Clough's tactics

[SandyMcBlade]

Looking back I could see Mr Clough being the ideal choice for the boards we've had in the past when in the old div 2, no chance of relegation but not quite good enough for promotion, a Steady Eddy top half of the division type of manager who can give you the odd cup run and work on a shoe string budget ......

UTB

 

[Ginger Gnome]

Clough will probably get to manage Forest at some point if they end up down the bottom of the Championship. He didn't do that badly here or at Derby, he just didn't seem to have the attitude to push on from a solid top-half finish to actually get promotion. In the cups and in his first season here he had a bit more of an open approach that let us attack so it's not like we couldn't have gone up with him in charge if he applied the same tactics to the league, but attempting to always scrape narrow wins with no central defenders was never going to work over an entire season. He did a lot of things right and built a decent squad, but I'm glad Adkins is in charge now instead.

 

[Fiery Blade]

I am sure that following the 3-0 defeat at Crewe in his first season we went on a seven match winning run without conceding a goal !
Everybody then thought we even had a chance of making the play offs !
The season is only started - It's about time people should take a reality check - Everything is still not right but hopefully it's getting there
Lets continue to back Mr Adkins and hope that we continue to improve, but lets not keep harping back on last season and forever keep making comparisons !
Edgar has done a great job to date and really looks the part but we could still do with another couple of players until Brayford and Harris are fully fit - unfortunately I don't see Kennedy or James Wallace ever likely to be key members with their appalling injury records !!!

 

[BushBlade]

Imo, Clough was the start of the new era and did a lot of good things. The arrival of the Prince gave him a fighting chance as he was well backed and, in the main, his recruitment was good. Yes, couple of duds in Higdon and Coutts (so far) but Brayford, Basham, Freeman, K-Wall, Che, JCR, McEvelly, Howard, Done will all play a big part in our season and they'll be contributions from J-Wall, Alcock, McGahey, Harris, Scougall and McNulty.
Compare that to what he inherited.
I think, given time, he would have had us playing decent football and got us promoted. But we don't have time. All managers have flaws and weaknesses but in Clough's case, his strengths perhaps didn't offer enough of a counterbalance. I think the club could have sucked up the various fall outs if they were convinced he would have achieved automatic this season but we were far enough away from the top two to suggest it could have been another two seasons.
I'm not sure whether the board looked at NA's availability and thought 'sod it, go for it' or if it was a case of getting rid of Clough and then deciding the replacement but either way, on paper, he's a significant improvement and has backed up his record on the pitch.
He seems a good fit. He has that same confident air about him that Warnock, Bassett and to an extent Kendall had about them, a personality, a presence. He's a leader.

 

[Cyprus Blade]

Cloughie's strategy to climb the League table uncovered !!!

 

[Gibbo89]

It is usual for a manager leaving you don't hear much from them due to contract embargos but it is literally like him, Andy Garner and his others right hand men, namely Gary Crosby, Martin Taylor and his brother Simon have disappeared off the face of the earth since being dismissed in late May. 3 months have passed and not heard a murmur from any of them and don't believe any have been re-employed anywhere?

Funny you should say that, the Pigs have signed Barry Bannon today who's 5'7", weighs 6 stone wet through, hasn't played that many games over the last few seasons and hails from Bonny Scotland. It just occurred to me what is Nigel Clough translated into Portuguese...... Carlos Augusto Soares da Costa Faria Carvalhal ?

 

[Sothall_Blade]

Thanks Nigel Clough for leaving us with the basis of a promotion winning squad.

You just needed the addition of a quality target man who you tried to sign (O Grady) and a quality, strong centre back who you bewilderingly didn't.

Also needed to put more faith in your fine attacking players and their ability to outscore the opposition.

Very fortunately for us and the board, Nigel Adkins agreed to come in and hopefully take us to the next level. No doubt he did so because of the foundations and potential that he could see were already in place.

We could so easily have ended up replacing you with the likes of Phil Parkinson instead.

 

[Bladesway]

Personally, I lean towards your view of Clough. Unfortunately the rumours, obviously unsubstantiated, various stories that have emanated that suggest there was far more than a grain of truth regarding his handling of certain situations and the individuals concerned. What this suggests to me is a lack of flexibility when it comes to the notion of crossing a line. In other words, if someone acted in a manner that Clough held in low regard there was no turning back. What lies behind this is uncertain, but I'd go so far as to suggest that Clough had/has disciplinarian qualities that are now inappropriate in an age where it's necessary to manage a variety of personalities in ways that were once regarded as perfectly acceptable. The world, let alone the business of football, has changed rapidly in a relatively short space of time, and for some they seem ill-equipped to recognise that with change comes the need to adapt to these new demands.

If you have ever left a job for the competition or under a cloud (I have on both counts, usually the first) you get blamed for just about anything and everything. People who were your closest suddenly tell all sorts of untruths to cover their own arses or disassociate themselves from any blame. Its always the guy last out the door who gets the blame for everything that ever went wrong.

 

[blade too long]

Clough was 75% on the right track , , he did sign Pommpeys hero Murphy who is now world class.
He fell down on communication of ideas though, and Adkins s weve seen with the flock of geese motivation is a far better communicator to players , he keeps it simple .
Have always been of the opinion footballers arent the brightest bulbs in a chandalier so keeping it simple is the best route
Football in essence is a very simple game
Get players all pulling in the same direction you improve , in understanding positioning back up support
Adkins after the Gillingham debacle effected serious change in outlooks

Clough was incapable of such drastic change
Not all car mechanics are good because they have the best snap on tools
the best mechanics can hear and see a problem and fix it with any old spanner

Adkins is in that category

 

[Woodwardfan]

If you have ever left a job for the competition or under a cloud (I have on both counts, usually the first) you get blamed for just about anything and everything. People who were your closest suddenly tell all sorts of untruths to cover their own arses or disassociate themselves from any blame. Its always the guy last out the door who gets the blame for everything that ever went wrong.

