Gap between Premier League and Championship

[Tickhill Blade]

The biggest single change that has had more influence on the gap widening is the 5 sub rule, the established club's just pack out there squad's and can change half their team during a game. I don't think it's a coincidence that the gap keeps getting wider in the last few years.

For me this change has also made the football more boring as well. It was not coincidence that the second halves of matches are often more exciting that the first and this was due to tiredness/fatigue, leading to teams losing organisation. Now teams can change half their team in the second half and just maintain the boredom levels for the fans.

 

[Balham]

I think Burnley need to build on their sound defence.

This all day long, l actually think that Burnley have the best chance of survival because they'll make themselves hard to beat, that's why we were so successful in 19-20 season

Burnley have already lost 1/3 of their successful keeper/central defence combination and the rumours are that the other two are going to agitate for moves. There's a significant chance that they'll do what we did in 2023 and sell their best players before the season starts.

EDIT: I see that Bellingham is trying to force a move away from Sunderland too. What's the point in promotion?

 

[The Fox]

One of the proposals of the proposed football regulator is to do away with parachute payments . Can you imagine any promoted club investing more than probably 20% of what's required with no safety net .
PL definitely becomes a closed shop if so , any clubs getting caught up in relegation due to points deductions could go under too.

Said for a while it needs PL1 and PL2 , 20 clubs in each graduating the finance and removing the cliff edge either way .
Can't see that happening either

 

[dsr-burnley]

Burnley have already lost 1/3 of their successful keeper/central defence combination and the rumours are that the other two are going to agitate for moves. There's a significant chance that they'll do what we did in 2023 and sell their best players before the season starts.

EDIT: I see that Bellingham is trying to force a move away from Sunderland too. What's the point in promotion?

No-one's gone yet. Egan-Riley is out of contract and may well move, but hasn't yet. Trafford will no doubt be subject to bids but nothing yet. (The ownership model does depend on selling players every year, so he might well go. If he does. we're relegated for certain instead of for almost-certain.) I haven't heard the rumours about Esteve.

 

[derfblade.3]

No-one's gone yet. Egan-Riley is out of contract and may well move, but hasn't yet. Trafford will no doubt be subject to bids but nothing yet. (The ownership model does depend on selling players every year, so he might well go. If he does. we're relegated for certain instead of for almost-certain.) I haven't heard the rumours about Esteve.

Even if you keep em mate it makes no difference. Teams just above the 3 relegated teams last season include Spurs, Manure, Wolves, West Ham Everton and Palace.
Can you honestly see you getting above any of those?
It's become a closed shop and the only positive of being in the Prem is the money that keeps teams like yourselves us and the ones just down able to compete at the top end of the Championship.
Anyway good luck next season but i suspect it's not going to be nice.

 

[dsr-burnley]

Even if you keep em mate it makes no difference. Teams just above the 3 relegated teams last season include Spurs, Manure, Wolves, West Ham Everton and Palace.
Can you honestly see you getting above any of those?
It's become a closed shop and the only positive of being in the Prem is the money that keeps teams like yourselves us and the ones just down able to compete at the top end of the Championship.
Anyway good luck next season but i suspect it's not going to be nice.

I agree. We'll be back down.

 

[Grappler]

I agree. We'll be back down.

Not just you, I suspect all three promoted teams will be back down again.

I mentioned this on another thread, but a few weeks ago I watched Wolves beat Spurs, 4-2. At that point in time, Wolves were 4th from bottom. I have no doubt that they would have hammered Leeds, Burnley and us/Sunderland quite easily, in fact I was shocked at how good they were, to say they were one place above the drop (at that point in time).

 

[Balham]

No-one's gone yet. Egan-Riley is out of contract and may well move, but hasn't yet. Trafford will no doubt be subject to bids but nothing yet. (The ownership model does depend on selling players every year, so he might well go. If he does. we're relegated for certain instead of for almost-certain.) I haven't heard the rumours about Esteve.

Maxime Esteve claim may add fuel to Burnley FC exit fear

Following an interview expressing his career ambitions, Burnley will once again fear the potential departure of defender Maxime Esteve.

footballleagueworld.co.uk

'Crystal Palace and Everton race to sign Maxime Esteve'

Crystal Palace and Everton are racing to sign Burnley star Maxime Esteve ahead of the summer transfer window.

www.footballinsider247.com

 

[Kozzy_is_my_Dad]

Read this morning that 9 !!! PL clubs playing in Europe next season , pretty much half the league.
6 clubs playing in the " champions league " alone , each automatically get £15.7m
Whatever gap there was is widening .

