Catapult training vests

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SwissBlade

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I'd noticed in the pics of preseason training that the players are all wearing a sports bra type vest. A quick google and it seems they're a type of GPS tracker vest for training and fitness.

http://www.performbetter.co.uk/performance-monitoring/catapult-athlete-tracking-systems/

Seems from the catapult site that there are a lot of teams using this system. Good to see were keeping up with techology and using this alongside our traditional training methods.

Obviously it doesn't get us 3 pts every sat/ Tuesday but it does mean that the club are looking at several different ways to monitor fitness.
 



GPS trackers? Surely someone could shoe horn a ched reference in about that........
 
Are they the ones that tell on you if you bunk off for a fag behind the club house ?
We had them at school back in the fifty's but we didn't call em GPS....:rolleyes:
 
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Looked like they were wearing them in the friendlies as well, saw some players adjusting them during breaks in play
 
I think its only a matter of time until they have these GPS things stiched into the back of shirts like in rugby.
 
I think its only a matter of time until they have these GPS things stiched into the back of shirts like in rugby.
Do they need them for league games? At The Lane anyway cause haven't we got that thing that I can't remember the name of? Got 4 cameras in each corner of the stadium that tracks player movement or something like that?
 
They have some proper technology these days. I forget which show I watched on Sky the other day but they were talking about modern advances in the game and how they help during pre season. The new equipment they have both on and off the pitch means that players daren't hit it hard during the summer break these days as the machines drop them straight in it and let the coaching staff, physio and manager know who's been hitting the shandy hard and not conditioning themselves correctly. As training and pre season moves on the can see who's progressing physically and fitness wise and who is grafting and stuff which helps the gaffer when picking his starting XI. There is literally no hiding for the players these days.

In addition to this they like to be stringent these days with physical health and stuff even more so since the fabrice muamba incident. So not only is it good on monitoring players and keeping them in top condition but it also protects them which is a good thing.
 
Following the comments by William Henry Foulkes in the adkins pre match wigan thread, its perhaps good to raise this thread from the ashes again to give some info on technology.

I can perhaps offer a little bit on Training/ Performance Zones, will try to listen to Adkins later and understand it a little more, so I’ve made some assumptions.


- Football League approved use of performance trackers in competitive games from mid 2015

- SUFC players use the “Catapult” vests for training – Did they appear to have a lump in between their shoulder blades during the game? If so its likely that this is what tracked the data on Sunday (and presumably in all games)

- GPS v Heart Rate Zones – Its unlikely that the zones are worked out from the GPS data alone, reading the catapult data sheets it seems that they have HR monitors as well, there will be an algorithm set up to monitor HR and GPS data to produce a report.

- Zones will be for each individual, so Sharp will work in different Zones to Collins, Edgar or Brayford.


Zones

The “Zones” for footballers will be specific (as opposed to cyclists/ Triathletes) which tend to work purely to Heart Rate Zones, I would suggest that footballers work on a combination of speed and HR to give the zones for the game.


The Zones are therefore based on effort. So the Red Zone would be likely to be at between 80-90% effort, so higher heart rate and number of sprints etc. It’s unlikely that any footballer will work for a long time in the Red Zone, However, players like Basham, Hammond, Edgar, Collins and Sharp will be more likely to be in their red zones for longer as they are seeing more of the ball than perhaps Woolford.


United will probably calculate how long they expect and want players working in certain zones, so they should also train to this.


For example, when I train, I train at a higher HR than some of the people I train with. I can ride on the same ride as a mate, but my average HR will always be higher than his because I spend more time in the “80-90%” effort.


There are factors such as food and drink consumed before and after, long term fitness, clothing worn as these will all play a part in body temperature and cooling, however there may also be natural differences.


In Game Recovery

Because of the individual nature of the effort levels and also the individual themselves, each will require a different recovery before Tuesday.


United will see from the graphs the recovery times from the 80-90% efforts. Half time probably gives a chance to monitor recovery as well because they can down load the first half data. But more importantly, they will see how the in match recovery is going.


