He's only 17

[Worksop II]

Making comments that will knock the lad's confidence is not.

One lesson George will have learnt this weekend, dont read fan message boards ......

 

[Muttley]

Sometimes I despair of some of our supporters. It's not surprising all confidence gets kicked out of players.

My advice,

GET OFF PLAYERS BACKS AND GIVE THEM SUPPORT!!!!!

 

[alcoblade]

Sometimes I despair of some of our supporters. It's not surprising all confidence gets kicked out of players.

My advice,

GET OFF PLAYERS BACKS AND GIVE THEM SUPPORT!!!!!

It's worth a reminder that these discussion boards are for us to discuss what we see. There's a world of difference between questioning a players ability on here and getting on their backs at the game. I've never once booed Evans, though I think he's shite.

I find it strange that some would want to write off a yong player so easily. But it's just an opinion. I can't see how an internet discussion, positive or negtive, affects the players form.

UTB

 

[Micalijo]

Mica, the lad is our only alternative to an experienced keeper in poor form.

Long isnt a bad keeper, he is simply too young and consequently not good enough yet.

Perfectly reasonable account of things and you cant seem to see it.

I've watched the lad a few times before and he is talented but still has a lot to learn.

Whether he is good bad or indifferent it doesnt take away the fact that we defend poorly.

If your fellow Blades loved mediocrity there would be little to discuss on here.

We would also have a full house at the lane every week.

Fair comments - totally understand where you are coming from but I asked why would any other league club or serious non-league outfit want a petrified 17 year old kid.

---------- Post added at 07:22 PM ---------- Previous post was at 07:20 PM ----------

Get a grip , he is fucking 17 ,he didn't ask to be thrown in yet ,he didn't have a good game but he wasn't helped and none of the goals were 100% his fault. What about getting behind young lads at the club who we are trying to nurture for the future ,Naughton didn't play very well at first should we have dropped him from the books. For years one of the sticks you and your ilk have used to beat Utd up with is the lack of players coming through the youth system ,as soon as we try some you virtually try and start a hate campaign against him.
I know you and your other mate are serial attention seekers but do it at someone elses expense and try and back Sheff Utd instead of continually slagging off everything and everyone at our club.

Utterly ridiculous Sitwell - grow up pal, you're as bad as me!

I've said on many occassions I am enjoying watching the Blades again.

 

[Deadbat]

Long debate

I think one of the main gripes I have and I hate saying it but so many on here seem convinced Long will be a good keeper and that they have seen real promise.

Despite dips in form likes of Maguire and also Lowton have shown bits and pieces to suggest they can be at least respectable footballers even if is only this level (although recent form suggests they are not even there yet!)

Sadly I have not seen much from Long to suggest he wil make a good keeper. He does not command, gets in poor positions and is generally indecisive. How many who went yesterday had their heart in the mouth every time it went near the goal? Ditto for Simonsen in recent weeks.

Long has conceded 9 goals in 3 league games and in all the games I have seen at first team and academy level he has not really impressed (saw quite a few games at Shirecliffe over last few years). Has anyone seriously seen him play at reserve / academy level and genuineyll thinks he will be a godo goalkeeper. I know he is 17 and I know he is way off 1st team level but regardless of that I have not seen anything to suggest he will make it (at least yet).

I feel for the lad he has been thrown into a terrible position and should be even be a regular at rserve level yet but it is ludicrous he has been put in such a good position. Maybe he might make it and I have missed some real promise but whatever happens his confidence is going to be shot if they play him anymore; 5 goals at Swansea, 4 at home yesterday; we could destroy him if we carry on.

 

[BladeFisher]

Isn't it 10 in 3 (MK Dons 2-1)?

 

[GAZBLADE]

I wonder who we could get in on-loan?? If we're looking at a Premier League or a Championship keeper then, you would have to assume that they haven't played much football for a while, so, would it be really fair to put them behind our incredibly sluggish back four??

---------- Post added at 08:16 PM ---------- Previous post was at 08:14 PM ----------

What's Alan Kelly doing?? I'm sure he'd fancy a run-out in our team at the moment!!!!

