Steve Cooper

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I suspect any forward thinking new investors would go with a technical director structure. Wilder would have to accept that his job is to coach the players that are bought for him. That way they could give any manager (coach) a role of the dice as long as they can afford to pay up their contract if they want to get shut.

For a club without unlimited funds the DOF model just makes more sense as it's easier to change 1 person (manager) rather than constantly buying new players to suit a particular manager.
 



Slim Man said:
By the damn law of averages, we have to. At least we've now scored at Wembley (thanks Baxter, thanks Scougall) so that sets us up nicely for our next attempt in a play off final...
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9/9 means we are done for mate never going to happen.
 
Torrix1889 said:
It's a yes from me every day of the week and twice on a Sunday for Cooper over Wilder.

And stop with the cruel comments about his looks, not necessary.
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His looks are on thing 🤣.

But managerial wise he’s a poor mans Wilder.

I don’t want to change the manager that’s for sure.

However if we are we need someone far superior.
 
I wouldn't mind Cooper and he's probably more suited for the modern game than Wilder. But isn't it a bit odd to more or less openly make pitches to other managers when your current manager is still here? I wouldn't be happy about it if I was Wilder.
 
Deadbat said:
I think Cooper is a decent manager whose stock is still high. Reckon he may still get a Prem job.

Probably BS but as others have said, things get leaked for a reason. If I am sat here now asking who I would rather have as manager it would be Cooper everytime over Wilder at the current time - 5 years ago I would have laughed at myself for typing that but sadly Wilder showed me absolutely nothing in terms of style. tactics, organisation, signings and more that that - motivation (one of his so called skills) that he can get us moving. I hope I am wrong but everyone so convinvced Wilder is the man to turn it around are basing it on what he did a long time ago. If he was anyone else but Wilder with his past/links, people would have asked him to have been removed end of the season or before. Anyone saying different is kididng themselves.

If and a big if we get took over, Wilder will not be here long I do not expect. He only came back because of Abdullah and his tiny black book of managers. Noone else would have touched him after his recent failures x 3.

Those that suggest he would get till Xmas I would be surprised - in fact I would say if we got took over, I would expect wholesale changes. This what makes the whole plan under Abdullah ridiculous - Wilder in, him running everything and brining in his old boys network of Allen and Hoyland.

A takeover and you would expect many of above to be moved on quite quickly would you not?

What we need is a proper structure (whether it;'s this chap being rumoured to be the technical director bloke or someone akin to that - that can oversee a proper plan) and not just who Wilder (or anyone else) knows from before.

I would love Wilder to get us moving in the right direction but the takeover (the big if as I say) would probably be the writing on the wall for him as manager here and maybe his career (at the top level).
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The issue in play here may be that there is a break clause in CW's contract as alluded to by PA. If so a decision will have to be made before 30 June. Any prospective owner would take that into account when formulating plans. Considering options available such as Cooper would be part of that bearing in mind a new regime is more likely to favour a Head Coach role.

It doesn't matter who the Football Team Manager is if the archaic structure currently have in place is retained. A Sporting Director overseeing recruitment strategy, contracts negotiation, player in and outs is a bare minimum. As is a Technical Director to overhaul medical facilities, post injury recovery fitness and conditioning and sports science.

New ownership has to upgrade medical facilities immediately rather than wait for any new training complex to be built some 2 to 3 years down the road. That may mean resurrecting the 2020 Shirecliffe plans. If there is a genuine desire to try to get back to the EPL then a continuation of long injury lists will de rail that aspiration.

PA has climbed into a Tardis and gone back to 2019 allowing CW to manage recruitment after the failings of the United World model. If there is to be a continuation of this under the new owner where UW are still paid fees for their services then theres no point in changing manager. I would question their credibility and competence if this was to ensue.

Is Cooper a better option than CW? Who knows their track records are similar but Cooper is certainly more compliant as espoused by the mad Greek owner buying and selling players over his head at Florist.

If there is money available to effect cultural change at SUFC then I would prefer us to look overseas for a new coach. Alexander Blessin someone we have courted in the past has just missed out on the Belgian title by 1 point with Union SG. USG are co owned by Brighton. Whether we could entice the likes of Blessin remains to be seen but it would be a statement of intent.

As they say money talks and until we have clarity on who, when and what they have in their pockets we can only speculate.
 
