Sheffield's Shame

[lenners]

Birthplace of the modern game, one of the country's biggest cities, more than 40,000 combined average gates and yet not a decent football club between United and Wednesday.
Absolute shambles. McCabe and whoever runs Wednesday these days ought to be ashamed that this is the best we can do compared to Bolton, Wigan, Blackburn, Stoke, Blackpool, QPR, Cardiff, Coventry, Doncaster, Derby, Reading etc, etc, etc.

 

[Micalijo]

How many times do I have to tell you, Donny are nowt special, mid-table in second tier - not good enough and a great disapointment to all their followers.

 

[gavtheblade]

How many times do I have to tell you, Donny are nowt special, mid-table in second tier - not good enough and a great disapointment to all their followers.

lenners does have a point tho micalijo,its embarrassing to think sometimes that football was born here and we aint got a top flight sheffield team.never mind

 

[Nick Jansky]

Lenners is spot on. The state of football in this city is absolutely shameful. Two horribly mismanaged clubs.

 

[SwissBlade]

Interesting thoughts. Not shameful at all, just a snapshot of a certain time. If anything its a reflection on the city that its not made itself attractive to outside investment since the early 90's.

I don't believe its about football its about the city and its links.

When we went down, we were so similar to Chelsea in so many ways, yet they attracted a big time backer, just like Man City, Pompey, Wigan, Blackburn, Man U, Leicester, Derby, Liverpool, QPR etc.

Others have slowly built, where were Burnley a few years ago, where were Bolton? Charlton spent many years in the big time, now look at them.

For every Donny and Blackpool there's a Southampton and Bradford...

The fact is that we, currently seem to be doing ok without major investment.

We have Premier League facilities at the lane and shirecliffe. We can't buy players, but players like Slew, Chappel, Lowton are making 1st team in roads...

Our time in the top flight will come, our time in the lower leagues will also come, but our desire for top flight should not put our status in this division at risk...

Just a question, how many teams have not been relegated from the Premier League? I.e. How many clubs have been there from the 1st day when Deano slammed home two against Man U?

 

[Casper]

Unfortunately the state of our football team mirrors entirely the state of our city. Compare our economy and commerce with similar sized UK cities and it really is embarrassing. Even taking Birmingham and Manchester out of the equation with their much larger conurbation, cities like Leeds, Newcastle, Bristol, Nottingham left us behind years ago.

 

[lenners]

Unfortunately the state of our football team mirrors entirely the state of our city. Compare our economy and commerce with similar sized UK cities and it really is embarrassing. Even taking Birmingham and Manchester out of the equation with their much larger conurbation, cities like Leeds, Newcastle, Bristol, Nottingham left us behind years ago.

It's an interesting point Casper. You have to wonder if it's something in the mentality of the city. They couldn't even build a decent city centre with hundreds of millions of pounds of funding. Not a single iconic building.
There's not even a great deal of unhappiness about the pathetic performance of United and Wednesday, it's just par for the course.

---------- Post added at 01:56 PM ---------- Previous post was at 01:54 PM ----------

Swiss, if you think we are doing ok at the moment I'm worried about the connection of your grey matter with actual reality.

 

[Toronto Blade]

Sack the city councillors!

 

[JohnDenver]

Lenners is spot on. The state of football in this city is absolutely shameful. Two horribly mismanaged clubs.

I don't think we're horribly mismanaged. A few bad managerial decisions have been made at a time when finances are a problem. This has magnified the mistakes.

We were one good performance away from the Premiership again 18 months ago. The line between huge success and ugly failure is incredibly fine.

 

[cahill]

I agree with SwissBlade and Casper. A reflection of the malaise that's hit Sheffield. On the whole the prem is dominated by London and the North West with the West Midlands getting a look in this season. All three regions with a large population.

 

[beightonblade]

bang on the button lenners !

 

[Paulus]

I'm sorry to say it but I do think the football reflects the City. In the mid 70's the City had an edge to it but also a confidence, a sense of humour and a sense of community the last 30 odd years have done for the majority of this. The city's full of miserable buggers looking to blame someone else these days.

