1 defeat in last 8 games

[1danewhitehouse]

I wouldn't bother. When losing an argument, this is the guy that makes up lies and pretends you've said things to suit his nonsensical argument.

Credit to him thought Pete. At least the stat quoted in the OP is accurate this time unlike the "you'll never win anything with kids thread".

I'm surprised he didn't try to say we're 9 unbeated on some such nonsense in this thread.

 

[PeteBlade]

Credit to him thought Pete. At least the stat quoted in the OP is accurate this time unlike the "you'll never win anything with kids thread".

I'm surprised he didn't try to say we're 9 unbeated on some such nonsense in this thread.

Give him time...

 

[1danewhitehouse]

*unbeated = unbeaten
** on = or

 

[Alfreton14Blade]

What points were Adkins' Southampton on at this stage?

Funnily enough, they were 9th after 14 games on 21 pts (with a GD of +4). Compared to us now being 5th on 24 pts (GD of +6).

Admittedly Adkins hadn't taken over from Pardew till Sept 12th that season. And it was a stronger division (Hudds, Pigs, Charlton, Brighton). But, on the other hand, Saints were in a much better position than us as a club, just being in their 2nd season down wallowing in the Division Three depths, as opposed to our 5th.

#statto

 

[Blade58]

I'm pretty sure that given time we will improve by being more consistent. We need to.

Fleetwood imo, were the worst side to come to BL this season. However, great 3 points and tbh that's all I asked Santa for. We got them. Roll on the next home game. We need to drive it home now and beat Millwall and as I say, show some level of consistency, because it's that which will win us promotion.

Positives from last night:

Winning and 3 points
Clean sheet
Wallace
McGahey
Adams goals
Coutts 2nd half
Bash
Sharp getting back to scoring after a 3 match spell (I think it's 3?)

Negatives:

Lack of movement which results in a lack of options for the man with the ball, hence passing back, sideways, to the GK
Booing (the day I boo my own team is the day I pack in going)

 

[longinthe toothblade]

Adkins measures and patience are starting to show dividends
we arent the finished article, but last night saw us sweep away a side we previously have struggled against with ease
if we cant take positives from a 3-0 win a clean sheet only conceding 6 in last 7 showing the defence is tightening up and the fact we can score goals we should all stay at home
We are gradually addressing the long standing lack of quality in the squad ,
Its a bit like putting an Ikea cupboard together with only swedish instructions
be all right when its all assembled though

Sounds to me that you are trying to convince yourself?

 

[HillmortonBlade]

Sounds to me that you are trying to convince yourself?

And nothing wrong with that. I am always trying to convince myself that things are on the up. It always comes back to... let's see how we get on at the next match and the inconsistency is what does me down. Until there is a tipping point. As with NC, I always looked for positives, until I watched how we defended in an infamous 5-5...

 

[sheffielder]

Then only stat that matters to me is we have won one of our last one. Your only as good as your last game. When we don't beat Oldham and port vale or teams like that the. I will say it's not good enough.

When we win games like last night, whether we play well or not doesn't matter to me, because it brings confidence.

Blade too long, you know what you're doing when you post this shit, so pick your bottom lip up when people give you and equally pointless stat like the one you have quoted.

Next game please

 

[Alfreton14Blade]

The sequence this season has sort of been:

Home games: winning ---> struggling ---> winning

Away games: getting thrashed ---> winning ---> struggling

Well, so far anyway.

Away form now seems the problem. But if we're struggling through to draws (with the odd win), then fine. So long as the high-scoring home record keeps getting extended.

 

[Bartleby]

Second highest scorers in the division in fact.

table I'm looking at shows Gillingham and Peterborough on more, but hey ...

 

[longinthe toothblade]

I'm pretty sure that given time we will improve by being more consistent. We need to.

Fleetwood imo, were the worst side to come to BL this season. However, great 3 points and tbh that's all I asked Santa for. We got them. Roll on the next home game. We need to drive it home now and beat Millwall and as I say, show some level of consistency, because it's that which will win us promotion.

Positives from last night:

Winning and 3 points
Clean sheet
Wallace
McGahey
Adams goals
Coutts 2nd half
Bash
Sharp getting back to scoring after a 3 match spell (I think it's 3?)

Negatives:

Lack of movement which results in a lack of options for the man with the ball, hence passing back, sideways, to the GK
Booing (the day I boo my own team is the day I pack in going)

Don't disagree with any of that.

Don't think Deej is being that negative either - a little bit of objectivity shouldn't hurt anyone!

3 points great, improvement/s, yes, but for me there's still room for quite a bit more.

First minute last night was super but as for the remaining 44, I've seen better. We water the pitch (to help facilitate a quick passing game) and then, we play walking football from the back. Half the time we go nowhere and in doing so, we put ourselves under pressure?

