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Westran

Westran

Ashleigh Spires Clubman of the Year 1994
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For the last 9 years we've been lucky enough to have one of our own in charge for long spells achieving success. To have this in English football is not normal at our level, it's an international business and we are the outlier.

The second foreign manager in Blades history is one day into his reign, he's already being subjected to criticism that will ripple, if he loses his first few games, he'll have vocal opposition, he already has vocal opposition.

Blades who I respect and know well have voiced their concerns, I get being concerned about change, AI, data, all that malarkey that nobody understands.

Some are plain racist and don't want a foreigner in charge.

We seem to be trying to follow the Brentford/Brighton model. But we're hamstrung by fan resistance. Do you think Brentford and Brighton were as resistant when their new owners started to change things? Do you think it helps to vocally oppose changes in the way our fan base has so far?

Personally I think we have a problem. Half of us want a progressive club that adapts to modern football and gives us the best chance of success. Half of us want to do things in the traditional way and will only be bought over by success.

The one thing we all have in common is that we have no choice, we may agree or disagree, or be unsure, but none of us can do anything other than watch it unfold. I'm hopeful, I'll enjoy my days out at the match, I'll enjoy the ride and I'll support my club unconditionally, unless I think we're being harmed, like Chansiri harmed

But I don't get why we have so much negativity when we're in probably the best condition we've been in on a general level.

I wish my fellow Blades could be less entitled and more supportive, the negativity is a problem for me and maybe for the club.
 

Westran said:
Do you think Brentford and Brighton were as resistant when their new owners started to change things?
Click to expand...

No because for much of their existences Brentford and Brighton were knocking about in non league and the fourth and third tiers.

They were more than happy to go along with anything that dragged them upwards.
 
Wilder has been a massive plus but also had his downside. It’s been fantastic having a blade as a manager in fact we’ve now done it at least three times with varying degrees of success. However this has come at the cost of some of the fanbase thinking that only a local lad who supports the club can ever understand us and get success.
Look around the successful clubs in this country and indeed Europe, how many have a fan as a manager? Is their success somehow lessened? Do Manchester City fans feel slighted that Guardiola isn’t from Longsights? Do Liverpool fans care that Slot is Dutch and before him a German was in charge?
Do they bollocks. I’m sad that Wilder has gone. I think I’d have probably given him another year but does that mean because we now have a non-Sheffielder in charge and even worse a Spaniard that somehow I’ll support the club less? Of course not.
Some of the stuff spouted on here has nearly made me glad that the board have done this. Little Sheffielders need to give their bloody heads a wobble. Why would you want the club you support to fail just so you can bask in some pathetic self congratulation of being right that their mate Chrissy should never have been let go. It’s that kind of small mindedness that has kept us in a state of mediocrity for longer than any living Blade can remember.
Fine don’t like the decision but if you can’t get over it and support your club can I invite you to fuck off and support Sheffield FC or Hallam or whoever else because I’m sick of listening to your whining bullshit now.
Rant over
 
Westran said:
For the last 9 years we've been lucky enough to have one of our own in charge for long spells achieving success. To have this in English football is not normal at our level, it's an international business and we are the outlier.

The second foreign manager in Blades history is one day into his reign, he's already being subjected to criticism that will ripple, if he loses his first few games, he'll have vocal opposition, he already has vocal opposition.

Blades who I respect and know well have voiced their concerns, I get being concerned about change, AI, data, all that malarkey that nobody understands.

Some are plain racist and don't want a foreigner in charge.

We seem to be trying to follow the Brentford/Brighton model. But we're hamstrung by fan resistance. Do you think Brentford and Brighton were as resistant when their new owners started to change things? Do you think it helps to vocally oppose changes in the way our fan base has so far?

Personally I think we have a problem. Half of us want a progressive club that adapts to modern football and gives us the best chance of success. Half of us want to do things in the traditional way and will only be bought over by success.

The one thing we all have in common is that we have no choice, we may agree or disagree, or be unsure, but none of us can do anything other than watch it unfold. I'm hopeful, I'll enjoy my days out at the match, I'll enjoy the ride and I'll support my club unconditionally, unless I think we're being harmed, like Chansiri harmed

But I don't get why we have so much negativity when we're in probably the best condition we've been in on a general level.

