Martin Samuel Pt. 487

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The bloke seems a trifle obsessed...he'll probably have the GCB song etched on his tomb whilst scrawled beneath in crayon, a diatribe as to how it's a rallying call against jellied eels and the Queen Mother...
 

The 'Journalist' said:
West Ham, remember, contrived to lose a case that hinged on Sheffield United being able to prove they were not responsible for their own league position.
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Don't see how he can draw any comparison between the 2 cases. In the case of Carroll they are trying to use the law to overturn a refereeing decision - no precedent for this that I can think of.
We all know the ins and outs of the other case...
My suggestion to Mr. Samuel is that he uses his journalistic super-powers to track down where the transfer fees for Tevez & Mascherano went. My bet would be nowhere near WH's bank account....
 
I just wasted 10 mins of my life actually reading the article. It is just a senseless babble of unrelated garbage cobbled together to try and demonstrate a silly point. The point being that clubs don't want to get relegated from the Prem (huge revelation there you fat knob-head). Made worse (in his opinion) by the football league wanting clubs to play fair with finances. It just beggers belief really that this man is allowed to be a journalist. Yes of course you thick fat arsewipe the football league should adopt an "unfair financial policy" to stop West Ham thinking about going to court to protect their position in the Premier League. Or maybe just a thought by the way, the Premier league could look at it self and try and get some sensible financial policies in place to try to help the whole game instead of its self. But no according to our rotund friend its the football league that's at fault for trying to get its house in order. Well it would be to him, if it means that the Cheats contemplated something that he has previously criticised but taking it to ridiculous new levels, wouldn't it.
I detest the Daily Mail but just wanted to see what he thought about the Cheats looking at using the courts, he had to bring the Blades into it (its bound to be our fault that the Cheats nearly went to the courts over an on field football decision). That is the last time I will look at his column I wished I hadn't this time.
 
grafikhaus said:
Once again our favourite fat idiot is at it again. Today, he writes an article which on the face of it, has some merit. He's discussing the loan system and in particular teams like Chelsea who can afford to loan out star players such as Lukaku who, despite being barred from playing against their host club, are free to inflict damage on Chelsea's rivals.

So far, so reasonable. But then he reverts to type, going back seven years with:

At the same time it was revealed that Sheffield United had a good thing going with Watford over Steve Kabba.

The match between the clubs at Bramall Lane, in which the loaned Kabba did not play for Watford, was one of only two in the final 11 that Sheffield United won.

Had the Premier League wished to conduct a proper investigation into those deals, the season might have ended in even greater chaos (it was also the year of Carlos Tevez at West Ham United), but instead they brushed the incidents under the carpet and introduced regulation that was intended to prevent this happening again.

So he's basically comparing the isolated 'Kabba incident' with West Ham's serial cheating with Tevez.

What a cunt. :fattwat:
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Kabba didn't play against us because he was injured, and I don't think he played for Watford again for the rest of the season.
 
super_pig said:
good point actually.. when he was on the Times i wrote a complaint about his 'biased journalism based upon a personal agenda that didn't' do justice to such a great newspaper'.. next thing you know he's a the Mail
just ignore him
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I agree super pig, but would you be kind enough to send a similar letter to the Daily Wail?
 
BerksBlade said:
My suggestion to Mr. Samuel is that he uses his journalistic super-powers to track down where the transfer fees for Tevez & Mascherano went. My bet would be nowhere near WH's bank account....
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Quite.

WHU had asserted their full and controlling rights over Tevez, at the time thought to be worth £30m.

And yet they let him leave for £2m.

That seems like a monumentally stupid decision, if you are in full control. If you aren`t in full control it seems that you may have been using him incorrectly in those last 3 games.

But of course the PL didn`t care about that...
 
Ah well, just to prove that not everybody has got it in for his beloved Spammers, they've just agreed the sale (around £70m) of Upton Park. This cosy deal, riding roughshod over Orient's interests and a clear 'get out of jail' card for 'Lord' (Legacy) Coe to shift one of his Olympic white elephants, will give Spam a huge financial leg-up over other struggling teams in the PL.

'The Galliard Group plans to build new homes on the site as well as retail and leisure facilities with underground parking which would be completed by 2018. The group has also been in talks with the family of the former Bobby Moore about the possibility of placing a landscaped garden named in the West Ham and England captain's honour at the centre of the site.'

Aah! Sweet!

'There are also plans for a statue of Moore and further artwork to commemorate the history of West Ham.' Link.

