Adkins vs Clough

[William Henry Foulkes]

What are the differences between the way Adkins' teams play and the way Clough's teams play?

There were a few posters here who had a fairly consistent message of what was required to get us promoted last season including height, centre backs and a more direct style of play. I'd have to say, so far it looks like this view was correct.

So, how does this season so far contrast with last season?

 

[Barney]

Adkins = Positive

Clough = Negative

 

[Kenilworth]

end of thread

 

[JohnDenver]

We're going to see a lot more goals this year.

Adkins set up is much more open and demands a lot from the midfield pair. The job of playing as a striker for SUFC this will be much more fun than under Clough. Meanwhile the defenders will be more exposed.

As a result of all that I expect Baxter and Collins will fall well short of what's needed. If they're replaced with quality (mobile and athletic players), we could see some fireworks.

 

[FTPE]

Clough was a stubborn bastard!
We'd still have Long in the net after his first game if he was in charge, just to prove that if/when he came good-that he'd been right all along.

 

[William Henry Foulkes]

We're going to see a lot more goals this year.

Adkins set up is much more open and demands a lot from the midfield pair. The job of playing as a striker for SUFC this will be much more fun than under Clough. Meanwhile the defenders will be more exposed.

As a result of all that I expect Baxter and Collins will fall well short of what's needed. If they're replaced with quality (mobile and athletic players), we could see some fireworks.

I'd agree with that. The 5 gave us some stability in midfield. To some extent that's gone and we might have to get used to things being a bit more open; especially as (for now) we are using Clough's players to play in Adkins's system, perhaps most noticeable in MF but applies elsewhere.

 

[ilovesufc]

Clough = if you go a goal in front stop attacking and invite pressure until you eventually concede.
Adkins = let's try and get more than 1 goal so that if they do score we will still be winning.

 

[Kenilworth]

What'samarrer wi' you lot? - The bloody thread ended at #2 when barney creamed it.


Stewth

 

[William Henry Foulkes]

Clough = if you go a goal in front stop attacking and invite pressure until you eventually concede.
Adkins = let's try and get more than 1 goal so that if they do score we will still be winning.

Tbf I think at 1-0 up Clough tried to play on the break - and it did work occasionally - but we just didn't have the solidity at the back and it failed too often.

 

[judge]

What are the differences between the way Adkins' teams play and the way Clough's teams play?

There were a few posters here who had a fairly consistent message of what was required to get us promoted last season including height, centre backs and a more direct style of play. I'd have to say, so far it looks like this view was correct.

So, how does this season so far contrast with last season?

We are 2 games into the season
Why dont you start a thread comparing prince george and henry vlll 's cock size

 

[William Henry Foulkes]

We are 2 games into the season
Why dont you start a thread comparing prince george and henry vlll 's cock size

We're three games into the season (and some of us have seen pre-season games as well).

Some responses contain reasonable observations on the available evidence.

For me it was most apparent against Chesterfield when four or five six-footers wandered into their box for a free kick. We were actually potentially a threat. I'd almost forgotten this was possible.

 

[Kenilworth]

We're three games into the season (and some of us have seen pre-season games as well).

Some responses contain reasonable observations on the available evidence.

For me it was most apparent against Chesterfield when four or five six-footers wandered into their box for a free kick. We were actually potentially a threat. I'd almost forgotten this was possible.

Sounds Positive

 

[Sheffsteel]

Clough concentrated on staying patient, good short passing with the number 1 objective to retain possession. He stubbornly believed in talent will always overcome physicality. Hence plenty of midgets in the squad. It was a good building block for any successful team but the players seemed to think as long as they passed sideways to our player then they'd done their job. It was as though winning the match was considered a bonus.

Atkins concentrates on not conceding goals at one end and scoring goals at the other end. He's more direct and plays to players strengths.

Also under NC when ever we used to defend corners we had almost all 10 outfield players inside our penalty area, so whenever anyone cleared it then it went straight to their player and the opposition could afford to push their centre halves deep into our half. However against Chesterfiedl I noticed that Sharp was perched on the shoulder (Keith Edwards style) of their last defender. This put pressure on them to keep their defenders deep meaning there was plenty of space in midfield and the game was stretched. Don't think Sharp ever came into our half so we always had an outlet.

Clough had a long term plan for PL football and focussed on young players with potential playing the right brand of football.

Adkins has a short term plan of promotion this year and worry about next year once we're promoted. He focuses on players who are reliable and he can trust to do a job in league 1 here and now, not players with potential.

Don't want to slag off Clough because he did a decent job to lay down foundations ( and I'll be forever grateful for the cup runs) but it was very very slow progress. He probably needed 10 years to get us where he wanted and he was incredibly stubborn rarely playing the same team twice and mysteriously dropping players whenever they had a good game.

However Adkins is a bit like Warnock, a more upbeat positive personality.
Adkins knows that even the playoffs would be considered mild failure and he accepts the challenge.

 

[JohnDenver]

Tbf I think at 1-0 up Clough tried to play on the break - and it did work occasionally - but we just didn't have the solidity at the back and it failed too often.

I liked what Clough was trying do, but he was too bloody stubborn to change his default method when it wasn't appropriate to the opposition or the players at his disposal.

As Alco always said, Clough's teams were just too damn passive. Tremendous against superior opponents. Not so against Div1 scrappers.

 

[ilovesufc]

Tbf I think at 1-0 up Clough tried to play on the break - and it did work occasionally - but we just didn't have the solidity at the back and it failed too often.

