Premier league myth

[oldblade]

I would rather gave Gordon Banks in goal than Jordan Pickford

I would rather have Gordon Banks in goal than anyone else since!

 

[Silent Blade]

Scotland qualified for the first time in 1974, strongly suspect JG had hung up his international boots by this date.

It was their third time. They also played in 1954 and 1958

 

[Charlieblade]

This myth regarding the premier league being the best in the world
Leeds united hammered by Crawley, Brighton struggled against Newport,Liverpool struggled against Aston Villa kids first half we scrapped through against Bristol Rovers,Everton v Rotherham Blackpool through against West Brom
The Manchester United team of Giggs,Scholes,Cantona,and the rest,the Liverpool, Leeds teams of the 70s,Arsenal invincibles would hammer today's premier league teams
How many of today's England players would get into the 1966 World Cup team NON
Football has gone backwards watching today's football sends you to sleep

Sorry, but the so called elite teams of today do not take the FA Cup seriously at all. The majority use it to give squad players and youthful talent a run out, that’s all.
The League cup is an even bigger joke. Top EPL sides are really only interested in qualifying for The Champions League, because that’s the big money spinner for them, and elite players want to play in that competition.

 

[Pittsburg Blade]

The elite teams of today are so far ahead of what professional football was like back in the 60s, 70s and even the 90s. Players are much better athletes now and I’d even argue the gap between the top level, (not necessarily elite level) and third tier isn’t anywhere near as pronounced nowadays due to improved knowledge of fitness and advancements when it comes to coaching.

I’m not trying to belittle the success of teams from the past, or argue that certain individuals didn’t possess a great deal of talent, obviously there are some players who were very good. Football as a sport has evolved considerably though, and even championship teams are now massively ahead of where second division teams from 30-40 years ago.

Based on athleticism, and footballing ability, I’d argue that a substantial number of the current England squad would quite easily walk into the 1966 team. Again, that’s not me suggesting that winning the World Cup wasn’t a huge achievement, but that it’s incredibly biased to imply that football hasn’t evolved over the past 55 years, and you should probably take off your nostalgia goggles once in a while.

Pittsburg instantly replaces nostalgia goggles with beer goggles...

 

[gordoncharles]

Sorry, but the so called elite teams of today do not take the FA Cup seriously at all. The majority use it to give squad players and youthful talent a run out, that’s all.
The League cup is an even bigger joke. Top EPL sides are really only interested in qualifying for The Champions League, because that’s the big money spinner for them, and elite players want to play in that competition.

They do, you're right.

And yet despite playing shadow and reserve sides in the early rounds the elite teams have still won 23 out of the last 25 FA Cups and 16 of the last 20 League Cups.

 

[Revolution]

They do, you're right.

And yet despite playing shadow and reserve sides in the early rounds the elite teams have still won 23 out of the last 25 FA Cups and 16 of the last 20 League Cups.

Compare that with 1970 to 1980, when 3 second division sides won the cup.

But we all wish football was the same as when we were young...

 

[SB_90]

Liverpool, Leeds teams of the 70s

it would be embarrassing if lets say leeds side of 70's that finished 5th in top division where knocked out by 3rd division palace & mighty liverpool were taken to a replay by 3rd division southend

 

[SB_90]

They do, you're right.

And yet despite playing shadow and reserve sides in the early rounds the elite teams have still won 23 out of the last 25 FA Cups and 16 of the last 20 League Cups.

your spot on with this, last week after the league cup semi finals, their was a few interesting stats. swansea in 2013 are the last team to win the league cup that wasnt mourinho or man city & to say man city dont care about the league under pep guardiola theyve never lost a league cup game outside of manchester

 

[BobblesBlade]

Who says it's the best in the world, and who defines what "best" actually means?
I've only ever heard it in relation to being the most entertaining, or competitive rather than best in terms of quality.

The world class players end up in Spain
The old world class players end up in Italy
Emerging talent in Germany and Portugal
Average leagues France and Holland

The Premier league is all about the money.

 

[SB_90]

how many foreign world class players are currently in la liga, because there very good at bring through the domestic players somethung premier league are dreadful at just look at phil foden for obvious example of that but i can think of many non spanish world class players in there prime in la liga

 

[Charlieblade]

They do, you're right.

And yet despite playing shadow and reserve sides in the early rounds the elite teams have still won 23 out of the last 25 FA Cups and 16 of the last 20 League Cups.

Thus proving that elitism works in favor of the few clubs wh can afford highly paid squad players to get the through the early rounds, and save the stars for the latter stages.
They are undermining the quality and diversity of those trophies.
The team that beat Bristol Rovers in the FA cup carried no lightweights, they were the only fit players available to Wilder.

 

[CentralQuay]

The world class players end up in Spain
The old world class players end up in Italy
Emerging talent in Germany and Portugal
Average leagues France and Holland

The Premier league is all about the money.

The reason World Class players in the Premier League go abroad is largely because Premier League clubs do not sell to other Premier League clubs.
Liverpool wouldn't sell Suarez to Man United, or Chelsea sell Hazard to Arsenal.....And Kane will not move to another side in this country.