Sheffsteel said:
I'm pro Wilder but that's a fair comment.
Wilder is like Warnock, give him nothing (basic players) and he's shown he's pretty good.
However give them both money to buy higher skilled tried and tested players and both aren't as good.

For me it's more about principle. Even if I don't rate or didn't even like a manager I'd at least give them a chance to prove themselves.
Also it's good from a strategic morale point of view. Imagine bringing in a top name manager and instantly struggling.
The comments on here would be horrendous and even after spending loads of money the new owners would be on an instant loser
facing heavy criticism and insults from many of our fans on here.
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We should have sacked Warnock for keeping us up, or kept him for relegating us….

Pep couldn’t do owt with our lot from last season, he wouldn’t be able to understand why we can’t play one touch in our own box

Your right, some managers are good at getting a tune, just not tactically savvy at the top level

Farke is a proven, Edward’s at Luton I think will be the same, maybe even Potter
See how McKenna & Martin do next season
 
Posted this in another thread around Mid October last year, but thought I'd dig it up and add Cooper to the mix. I've not updated all names - CBA'd - just the pertinent 3 + a comparison. Look at Kompany's numbers!

Looking at Career Loss % as opposed to Win % shows some unexpected highs and lows. Not exhaustive data but an interesting snapshot

1717155068075.png
 
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It could of course be that the reason we have evidently courted Cooper is that Wilder doesn't like whatever is going on behind the scenes and has suggested he may not wish to continue......
 
Thrice said:
. But isn't it a bit odd to more or less openly make pitches to other managers when your current manager is still here? I wouldn't be happy about it if I was Wilder.
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it should be, but it isn’t sadly

Ten Haag, Potch, Tuchel, cooper himself

given Chris’s 2021/22 exit strategy of throwing the players and his employers under the bus before trousering a nice sum of moneh from this ‘football club’ - Can’t help but see a tinge of irony in this
 
St Annington said:
I suspect any forward thinking new investors would go with a technical director structure. Wilder would have to accept that his job is to coach the players that are bought for him. That way they could give any manager (coach) a role of the dice as long as they can afford to pay up their contract if they want to get shut.

For a club without unlimited funds the DOF model just makes more sense as it's easier to change 1 person (manager) rather than constantly buying new players to suit a particular manager.
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As much as I don't really like this in a traditional sense, it's totally true these days due to the crazy fees and wages for players.
 



I Like Steve Cooper, excellent work at Forest, won the U17 World Cup, where Rhian Brewster received the Golden Ball. Wilder appreciates Cooper too, as it was mentioned he was recommended to be his successor, so it wouldn't be the worst idea.

I think making a change is a bad idea. I could be wrong as no one knows what the future holds, but he deserves at least until Christmas. Wilder seems highly motivated to redeem himself for the 2020/21 & 2024, as this job is personal to him. At the moment, that's all you can ask of him, although it's a fine line to walk.
 
Dkc said:
Wilder's only in his 50s so I wouldn't call him 'yesterday's man'. He isn't a 'pisshead' either as someone else said. He's a competant manager with an excellent record of success and he knows and loves the club. I'd be very happy for him to be in charge next season - more so than if we sacked him and brought in Cooper or anyone else.
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Yesterday’s man unfortunately. The game moves on
 
Thrice said:
I wouldn't mind Cooper and he's probably more suited for the modern game than Wilder. But isn't it a bit odd to more or less openly make pitches to other managers when your current manager is still here? I wouldn't be happy about it if I was Wilder.
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Errm, that's exactly what we did to Hecky with Wilder!
 
Thrice said:
I wouldn't mind Cooper and he's probably more suited for the modern game than Wilder. But isn't it a bit odd to more or less openly make pitches to other managers when your current manager is still here? I wouldn't be happy about it if I was Wilder.
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It might not have come from the club directly. Most likely someone like Des Taylor/someone closely connected with the proposed takeover.
 
sheff_blade90 said:
I Like Steve Cooper, excellent work at Forest, won the U17 World Cup, where Rhian Brewster received the Golden Ball. Wilder appreciates Cooper too, as it was mentioned he was recommended to be his successor, so it wouldn't be the worst idea.