 

[stannyblade]

to be fair just getting a keeper in wont solve it. We need a leader at centre half. Although it will help

 

[GAZBLADE]

to be fair just getting a keeper in wont solve it. We need a leader at centre half. Although it will help

That's a fair point. I've always respected how good Paddy Kenny and Chris Morgan are, but, i could never have imagined how much our back four has deteriorated since we sold Kenny and Morgs got badly injured. At least we've got Morgan to come back. Oh for a Paddy Kenny right now!!

 

[DuncDisorderly]

... 5 goals at Swansea, 4 at home yesterday...

Four at Swansea...

Keepers mature a lot later than outfield players, and 17 is a bit early to be expecting him to put in big performances. If there is a problem with e.g. his starting positions at corners, or marshalling his defence then these can be coached into the lad (back to the same question about coaching...). He really needs to go back to the more usual progression of reserve games and loans to (even) lower leagues. Maybe he won't make it, maybe he will, but some of the criticism of a young lad chucked in the deep end in difficult circumstances has been a bit aggressive...

PS. On the earlier point of Simmo and whether as a mature and experienced keeper he should still need coaching...yes of course he does. Van der Sar had a coach, Messi has a coach, Federer has a coach, Rory McIlroy has a coach. Having talent and experience is one thing, applying it properly is another...

 

[Ollessendro]

Get a grip , he is fucking 17 ,he didn't ask to be thrown in yet ,he didn't have a good game but he wasn't helped and none of the goals were 100% his fault. What about getting behind young lads at the club who we are trying to nurture for the future ,Naughton didn't play very well at first should we have dropped him from the books. For years one of the sticks you and your ilk have used to beat Utd up with is the lack of players coming through the youth system ,as soon as we try some you virtually try and start a hate campaign against him.
I know you and your other mate are serial attention seekers but do it at someone elses expense and try and back Sheff Utd instead of continually slagging off everything and everyone at our club.

Were you at the game? I cannot believe anyone who was there would argue anything other than he had a mare. This is a forum matey. People post opinions. My opinion is Long is a poor keeper and on yesterday's evidence I am right. As DB points out below, 3 games and 10 goals conceded. If you don't like hearing people's opinions then why not try going to North Korean on hols for a few weeks?

I think one of the main gripes I have and I hate saying it but so many on here seem convinced Long will be a good keeper and that they have seen real promise.

Despite dips in form likes of Maguire and also Lowton have shown bits and pieces to suggest they can be at least respectable footballers even if is only this level (although recent form suggests they are not even there yet!)

Sadly I have not seen much from Long to suggest he wil make a good keeper. He does not command, gets in poor positions and is generally indecisive. How many who went yesterday had their heart in the mouth every time it went near the goal? Ditto for Simonsen in recent weeks.

Long has conceded 9 goals in 3 league games and in all the games I have seen at first team and academy level he has not really impressed (saw quite a few games at Shirecliffe over last few years). Has anyone seriously seen him play at reserve / academy level and genuineyll thinks he will be a godo goalkeeper. I know he is 17 and I know he is way off 1st team level but regardless of that I have not seen anything to suggest he will make it (at least yet).

I feel for the lad he has been thrown into a terrible position and should be even be a regular at rserve level yet but it is ludicrous he has been put in such a good position. Maybe he might make it and I have missed some real promise but whatever happens his confidence is going to be shot if they play him anymore; 5 goals at Swansea, 4 at home yesterday; we could destroy him if we carry on.

Talking sense as usual DB. The flaws I saw yesterday (positioning, poor judgement, indecisiveness and lack of confidence) are pretty big ones and it makes me doubt he can ever be a good keeper.

 

[GAZBLADE]

Were you at the game? I cannot believe anyone who was there would argue anything other than he had a mare. This is a forum matey. People post opinions. My opinion is Long is a poor keeper and on yesterday's evidence I am right. As DB points out below, 3 games and 10 goals conceded. If you don't like hearing people's opinions then why not try going to North Korean on hols for a few weeks?



