Director of Football

[CrookesBlade]

Nah,

Certainly not needed in the Championship and if were to be a Premier League side again in 22/23 Wilder, Bettis, Prince etc simply need to learn the fairly obvious lessons of this season, doesn't need a symbolic appointment. It also needs to be accepted that the teams who have the fewest financial resources (or at least the teams least willing to chuck the cash about) will always finish towards the bottom. You either then roll the dice or accept your place in the pecking order.

If Wilder did get forced out then we'll repeat the same cycle that started with sacking Warnock in 07. I just hope there are enough people at the club around from that era to remind the Prince of that.

 

[Yogi]

Yeah definitely, lots of individual squad members could easily be sold for profit, particularly 90% of the Championship squad.

But I was specifically referring to the players brought in during our £130m Premier League spending spree. as a whole, after someone suggested that if we sold them all, we’d make a profit?

Ahhhh I understand now. Yeah I think we’d take a loss on some mousset being the standout. Others like Brewster I just don’t think we’ve had enough time to get a proper look. And then some like McBurnie it’s hard to evaluate because it’s so subjective some I think just wouldn’t be interested whereas others would value his physical attributes highly.

 

[Silent Blade]

I have never really understood what a DoF does

 

[AWetFlannel]

I went for other because there was no option for just 'no'.
Wilder's recruitment is fine and the ownership have invested responsibly.

 

[Yogi]

I have never really understood what a DoF does

It varies from club to club but in general they are the one directly answerable to be board and then everyone else at the club answers to them including the coach/management and the recruitment department it’s another management position. Imo in this instance it will be the prince wanting van winkle above wilder again.

 

[metalblade]

Why do we need a DOF it is just another level on a salary. The manager who picks the tactics should be the man picking the players to play those tactics. If the manager tells the board he wants a player then it is up to the board to go and get that player if possible, if not you get the mangers 2nd choice. Get a DOF in and he might go buying wingers for a team and manager that does not play with wingers, the DOF soon becomes the one picking the team. OK maybe for clubs like Chelsea who buy up every player they can then farm them out on loan on the chance some will turn out brilliant but we can't afford to do that we need to pull in players who fit our style of play. I'd rather we increased the scouting network the manager has to pick his players or he becomes redundant and having to play a style that is forced upon him.

 

[SB_90]

it depends on the director of football role works. because ive seen many times where a DOF has been signing players against the wishes of manager & it never ends well. just leads to arguments. but then ive seen it where the managers is involved & it can be a good delegation.

so i hope its the latter as for this to work. wilder needs final say. as if force players on him it will only go badly

 

[McGrath]

If we do hire a Director of Football (which I hope we don't).... then they'd better come with a thick skin, because if Wilder leaves and we're not top of the Championship then the new DoF is going to be an absolute lightening rod for abuse from the fans.

 

[Luke1993]

Whether it be DOF or better scouting/recruitment teams, as long as the final decision is made by the manager/head coach I have no objections, if wilder says we want a tall rb who can be moulded into an attacking Rcb, give me 5 options, the DOF or whoever goes out finds those options presents them to CW he makes the decision as to which he thinks is best suited then let's the board know. If it works like this I'm 100% for it. Infact it should take some work off cw's workload in theory. He can still conduct his 'attitude' interviews/assessment before saying yes.

 

[Come from away]

A great deal depends on the actual role for the DOF relative to CW.

 

[BushBlade]

A great deal depends on the actual role for the DOF relative to CW.

Which is where PA can flex a bit. Bring in a DoF who is responsible for overseeing recruitment and the other stuff like the academy but not the first team, i.e. Wilder doesn’t report to him. When Wilder does eventually leave, the role is expanded to include the first team and recruitment of the new manager.

 

[Yogi]

Which is where PA can flex a bit. Bring in a DoF who is responsible for overseeing recruitment and the other stuff like the academy but not the first team, i.e. Wilder doesn’t report to him. When Wilder does eventually leave, the role is expanded to include the first team and recruitment of the new manager.

That’s kind of an amalgamation if bettis role with jack jester. Incidentally if the person above him was bettis I don’t think wilder would have an issue as there’s already a working relationship there.

 

[Fulwood Blade]

A lot of talk about director of football here but I reckon that this spat is as much about the (non) development of the off field facilities as anything else.

Agreed - particularly the 1st team building up at Shirecliffe.

Some of the existing Premier League training facilities are light years ahead of us - and even the new building (if it ever happens) would still leave us light years away, but at least it's a start.

UTB

 

[BushBlade]

That’s kind of an amalgamation if bettis role with jack jester. Incidentally if the person above him was bettis I don’t think wilder would have an issue as there’s already a working relationship there.

