Depth

[LewishamBlade]

I get it. We don’t have much moolah.

But if our depth is completely made up from the academy we’ll be closer to the bottom than the top.

And I’m seeing a few people using names of youth players as making up our squad moving forward. Strongest first XI, few first teamers such as Osborn, Baldock, Stevens, then youth.

It’s not going to be enough. Not to compete at the top end of the table as we all want to.

I know we will need to utilise the youth but Christ almighty, 3 or 4 max we should be looking at.

So can people stop suggesting the likes of Gordon and Lopata are sufficient enough to supplement the back three. They aren’t.
Can people stop suggesting Peck, Arblaster, Brunt, Maguire etc. are sufficient enough to supplement the midfield. They aren’t.
Can people stop suggesting Jebbo, Osula and Hackford are sufficient enough to supplement the attack. They aren’t.

We need 6 players at least, and pretty good ones at that.

 

[biggiesablade]

I really like the look of Peck but see your point. If we don't go up this year can se hard times ahead but then again we aren't blades for the glory of it

 

[Guesty]

I've got to agree that if Osula and particularly Jebbison are part of the main rotation of attackers next season we'll be in big trouble.

 

[LewishamBlade]

I really like the look of Peck but see your point. If we don't go up this year can se hard times ahead but then again we aren't blades for the glory of it

Agree. Looks a reyt player, but he’s a babbi. If he somehow becomes a revelation next season it should be because he’s overtook 2 or 3 players in training and with performances, not because he’s our second choice midfielder. Not at 17.

 

[biggiesablade]

Agree. Looks a reyt player, but he’s a babbi. If he somehow becomes a revelation next season it should be because he’s overtook 2 or 3 players in training and with performances, not because he’s our second choice midfielder. Not at 17.

Completely agree I'd rather see Bogle move position but we are where we are with no cover in midfield. Insane after the money we've spent on strikers for jebbo and osula to be up higher in the pecking order

 

[blade67]

The tricky bit is that some players make a sudden improvement in 6 months that moves them from prospect to first teamer and we need to mix up who's on loan versus who stays and fights for it.

If we want to compete, we are going to have to bring a few in, as they won't all be successful either.

The truth is that we won't know how the transfer window has gone until the end of August, just like every other year

 

[blades14]

I've got to agree that if Osula and particularly Jebbison are part of the main rotation of attackers next season we'll be in big trouble.

Play to Jebbisons strength and he will be a great player. The problem is asking 2 18 year old's to hold the ball up and bring others into play against seasoned championship defenders is stupid. Knock the ball over the top and 9/10 times Jebbo will win in a footrace. Pump the ball up from defence up in the air and 9/10 he will lose his battle

 

[RecordBreakers]

Nobody is good enough to push the first team it's as simple as that, jebbo looks like a gazell running from a chasing lion. We all love a home grown but in all honesty non are good enough (YET) will they ever be? Time will tell but totally agree we'll be in trouble relying on them an tbh if we don't get new faces in we'll be in closer to 16th than 6th and to be frank about it I'm sick of seeing Enda Norwood Fleck Osbourn Mcburnie.

 

[mancunianblade]

Just a shame the club dont have fresh memories of being ravaged by injuries and having to cobble together a bench, if they did then they may appreciate how important depth is.

 

[Stevo]

.

 

[3Cheers4Ramirez]

Using the kids for depth is fine for a club with our aspirations, I don't see what the problem is tbh

 

[blade too long]

I get it. We don’t have much moolah.

But if our depth is completely made up from the academy we’ll be closer to the bottom than the top.

what is that based on
we finished 5th despite an enormous injury list finishing the season with not one fit forward

what depth we have is still better than 19 other clubs last season
what we need is like most promotion chasing clubs is to have 8 to 12 players capable of 35 plus games a season

 

[Bell4]

How we replace Berge , MGW & Didz will be the key - they provided , especially MGW , the flair . All will be gone and we are then left with IN as our only flair player and love him to bits but he isn't consistent yet and doesn't finish many games.

Lets judge on opening day .

But the club our size , the ground we have , the support we attract and the fact we have been in the Prem 2 years and had 2 years of parachute payments - our transfer business is a poor show to date . But the Prince through his mouthpiece said there will be no money to invest so its not a surprise. Just a poor who for a club our size.