And what 'history' will they commemorate? 'Mascherano Mansions? Tevev Towers? Or, to be in touch with their real heritage, 'The Alf Garnett Memorial Gardens', 'The Alfie Moon Shopping Centre' and the 'Bradley Walsh Kebab Shop.'
 
grafikhaus said:
Ah well, just to prove that not everybody has got it in for his beloved Spammers, they've just agreed the sale (around £70m) of Upton Park. This cosy deal, riding roughshod over Orient's interests and a clear 'get out of jail' card for 'Lord' (Legacy) Coe to shift one of his Olympic white elephants, will give Spam a huge financial leg-up over other struggling teams in the PL.

'The Galliard Group plans to build new homes on the site as well as retail and leisure facilities with underground parking which would be completed by 2018. The group has also been in talks with the family of the former Bobby Moore about the possibility of placing a landscaped garden named in the West Ham and England captain's honour at the centre of the site.'

Aah! Sweet!

'There are also plans for a statue of Moore and further artwork to commemorate the history of West Ham.' Link.

And what 'history' will they commemorate? 'Mascherano Mansions? Tevev Towers? Or, to be in touch with their real heritage, 'The Alf Garnett Memorial Gardens', 'The Alfie Moon Shopping Centre' and the 'Bradley Walsh Kebab Shop.'
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Good point Grafik - I wonder how West Ham will explain how they did not accept the highest bid for the Upton Park site - they accepted a £20 million bid from "a local developer, Galliard Group", as they will develop the site "more sympathetically".

My arse.
 
blade too long said:
getting 70 million , might finally pay us up then
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Don't know if you missed it BTL - we got £25m* out of them six years ago. That we've pissed it up the wall in the intervening years is another matter...

*I know it was reported as £18.1m but that was the present value of the future cashflows at the time. The settlement was £25m.

**This doesn't change the fact that West Ham United represents the worst of football and should, if there's any justice, get relegated this season.
 

itsinyerblood said:
blade too long, I knew I'd seen that article before, thanks for refreshing my memory.

As it's about 18 months old, what's happened since then? Has the balance been paid to SUFC, or are we still waiting for the £10million?
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I believe - whatever they owe *us* we borrowed against it from santander, so SUFC have *spent* the money, the balance, if there is any, is owed to McCabe to pay back santander.
 
I think that in the accounts to 30 June 2013, there was still a bank loan balance in creditors, however the notes said that this would be/was cleared by a post balance sheet date event i.e. the final tranche of monies from West Ham. So pretty sure that it is all paid up. Typing this from memory as I don't have a copy of the accounts to hand, but pretty sure what I am saying is correct.

So borrowed against it, spent it (doing nothing to improve that status of the club) and received it (paying off the borrowings). A sad state of affairs.
 
blade too long this is how it worked: (itsinyerblood this might be of interest to you too?)

March 2009
West Ham and United agree £25m settlement. West Ham will pay this in 4 instalments, starting summer 2008
United recognise the income in the accounts (as £18.1m; the present value of future cash flows*)
United borrow £20m-ish from Santander, with repayments equal to the West Ham debt schedule.

July 2010
West Ham pay United the first £6.25m.
United pay £6.25m back to Santander

July 2011
West Ham pay United the second £6.25m
United pay £6.25m to Santander

July 2012
West Ham pay United the third £6.25m
United pay £6.25m to Santander

July 2013
West Ham pay United the final £6.25m
United clear the Santander debt.

There seems to be a mistaken belief that the West Ham money will save us. It's already been spent, as puppet says.

*this is based on the belief that £1 today is worth more than £1 in the future. Based on inflation of 5%, if you buy something today for £1 you'll need £1.05 to buy that same item in a year's time. Therefore, £1 in a year's time is only worth 95.2p today. Businesses don't use the rate of inflation, they use the cost of capital. United use a punitive rate because the business is risky - as far as I can work out, the cost of capital employed by United for investment calculations is 15% (so £1 next year is worth £0.870 today).
 
And if you want to know what Sheffield United spent the money from West Ham on?
We built an hotel with it and then sold it Kevin McCabe for £1.

SUFC 2010 Annual Report:-
"£13.5 million (2009: £13.5 million) of the loans due in one year relate to a development overdraft facility used to
finance the construction of the hotel next to the stadium."

On 9 November Sheffield United Football Club Limited raised a £15.5m loan from Santander, secured on the future
receipts from West Ham United in respect of the Tevez case. This debt will be repaid as the Tevez money is received
over the next 3 years.

£4m of this debt has been used to repay part of the Hotel debt, reducing the net liabilities in that company. Following this repayment Sheffield United (Hotel) Limited was sold to Scarborough Partnership Limited for a consideration of £1. Scarborough Partnership Limited have assumed responsibility for the remaining Hotel debt."
 
My memory was sketvhily correct then - i had no bloody idea it was used to build the hotel which we now don't own. Utter pisstake.
 
Sothall_Blade said:
And if you want to know what Sheffield United spent the money from West Ham on?
We built an hotel with it and then sold it Kevin McCabe for £1.