An indication that a player is fatiguing is following a high effort (80-90%), how quickly does his heart rate drop to perhaps 50%, again, they will have this set for individuals. The longer it takes to recover after a sprint(especially compared to normal games), generally this indicates fatigue


Post Match Recovery

Again, it’s different for individuals. I’m ok for about 2-3 days after a race, a few aches but physically I’m ok. After the 3 day mark though, I need extra recovery time.


So we’ll find that certain players may be ok for Tuesday, but not Saturday and vice versa.


The recovery training will be interesting as well. Personally I like to swim and recover, United will certainly run and the recovery will be an active recovery for most, so they’ll work on light cardio, no speed work, but perhaps some gym work.


Working on things like set pieces will be avoided, perhaps as they are quite exhausting due to the repetitive nature of being in and out of the red zone for short periods.


I’m sure that there are some sports scientists on here which will provide a better insight, but this is just my view from my training and testing over the last couple of years
 



Following the comments by William Henry Foulkes in the adkins pre match wigan thread, its perhaps good to raise this thread from the ashes again to give some info on technology.

I can perhaps offer a little bit on Training/ Performance Zones, will try to listen to Adkins later and understand it a little more, so I’ve made some assumptions.


- Football League approved use of performance trackers in competitive games from mid 2015

- SUFC players use the “Catapult” vests for training – Did they appear to have a lump in between their shoulder blades during the game? If so its likely that this is what tracked the data on Sunday (and presumably in all games)

- GPS v Heart Rate Zones – Its unlikely that the zones are worked out from the GPS data alone, reading the catapult data sheets it seems that they have HR monitors as well, there will be an algorithm set up to monitor HR and GPS data to produce a report.

- Zones will be for each individual, so Sharp will work in different Zones to Collins, Edgar or Brayford.


Zones

The “Zones” for footballers will be specific (as opposed to cyclists/ Triathletes) which tend to work purely to Heart Rate Zones, I would suggest that footballers work on a combination of speed and HR to give the zones for the game.


The Zones are therefore based on effort. So the Red Zone would be likely to be at between 80-90% effort, so higher heart rate and number of sprints etc. It’s unlikely that any footballer will work for a long time in the Red Zone, However, players like Basham, Hammond, Edgar, Collins and Sharp will be more likely to be in their red zones for longer as they are seeing more of the ball than perhaps Woolford.


United will probably calculate how long they expect and want players working in certain zones, so they should also train to this.


For example, when I train, I train at a higher HR than some of the people I train with. I can ride on the same ride as a mate, but my average HR will always be higher than his because I spend more time in the “80-90%” effort.


There are factors such as food and drink consumed before and after, long term fitness, clothing worn as these will all play a part in body temperature and cooling, however there may also be natural differences.


In Game Recovery

Because of the individual nature of the effort levels and also the individual themselves, each will require a different recovery before Tuesday.


United will see from the graphs the recovery times from the 80-90% efforts. Half time probably gives a chance to monitor recovery as well because they can down load the first half data. But more importantly, they will see how the in match recovery is going.


An indication that a player is fatiguing is following a high effort (80-90%), how quickly does his heart rate drop to perhaps 50%, again, they will have this set for individuals. The longer it takes to recover after a sprint(especially compared to normal games), generally this indicates fatigue


Post Match Recovery

Again, it’s different for individuals. I’m ok for about 2-3 days after a race, a few aches but physically I’m ok. After the 3 day mark though, I need extra recovery time.


So we’ll find that certain players may be ok for Tuesday, but not Saturday and vice versa.


The recovery training will be interesting as well. Personally I like to swim and recover, United will certainly run and the recovery will be an active recovery for most, so they’ll work on light cardio, no speed work, but perhaps some gym work.


Working on things like set pieces will be avoided, perhaps as they are quite exhausting due to the repetitive nature of being in and out of the red zone for short periods.


I’m sure that there are some sports scientists on here which will provide a better insight, but this is just my view from my training and testing over the last couple of years
Interesting, thanks Swizzles. But have you not got any work to do today?
 