 

[LewishamBlade]

what is that based on
we finished 5th despite an enormous injury list finishing the season with not one fit forward

what depth we have is still better than 19 other clubs last season
what we need is like most promotion chasing clubs is to have 8 to 12 players capable of 35 plus games a season

You’re absolutely bonkers

 

[247Blade]

Completely agree I'd rather see Bogle move position but we are where we are with no cover in midfield. Insane after the money we've spent on strikers for jebbo and osula to be up higher in the pecking order

Not in the near future ... hope Bogle doesn't become another JOC

 

[Wizard]

It's clear that the club aren't wanting to spend too much on transfer fees but it does feel like we're willing to spend a good amount on wages for good quality players. You can debate how well each of them worked but the business we did last year was all pretty ambitious and all of them will have been on a decent wedge I'd imagine and with all of them going back/leaving as well as getting a few others off our books we should again have some wiggle room in the wage bill. In recent times it also feels like there's been a lot of transfers that appear somewhat out of nowhere so I'd trust that the club are working to get deals over the line. It only makes sense to analyse the window after it's happened rather than during, I'd be disappointed if we didn't get 1 or 2 in before Portugal but it wouldn't be the end of the world either. The season is over a month away and the window closes another month after that, there's plenty of time and even if the season started today we could put out a decent side

 

[Wizard]

At the minute our starting 11 first day would probably look like this:

Foderingham
Basham - Egan - Robinson
Baldock - Berge - Norwood - Fleck - Stevens
Sharp - Ndiaye​

I'd imagine 5 of the 6 players Hecky is talking about to fill out the squad are replacements or new deals for:

1. Backup Keeper (A. Davies)​
2. Basham Competition & Egan Cover (Goode/Uremovic)​
3. Left-Sided Centre Half (B. Davies)​
4. Solid Centre Mid (Hourihane)​
5. Attacking Option (MGW/McGoldrick)​

Not sure what the last one is. I'd like another midfield option that can compete with/cover Norwood. Thought we were light there last year and it would free up Berge to always be in a more adventurous role (if he's still here).

By my reckoning that would give us this squad:

Foderingham
(1)

2 - Egan - 3
(Basham) - (Robinson)
(Gordon)

Bogle - Berge - Norwood - Fleck - Stevens
(Baldock) - (Coulibaly) - (6) - (4) - (RND)
(Osborn)

Brewster - Ndiaye
(Sharp) - (5)
(McBurnie)​

Remains to be seen how close we get to that or what we do to fill those roles but that looks about right to me.

 

[Snowflake]

I get it. We don’t have much moolah.

But if our depth is completely made up from the academy we’ll be closer to the bottom than the top.

And I’m seeing a few people using names of youth players as making up our squad moving forward. Strongest first XI, few first teamers such as Osborn, Baldock, Stevens, then youth.

It’s not going to be enough. Not to compete at the top end of the table as we all want to.

I know we will need to utilise the youth but Christ almighty, 3 or 4 max we should be looking at.

So can people stop suggesting the likes of Gordon and Lopata are sufficient enough to supplement the back three. They aren’t.
Can people stop suggesting Peck, Arblaster, Brunt, Maguire etc. are sufficient enough to supplement the midfield. They aren’t.
Can people stop suggesting Jebbo, Osula and Hackford are sufficient enough to supplement the attack. They aren’t.

We need 6 players at least, and pretty good ones at that.

I seem to recall no enthusiasm for Jagielka, Maguire and Brooks in the summer before they began first team matches and no doubt there are more examples.
We don’t know at this stage whether any of the aforementioned youngsters have developed physically and technically to be good first team players, so don’t write them off for this season yet.
If you try to bring in 6 from outside they would have to be replacing what we already have otherwise they would not come, so who are we now leaving out and can we afford their replacements ?

 

[Snowflake]

At the minute our starting 11 first day would probably look like this:

Foderingham
Basham - Egan - Robinson
Baldock - Berge - Norwood - Fleck - Stevens
Sharp - Ndiaye​

I'd imagine 5 of the 6 players Hecky is talking about to fill out the squad are replacements or new deals for:

1. Backup Keeper (A. Davies)​
2. Basham Competition & Egan Cover (Goode/Uremovic)​
3. Left-Sided Centre Half (B. Davies)​
4. Solid Centre Mid (Hourihane)​
5. Attacking Option (MGW/McGoldrick)​

Not sure what the last one is. I'd like another midfield option that can compete with/cover Norwood. Thought we were light there last year and it would free up Berge to always be in a more adventurous role (if he's still here).

By my reckoning that would give us this squad:

Foderingham
(1)

2 - Egan - 3
(Basham) - (Robinson)
(Gordon)

Bogle - Berge - Norwood - Fleck - Stevens
(Baldock) - (Coulibaly) - (6) - (4) - (RND)
(Osborn)

Brewster - Ndiaye
(Sharp) - (5)
(McBurnie)​

Remains to be seen how close we get to that or what we do to fill those roles but that looks about right to me.

5 loanees gone and McGoldrick not resigned, hence the 6 needed to make up the squad numbers

 

[ThatJa]

If you told me the same about ndiaye this time last summer I'd have believed you.

 

[mancunianblade]

Using the kids for depth is fine for a club with our aspirations, I don't see what the problem is tbh

Depth isn’t just making up the numbers though, clubs need strength in depth, the players need to be good enough to be able to step in and ours aren’t bar maybe 1-2 and the worse part about them not being good enough is that they won’t play and as a result it will hinder their development.

