percent of the matches so far, he won't count as a change? This may possibly enable McAllister to come in as well?

I read this about the Burton manager "But the competition's rules are designed to ensure clubs cannot field artificially weakened teams. They must either name six players who started their previous match – or six of those who have started the most matches to date. "We'll go down the second route, because that gives me a slightly broader spread," said Rowett.

So you're right it's five changes but you have to base it either on the last match or the most often picked.
I think United should go down the first route as Long, Williams, Flynn and Kitson probably wouldn't be in our most often picked team.
I'll put Philliskirk in my team instead of Flynn then. Only five subs allowed as well, so leave McAllister out.

 

[Balham]

So you're right it's five changes but you have to base it either on the last match or the most often picked.
I think United should go down the first route as Long, Williams, Flynn and Kitson probably wouldn't be in our most often picked team.
I'll put Philliskirk in my team instead of Flynn then. Only five subs allowed as well, so leave McAllister out.

The most picked players are Maguire, McMahon, McDonald, Blackman (all 12 starts), Hill, Howard* (11 starts), Collins (10), Doyle (9), McAllister (8), Cofie (7), Gallagher**(6), Flynn (6).

*Howard is out injured so wouldn't be considered: Long will be OK.
** Gallagher has gone back to Leicester.

I don't think it makes much difference which basis we use: using most picked allows McAllister and Collins to come back in at the expense of Hill and Kitson.

I'd like to see:

Long​

​

Westlake Collins Maguire Williams​

​

Chappell Doyle McAllister McFadzean​

​

Porter Cofie​

Subs: Willis(G), McMahon, Harriott, Philliskirk, Miller

In an ideal world, Miller would be in for Cofie but that would take us down to 5 of the most picked.

 

[Sothall_Blade]

Thanks for working that out. As you say 2 of our "most picked" are unavailable which reduces the options for change.
I wouldn't risk Collins returning from injury in this match and McAllister has already had more chances than most.
5 changes from our last team and therefore 5 opportunities for fringe players is still the way to go for me.