I think making a change is a bad idea. I could be wrong as no one knows what the future holds, but he deserves at least until Christmas. Wilder seems highly motivated to redeem himself for the 2020/21 & 2024, as this job is personal to him. At the moment, that's all you can ask of him, although it's a fine line to walk.
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Cooper is an excellent manager, good character, conducts himself with class. Promotion on his CV under very testing ownership.

Mind you, you could write that about Heckingbottom.

(I think Cooper is levels above PH to be fair and anyone thinking we should 'do better' is living in cloud cuckoo land)
 
Dkc said:
Pep or Klopp would have struggled to keep us up if they'd inherited that squad. We need to see how we get on this coming season.

Wasn't it Benjamin Bloom who did / cited research showing that managerial stability is key to getting promotion from the Championship? Clubs that sack their manager every season tend not to finish in the top two.

If we're in contention next season I'd stick with CW even if we don't go up. He isn't perfect, but I can think of no-one better if we want some stability.
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Yeah I do agree with you and like I say, next season with Wilder is fine by me but if we could get a fresh face in with some potential new ideas or ways to run things I would prefer that. The chances of Cooper coming in are slim to none as far as I'm concerned so I'm gearing up for a Wilder season, besides if he has the chance to build his own squad we may be in a good position

HOWEVER despite their feelings about him whether good or bad, I think it would really bother alot of Forest fans if Cooper ended up at the Lane. So, worth it.
 
I really hope this isn't true because I feel Wilder should stay given how tough a job it was last season. It looks ominous though with this story from the mail and before that when the Osborn decision from Wilder appeared to be overturned but then we don't know what's going on at the moment.
 
If I was choosing somebody to manage my club right this moment I’d go for Cooper over Wilder but realistically I don’t think Cooper has better pedigree as some are saying.

Cooper kept Forest up, Wilder kept us up and took us to 9th place.

They both left second season, we were considerably worse than Forest but they had much more to spend.

Wilder squandered a lot of money for us, other than MGW did Cooper really get much better value for money from the players he brought in at Forest?
 
I'm not sure i get this "Wilder is yesterdays man, and the game has moved on" He totally understands the game and more importantly he understands his players and the dressing room and what's needed - the problem is will he get what is needed ?

A lot of managers get the sack for not being able to get a team to play when it's actually somebody else that's chosen the players.
Look at Poch? at Spurs, doing a steady job of rebuilding only to be sacked for not getting a disfunctional team to win trophy's
does that make him a bad manager? or does it make the people above him bad managers I know what I think.

Just as an aside there is two Utube podcasts "The overlap (yes, ok, it's Gary Neville!) interviewing Wayne Rooney, yes he looks like a bag of do dah, but he interviews really well, His house is something else! he's very funny with his stories, and has a serious side but also comes across as knowing his "football" (which I didn't expect), talks well, when asked what was the first thing he looked at when moving into a club he said "Leaders, where are the leaders ? you need them, allude to Man' Ure lacking leaders.
Anyway, both worth a listen, I actually thought more of him after listening.
I'll wait for the keyboard warriors to tell me how he cheats on his wife etc!!
 
Eric_Brooks said:
Yesterday’s man unfortunately. The game moves on
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Can you explain what you mean? Wilder's shown that he can adapt his tactics and team sheets to the teams we're up against. He's taught innovative set-plays. He's excellent at getting the best out of players. Unfortunately last season we didn't have the squad to compete, but apart from that and 2/3 of the covid season he's always been successful - not only with us, also with the other clubs he's managed.
 
HeCanDoMagic said:
Do you get the feeling that if/when the takeover gets done that its wholesale changes top to bottom?
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They'll be huge change. Bettis, Wilder and his backroom staff will be out and obviously significant change at boardroom level. Will probably be a more modern and complex structure on the footballing side of things, rather than the Wilder-style fiefdom we have currently.
I don't think they'll take a wrecking ball to the Academy personnel, changes here would be more incremental. But this is just me speculating.
 



BalticBlade said:
They'll be huge change. Bettis, Wilder and his backroom staff will be out and obviously significant change at boardroom level. Will probably be a more modern and complex structure on the footballing side of things, rather than the Wilder-style fiefdom we have currently.
I don't think they'll take a wrecking ball to the Academy personnel, changes here would be more incremental. But this is just me speculating.
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Change is inevitable, except from a vending machine.
 
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