Kids should be involved when good enough or loaned out to develop when not good enough. The worst option is to keep them and have them make up the numbers

 

[blade too long]

as far back as I remember it's very rare we get in loans in June .
a look back over the years. it's often mid july

it's also new loan players every season
so why all the hysteria and blind panic

who had. heard of MGW prior to him voming

last season we loaned 6.
Ben Davies was the first in ....on August 16th

 

[S64 Blade]

I've got to agree that if Osula and particularly Jebbison are part of the main rotation of attackers next season we'll be in big trouble.

And McBurnie.

 

[metalblade]

There is an old saying "if they are good enough they are old enough" but if you are too scared to play youth you will never know if they are good enough. Id sooner put 17-18 year olds into the mix than have them hanging around until they are 22-23 before we find out they are not up to anything more than League one standard. A footballers career lasts around 15 years but if they don't break into the first team until they are 23 they have wasted a third of their career. Good players should be in the first team by the time they are 20 if not get rid, United have been guilty in the past of hanging on to young players too long when they are not good enough. You might lose one or two gems that develop late but that is the risk you have to take.

 

[Flatulent_Bob]

There is an old saying "if they are good enough they are old enough" but if you are too scared to play youth you will never know if they are good enough. Id sooner put 17-18 year olds into the mix than have them hanging around until they are 22-23 before we find out they are not up to anything more than League one standard. A footballers career lasts around 15 years but if they don't break into the first team until they are 23 they have wasted a third of their career. Good players should be in the first team by the time they are 20 if not get rid, United have been guilty in the past of hanging on to young players too long when they are not good enough. You might lose one or two gems that develop late but that is the risk you have to take.

Very, very few players will be playing top end Championship football in the first team by 20.
If you’re relying on your under 21s to shore up the first team then your recruitment is failing and it should be a huge warning klaxon that something is seriously wrong.
I’d much rather them be playing out on loan and if that means they’re ready for the sharp end of the championship week in week out at 22/23 then it’s a massive success story for our academy. That would be huge and a real game changer for us to have such a production line.
Our kids playing in the first team at 21 and under should be the exception rather than the rule.

 

[LewishamBlade]

who had. heard of MGW prior to him voming

It was a bad sickness bug that to be fair

 

[3Cheers4Ramirez]

Depth isn’t just making up the numbers though, clubs need strength in depth, the players need to be good enough to be able to step in and ours aren’t bar maybe 1-2 and the worse part about them not being good enough is that they won’t play and as a result it will hinder their development.

Kids should be involved when good enough or loaned out to develop when not good enough. The worst option is to keep them and have them make up the numbers

We should easily be able to achieve our goal of survival with just the kids as depth so again I really dont see the problem

 

[Champagneblade]

It's all a game of patience for the next month.

It's easy to get distracted when others seem active but it's a marathon not a sprint.

One of the best players I saw last season was the lad Reda Khadra when we played Blackburn.

Not really seen him linked with anyone. 5 goals and 4 assists in his first loan and he's only 20.

Imagine what he can do in a second loan.

But when will he become available? Brighton will probably take a look at him all summer, while they make sure they get replacements for Bissouma or consider internal options.

Even if you assume Sander leaves, this lad as a 10 with N'Diaye in front of him and just off Billy or Brewster would be great. I like Sander but it isn't a case of of he plays, we play. We don't depend on him.

You've got many Man City lads still available and whilst there is now an expectation that Kompany might be given a helping hand, Pep isn't daft. They aren't going to loan so much that they won't get games. Not going to send McAtee and Palmer to only compete with each other for example.

There's the Leeds lad, Crysencio Summerville, who is very close to their team that could be coming out.

Quite a few Man U players who will become available of an attacking midfield variety.

We'll do what suits us. If we think waiting for one of these, where to be honest, Mitchell seems to have good connections (perhaps more challenging when we were top level) is better than spending 4m on a signing that may or may not step up, then only will we know if this was a good idea as the season is underway.

It feels like things are moving or at least starting to. But we're in a queue. You jump forward and spend you money, you're out of what becomes available later. It's a gamble.

I'd just urge patience. Gibbs-White was last in and ended up being our talisman.

We'd already played 3 matches by the time Davies arrived. Hourihane didn't arrive until the day before the window and the legend that is Robin Olsen only turned up on the final day.

We'll pay wages when needed but we probably won't commit to too many longer term deals while we still have large commitments to settling Wilder's signings.

 

[blade too long]

Very, very few players will be playing top end Championship football in the first team by 20.
If you’re relying on your under 21s to shore up the first team then your recruitment is failing and it should be a huge warning klaxon that something is seriously wrong.
I’d much rather them be playing out on loan and if that means they’re ready for the sharp end of the championship week in week out at 22/23 then it’s a massive success story for our academy. That would be huge and a real game changer for us to have such a production line.
Our kids playing in the first team at 21 and under should be the exception rather than the rule.

you mean like the 2 Kyle's weren't up to it
Ndiaye seemed to cope quite well

 

[Flatulent_Bob]

you mean like the 2 Kyle's weren't up to it
Ndiaye seemed to cope quite well

I think you need to read my post again.