One of the proposals of the proposed football regulator is to do away with parachute payments . Can you imagine any promoted club investing more than probably 20% of what's required with no safety net .
PL definitely becomes a closed shop if so , any clubs getting caught up in relegation due to points deductions could go under too.

Said for a while it needs PL1 and PL2 , 20 clubs in each graduating the finance and removing the cliff edge either way .
Can't see that happening either

Great thread this.

Firstly, the fact that almost half the division will play in Europe is absolutely ludicrous. Not only is there the financial imbalance that you describe, but the prestige of a place in Europe should be reserved for the top few sides (even 4th sounds ridiculous). We don't want to be celebrating mediocrity but a no-mark side going on a roadtrip of Europe.

The cynic in me believes that this is a manufactured situation. A few years ago, there was talk of a Super League or similar. I reckon the intention is to make the Premier League that much of an uncompetitive non-event, that they close up shop and remove promotion/relegation altogether. Save a spot for the elite and richest clubs. The widening of the gap only serves to undermine the idea of promotion.

The only rallying against that is if the majority of football fans criticise the Premier League model and argue for fair distribution of resources.

 

[Kozzy_is_my_Dad]

Burnley have already lost 1/3 of their successful keeper/central defence combination and the rumours are that the other two are going to agitate for moves. There's a significant chance that they'll do what we did in 2023 and sell their best players before the season starts.

EDIT: I see that Bellingham is trying to force a move away from Sunderland too. What's the point in promotion?

I was coming here to make a similar point.

I think 2-3 years ago, we were bemoaned for being so poor. My mate (not a Blade) said he didn't want us to go up last weekend, just because we were so turgid last time around. I argued that instead, we were just the first example of an emerging pattern/issue, and one that will only continue IMO.

The problem is exacerbated by the issue you describe. In earning promotion, the best players of the Championship now put themselves in the international shop window. They are less likely to stick around, due also I suspect to agents in their ear, reminding them that the year ahead is likely to be dire.

United: Berge and NDiaye
Burnley: Trafford, Esteve, Egan-Riley rumours
Sunderland: Jobe Bellingham rumours.

There is no sticking together, proving yourself at the top level, being plucky and maybe earning a move the year after, come what may. Instead, the move is starting to happen now, on promotion. The selling clubs, feeling the financial pressures no doubt cashing in on their prize assets now, whilst their stock is high - as opposed to a year later, after a year of drubbings and with their player going at a cut-price rate.

 

[Roygbiv]

Great thread this.

Firstly, the fact that almost half the division will play in Europe is absolutely ludicrous. Not only is there the financial imbalance that you describe, but the prestige of a place in Europe should be reserved for the top few sides (even 4th sounds ridiculous). We don't want to be celebrating mediocrity but a no-mark side going on a roadtrip of Europe.

The cynic in me believes that this is a manufactured situation. A few years ago, there was talk of a Super League or similar. I reckon the intention is to make the Premier League that much of an uncompetitive non-event, that they close up shop and remove promotion/relegation altogether. Save a spot for the elite and richest clubs. The widening of the gap only serves to undermine the idea of promotion.

The only rallying against that is if the majority of football fans criticise the Premier League model and argue for fair distribution of resources.

There are still way too many fans and pundits who think think the promoted teams just aren't trying hard enough. Not sure how many more seasons it's going to take for people to wake up but none of The Premier League clubs or fans are going to vote for change. It's absolutely fucked.

 

[Kozzy_is_my_Dad]

There are still way too many fans and pundits who think think the promoted teams just aren't trying hard enough. Not sure how many more seasons it's going to take for people to wake up but none of The Premier League clubs or fans are going to vote for change. It's absolutely fucked.

Oh I agree, they think we're all dogshit, lazy, pauper wankers.

 

[HillmortonBlade]

Anyone going up is just hoping for another club in the league to fully implode. You currently need to be better than Spurs just to finish 4th bottom and they achieved 38 points.

People talk about Forest but they broke FFP and just survived the first season by the skin of their teeth and only got 32 points last season. You can't throw any more money at it than they have yet still they massively struggled and only managed to stay up because first Leicester imploded and then 2 of the 3 promoted clubs the year after didn't really bother trying to stay up. Us and Luton were only there for the money whereas Burnley spent but not enough to compete.

I hope all 3 come back down again purely because we still have people believing it's the clubs fault for playing the wrong way and not that the system is broke.

Exactly!!

I wouldn’t want us taking the route of Forest, they gambled and it paid off. Even allowing for my Bladey pessimism, not many clubs will be as fortunate as them in avoiding ruin.