Interesting, thanks Swizzles. But have you not got any work to do today?

Been here since 7am (4 am your time) so i've done almost half a day already, picked up an espresso and a slice of panettone and set about flicking through the forum ;)
 
Can they get an implant or something that can help them defend in league games.

I think this is an issue (whilst i know you probably posted it for comedy purposes its actually got a point with it), Adkins and several other managers like to use stats and data, which is great, but when you compare football with Cycling, its a very different matter. There are lots of tactics in team cycling, but a lot of them are linked directly to the data and whilst you don't know exactly what another team or individual will do on a day, the planning for each stage or an entire race is based on the the race course, conditions, the planning is such that the riders will work to specific power and HR outputs, this is to optimise their effort for that day or the whole race.

In cycling they use a Watts of power measurement, based upon training data and also race data, so team Sky know exactly how much power Chris Froome should be working to on the Alp d'huez and if other riders attack him, then they have a buffer that they can go to. This is so that he is then ok for that day and the next etc.

In football, its about much more than data, but data seems to now be such a big part of what we do at United, i guess its the marginal gains (we've discussed before whether this should be applied in football), so as long as it doesn't dominate what we do, but enhances it, then it can be a good thing.

Personally i'd like them to just work on being less shit than the opposition.
 
I'd noticed in the pics of preseason training that the players are all wearing a sports bra type vest. A quick google and it seems they're a type of GPS tracker vest for training and fitness.

http://www.performbetter.co.uk/performance-monitoring/catapult-athlete-tracking-systems/

Seems from the catapult site that there are a lot of teams using this system. Good to see were keeping up with techology and using this alongside our traditional training methods.

Obviously it doesn't get us 3 pts every sat/ Tuesday but it does mean that the club are looking at several different ways to monitor fitness.
GPS tracker shows us Higdons exact location:
Screenshot_2016-01-12-08-32-46~01.png
 
I think this is an issue (whilst i know you probably posted it for comedy purposes its actually got a point with it), Adkins and several other managers like to use stats and data, which is great, but when you compare football with Cycling, its a very different matter. There are lots of tactics in team cycling, but a lot of them are linked directly to the data and whilst you don't know exactly what another team or individual will do on a day, the planning for each stage or an entire race is based on the the race course, conditions, the planning is such that the riders will work to specific power and HR outputs, this is to optimise their effort for that day or the whole race.

In cycling they use a Watts of power measurement, based upon training data and also race data, so team Sky know exactly how much power Chris Froome should be working to on the Alp d'huez and if other riders attack him, then they have a buffer that they can go to. This is so that he is then ok for that day and the next etc.

In football, its about much more than data, but data seems to now be such a big part of what we do at United, i guess its the marginal gains (we've discussed before whether this should be applied in football), so as long as it doesn't dominate what we do, but enhances it, then it can be a good thing.

Personally i'd like them to just work on being less shit than the opposition.
As an unrelated aside, I see team sky's support vehicles are changing from the rather down market jaguar to the less down market Maserati.

Marvellous
 
Long cry from a cup of tea and a ciggy at half time, wonder what Alf Tupper (Tough of the Track) would have thought, those were't' days
image.jpeg
 
I thought this had been bumped again due to issues in the Trans Gender thread.
 
So if one of our players gets nutmegged, will the GPS instruct them to "Turn around when possible"?
There is no truth in the rumour that Collins used to hears that whenever he entered the pitch under Clough, all evidence was removed when his slate was cleaned in June
 
Waste of money for me. As if that's going to improve anything. Proper hard working training sessions, that's all you need. No GPS trackers for gods sake, get it back to basics. World's gone daft.
 
Waste of money for me. As if that's going to improve anything. Proper hard working training sessions, that's all you need. No GPS trackers for gods sake, get it back to basics. World's gone daft.

And meanwhile, as we come back from the dark ages, its been proven, scientifically, that by using the data you can specifically target training to individuals to get them and keep them fitter...
 



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