I think it needs to be someone with a background in coaching and recruitment and with a track record of doing a similar role. Part of the benefit of bringing in an outsider is they have a different knowledge base and perspective and different contacts in the game, someone from a club that’s well run, who knows what well run looks like and can benchmark that against what we’re currently doing.

 

[Yogi]

I think it needs to be someone with a background in coaching and recruitment and with a track record of doing a similar role. Part of the benefit of bringing in an outsider is they have a different knowledge base and perspective and different contacts in the game, someone from a club that’s well run, who knows what well run looks like and can benchmark that against what we’re currently doing.

Yeah what you’re saying is right. As others have said I’m not too keen on the timing of this move given the need for stability going into this summer. One possibility of the prince wants a succession plan to wilder along these lines then put it in place at one of his other clubs who are struggling bring in a DOF let them cut their teeth and prove their skills and then if wilder wants to leave at any point or if next year doesn’t go well and we look to move on then bring in a DOF that you know well and are confident in their approach.

 

[Pedro's Winger]

Struggling to understand the hierarchy's logic on this if it ends up with Wilder leaving.
They'll end up with a director of football and a manager who's going to be our equivalent to the successor to Ferguson. That scenario's very unlikely to yield promotion or a club pulling in the same direction.
Even with relegation, Wilder's time hasn't yet run its course. If the hierarchy really want a DoF they'd be better off waiting to see what happens next season.
If we're struggling then they can get rid of Wilder and put in whatever blue-sky managerial arrangement they like and probably with little to no fuss at all.

 

[JohnDenver]

As others have said DoF is a very broad title and what they actually do comes down to the remit set by the individual club.

So what do people expect a DoF to do for us? Because my suspicion is it all boils down to "We need to expand our scouting network", which is something we're all very aware of. I'm not sure it needs the special job title and if it's anything else then I'm always deeply sceptical of taking control of the playing squad away from the manager who has to use them.

Like anything in football I'm sure you can point to a failed DoF for every one that works. The title doesn't matter, the set up and the personnel do. If we were talking about bringing someone in with the knowledge and understanding to widen our net in terms of players to choose from, I guess I'm all for it. If it means having someone select the squad for Wilder then I don't see that working.

To me it’s simply a role that ensures a strategy is place that spans managerial tenures. Clubs shouldn’t do what Wednesday are doing right now in appointing and backing managers of polar opposite methods. The academy, the manager, the players all need to be aligned.

It doesn’t have to be one person, but we need something at board level that ensures continuity and footballing sense. McCabe or Chansiri show what can happen when that’s missing.

 

[Snowflake]

The question is based on reports that the Prince wants to get a Director of Football in specifically to help with recruitment. I realise it's totally hypothetical, but I just thought it was an interesting discussion to have.

The discussion is good, but those that are adamant that we should have one are perhaps a little premature

 

[Black Cloud]

Why does the role have to be called a 'DOF', why, if there's any truth in it, would anyone suggest it other than to cause avoidable conflict. The Prince isn't daft he could employ someone with both business sense (CW has none) and contacts (CWs would appear limited) and explore markets home and abroad in a search of affordable targets - we could call him anything other than DOF and ensure that he works with Chris rather than invite a power struggle. What we must remember is Chris is hopeless in the transfer market and is far too loyal with existing players....

 

[Superblades]

It’s easy to say Wilders signings have been poor, but, you could argue that had he not lost his targets to other clubs due to wages, then his signings would have been decent.

Having said that, I’d welcome a DOF as we need to look further than players here. However to compete at Prem level and become established here, we really need to start matching the wages that go with becoming a Prem club.

 

[IdLiketoRogerMoore]

If you look at our recruitment post winning promotion to the PL it's very hard to disagree with the fact something needs to diametrically change.

If Tufty objects/disagrees with this, then I'm sorry it's time for him to consider his own position. There's ego and stubbornness but there's also stupidity....

The alternative is to work with the club and come up with a solution that works for all. Hopefully as a bunch of grown ups, that can be accomplished.

 

[Yogi]

If you look at our recruitment post winning promotion to the PL it's very hard to disagree with the fact something needs to diametrically change.

If Tufty objects/disagrees with this, then I'm sorry it's time for him to consider his own position. There's ego and stubbornness but there's also stupidity....

The alternative is to work with the club and come up with a solution that works for all. Hopefully as a bunch of grown ups, that can be accomplished.

This I really hope once the season is over and passions have cooled they can all get round a table like they have in previous years and hash out a plan for the coming season.