I know, I agree to some extent and I'm just being simplistic. However due to this style we played far too deeply far too much of the time. So far I think we can see Adkins wanting us to play higher up the pitch and be more combative in our approach. I think we look more physical this season - IMO an absolute requirement if we have any hope of promotion from this division.

 

[William Henry Foulkes]

I liked what Clough was trying do, but he was too bloody stubborn to change his default method when it wasn't appropriate to the opposition or the players at his disposal.

Walsall away was one where it was really clear. Baxter scored a wonder goal and we sat back with (from memory) a very makeshift defence and keeper (Turner?). There were several others.

Otoh he did at least once try 4-4-2, and in what turned out to be his last game he really went for it. (I wonder if he's learned from that.) So it's not like he never changed but in the end too often he was too bloody stubborn to change his default method when it wasn't appropriate to the opposition or the players at his disposal.

 

[William Henry Foulkes]

It was a good building block for any successful team but the players seemed to think as long as they passed sideways to our player then they'd done their job.

This is a really good point.

 

[William Henry Foulkes]

I think we look more physical this season

Agreed - and another consistent recommendation/requirement from some posters.

 

[Jonboy60]

We are 2 games into the season
Why dont you start a thread comparing prince george and henry vlll 's cock size

Prince George's cock= negative. Henry V111s cock positive.

 

[Lord Bos of Eckington.]

Adkins = Positive

Clough = Negative

No blame culture . We are all in it together . Different refreshing mentality . Even us fans have to get used to it.

UTB

 

[CaptainMorgans]

The above poster has nailed it. Upgrades on Collins and Baxter (and Howard) are absolutely essential to effectively executing Adkins' game plan. Baxter simply cannot operate in a four man midfield, I'm not sure how high his stock is right now, but I'd consider shipping him out if we can get a decent fee and find a decent box-to-box player (a la Coady, not sure Basham or Wallace are the answer for different reasons). Collins is always going to struggle against the better strikers of this league, he shouldn't be at this club anymore, certainly not as a starter.

I can see us kicking on quite a bit when Matty Done and John Brayford (our two best players) return to fitness. I also think the way we're setting up could really suit JCR, we all know he's wildly inconsistent, but with this open style we're playing he might just have a bit of room to cause some damage in the last twenty minutes of matches. I also don't think his crossing is as consistently bad as some make out, it'll be interesting to see how he gets on with some options in the box for him to aim at because he rarely had that last season. Bob Harris will also be an upgrade on McEveley at left back, despite my big criticisms of him.

As it is I don't see us being anywhere near the top two with the squad as it is, at least not until Christmas when our better players are back and finding fitness. I'm just hoping we can stay in and around the top 6 and within striking distance.

 

[maxstertheblade]

Personally thought on Saturday some parts of the game we played counter attacking football. Clough also used this system. But, the counter attacking with NA worked as unlike with NC we passed it at a quicker tempo and moved it into very dangerous areas. Also thought we was very clinical and Adkins wants that first goal bcos evidently on Saturday it killed the game.

 

[ilovesufc]

I think Adkins likes Baxter. I thought he played OK on Sat actually. Never seen him run so fast either! Out of interest, where did he play when he was at Oldham - he did well there and the fans there really rated him I seem to remember?

 

[Fulwood Blade]

we might have to get used to things being a bit more open; .

Those words above are the key element to how the game should be actually played.

What makes the difference is if you have a STRONG and SOUND defence.

There is nothing wrong with being open and with quality defenders you will lose only a few.
That is why some of us have banged on about CH for ages and why, if we need to be brutally honest, Collins ideally needs replacing.
It isn't anything personal - a strong defence doesn't concede many stupid goals and therefore doesn't lose.
If you lose games make sure you lose them to goals that actually makes you think...wow........not, fuck me, just another simple ball into the box.

UTB

 

[ilovesufc]

Personally thought on Saturday some parts of the game we played counter attacking football. Clough also used this system. But, the counter attacking with NA worked as unlike with NC we passed it at a quicker tempo and moved it into very dangerous areas. Also thought we was very clinical and Adkins wants that first goal bcos evidently on Saturday it killed the game.

I don't think we were playing counter attack as such, to me it was just a fairly open and end to end game. We weren't sitting back and inviting them on - more like at some points they just had more of the play than us. We did then counter attack well - but I wouldn't say we were actually playing that style as a tactic.

 

[Caseh]

No blame culture . We are all in it together . Different refreshing mentality . Even us fans have to get used to it.

UTB

Are we all united, together?

 

[Bergen Blade]

Too early to compare them. Overall we weren't very attacking on Saturday. McEveley at left back and Scougall at wide midfield are clearly moves to make sure we aren't too attacking and too open. Mind you, both were probably needed as we had two strikers and Adams on the left.

I also think the early goals contributed to us not taking more risks than we had to. The full backs (Freeman as well) didn't overlap as much as Adkins' teams are known for, and the central midfielders were also reluctant to bomb forward. They will be needed to do more going forward in other games. Sammon and Sharp also did their bit to help out defensively and we did drop quite deep at times.

 

[William Henry Foulkes]

No blame culture.

Wait till McNulty misses a sitter

 

[Bergen Blade]

Agreed - and another consistent recommendation/requirement from some posters.

Adkins seems to have prioritised this after Gillingham (when we still had small players marking six footers). I agree Clough was strangely ignorant about this.

 

[Reedy1889]

I now don't just expect our set pieces to be cleared by the opposition, we scored a goal in the first half!!! and we didn't set up to hold onto the slender one goal lead after we scored, we tried to score more which was refreshing to see.