I wish my fellow Blades could be less entitled and more supportive, the negativity is a problem for me and maybe for the club.
Click to expand...

Yes, see last season.
 
FTPE said:
I agree with most of that.

Except, Spanish isn't a race, and if it was I don't think its racist to prefer an Englishman in charge of an English club.
I'm not overly fussed to be honest, but I don't agree its racist for those who are.
Click to expand...
Semantics. Spanish might not be a race, but if you don't want a foreigner in charge, you're probably racist.
 
Yellarbellyblade said:
Wilder has been a massive plus but also had his downside. It’s been fantastic having a blade as a manager in fact we’ve now done it at least three times with varying degrees of success. However this has come at the cost of some of the fanbase thinking that only a local lad who supports the club can ever understand us and get success.
Look around the successful clubs in this country and indeed Europe, how many have a fan as a manager? Is their success somehow lessened? Do Manchester City fans feel slighted that Guardiola isn’t from Longsights? Do Liverpool fans care that Slot is Dutch and before him a German was in charge?
Do they bollocks. I’m sad that Wilder has gone. I think I’d have probably given him another year but does that mean because we now have a non-Sheffielder in charge and even worse a Spaniard that somehow I’ll support the club less? Of course not.
Some of the stuff spouted on here has nearly made me glad that the board have done this. Little Sheffielders need to give their bloody heads a wobble. Why would you want the club you support to fail just so you can bask in some pathetic self congratulation of being right that their mate Chrissy should never have been let go. It’s that kind of small mindedness that has kept us in a state of mediocrity for longer than any living Blade can remember.
Fine don’t like the decision but if you can’t get over it and support your club can I invite you to fuck off and support Sheffield FC or Hallam or whoever else because I’m sick of listening to your whining bullshit now.
Rant over
Click to expand...
To be fair, the proof has been in the pudding. We've only ever been promoted to the Premier League by managers who grew up a few miles from Bramall Lane. Pretty much everyone else has been a disaster.

We need Billy Sharp to get his coaching badges sharpish, or we're in trouble.
 
FTPE said:
I agree with most of that.

Except, Spanish isn't a race, and if it was I don't think its racist to prefer an Englishman in charge of an English club.
I'm not overly fussed to be honest, but I don't agree its racist for those who are.
Click to expand...
The "Wilder is racist" meme is overplayed and not rooted in reality.

He preferred homegrown, so what? Many of the homegrown players he signed were black!

As for "Sausage Rohl" being a racist slur towards Germans and not a funny play on words...
 
Westran said:
Half of us want a progressive club that adapts to modern football and gives us the best chance of success. Half of us want to do things in the traditional way and will only be bought over by success.
Click to expand...
Utter fucking titwank*.

Just because someone thinks that the use of technology should in some way perhaps in some limited circumstances may reasonably possibly be subject to some minor amount of gentle questioning DOESN'T MAKE THEM A FUCKING DINOSAUR.

It's the same utter fucking bollocks that told us all VAR would bring about World Fucking Peace or something.

I remember a change of manager and Mark Duffy, John Fleck, and Jack O'Connell walking through the door not long after. All, somehow, without the use of ChatGPT. I mean, how the fuck did that ever happen??

This time we've had a change of board, a focus on 21st Century space age! forward thinking!! progressive!!! "AI"!!!!, and with all these powers at our disposal we've raided the backwaters of Bulgaria for...someone or sometwo. Oh and Peru.

They've hardly set the world on fire now have they. So far we'd've been better off signing Paddington.

Senor Selles talks a good game. None of this is his fault. Given how the board backed Wilder in the JTW it looks like they've got a few bob and don't mind spending it if someone makes a good case. I'm looking forward to him being able to bring in players that suit his style and maybe watching some exciting games.

But anyone expecting unquestioning slavish obedience to technology from the masses can fuck right off.

1750366506460.webp

*I think the technical terms is "false dichotomy".
 
FTPE said:
I don't think its racist to prefer an Englishman in charge of an English club
Click to expand...
If we're splitting hairs, it would be xenophobic. Especially if the hiring of an English manager is done at the expense of a non-English manager, exclusively due to the two people's nationalities.