Plus they end up at Barcelona/Real Madrid, it's not like they sign for any club in Spain, only those 2 have the draw to sign players.

 

[bladesmanluke]

I would rather gave Gordon Banks in goal than Jordan Pickford

100%. Doesn't make much difference for a keeper

 

[gordoncharles]

Thus proving that elitism works in favor of the few clubs wh can afford highly paid squad players to get the through the early rounds, and save the stars for the latter stages.
They are undermining the quality and diversity of those trophies.
The team that beat Bristol Rovers in the FA cup carried no lightweights, they were the only fit players available to Wilder.

I'm not sure about your point Charlieblade?

If they're good enough to negotiate the early rounds with their shadow team and U23s, why do they need to put the entire 1st team out?

What would have been the point in Spurs playing their regular starting eleven at Marine?

What's more in the Luton v Reading tie the two sides made 18 changes between them. Should we fine them both for undermining quality & diversity?

 

[Brumdog66]

Pointless comparing eras in terms of ability but in terms of style I'd say noughties premier league was the best balance of modern tactics and play vs actually being allowed to tackle

 

[Willie Carlin]

There’s one thing about the Premier league. You have to be able to be dishonest, cynicle, twist, cheat, scream, dive, feign being injured, hold your head and cover your face when you been tackled and lost the ball to be a success.

 

[fuerstenberger]

The PL is very well marketed around the globe. English football has been popular in the East and Africa for ages. I can remember going to Nigeria in the 80's and there were thousands of Liverpool, Man Utd and Arsenal shirts. The marketing and PR Departments of the PL have just built on that and you have the phenomenon that it is now.
I did post on here ages ago, detailing how I went into a pub to watch a Bundesliga game about 10 years ago. I was shocked to see a League One game being watched. I think Bradford v Scunthorpe, can't remember. I asked about the Bundesliga game and was told English football is more exciting as the crowds are so passionate and the players tough etc.
In the end this has to be down to opinion. Personally, as a product, I think the Bundesliga is up there, but pales into the distance when things like atmosphere, player and manager passion are taken into the equation. Let's not forget how huge (preserving the 'massive' word for the Mittwochers), the PL is around the globe. I can surmise what the reasons for that are, the fact is it is Massive, sorry huge.

 

[Willie Carlin]

This myth regarding the premier league being the best in the world
Leeds united hammered by Crawley, Brighton struggled against Newport,Liverpool struggled against Aston Villa kids first half we scrapped through against Bristol Rovers,Everton v Rotherham Blackpool through against West Brom
The Manchester United team of Giggs,Scholes,Cantona,and the rest,the Liverpool, Leeds teams of the 70s,Arsenal invincibles would hammer today's premier league teams
How many of today's England players would get into the 1966 World Cup team NON
Football has gone backwards watching today's football sends you to sleep

Agree and they did it without resorting to cheating and diving about like soft lasses!!!

 

[Charlieblade]

I'm not sure about your point Charlieblade?

If they're good enough to negotiate the early rounds with their shadow team and U23s, why do they need to put the entire 1st team out?

What would have been the point in Spurs playing their regular starting eleven at Marine?

What's more in the Luton v Reading tie the two sides made 18 changes between them. Should we fine them both for undermining quality & diversity?

I suppose my point is that, elite EPL clubs have shown disrespect to what was once the best knock out competition in the world. All in the name of financial success. The crowds don’t turn out to watch Liverpool reserves against anyone, but clubs like them don’t want to risk highly paid stars, to progress in the FA Cup, when their priorities are clear. CL qualification, or the “business” model just doesn’t work.
Not content with dissing national cup competitions, they now want greater control over EPL, purely for their own benefit in more lucrative European competitions.
The roots of this great game are in domestic competition, but some teams seem to have conveniently forgotten where they came from, and that was originally granted to them by supporters of the team.
The grass roots nature of the game is gradually being sold down the river of commercial success, and to hell with the supporters.
The pinnacle of a players carrier is no longer getting picked to represent your country, but playing in the CL with lots of TV exposure and a fat salary.
Rant over and thanks for listening to my geriatric opinions.

 

[blade too long]

Teams never used to rest players for the FA cup. Even championship clubs rest 7 and 8 players
What's changed most is teams bottom half of the prem are willing to make 11 changes and dont seem arsed if they bow out to try and stay in the cash cow prem

 

[gordoncharles]

I suppose my point is that, elite EPL clubs have shown disrespect to what was once the best knock out competition in the world. All in the name of financial success. The crowds don’t turn out to watch Liverpool reserves against anyone, but clubs like them don’t want to risk highly paid stars, to progress in the FA Cup, when their priorities are clear. CL qualification, or the “business” model just doesn’t work.
Not content with dissing national cup competitions, they now want greater control over EPL, purely for their own benefit in more lucrative European competitions.
The roots of this great game are in domestic competition, but some teams seem to have conveniently forgotten where they came from, and that was originally granted to them by supporters of the team.
The grass roots nature of the game is gradually being sold down the river of commercial success, and to hell with the supporters.
The pinnacle of a players carrier is no longer getting picked to represent your country, but playing in the CL with lots of TV exposure and a fat salary.
Rant over and thanks for listening to my geriatric opinions.

