Get outtttttt

[The_Green_Man]

One of the most common things that you will probably hear somebody shout at a Sunday League game, well that and "hit him" but that's another story for another day

I think this was an issue that I picked up on at BDTBL last weekend. We found ourselves very deep at times and extremely slow to push out which incidentally left Chesterfield in the final third of the pitch with goalscoring opportunities. Luckily due to Edgar's brave heroics of throwing himself in front of shots and due to the fact that well let's face it, Chesterfield weren't that good in front of goal so we escaped unharmed.

But yeah, long winded way of saying it I guess but I would like to see our back four push up in typical Sunday league style and hold a decent line. Sitting as deep for me and being slow to react is just inviting pressure. Probably doesn't merit a thread in it's own right but I missed it from my reviews at the weekend.

 

[Barney]

You can argue it either way, the more you move up, the more you leave yourself open huge spaces in behind for a pacey striker to find gaps and run into.

It's about finding the balance between not inviting pressure and not inviting strikers to find gaps and get a 1 vs 1 with the keeper.

 

[BushBlade]

And pushing up leaves you vulnerable to balls over the top if you don't have a pacy defender and the opposition has a nippy striker.

 

[Grecian2000]

Doesn't always work now though with the way the offside rule is interpreted. Used to be clear, push out, ball played back, CF caught offside.
Now, it it's played out wide and winger has stayed onside, CF is 5 yards in the clear but not counted and there for a nice easy pull back.

 

[The_Green_Man]

I agree with what you are all saying but as a bare minimum surely you need to be looking to hit the edge of the 18 yard box. Our lads just appeared a little slow out against Chesterfield, the CB's found themselves crawling out from the 6 yard box which effectively gave the opposition a second chance at goal if you get what I mean. I understand we haven't got the athletes at the back to march up 25-30 yards in an attempt to play the offside trap but we need to be quicker to react and push out some more.

 

[Caseh]

I agree with what you are all saying but as a bare minimum surely you need to be looking to hit the edge of the 18 yard box. Our lads just appeared a little slow out against Chesterfield, the CB's found themselves crawling out from the 6 yard box which effectively gave the opposition a second chance at goal if you get what I mean. I understand we haven't got the athletes at the back to march up 25-30 yards in an attempt to play the offside trap but we need to be quicker to react and push out some more.

I do think eventually the defence will push out quicker an generally play with a higher line, but I'm guessing they were more than a little apprehensive since the team had conceded 9 goals in their previous 2 league games before that game. Now they have a clean sheet behind them they may start looking a little more assertive and forcing the defensive line.

 

[Slug]

I believe this was one of the main reasons Negative Nigel bombed Collins out last season as he blamed Collins influence for how deep we were defending

 

[super_pig]

And pushing up leaves you vulnerable to balls over the top if you don't have a pacy defender and the opposition has a nippy striker.

you have to make sure that you press the midfielders then so that they can't play it into the gaps

 

[BushBlade]

you have to make sure that you press the midfielders then so that they can't play it into the gaps

How do you do that playing 442 against 451?

I'm not talking about the gaps, other than the gap between the defence and the keeper, I'm talking about the ball over the top of a high line for the striker to chase.

Ideally, you have a fast defender who reads the ball over the top and a keeper who doesn't stay on his line (sweeper-keeper, as they now call them) and comes out like Kenny used to.

You have to have at least one of those or you'll always be vulnerable to a ball over the top if you defend with a high line.

As Barny said, it's about getting the balance right.

 

[metalblade]

We can't push out too far when we have defenders as slow as Collins in the team, even so we have been too deep at times. At Gillingham all we seemed to do was pack the six yard box which hinders a keeper trying to claim a cross and gives him little chance if someone gets a header in on goal.

 

[super_pig]

How do you do that playing 442 against 451?

it's difficult. that is why teams sometimes get overrun and go man for man.. however most teams don't play straight five across the field so that is a red herring.. they mainly play 4 2 3 1 these days. but long story short.. you can play deep or a high line and press the ball.. there is no inbetween.. Bergen??

 

[BushBlade]

it's difficult. that is why teams sometimes get overrun and go man for man.. however most teams don't play straight five across the field so that is a red herring.. they mainly play 4 2 3 1 these days. but long story short.. you can play deep or a high line and press the ball.. there is no inbetween.. Bergen??

I think to play 4231 you have to have a high line and press from the front, with the midfielders supporting the forwards pressing. The defenders have to hold a high line to close the space between them and the midfielders and the two have to be box to box as they need to support the attack when they've won the ball back and be able to turn the possession they've won into an attacking move as well as being ball winners and athletic enough to get back quickly when needed.

You can play a higher line in a 442 if you have a sweeper-keeper or a pacy centre half.

 

[super_pig]

indeed you can but i believe you just changed the parameters

 

[BushBlade]

indeed you can but i believe you just changed the parameters

In what way?

 

[Bladesway]

You can only start to push out if there is a level of understanding between back 4 and keeper. You also need your midfield to press up otherwise you end up with 8 players in a very small section of the pitch. Then you need at least 1 centre half to have a yard of pace to cover back if needed.

I'm not saying we shouldn't push up but there's more to it than a dog and duck shout from the keeper.

Also you can play 442 and go man for man with a 5 man midfield. You ensure one of your forwards sits deep when the opposition has the ball. Almost 4-4-1-1 if you like. One reason to have a quick un and a big un us the big un leads the line and the quick un makes the distance between midfield and front line.

 

[blade too long]

I applaud this you score 1 we will score 3 attitude
it bodes well
fair heart never fucked a pig