 

[SwitchBLADE Smiles]

Exactly!!

I wouldn’t want us taking the route of Forest, they gambled and it paid off. Even allowing for my Bladey pessimism, not many clubs will be as fortunate as them in avoiding ruin.

The issue with this gamble is, if the 3 promoted teams do the same and somehow make it stick, there will be 3 other clubs who have taken the same gamble and are now in the shit.

The bubble is going to have to burst at some point or we’re going to end up with a scenario where there are 17 premier league teams and then everyone else. The early signs are already there - the problem is nobody who matters will give a shit so nothing will change.

 

[HillmortonBlade]

The issue with this gamble is, if the 3 promoted teams do the same and somehow make it stick, there will be 3 other clubs who have taken the same gamble and are now in the shit.

The bubble is going to have to burst at some point or we’re going to end up with a scenario where there are 17 premier league teams and then everyone else. The early signs are already there - the problem is nobody who matters will give a shit so nothing will change.

By design or by consequence, the pal is increasingly a closed shop. And an expensive one at that. Disappointed as I am to have lost on Saturday (would have been nice to see us lift a cup, even if it’s a Play Off one) I’m now looking forward to next season.

 

[Brian Deane]

My main hope with Leeds is that they believe Bogle is a competent PL right back. If they do they’re fucked.

As much as I agree with what you posted it does make you wonder though why Bogle has looked a better player for Leeds than he ever did for us ?

 

[Rochdaleblade]

As much as I agree with what you posted it does make you wonder though why Bogle has looked a better player for Leeds than he ever did for us ?

They play him farther up the pitch in a more attacking role. They force teams to defend for much of the game. I can't see this approach being successful in the Premier League.

 

[Berkshire Blade]

They play him farther up the pitch in a more attacking role. They force teams to defend for much of the game. I can't see this approach being successful in the Premier League.

If we had won on Saturday I was confident we would have the best set up for premier league football out of the promoted sides tbh.

There's absolutely no chance in hell Burnley will be as tight at the back in the premier league for example

 

[Wizard]

There are still way too many fans and pundits who think think the promoted teams just aren't trying hard enough. Not sure how many more seasons it's going to take for people to wake up but none of The Premier League clubs or fans are going to vote for change. It's absolutely fucked.

The amount of neutral fans who didn't want us to go up because we'd be rubbish is evidence of this. I sincerely hope I'm wrong but I'd wager Sunderland finish far closer to Derby's points record than 17th.

Playing one game a week might offer some advantage when half the league is competing in Europe but I'm not convinced it's enough to make the difference.

I do think there's some mitigation around how poor the promoted sides have been recently. Us and Leicester being a bit of a mess behind the scenes, Burnley/Southampton dogmatically sticking to a failing style of play, Luton/Ipswich overachieving to get promoted in the first place.

I think that next season could be a breaking point where if the 3 up go down again then there will be serious questions asked of the system.

 

[Houston_Blade]

As much as I agree with what you posted it does make you wonder though why Bogle has looked a better player for Leeds than he ever did for us ?

He was good in the promotion season for us. Just shite in the PL. He seems to play well in a team playing on the front foot.

 

[Wizard]

If we had won on Saturday I was confident we would have the best set up for premier league football out of the promoted sides tbh.

There's absolutely no chance in hell Burnley will be as tight at the back in the premier league for example

I was also feeling oddly optimistic about the prospect. The new owners would've actually invested and improved our squad and I think Wilder has learnt from his failures at that level and would be determined to not be embarrassed again. Maybe I'm deluded but I'm hoping he finds the energy to go again and we can tear through the Championship next season.

 

[LBA_Blade]

The only way the gap would change would be the creation of the "European Super League" although many didn't like the idea the Barca and Real were sticking out. If you got rid of Arsenal, Chelsea, Man City, Man United, Liverpool, and Spurs. Then brought up 6 teams to fill the gap moving up the EFL teams too/National league. If you were bringing up 6 teams into the league based on final standings it would be adding us, Coventry, Bristol City, Blackburn, Millwall and West Brom. The league would be a lot more competitive naturally it would be sat behind the European league but if their broadcasting rights gave them a set kick off times to avoid the PL classic 3pm's on a Saturday with no black out wall you would have some fantastic fixtures. The Champions League could be open for the winners with other European competitions still in place if you still wanted. In some ways I can see the benefit but in others it could turn the PL into the equivalent of the Scottish Premier League.