Talking sense as usual DB. The flaws I saw yesterday (positioning, poor judgement, indecisiveness and lack of confidence) are pretty big ones and it makes me doubt he can ever be a good keeper.

I agree Olle.
I played pro reserve level and still play semi-pro, but, watching Long's positioning yesterday was pretty shocking.
I'd get crucified if i let at least two of those goals in.
Yes, i know he's only 17, but WTF are we doing as a club putting the weight of our core problems on his shoulders.

 

[BornOnShorehamStreet]

If we can't get a loanee I'd stick 'em both in the net.......

 

[Bergen Blade]

GoalkeeperWatch

Just back from a week in Tenerife, so only just had a look at the highlights. Reading the views on here, I got the impression Long gifted Exeter four goals. Judging by the highlights that's far too harsh.

1st goal: In these situations there is a golden rule for goalkeepers saying "If a defender and attacker challenge for the ball - don't get involved". Furthermore, a defender who is facing his own goal with an attacker aggressively pressing him should do one thing - clear it. As the first photo shows, Long signals that Williams should do that. Stick to these rules and you avoid trouble.

2nd goal: A good shot, well struck, the deflection gives it an awkward curve and it flies into the top corner. It would have taken a world class save to stop that.

3rd goal: He's not out of position, but I think his awareness is poor, as it seems he hasn't seen the Exeter player who nods it in. He moves over to the left as the cross comes in, and is on his heels when the header goes over him. The header doesn't look unstoppable, but I think it is more worrying that we are allowing a free header, relying on our gk to make a save with no defender challenging.

4th goal: I think Maguire gets an arm on his shoulder as he goes for the header, this makes his body turn/lose balance, and him heading the ball towards his own goal takes everybody by surprise. Including Long who reads the situation as a one on one. Seeing how wide the striker comes it would probably have been better to stay on his line.


I think people need to realise that we can't keep giving the opposition glorious chances and hope our goalkeeper rescues us, only to chop his head off if he doesn't.

 

[Eckingtonian]

People can debate until the cows come home.Who's at fault who's not at fault.The main reason we are in this position is down to one man and one man only.Mcabe.He as run this club into the ground and people are blind to it.

 

[Micalijo]

Just back from a week in Tenerife, so only just had a look at the highlights. Reading the views on here, I got the impression Long gifted Exeter four goals. Judging by the highlights that's far too harsh.

1st goal: In these situations there is a golden rule for goalkeepers saying "If a defender and attacker challenge for the ball - don't get involved". Furthermore, a defender who is facing his own goal with an attacker aggressively pressing him should do one thing - clear it. As the first photo shows, Long signals that Williams should do that. Stick to these rules and you avoid trouble.

2nd goal: A good shot, well struck, the deflection gives it an awkward curve and it flies into the top corner. It would have taken a world class save to stop that.

3rd goal: He's not out of position, but I think his awareness is poor, as it seems he hasn't seen the Exeter player who nods it in. He moves over to the left as the cross comes in, and is on his heels when the header goes over him. The header doesn't look unstoppable, but I think it is more worrying that we are allowing a free header, relying on our gk to make a save with no defender challenging.

4th goal: I think Maguire gets an arm on his shoulder as he goes for the header, this makes his body turn/lose balance, and him heading the ball towards his own goal takes everybody by surprise. Including Long who reads the situation as a one on one. Seeing how wide the striker comes it would probably have been better to stay on his line.


I think people need to realise that we can't keep giving the opposition glorious chances and hope our goalkeeper rescues us, only to chop his head off if he doesn't.

I think you've got the first one wrong Bergen, Long had loads of time for me to come and clear it up. He was way too deep to start with which maybe is the problem. Agree that Williams got worse the longer the situation drifted on - imo he did well at first - expecting to either let keeper claim it or Long whack it downfield.

The 3rd came from a quick break from our corner - it wasn't like poor marking from a set piece. Colins and Maguire were out of it. Yes, that raises questions but Long's awareness of what was developing was a total disgrace.