Second half was a bit like 'the curates egg' (good in parts). When we picked up the pace and when we went forward and got folk in the box we hurt them - as we would / will many more in this league if we maintained this.

The only other negative I'd add to your list is that we start too slowly - apart from Colchester when we didn't start at all. Blackpool, Bury, Vale, Oldham, Rochdale we gave them all 45 mins start. It's even more noticeable away from home (trust me) but we can't afford to do that and we have to get on the front foot quicker. We have the players to win this league but we have to start games as we finish them.

 

[Newbury Blade]

Second highest scorers in the division in fact.

Correction: we are indeed the third highest scores. I hadn't noticed Peterborough for some reason.
Interesting that Sharp and Adams have now scored as many league goals between them as the entire Burton squad, a team that some of the moaners on here reckon will finish above us.

 

[Newbury Blade]

table I'm looking at shows Gillingham and Peterborough on more, but hey ...

Yes apologies, my mistake. We will soon be the highest scorers so it will all be academic.

 

[longinthe toothblade]

And nothing wrong with that. I am always trying to convince myself that things are on the up. It always comes back to... let's see how we get on at the next match and the inconsistency is what does me down. Until there is a tipping point. As with NC, I always looked for positives, until I watched how we defended in an infamous 5-5...

True for most of us

 

[Bartleby]

We will soon be the highest scorers so it will all be academic.

Hoping so. Sharp and Adams both looking odds on to be in double figures soon

 

[Bartleby]

Funnily enough, they were 9th after 14 games on 21 pts (with a GD of +4). Compared to us now being 5th on 24 pts (GD of +6).

Admittedly Adkins hadn't taken over from Pardew till Sept 12th that season. And it was a stronger division (Hudds, Pigs, Charlton, Brighton). But, on the other hand, Saints were in a much better position than us as a club, just being in their 2nd season down wallowing in the Division Three depths, as opposed to our 5th.

#statto

and he only made one signing before the JTW - wonder if their forums were in meltdown?

 

[Paulus]

It does, but 3 wins in 9 isn't promotion form either.. even in a league as bad as this.

I still don't buy into the commonly stated fact that this league is piss poor. Yes, it is frustrating that we are still at this level in the football pyramid given all the reasons we have debated ad nauseam but in my view the standards in this league are better than they have ever been.

My reasons:
1. The presence of huge numbers of international players in the PL results in many of the best home players having to move down the leagues to get regular starts, this has impacted significantly on L1.
2. The large squads in the PL result in virtually every L1 team being able to bring in on loan better quality players at times during the season.
3. Sports science has transformed the understanding and practice of player fitness. From 79 onwards it was pretty common for players to be blowing out for the last 20 minutes or so when a disproportionate number of goals were scored, this happens far less these days.
4. The three sub rule has covered over injury weaknesses during matches when in the past teams could and were steamrollered when they were carrying walking wounded.
5. Tactical sophistication has permeated to L1. Even the weakest teams will have a game plan and have enough ability and fitness to implement it and if necessary change it mid match. The option of sitting back and defending and hitting on the break has become more and more successful and regularly frustrates at all levels of football. Opting to adapt this tactic does not necessarily mean that the team is poor e.g. Arsenal last night.

I think that modern football produces less of the unexpected and less entertainment than it often did in the past because in essence teams and players these days are hugely more professional in their approach and this equates with a lot of supporters as being not as good as it was in the past but I'm pretty sure that if you could play matches between L1 teams now and even L1 teams of 10 years ago the current ones would win the vast majority of the games.

 

[William Henry Foulkes]

Don't disagree with any of that.

Don't think Deej is being that negative either - a little bit of objectivity shouldn't hurt anyone!

3 points great, improvement/s, yes, but for me there's still room for quite a bit more.

First minute last night was super but as for the remaining 44, I've seen better. We water the pitch (to help facilitate a quick passing game) and then, we play walking football from the back. Half the time we go nowhere and in doing so, we put ourselves under pressure?

Second half was a bit like 'the curates egg' (good in parts). When we picked up the pace and when we went forward and got folk in the box we hurt them - as we would / will many more in this league if we maintained this.

The only other negative I'd add to your list is that we start too slowly - apart from Colchester when we didn't start at all. Blackpool, Bury, Vale, Oldham, Rochdale we gave them all 45 mins start. It's even more noticeable away from home (trust me) but we can't afford to do that and we have to get on the front foot quicker. We have the players to win this league but we have to start games as we finish them.

These 45' starts are sometimes 30' starts when Adkins decides it's not going to work and switches things around.

This is inevitable as we try different options - and is very clear from Bergen Blade's analysis of Oldham.

Hopefully the number of games in which we play 90' will increase, and with this will come an increase in fortunes.