 

[jt64]

The league would be a lot more competitive

And become a lot less interesting. Zero people would give a shit in a top division league knowing that, if you win it, you're only really the seventh best team in the country.

 

[LBA_Blade]

And become a lot less interesting. Zero people would give a shit in a top division league knowing that, if you win it, you're only really the seventh best team in the country.

Similar to the "Champions League" that doesn't include Champions

 

[Roygbiv]

The amount of neutral fans who didn't want us to go up because we'd be rubbish is evidence of this. I sincerely hope I'm wrong but I'd wager Sunderland finish far closer to Derby's points record than 17th.

Playing one game a week might offer some advantage when half the league is competing in Europe but I'm not convinced it's enough to make the difference.

I do think there's some mitigation around how poor the promoted sides have been recently. Us and Leicester being a bit of a mess behind the scenes, Burnley/Southampton dogmatically sticking to a failing style of play, Luton/Ipswich overachieving to get promoted in the first place.

I think that next season could be a breaking point where if the 3 up go down again then there will be serious questions asked of the system.

Yeah the idea the team that finished 16 points behind us would put up a better fight shows how little attention people pay to The Championship. I get people don't want us and Burnley in there again because it's boring playing the same teams but Sunderland were much worse than both and will need to spend £50m or so just to get to Burnley's level who will almost certainly come down. People will be bored of all the promoted sides within a few years

 

[Roygbiv]

The only way I see anything changing is if the Premier League take over the 2nd tier too and the money is divided between 44 teams. Nobody will vote for it though It would probably mean 3rd and 4th tier clubs become part-time too.

 

[LBA_Blade]

Yeah the idea the team that finished 16 points behind us would put up a better fight shows how little attention people pay to The Championship. I get people don't want us and Burnley in there again because it's boring playing the same teams but Sunderland were much worse than both and will need to spend £50m or so just to get to Burnley's level who will almost certainly come down. People will be bored of all the promoted sides within a few years

You do wonder how long it is until UEFA and FIFA make it continental club football championships. With the final in Saudi. An UEFA club league with top 2 playing off against CAF, AFC, CONCACAF, OFC and CONMEBOL to make the final.

 

[The Fox]

The only way the gap would change would be the creation of the "European Super League" although many didn't like the idea the Barca and Real were sticking out. If you got rid of Arsenal, Chelsea, Man City, Man United, Liverpool, and Spurs. Then brought up 6 teams to fill the gap moving up the EFL teams too/National league. If you were bringing up 6 teams into the league based on final standings it would be adding us, Coventry, Bristol City, Blackburn, Millwall and West Brom. The league would be a lot more competitive naturally it would be sat behind the European league but if their broadcasting rights gave them a set kick off times to avoid the PL classic 3pm's on a Saturday with no black out wall you would have some fantastic fixtures. The Champions League could be open for the winners with other European competitions still in place if you still wanted. In some ways I can see the benefit but in others it could turn the PL into the equivalent of the Scottish Premier League.

At risk of repeating myself on this forum the super league was never about clubs leaving thier domestic leagues , purely an alternative to the ECL .

I really don't see anything changing , the EPL is becoming the closed shop that suits the incumbents who are unlikely to push for change .

Every club in the 17 will strengthen this summer , certainly in terms of squad depth so it will be more difficult year on year to break in .

Due to PSR clubs can neither spend their way in .

Next seasons PL will be interesting, only in terms of the promoted clubs.
The only change will be instigated by broadcasters if viewers lose interest in watching groundhog day season after season .

 

[WayneAllison]

Those poor old promoted clubs are only getting 200 million pounds and becoming richer than the vast majority of most clubs in every other top 5 league in Europe


The problem isn't the gap it's mismanagement as seen recently by us under Hecky, Leicester and Southampton,the season just gone


Sign crap expect too go down recruit properly and have proper manager then you can expect a chance at becoming a top club lie Bournemouth/Fulham/Forest


The Woe is me is laughable considering promotion gives you a huge opportunity to transform your club look at forest

 

[Roygbiv]

You do wonder how long it is until UEFA and FIFA make it continental club football championships. With the final in Saudi. An UEFA club league with top 2 playing off against CAF, AFC, CONCACAF, OFC and CONMEBOL to make the final.

I think there is a definite chance we have a situation where there is a NFL style Super League and the rest is seen like college football in America. The Super League clubs will dominate and their fans will be from all over the world but the "legacy fans" will barely ever get the chance to go to games. The rest of us will carry on as we are with less money, more youth orientated and knowing any good player will end up in the Super League. In that scenario I'd rather support United than a Liverpool to be honest