4th - poor goalkeeping for me again.

In general, keepers are meant to help out - I guess all chances come from some sort of defensive mistake?

 

[stannyblade]

That's a fair point. I've always respected how good Paddy Kenny and Chris Morgan are, but, i could never have imagined how much our back four has deteriorated since we sold Kenny and Morgs got badly injured. At least we've got Morgan to come back. Oh for a Paddy Kenny right now!!

With the experience Collins has you would expect him to lead but he doesnt. If we cant get a leader in then Im afraid young Maguire will continue to make errors. We need someone like Steve Bruce or Paul Mcgrath of old when we got them, coming to the end of their carrear but has seen it and done it.

 

[bladeinspaceandtime]

People can debate until the cows come home.Who's at fault who's not at fault.The main reason we are in this position is down to one man and one man only.Mcabe.He as run this club into the ground and people are blind to it.

There are plenty of people on here who aren't!

 

[Ollessendro]

Just back from a week in Tenerife, so only just had a look at the highlights. Reading the views on here, I got the impression Long gifted Exeter four goals. Judging by the highlights that's far too harsh.

1st goal: In these situations there is a golden rule for goalkeepers saying "If a defender and attacker challenge for the ball - don't get involved". Furthermore, a defender who is facing his own goal with an attacker aggressively pressing him should do one thing - clear it. As the first photo shows, Long signals that Williams should do that. Stick to these rules and you avoid trouble.

2nd goal: A good shot, well struck, the deflection gives it an awkward curve and it flies into the top corner. It would have taken a world class save to stop that.

3rd goal: He's not out of position, but I think his awareness is poor, as it seems he hasn't seen the Exeter player who nods it in. He moves over to the left as the cross comes in, and is on his heels when the header goes over him. The header doesn't look unstoppable, but I think it is more worrying that we are allowing a free header, relying on our gk to make a save with no defender challenging.

4th goal: I think Maguire gets an arm on his shoulder as he goes for the header, this makes his body turn/lose balance, and him heading the ball towards his own goal takes everybody by surprise. Including Long who reads the situation as a one on one. Seeing how wide the striker comes it would probably have been better to stay on his line.


I think people need to realise that we can't keep giving the opposition glorious chances and hope our goalkeeper rescues us, only to chop his head off if he doesn't.

I would expect better from you Bergen. After your comments on Cresswell (we cannot keep defedning poor form) I would not expect you to accept mediocrity. Eve more so, I wpould not expect you to defend the indefensible.

The first goal I agree Williams should clear. It was a mix up and for me they both have to take their share of the blame.
2nd no chance.
Just look where he is on the third. His positioning is shocking. He comes into no mans land. Their player is 12 yards out and stretching for the ball. It would take a brilliant header to beat Long, if the young keeper stays on his line. Instead he makes it really easy for him. It was a soft, soft goal. Montgomery let his man run 40 yards unnopposed, get the ball on his best foot and put in a cross. There is also the question as to why the Exeter player is allowed so much space. Terrible defending alll round. HOWEVER, keepers are there to stop shots and stop goals. Long made it really easy for their player.
the 4th is terrible keeping also. His positioning is woeful. As Gaz points out, this is not the positioning of a professional keeper. Their player is heading towards the by line and has a lot of work to do to beat Long if the keerper stays on his line. Look at your 4th picture. The guy would probably have taken a touch and looked for the pass (allowing the 3 United defenders to try and get in position). Instead Long comes rushing out and leaves a tap in. It was not just his error of judgement, it is also his positioning. Look at the photo: he does not know where the goal is. His angles are all wrong. His bad judgement and terrible positioning leave any easy tap in. It was poor defending from Maguire and he should take the blame also. Absolutely. But Long was as much use as a chocolate fireguard.

What is the point in having a goalkeeper if they cannot save shots? We may as well have an extra outfield player. Let's pack out the midfield, not allow any shots etc. That is essentially what people are saying when they defend Long's terrible keeping and lay the blame with outfield players.