I take the point Charlieblade , as a geriatric myself, but there have been changes

International football was once the pinnacle, the World Cup the greatest prize. But most World Cup winning sides now wouldn't even win the Europa League.

In 1970 practically every player in Mexico played in their own domestic league, but the world's best players are now lightly scattered across the European giants so the CL is now the height of football achievement.

The FA Cup's just ended up on the same trajectory

 

[finlaytheblade]

Sorry Bianca, with the protection and pitches that Kane has Greaves would be double that. On the mud heaps with the tackling allowed back then Kane would be at least 30% less.

It's like comparing apples and pears, but Greaves would be up there with Ronaldo and Messi in goals scored in the modern game. Skill, balance, speed, positional sense, finishing are nothing to do with athleticism and can't be found in the gym however long you spend in there.

He had all the attributes great strikers have today:: bravery,quick feet and close control ,fantastic pace over short distances and the thing that has to be there! great finisher.He had to be athletic to have all them things .
Unfortunately he was a big drinker and when he retired went to seed very quickly.
In my eyes the best ever in my lifetime.
Pitches in them days were awful and became like puddings in midwinter.

 

[oldblade]

I take the point Charlieblade , as a geriatric myself, but there have been changes

International football was once the pinnacle, the World Cup the greatest prize. But most World Cup winning sides now wouldn't even win the Europa League.

In 1970 practically every player in Mexico played in their own domestic league, but the world's best players are now lightly scattered across the European giants so the CL is now the height of football achievement.

The FA Cup's just ended up on the same trajectory

I could well be wrong, but if I remember correctly every one of the 1970 world cup winning Brazilian side played for a Brazilian club.

To this day I don't think I have ever taken more pleasure in terms of pure footballing genius than watching that Brazil side in that world cup. I wanted England to win and was gutted when we lost to them (even more gutted when we lost to West Germany!), but you couldn't help being mesmerised by them.

Odd fact time. Brazil failed to score fewer than 3 goals in any of their matches on just one occasion. That was against England.

However, the other edge of the sword is that Brazil only kept a clean sheet against one country. That was also England.

I remember watching that match as if it was yesterday. A fascinating and nerve wracking game. I was on edge all mat h. England played very well and really should have scored, but I always had this feeling that Brazil were going to come out on top. They dropped one or two clangers, but to me their players always looked more at ease with the ball. Their ball control was instant. No second touch needed. And they just somehow seemed more fluent.

Although it is interesting to mull over whether perhaps Tony Currie, George Best, Bobby Charlton etc could survive today we will never ever be able to show if they could or couldn't. Sides and players have to be judged in the context of their time and what they achieved in their time.

All I can say is that that Brazil side is the best in it's time that I have ever seen. For me, since then, no domestic or international side has impacted on football in the way that Brazilian side did and I feel lucky to have witnessed it first hand. Even if it was on black and white TV. (Colour was around by then, but the vast majority couldn't afford it!).

 

[BarcaBlade]

Yes I know one of Barcelona, Real Madid, or Atletico Madrid don't win the league every year

Not so much of the Athletico. Once in more than 20 years

 

[Mercedes]

wrexham beating Arsenal
bournemouth beating man utd
colchester beating leeds ,,,,,

the fa cup is a leveller
more so now as the top clubs play on pristine bowling green quality surfaces
and have to overcome playing on cabbage patches

we didnt struggle v bristol we were always in front and had 22 attempts compared with some it was comfortable

burnley made it hard for themselves v mk dons, that was in doubt throughout we werent

 

[Mercedes]

So there were no cup upsets, back in't day?

Wow here we go again Chorley absolutely running wolves multi million pound players all the way Premier League what a joke

 

[Mercedes]

Wow here we go again Chorley absolutely running wolves multi million pound players all the way Premier League what a joke

Just shows how go the premier league is absolutely a waste of time,part time players pushing multi million pound players I know the pitch is not perfect, the changing rooms are too small,it's too cold what a joke football has become

 

[ancientblade]

the fa cup lost its glamour years ago bbc try and build it up because its the only live football theyve got and go way over the top trying to promote it

 

[Mercedes]

the fa cup lost its glamour years ago bbc try and build it up because its the only live football theyve got and go way over the top trying to promote it

So the premier league players know this
Have some pride
This football is a joke
If this was tennis get Nadal out there again a club player what would happen
Chorley had more attempts at goal
What a joke
I'm watching Robbie Savage say Wolves are missing players
Me done

 

[Mercedes]

Sorry, but the so called elite teams of today do not take the FA Cup seriously at all. The majority use it to give squad players and youthful talent a run out, that’s all.
The League cup is an even bigger joke. Top EPL sides are really only interested in qualifying for The Champions League, because that’s the big money spinner for them, and elite players want to play in that competition.

Wolves did
Chorley more attempts at goal
What a joke