Wasn't it obvious just looking from the stands and reading the papers and listening to interviews?

I agree though, much better to say it all while he's still with us.

 

[Woodwardfan]

Bladetoolong - Clough did not sign Murphy of course.

 

[itsinyerblood]

If you have ever left a job for the competition or under a cloud (I have on both counts, usually the first) you get blamed for just about anything and everything. People who were your closest suddenly tell all sorts of untruths to cover their own arses or disassociate themselves from any blame. Its always the guy last out the door who gets the blame for everything that ever went wrong.

I've too worked in environments where the atmosphere was, how shall I say, murky in the extreme. As you suggest Bladesway, the desire to disassociate yourself from anything regarding an unpleasantness can bring out qualities that often surprise or even disgust. I found that being completely open and honest wasn't a required trait in some jobs, so I too went along with some of the nonsense, until I found it went against the grain and I had to remove myself from working in these conditions.

So yes, I do understand the idea that blaming Clough is the easy option and allows those who may have contributed to any unpleasantness to shy away from how things really were. Unfortunately I've found that people sometimes prefer to have their prejudices confirmed rather than dig deep and reveal what actually happened. I doubt we'll ever get a completely honest view of what happened while Clough was manager, but that's how things are in life, so we draw conclusions and live with the consequences.

 

[Bladesway]

Bladetoolong - Clough did not sign Murphy of course.

No that was another of the previous guys who couldn't do anything right

 

[Bladesway]

Wasn't it obvious just looking from the stands and reading the papers and listening to interviews?

I agree though, much better to say it all while he's still with us.

I think if you take both ends of the argument the truth probably lies in the middle ground. What I cannot abide (like my recent defence of Dave Bassett) is someone being unduly lambasted. I know the bloke had failings hence why he isn't here any longer but the way some talk about him you would suspect he'd been round firtling with their daughters.

 

[grafikhaus]

I expect Clough and co to reappear at League Two level sometime this season when someone sacks a manager;

Oh some other mug will employ him. His name's Clough, innit? He'll be hoping that his new club don't have a quick look at Wikipedia and see that, in 19 years as manager, his only success was a mere 16 years ago when his Burton won the Conference. If he gets a 'Golden Goodbye' for his next failure and brings his family and other hangers-on with him, result!

 

[Woodwardfan]

I think if you take both ends of the argument the truth probably lies in the middle ground. What I cannot abide (like my recent defence of Dave Bassett) is someone being unduly lambasted. I know the bloke had failings hence why he isn't here any longer but the way some talk about him you would suspect he'd been round firtling with their daughters.

Nobody at this football club needs to defend Dave Bassett, though he was a menace at Wimbledon

Time to forget Clough and even our differences and hope Adkins is the man or the "Messiah" we need. I will not make up my mind until he has been with us a year. To my mind promotion from L1 is only the first step, it's the quality of the squad we take up to the Championship that matters to me. At this moment in time Adkins has made 4 good signings ( though Woolford has not shown how good he is to date, and he is good) but there is a lot more to do yet.

Without pointing any fingers, we have so many players on contracts we wish we didn't have but next summer a good number expire. That's when Adkins has to make it all happen.

Given our squad and with Done and Brayford and Kennedy to add before long, we will be promoted. The real job in S2 is what happens then.

 

[William Henry Foulkes]

Personally, I lean towards your view of Clough. Unfortunately the rumours, obviously unsubstantiated, various stories that have emanated that suggest there was far more than a grain of truth regarding his handling of certain situations and the individuals concerned. What this suggests to me is a lack of flexibility when it comes to the notion of crossing a line. In other words, if someone acted in a manner that Clough held in low regard there was no turning back. What lies behind this is uncertain, but I'd go so far as to suggest that Clough had/has disciplinarian qualities that are now inappropriate in an age where it's necessary to manage a variety of personalities in ways that were once regarded as perfectly acceptable. The world, let alone the business of football, has changed rapidly in a relatively short space of time, and for some they seem ill-equipped to recognise that with change comes the need to adapt to these new demands.

My mate was queueing at the tickets recently and Jim was around and about.

He asked about why Clough was sacked and Jim said it was bc he was either unwilling or unable to repair broken relationships. I don't know the exact form of words but that was the gist of it.

I could scarcely believe this scoop - but the conversation took place in public when there was a decent queue and several other people around.

Given the circumstances, if the topic ever came up with a journalist I'm as sure as I can be that that answer would be repeated.

But as several people have said it's time to look forward not backward.

 

[Bladesway]

Nobody at this football club needs to defend Dave Bassett, though he was a menace at Wimbledon

Time to forget Clough and even our differences and hope Adkins is the man or the "Messiah" we need. I will not make up my mind until he has been with us a year. To my mind promotion from L1 is only the first step, it's the quality of the squad we take up to the Championship that matters to me. At this moment in time Adkins has made 4 good signings ( though Woolford has not shown how good he is to date, and he is good) but there is a lot more to do yet.

Without pointing any fingers, we have so many players on contracts we wish we didn't have but next summer a good number expire. That's when Adkins has to make it all happen.

Given our squad and with Done and Brayford and Kennedy to add before long, we will be promoted. The real job in S2 is what happens then.

No argument there. Good points well put.

 

[Bladesman]

Just reminded me of the football at times under Nigel Clough.