 

[raul]

One lesson George will have learnt this weekend, dont read "fan" message boards ......

Fixed.....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k_1nkUbepaU


I too expect better Bergo. All forum rules state you cannot go on holiday without the obligatory "I'm going to X next week, anyone know a bar that'll be showing our game?".

 

[shreds1975]

3 games and he should never play for us again. Christ on a bike!

If this forum applied the same logic and means of assessment to your posts, you would be long gone (no pun intended)

 

[Bergen Blade]

I think you've got the first one wrong Bergen, Long had loads of time for me to come and clear it up. He was way too deep to start with which maybe is the problem. Agree that Williams got worse the longer the situation drifted on - imo he did well at first - expecting to either let keeper claim it or Long whack it downfield.

Football is a complex game, but there are some general rules that you should stick to at all times. IF you start dithering with these basic rules, you'll end up with confusion, misunderstandings and disorganisation. Williams having a man pressing him dictates his task - it is to clear the ball. I'll include a couple more photos that shows Monty kicking nothing but air, and Nardiello and Williams fighting for the ball continuously after that.

The 3rd came from a quick break from our corner - it wasn't like poor marking from a set piece. Colins and Maguire were out of it. Yes, that raises questions but Long's awareness of what was developing was a total disgrace.

4th - poor goalkeeping for me again.

Don't think there's much we disagree on regarding those goals, maybe you like using stronger words.

When I analyse I try to look at our general defending, rather than what happens at the last second. No matter who our goalkeeper is, we shouldn't accept unchallenged finishes - in the final minutes, when we're winning, at home, against Exeter, twice. Next time we may have a better goalie, but the header may be better placed, and the striker may not be as wide. I bet more will be bothered about our defending then.

 

[Patrick Suffaux]

Football is a complex game

Football is actually a very simple game. People over complicate it.

You do however make some good points that I agree with, Williams should have cleared for one.

One of the first things you are taught when defending - "if in doubt, put it out!"

Mic made a good point about positioning and Long could have certainly been more decisive.

To me though, Williams has to take responsibility for the first goal.

The ball should have been put into John Street, end of.

 

[Bergen Blade]

I would expect better from you Bergen. After your comments on Cresswell (we cannot keep defedning poor form) I would not expect you to accept mediocrity. Eve more so, I wpould not expect you to defend the indefensible.

See my reply to Micalijo regarding the first goal. Second goal we agree on. Then there's little regarding Long's actions in your post that I haven't covered with my first post, seems you just like to have a go a little more.

Regarding what's to be expected from me, I try to be honest and objective and like to look at where we should improve. Am I accepting mediocrity more when I blame Williams, rather than Long for a goal? Is it being less critical when I don't want us to give the opposition one on one chances in the final minutes, rather than lambasting the goalie for not saving them?

 

[Highbury_Blade]

Totally williams' fault for the first goal. Horrendous defending.

---------- Post added at 11:11 AM ---------- Previous post was at 11:05 AM ----------

I'd agree with Olle about the third. Should have been a comfortable catch on the line for Long. He'll learn from that though. He could have probably done better on the 4th as well, but it's utterly ridiculous to say he shouldn't be playing for us ever again. If he's still making these daft mistakes when he's 23 then you'd have a point olle.

 

[Hodgyman]

It's time for a loan keeper



From where I was sat, the first goal could be shared between Monty, Long and Williams. Monty could have connected with his tackle and thereafter I think that the problem continued with how Long was too near Williams for a back pass and a little worried about coming for the ball and clashing with Williams. In that situation a clear shout should be made to warn the other about their intentions. Either Long or Williams should then have put the ball into John Street.

I could not see the amount of deflection there was on the second but it seemed to swerve with the spin from a deflection. I cannot comment on whether Long could or should have got to it from my angle of view.

For the 3rd and fourth goals George was not helped by his defenders but seemed to have his weight on his heels, making it difficult make upward or sideways movement to make a save. This can be laid at the door of our goalkeeping coach (Paul Crichton) as keeping the balance on your toes is one of the most basic lessons given to any goalkeeper over the age of 5. Paul seems to have had spectacular lack of success in this area with both of his pupils.