UTMB

 

[William Henry Foulkes]

I still don't buy into the commonly stated fact that this league is piss poor. Yes, it is frustrating that we are still at this level in the football pyramid given all the reasons we have debated ad nauseam but in my view the standards in this league are better than they have ever been.

My reasons:
1. The presence of huge numbers of international players in the PL results in many of the best home players having to move down the leagues to get regular starts, this has impacted significantly on L1.
2. The large squads in the PL result in virtually every L1 team being able to bring in on loan better quality players at times during the season.
3. Sports science has transformed the understanding and practice of player fitness. From 79 onwards it was pretty common for players to be blowing out for the last 20 minutes or so when a disproportionate number of goals were scored, this happens far less these days.
4. The three sub rule has covered over injury weaknesses during matches when in the past teams could and were steamrollered when they were carrying walking wounded.
5. Tactical sophistication has permeated to L1. Even the weakest teams will have a game plan and have enough ability and fitness to implement it and if necessary change it mid match. The option of sitting back and defending and hitting on the break has become more and more successful and regularly frustrates at all levels of football. Opting to adapt this tactic does not necessarily mean that the team is poor e.g. Arsenal last night.

I think that modern football produces less of the unexpected and less entertainment than it often did in the past because in essence teams and players these days are hugely more professional in their approach and this equates with a lot of supporters as being not as good as it was in the past but I'm pretty sure that if you could play matches between L1 teams now and even L1 teams of 10 years ago the current ones would win the vast majority of the games.

Great post.

 

[longinthe toothblade]

These 45' starts are sometimes 30' starts when Adkins decides it's not going to work and switches things around.

This is inevitable as we try different options - and is very clear from Bergen Blade's analysis of Oldham.

Hopefully the number of games in which we play 90' will increase, and with this will come an increase in fortunes.

UTMB

Bergen Blade's analysis or otherwise I'll repeat what I've said.

We start too slowly - apart from Colchester when we didn't start at all. Blackpool, Bury, Vale, Oldham, Rochdale we gave them all 45 mins start. It's even more noticeable away from home (if you haven't managed to get away yet, trust me) but we can't afford to do that and we have to get on the front foot much quicker. We have the players to win this league but we have to start games as we finish them.

 

[William Henry Foulkes]

Bergen Blade's analysis or otherwise I'll repeat what I've said.

We start too slowly - apart from Colchester when we didn't start at all. Blackpool, Bury, Vale, Oldham, Rochdale we gave them all 45 mins start. It's even more noticeable away from home (if you haven't managed to get away yet, trust me) but we can't afford to do that and we have to get on the front foot much quicker. We have the players to win this league but we have to start games as we finish them.

As Bergen points out there are very good reasons for these slow starts - and it's nothing to do with lack of effort, which seemed to be the consensus amongst a group of fans at Oldham.

As Adkins finds out more about the players and their capabilities he will need to experiment less, know what works, and go with that from the outset.

Also as the team become increasingly familiar with what's expected of them, individually and collectively, performances will become of a more even, and higher, standard.

All of this points to a gradual and hopefully significant improvement in results.

 

[wizadry]

Correction: we are indeed the third highest scores. I hadn't noticed Peterborough for some reason.
Interesting that Sharp and Adams have now scored as many league goals between them as the entire Burton squad, a team that some of the moaners on here reckon will finish above us.

I haven't seen one poster on here that thinks Burton will finish above us mate.

They won't finish above us, just to clarify my view on it.

We will more than likely finish atleast 20 points clear of them just with the resources we have over them, that is of course if we put those resources to good use.

 

[Lord Bos of Eckington.]

I still don't buy into the commonly stated fact that this league is piss poor. Yes, it is frustrating that we are still at this level in the football pyramid given all the reasons we have debated ad nauseam but in my view the standards in this league are better than they have ever been.

My reasons:
1. The presence of huge numbers of international players in the PL results in many of the best home players having to move down the leagues to get regular starts, this has impacted significantly on L1.
2. The large squads in the PL result in virtually every L1 team being able to bring in on loan better quality players at times during the season.
3. Sports science has transformed the understanding and practice of player fitness. From 79 onwards it was pretty common for players to be blowing out for the last 20 minutes or so when a disproportionate number of goals were scored, this happens far less these days.
4. The three sub rule has covered over injury weaknesses during matches when in the past teams could and were steamrollered when they were carrying walking wounded.
5. Tactical sophistication has permeated to L1. Even the weakest teams will have a game plan and have enough ability and fitness to implement it and if necessary change it mid match. The option of sitting back and defending and hitting on the break has become more and more successful and regularly frustrates at all levels of football. Opting to adapt this tactic does not necessarily mean that the team is poor e.g. Arsenal last night.