SUFC 2010 Annual Report:-
"£13.5 million (2009: £13.5 million) of the loans due in one year relate to a development overdraft facility used to
finance the construction of the hotel next to the stadium."

£4m of [the Santander] debt has been used to repay part of the Hotel debt, reducing the net liabilities in that company. Following this repayment Sheffield United (Hotel) Limited was sold to Scarborough Partnership Limited for a consideration of £1. Scarborough Partnership Limited have assumed responsibility for the remaining Hotel debt."
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Not quite: only £4m of the Tévez settlement was spent on the hotel; the remaining £9.5m debt was taken on by McCabe (in effect, Scarborough bought the hotel for £9,500,001 but unfortunately we had an overdraft which ate £9,500,000 of that).

The rest went on paying off Robson, Blackwell and Adams as well as buying and paying Beattie, Naysmith, Nosworthy, Ehiogu, Hendrie, Henderson, Evans and all the other shit we have bought over the past 5 years.

Here's some conservative estimates:
Robson: £1.5m pay off
Blackwell: £1m pay off
Adams: £500k pay off
Beattie (£1m net transfer fee, £3m wages) £4m
Nosworthy (£1m loan fees, £3m wages) £4m
Ehiogu (£1m wages) £1m
Hendrie (£2m wages) £2m
Henderson (£2m transfer fee, £2m wages) £4m
Evans (£2m transfer fee, £3m wages) £5m
Naysmith (£1m transfer fee, £2m wages) £3m

That little lot cost us £25m. Imagine where we could have been if we'd bought decent players and moulded them into a team?!
 
Balham Blade said:
Not quite: only £4m of the Tévez settlement was spent on the hotel; the remaining £9.5m debt was taken on by McCabe (in effect, Scarborough bought the hotel for £9,500,001 but unfortunately we had an overdraft which ate £9,500,000 of that).

The rest went on paying off Robson, Blackwell and Adams as well as buying and paying Beattie, Naysmith, Nosworthy, Ehiogu, Hendrie, Henderson, Evans and all the other shit we have bought over the past 5 years.

Here's some conservative estimates:
Robson: £1.5m pay off
Blackwell: £1m pay off
Adams: £500k pay off
Beattie (£1m net transfer fee, £3m wages) £4m
Nosworthy (£1m loan fees, £3m wages) £4m
Ehiogu (£1m wages) £1m
Hendrie (£2m wages) £2m
Henderson (£2m transfer fee, £2m wages) £4m
Evans (£2m transfer fee, £3m wages) £5m
Naysmith (£1m transfer fee, £2m wages) £3m

That little lot cost us £25m. Imagine where we could have been if we'd bought decent players and moulded them into a team?!
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I am not disputing your general point, but I can't see us paying £1m loan fees for Nosworthy. We could have got him permanently for less than that. Ditto with his wages. He was with us (in his two spells) about a year in total in 2010-11. £3m wages would be £57,000 a week. I think not.
 
Darren said:
I am not disputing your general point, but I can't see us paying £1m loan fees for Nosworthy. We could have got him permanently for less than that. Ditto with his wages. He was with us (in his two spells) about a year in total in 2010-11. £3m wages would be £57,000 a week. I think not.
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OK, I was rushing this through in a slight lull at work. Nosworthy was with us for a season and a half and working on £30k per week (not unreasonable given his cult status at Premiership Sunderland), we're looking at £2m of wages. Maybe the loan fee was out but that was still probably in the region of £500k so the overall figure is not going to be massively out.
 
Balham Blade said:
OK, I was rushing this through in a slight lull at work. Nosworthy was with us for a season and a half and working on £30k per week (not unreasonable given his cult status at Premiership Sunderland), we're looking at £2m of wages. Maybe the loan fee was out but that was still probably in the region of £500k so the overall figure is not going to be massively out.
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He was with us Jan-May 2010 and August 2010-April 2011, so about 12 months in total. We wouldn't have had to pay him in the 2010 close season.

I can't see us paying hi anything like £30K in 2010 when we were cutting costs. I would say we were paying £10K a week max with Sunderland making up the difference.
 
Although this thread was about an Obese fuckwit, it seems to me that the financial argument has taken over. The truth is such that no-one, outside of the board, actually knows the true state of the financial situation. This is an excellent state of affairs for the board. They can plead poverty whenever they want to, agents etc. or they could splash out if it was deemed necessary. We all watch the club closely and don't know the truth so what chance have negotiating agents got who deal with multiple clubs. Other than saying we have a rich Prince what over bargaining chip can agents utilise. And since the Prince is in for profit as Jim Phipps has clearly stated then there is no bargaining tool there either. There is not going to be a Leeds - Seth Johnson situation. I don't think we will ever truly know the financial situation at the club for a long time.
 

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