 

[Cheshire Cat]

Unfortunately the state of our football team mirrors entirely the state of our city. Compare our economy and commerce with similar sized UK cities and it really is embarrassing. Even taking Birmingham and Manchester out of the equation with their much larger conurbation, cities like Leeds, Newcastle, Bristol, Nottingham left us behind years ago.

Bang on the button. For some reason in spite of the size of the city the attitude and feeling is much more in line with that of a big town than 5th, 6th or 7th biggest city in the UK. None of the swagger or ambition of Leeds or Newcastle (unfounded or not) - our support and our clubs reflect it. That said, I miss the culture and the humour daily, in spite of my daily ration of scouse wit and Mancunian banter.

 

[Kenilworth]

You get what you vote for. Half the problem is the left wing political landscape and the heavy reliance on public sector jobs. Then there is the piggy dominated power base and the purely destructive envy that results from socialist politics that prevents any individuals running successful businesses in the city leading to mediocrity all round.

Sheffield has always been too up itself to the point it actually discourages private investment. That's why the city has few people who have any real wealth to speak of and that means there are no sugar daddies (e.g. Jack Walker or Dave Wheelan John Moore) with a wedge burning a hole in their pocket. Other cities encouraged the birth of new companies, new industries and new opportunities whereas Sheffield kept itself in the dark ages.

Mediocrity rules in the city and it's football teams. Get used to it. It won't change unless the commerce changes.
Think about it. Where did McCabe make his money? Not in Sheffield that's a dead cert. There are many on here who moan about the lack of investment etc. but I cannot see a long queue waiting to step in to replace him. The rest of us haven't got a bean to spare to warrant that scale of investment. We can only just about pick and choose the games we attend and many of us wont justify that at the moment the way the team is playing.

We're shit and we know we are. It ain't going to change without significant investment.
Get used to it. We have a mediocre team that reflects an unambitious city with a council that actually is a REAL Mill Stone around the neck.

 

[mickle-blade]

Birthplace of the modern game, one of the country's biggest cities, more than 40,000 combined average gates and yet not a decent football club between United and Wednesday.
Absolute shambles. McCabe and whoever runs Wednesday these days ought to be ashamed that this is the best we can do compared to Bolton, Wigan, Blackburn, Stoke, Blackpool, QPR, Cardiff, Coventry, Doncaster, Derby, Reading etc, etc, etc.

While a merger is never going to happen.
I would not be against SUFC 'saving them extinction' by buying them out and selling The Sty for development.
After all the land must be worth a bob or two with planning permission.
We could then have one team in Sheffield playing in red and white stripes called of course Sheffield United (that's what it would be) playing at Bramall Lane.
We could make a small concession to the massives illustrious history by having a bit of blue built in to the kit. Perhaps a small pinstripe on the socks somewhere. Nothing too obvious though.
We would also have to allocate a small section of the ground to the disaffected on match days. Upper tier at the Bramall Lane stand should be enough, leaving the bottom tier for away supporters.
And, just a thought, we could play our midweek home matches on a Wednesday night as a sort of memorial for them. Only for one season though.
We could then have one team that will compete at the top level with regular gates inxs of 40k and the birthplace of football will be able to compete at a better level.
Then we can get rid of the 'Global Brand' liability and rid ourselves of this foolish interest in foreign clubs. Not exactly producing a lot for us is it !
So all we need is McCabe to dig a bit deeper in his pocket and step in to complete the takeover at the Sty.
Thinking about it, there isn't a decent hotel on that side of town so McCabe may be tempted.

 

[lenners]

I don't think there's been anything approaching socialist politics in Sheffield for about 20 years.
But if you thought about it, prior to then Sheffield would at least stand up for itself, did have some pride.
Now we have a deputy prime minister with a constituency in Sheffield who can't even stick up for our own historic industry.

 

[oldblade]

Interesting thoughts. Not shameful at all, just a snapshot of a certain time. If anything its a reflection on the city that its not made itself attractive to outside investment since the early 90's.

I don't believe its about football its about the city and its links.

When we went down, we were so similar to Chelsea in so many ways, yet they attracted a big time backer, just like Man City, Pompey, Wigan, Blackburn, Man U, Leicester, Derby, Liverpool, QPR etc.