I think that modern football produces less of the unexpected and less entertainment than it often did in the past because in essence teams and players these days are hugely more professional in their approach and this equates with a lot of supporters as being not as good as it was in the past but I'm pretty sure that if you could play matches between L1 teams now and even L1 teams of 10 years ago the current ones would win the vast majority of the games.

10 years ago 2005/ 06 weren't we getting promoted to the premier league on 90 points .

UTB

 

[PeteBlade]

I haven't seen one poster on here that thinks Burton will finish above us mate.

They won't finish above us, just to clarify my view on it.

We will more than likely finish atleast 20 points clear of them just with the resources we have over them, that is of course if we put those resources to good use.

I've no idea what you've seen to suggest we'll finish 20 points ahead of them

 

[blade too long]

You can't quote a fact to suit your argument then slag someone else when they quote a fact to suit theirs.
Last night was better but certainly not outstanding. Plenty of room for improvement but as you say 1 defeat in 8. Roll on Saturday and let's make it maximum points from these two home games

wasnt about last night it was about its getting better
player coming in, clean sheet , 3 goal win players returning from injury
things are looking up

 

[wizadry]

On the subject of stats, Oldham have only lost 3 out of the first 14 matches and find themselves in 17th place, just goes to show that stats can be made to look very misleading indeed. Discuss them by all means but they really can mean fuck all when it comes to the next game.

 

[blade too long]

10 years ago 2005/ 06 weren't we getting promoted to the premier league on 90 points .

UTB

116 years ago we were winning the league , hey ho
35 years ago we were in division 4

times change

 

[wizadry]

I've no idea what you've seen to suggest we'll finish 20 points ahead of them

Resources should mean you have a distinct advantage over a side with Burtons' credentials, now we haven't put this to good use over the previous years but i think we have a manager in place to change all this by the seasons end, just my view Pete and don't get me wrong, it certainly isn't concrete evidence.

 

[longinthe toothblade]

As Bergen points out there are very good reasons for these slow starts - and it's nothing to do with lack of effort, which seemed to be the consensus amongst a group of fans at Oldham.

As Adkins finds out more about the players and their capabilities he will need to experiment less, know what works, and go with that from the outset.

Also as the team become increasingly familiar with what's expected of them, individually and collectively, performances will become of a more even, and higher, standard.

All of this points to a gradual and hopefully significant improvement in results.

Well I suppose that's yours (and Bergens?) view.

A lot of words but for me, you ain't getting anywhere fast - a bit like our walking football from the back which (again) characterised the first 45 mins for me. I don't miss many games (I haven't for a number of years now since I stopped playing Saturdays myself) and for me football is a simple game which is all too often made overly complicated.

We start poorly, often, and (IMO) it's not down to experimentation and/or team members 'unfamiliar' with their roles. Home games aside (which I presume you attend) I'm sure you've said previously that you were at Burton, Vale and Oldham (three of the most recent away games). Where was the experimentation there? I'm struggling to see what was fundamentally different from one game to another? A few changes here and there yep, some adjustments in set up, etc, but where's this experimentation that amazingly, only ever impacts on the first 45 minutes?

Just for the record and looking at what I posted (here and elsewhere), I've never ever said it's down to any lack of effort either?







I

 

[William Henry Foulkes]

Well I suppose that's yours (and Bergens?) view.

A lot of words but for me, you ain't getting anywhere fast - a bit like our walking football from the back which (again) characterised the first 45 mins for me. I don't miss many games (I haven't for a number of years now since I stopped playing Saturdays myself) and for me football is a simple game which is all too often made overly complicated.

We start poorly, often, and (IMO) it's not down to experimentation and/or team members 'unfamiliar' with their roles. Home games aside (which I presume you attend) I'm sure you've said previously that you were at Burton, Vale and Oldham (three of the most recent away games). Where was the experimentation there? I'm struggling to see what was fundamentally different from one game to another? A few changes here and there yep, some adjustments in set up, etc, but where's this experimentation that amazingly, only ever impacts on the first 45 minutes?

Just for the record and looking at what I posted (here and elsewhere), I've never ever said it's down to any lack of effort either?
I

If you refuse to read Bergen's analysis there's not much I can do about that. However it is by a country mile the best and clearest explanation of what actually went wrong.

It's pretty clear and to be expected that we are still experimenting, though gradually as manager and players familiarise themselves with each other, their roles will become clearer and they will be able to play at a higher level for a longer period including hopefully one day from the first whistle.

I've said this a number of times now and, for me, it seems obvious and true, nevertheless it doesn't seem to be gaining any traction in this thread so I'll leave it at that.

Fwiw the point about lack of effort was not aimed in your direction it was a thread after the game.

Also since it seems to be an issue I've been to every League game apart from Burton. Though I don't see it as at all relevant: it doesn't make my views on this any more or less valid - Bergen's not even in the country and he knows more about the games than anyone apart from Positive Nigel.

UTMB