All said, George isn't ready yet for first team action and Simmo cannot be tolerated any further. I suggest that we need a loan keeper and let him continue to train with his own club.

 

[SwissBlade]

I remember discussing bringing the Academy players through to the first team in the summer and highlighting that the youngsters wouldn’t be given a chance. I was shot down by many on here for saying it.

The thing is that we ALL wanted the club to bring the youngsters through into the first team and it was discussed that we shouldn’t be playing the overpaid shite 1st teamers, but bring through the likes of Long, Harry, Lowton, Slew.

Well the club have done that, Long has completed the quartet and every one of them has been criticised.

The thing is that whilst the young lads should be stepping up to the plate (and my understanding is that generally they have done) we can’t expect them to not make mistakes. They need to make mistakes to learn and gain experience.

Here is my early summary of what I’ve seen and read.

Harry – Done well. Distribution excellent, has a footballing brain, but does tend to make a few mistakes at crucial times such as corners.
Development – Give him back up and work on set pieces with him

Lowton – Weighs in with some very important goals, great going forward, but defensively he’s not great.
Development – For me Lowton is not a fullback, but does a decent job there as he gives a good attacking option. Personally I’d push him forward to the right mid (one Phillips has gone back) and get a partnership between him at RM and Parrino at RB

Slew – Looked decent at the end of last season, pacey and wanted the ball. Had a tendancy to drift out wide at times when the ball didn’t drop for him. Needed to fill out.
Development – We sold him too early (although its all about the money with us) thought he needed to work on staying close to the target man and developing his ability to hold the ball up better.

Long – Not seen him myself, but understand that he’s done ok at times, although its always a big step up for keepers, the ball comes harder, faster and more random than in the Juniors.
Development – A good run of games will help him. From the goals conceded he needs to be more commanding. Needs to be quicker to react and work on the communication with the defenders.

I think we need to lay off the youngsters at times, let them male their mistakes, just unfortunate that 3 of the back 5 are so young and inexperienced that we don’t have enough experience around them to support them

 

[beechblade]

To me Williams had chance to clear the ball on Berg's second image, with plenty of time and keeping the threat relatively down, he then also had other opportunties afterwards before the ball even got near Long.

Long's too raw for the step up at the minute but this situation comes from the club not making funds available to give us a competitor for Simmo's number 1 jersey.

---------- Post added at 12:24 PM ---------- Previous post was at 12:20 PM ----------

Football is actually a very simple game. People over complicate it.

Football has never been a simple game from it's creation were coaching is concerned, the basics of "play" have always been relatively simple, but if you look at the evolution of the game, tactics and formations the game has simplified in some manors, as well as become more complex in others.

 

[Patrick Suffaux]

Football has never been a simple game from it's creation were coaching is concerned, the basics of "play" have always been relatively simple, but if you look at the evolution of the game, tactics and formations the game has simplified in some manors, as well as become more complex in others.

Coaches like to over analyse it and pull it to pieces imo.

Attractive, winning football can be achieved by applying common sense.

The difficult part is coaching discipline and understanding into players.

That is largely down to the individual and how they receive/use information.

The line between winning/losing, being good/crap is largely determined by the quality of your players.

 

[Blade55]

Hodgyman :
"For the 3rd and fourth goals George was not helped by his defenders but seemed to have his weight on his heels, making it difficult make upward or sideways movement to make a save."

Agree with this - just before start of 2nd half when given balls to catch, Long seemed "flat footed" making it very difficult to make any movement from his central position - not Long's fault. Tuesday there was an expected urgency to protect Long, but surely that should be the case every game regardless of who is in goal and who the opposition is ?

Long, Lowton, Maguire are young lads with promise and unfortunately mistakes will be made as part of the learning process - coaching should iron out most of these mistakes in training and experienced players should help on the pitch - unfortunately we lack that dominant figure in defence when things start to go wrong and panic and indecision ensue.