If people are concerned about Selles' credentials, so be it. While I disagree with that viewpoint, I would find that a reasonable position to take.

But dismissing his ability simply because "he's forrun" is extremely unfair, and quite narrow-minded.
 
I get what you mean in the original post.

For me it's just when I sum everything up from my point of view I'm struggling to see how it's logical.

The owners do see it that way though and I just hope they are right.

I just feel it's quite the gamble.
And Selles might turn out to be fantastic but he has a limited track record so far.

I suppose I wasn't too enamoured when we appointed hecky and that turned out rather well.
 

There are a few other issues splitting the fanbase.

1: There’s a fashion these days to be a drama queen and over exaggerate every opinion, having extreme view points with some deliberately attention seeking.

This board isn’t too bad but on social media it’s a toxic mess.
The vitriol and anger towards Sheff Utd is really high. Quite a few Blades predicting relegation next season and suggesting Blades hand back their season tickets demanding a refund.

2: There’s been loads of new posters in the last few weeks onto Blades social media boards slagging off the club and even praising Wednesday. No doubt quite a lot of these supposed Blades slagging off Sheff Utd and Telles are actually Wednesday and Leeds fans.
 
DifferentClass said:
The "Wilder is racist" meme is overplayed and not rooted in reality.

He preferred homegrown, so what? Many of the homegrown players he signed were black!

As for "Sausage Rohl" being a racist slur towards Germans and not a funny play on words...
Click to expand...
Mate, given the choice I'd rather all 11 men be from Sheffield. I'm not sure its possible to be racist against Lancashire, but I'd like them all to be Yorkshiremen at least. I dont care about their colour, I care that they are from the City the football club represents.
I know its not going to happen, but for wanting Sheffield lads to represent a Sheffield team, and preferring a English manager to run an English club, its madness that people would complain at that.
I wish this new guy all the best, I'll support him the exact same as I did Wilder, and I'm only bringing this up because someone's already brandishing the racism card.
 
Westran said:
Semantics. Spanish might not be a race, but if you don't want a foreigner in charge, you're probably racist.
Click to expand...
Not necessarily - it depends on the reason why you might not want a foreign manager.

Perhaps you feel there might be an issue with language, or maybe because you feel they might not "get" English football those two examples are surely not racist.
 
Westran said:
I'll support my club unconditionally
Click to expand...
That’s the start, middle and end of the argument if you support SUFC.

There’s only a lot more to be said if you support anything or anyone other than the badge on your shirt.

We’ve had and are looking at more success and our fans are dividing the club. Pigs have nowt and are at risk of losing that but their uniting against the cause of the problem.

Turn on the owners if it goes totally t!ts up like S6 but FFS get behind the club and those trying to deliver that bit extra we’re missing.
 
Last edited:
Genuinely couldn't care less where our manager comes from as long as he's good, intelligent and understands football. I'm not really sure why it's a big thing with a manager.

I can understand why there's more of an appeal to have home grown players. Because in one sense it's aspirational, both for kids and parents. Someone you have a tenuous connection with becoming successful.

As for xenophobia, wait until the club hires a manager who is foreign and isn't white. Lots of racists and xenophobes in the north of England and we have our fair share.
 
CPB said:
And Selles might turn out to be fantastic but he has a limited track record so far.
Click to expand...

That’s using the old style of judging managers just on results.

We don’t know what the job spec is

But here are 4 factors where Selles is factually a much stronger candidate than Wilder.

Maybe the job spec/ direction the new owners want to take the club is.

1: Re-structure with a director of football at the top choosing players and planning policy and the 1st team coach (Selles) is employed to train and prepare the players, devise tactics and pick the team. This is the “normal” structure throughout the world and in the PL. Wilder has always been a manager and his ego would struggle to accept being a 1st team coach, whereas for Selles it’s an easy role.

2: Club plan to bring in many more foreign players. Wilder has limited experience with foreigners whereas Selles is multi lingual, worked as a coach in many countries and has vast experience coaching multiple nationalities.