 

[finlaytheblade]

He seen but a lot has happened since then,Wilder cant have his finger on the pulse 24/7 Van Winkel would be the ideal appointment as he knows european football well which KWACK dont we have to improve our scouting network full stop!.He also is a director so will be really into it not just as a job.
going forward as a club DOF and Wilder have to be on the same page ,style of football down to the chief coach (manager) .
If there ideas differ regarding recruitment it will not work .
of we are serious about being in premiership then changes will have to happen as I said earlier to much going on for one man to take on board.
Looks like that's what the prince wants
so a compromise has to happen.No reason Wilder cant have a say on every aspect but hes not the owner and maybe has to accept this way forward

If we do go down the DOF route l’d guess Van Winkel would be a shoe in. Didnt Wilder put a stop to that once?

 

[true99blade]

Is there anyone who doesn’t exaggerate on this board? You’d have thought Wilder’s recruitment took us from the Prem to League One rather than the other way round. Christ above.

 

[S64 Blade]

In terms of Chris' position on the matter, it's paradoxical. If he was wants to maintain full responsibility of the football club, then he needs to realise that that's full accountability too. That accountability calls in to question our largely piss poor season; a fundamental factor being the poor recruitment - not signing a LCB knowing JOC would be out for most of the season and not signing a new midfielder, knowing Lundstram wasn't playing ball/and Freeman was off. That's without dissecting the players brought in, in other areas.

Alternatively, sharing some of that responsibility, also means the potential to share some accountability.

You can't have your cake and eat it and I think he needs to be careful what he wishes for. His hand gets weaker with every poor performance.

Name me another club that wouldn't have sacked him after the amount of money spent, abject performances and league position?

I really do hope he stay, but focuses his attention on his excellent man management and tactical skills.

 

[Stantheman]

Is there anyone who doesn’t exaggerate on this board? You’d have thought Wilder’s recruitment took us from the Prem to League One rather than the other way round. Christ above.

And by its nature is starting the journey to take us back again.

 

[DronnieBlade]

Wilder would do well to understand that the demands on a modern football manager at Championship level and above are such that you need good, professional help to optimise your own effectiveness.

Effective delegation appears to be an inherent weakness. Stubborn focker would probably be nearer the mark actually !!

A DOF, with a degree of understanding on where job roles and boundaries are set, SHOULD be a major benefit and not the interference it most probably is perceived as being !!

UTB

 

[ashsufc1889]

Other: Wider scope of recruitment and more responsibility to lie with "Head of Recruitment"/"Talent Acquisition Manager".
Definitely need to look further afield than the UK and Belgium. Delve into the German leagues, for example, and the yank system (look at some of the yanks coming through in Germany).

 

[BanderSerge]

Seems as though this could well be one of the biggest sticking points for Wilder. As well as being keen to keep hold of the bulk of the squad, Wilder doesn't appear fond of the Prince's plans to bring in a DoF to look after recruitment. What does everyone on here think?

Tried to cover all bases, but inevitably I'll have missed several, so if you click "other", specify your view.

Thought that was Bettis role?

 

[SwissBlade]

I put

No - but we do need to get better at recruitment (e.g. larger scouting network)​

I don't actually think recruitment over the last two seasons has been bad, but I think there are two factors (amongst others) which i think have made it look bad:
a) We've recruited mostly young, raw players, lacking Premier League experience
b) We have an ageing squad which has probably just reached its limit

I've said this for a while, we're in transition. We've moved too fast as a club to allow an organic transition to happen, with the next Billy Sharp, Basham, Stevens, Norwood coming through at Championship level, playing their part, understanding the unique way we play and then eventually forcing their way through and taking up the responsibility.

Robinson, Ampadu, Bryan, Bogle, Berge, Osborn, Brewster, Mousset, McBurnie and Burke have all got the right attributes, they've shown the signs but they're not ready to take over from the Original Journeymen that we came up with. So we have chopped and changed.

Ramsdale, has had to step up, learn, make mistakes and show character and in fairness he probably wanted some time out, but couldn't get it.

So i don't think the recruitment of individuals has been bad. I think we've been unable to buy a player in their prime, not because we can't afford the fee, but because wages over the contract would kill us and it would smash the wage structure. Perhaps another year in the Prem could've seen us go for that player.

We've not got depth to the squad either, when we lose a player like O'Connell or Berge or Fleck we struggle. The Premier League has shown that even Liverpool don't have the depth to take some of their players out and still compete.

Norwich didn't invest at all when we came up, they've kept their squad together and smashed the Championship. I think our recruitment is strong for the Championship and yes we've had a lot of bad luck, but we're fishing in a Burnley and Brighton pond, even Wolves have struggled with a couple of losses.

I actually think we work in a way that needs a bigger network to find the gems, we've brought in the likes of Berge, but we need to be doing more along these lines....