3: Wouldn’t surprise my if these US businessman owners understand the effect of positive and negative publicity effecting “reputation”. We love Wilder showing emotion and being passionate, where as the owners now see it as a big negative and want someone calm and measured like Selles. The owners probably aren’t impressed that the players discipline has been so poor (fighting on the pitch) that it’s lead to £500,000 of fines. This lack of discipline is a poor reflection on the manager and Selles will be much better. Also regards image they possibly prefer a young good looking manager representing the club instead of a slightly overweight old guy who is disliked by most fans around the country and even with parts of the media.

4: Blades value the “he’s one of our own” mentality but maybe the owners see that as a negative and are desperate to pull away from the “any future manager must have pashun and be a Blade” mentality. They want to drag the club and its supporters kicking and screaming into the 21st century.

4: Selles is known for having fit players playing a high press game, which had become the fashion amongst top teams. Whereas this season many of the squad have struggled with fitness with several unable to last 90 minutes. Selles will be more successful regards having a fitter squad.
 
I don't think it's the case that those of who wanted Wilder to stay are against Selles. Neither do I think it's the case that rhey are opposed to having a manager that isn't English or from Yorkshire, or Sheffield or a Blade or whatever. I am sure that a vast majority of those in the pro Wilder camp see this as a gig gamble, would have preferred stability and continuity and are sad to see Wilder go. That's it. I am sure there are a few narrow minded parochial bigots out there but most of those who are sad to see Wilder go have reservations but wish Selles well, will get behind him and hope this doesn't backfire. That's how feel anyway. I don't care what the background of the coach or manager is. It's irrelevant
 
Sheffsteel said:
That’s using the old style of judging managers just on results.

We don’t know what the job spec is

But here are 4 factors where Selles is factually a much stronger candidate than Wilder.

Maybe the job spec/ direction the new owners want to take the club is.

1: Re-structure with a director of football at the top choosing players and planning policy and the 1st team coach (Selles) is employed to train and prepare the players, devise tactics and pick the team. This is the “normal” structure throughout the world and in the PL. Wilder has always been a manager and his ego would struggle to accept being a 1st team coach, whereas for Selles it’s an easy role.

2: Club plan to bring in many more foreign players. Wilder has limited experience with foreigners whereas Selles is multi lingual, worked as a coach in many countries and has vast experience coaching multiple nationalities.

3: Wouldn’t surprise my if these US businessman owners understand the effect of positive and negative publicity effecting “reputation”. We love Wilder showing emotion and being passionate, where as the owners now see it as a big negative and want someone calm and measured like Selles. The owners probably aren’t impressed that the players discipline has been so poor (fighting on the pitch) that it’s lead to £500,000 of fines. This lack of discipline is a poor reflection on the manager and Selles will be much better. Also regards image they possibly prefer a young good looking manager representing the club instead of a slightly overweight old guy who is disliked by most fans around the country and even with parts of the media.

4: Blades value the “he’s one of our own” mentality but maybe the owners see that as a negative and are desperate to pull away from the “any future manager must have pashun and be a Blade” mentality. They want to drag the club and its supporters kicking and screaming into the 21st century.

4: Selles is known for having fit players playing a high press game, which had become the fashion amongst top teams. Whereas this season many of the squad have struggled with fitness with several unable to last 90 minutes. Selles will be more successful regards having a fitter squad.
Click to expand...
Agree with all that. However, not sure about 1. The announcement referred to him as new manager (not head coach). Also, I would have expected a DoF to be announced before new manager. Maybe we’re not having DoF unless I’ve missed something.
 
BornOnShorehamStreet said:
Not necessarily - it depends on the reason why you might not want a foreign manager.

Perhaps you feel there might be an issue with language, or maybe because you feel they might not "get" English football those two examples are surely not racist.
Click to expand...
They're both completely invalid by the fact that hundreds of foreign managers have succeeded at other clubs under the same conditions
 
Blade56 said:
Agree with all that. However, not sure about 1. The announcement referred to him as new manager (not head coach). Also, I would have expected a DoF to be announced before new manager. Maybe we’re not having DoF unless I’ve missed something.
Click to expand...
Might announce a DoF later this summer, apparently we were after that bloke at Bristol City (Trinnion?) but that seems to have gone quiet in the last few days.

Maybe we might see Des Taylor become Director of Football, he's been at the club a while now and theoretically will have a head start on other candidates, knowing what we need right now as he watched us last season.
 

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