Others have slowly built, where were Burnley a few years ago, where were Bolton? Charlton spent many years in the big time, now look at them.

For every Donny and Blackpool there's a Southampton and Bradford...

The fact is that we, currently seem to be doing ok without major investment.

We have Premier League facilities at the lane and shirecliffe. We can't buy players, but players like Slew, Chappel, Lowton are making 1st team in roads...

Our time in the top flight will come, our time in the lower leagues will also come, but our desire for top flight should not put our status in this division at risk...

Just a question, how many teams have not been relegated from the Premier League? I.e. How many clubs have been there from the 1st day when Deano slammed home two against Man U?

The thing is though SwissBlade, that snapshot has been a pretty regular state of affairs for far too many years. And not just since the premier league was formed. Since the second world war there have been 65 seasons (including this season). United have spent a total of 23 of those seasons in the top division, and Wednesday have had 32 seasons. And between us we have won a total of 1 league cup since the 1930s.

Also, I do not think we are doing okay at all. Our status as a championship club is already very much at risk. If something doesn't change pretty drastically our time in the lower leagues will come far more swiftly than any return to the premier league. The side is not good, and apart from the Burnley game there is little evidence that it has any stomach for a fight. I doubt that it has what it takes to survive a relegation struggle.

In answer to your question I think only 7 teams have not been relegated from the premier league since it's formation in 1992-3 season: Arsenal, Tottenham Hotspur, Chelsea, Aston Villa, Everton, Liverpool and Manchester United.

 

[Kenilworth]

I don't think there's been anything approaching socialist politics in Sheffield for about 20 years.
But if you thought about, prior to then Sheffield would at least stand up for itself, did have some pride.
Now we have a deputy prime minister with a constituency in Sheffield who can't even stick up for our own historic industry.

When do you think it all started lenners?
The malaise has been there for years. We have no business of any worth in the City so no one with any personal fortune to play with. Liverpool would have been nothing without Littlewoods Pools, Balckburn would have been nowhere without Jack Walker. Where are their equivalents in Sheffield. One of the reasons I left Sheffield 28 years ago was to get work.
Leeds has always been more forward thinking than Sheffield. It too had large industries coming to the end but had the foresight to encourage replacements. Their plight now is down to complete misanagement but they have won stuff and we have won ........ SFA. You have to ask if Sheffield had anything like the same vision would the two clubs be as bad as they are?

We are in the wilderness years. Have been for many many years and will be for many years to come.
For the size if city and the size of fan base Utd have been a massive, massive failure.
Still won't stop me supporting them as they are my team. I just see no light at the end of this very long tunnel and fear that even if I walked it for the rest if my life I will never see so much as a candle in the wind.

 

[Pittsburg Blade]

When do you think it all started lenners?
The malaise has been there for years. We have no business of any worth in the City so no one with any personal fortune to play with. Liverpool would have been nothing without Littlewoods Pools, Balckburn would have been nowhere without Jack Walker. Where are their equivalents in Sheffield

I suggest McCabe comes over to visit Pittsburgh. Similar run-down northern red brick town with a history of failed steelworks. Still managed to produce the Steelers and the Penguins taking the Superbowl and Stanley Cup in the same season (we'll not mention the baseball team though...). Steelers again looking fearsome this season with a fascinating game against the New Orleans Saints coming up later today.

 

[Nick Jansky]

We have no business of any worth in the City so no one with any personal fortune to play with.

As somebody who has spent the last 20 years advising predominantly large businesses in Sheffield and beyond, I have to say that is tosh. Sheffield has some cracking businesses, but increasingly they are in overseas ownership. To pick an example that isn't, SIG has a turnover of approx £3bn. There is certainly wealth in this city, and I am afraid you are typical of the people, usually those that have left, who talk the city down. It doesn't punch its weight economically, but it is nowhere near as bad as the sorry picture you paint.

 

[lenners]

United have under-achieved throughout nearly 40 years I've supported them, bar the early 70s, a period under Bassett and maybe a couple of flashes from Warnock.
Wednesday have been better and achieved much more in the 80s and 90s though they've been a car crash for a decade now.
But I don't buy the city not making stuff argument. There's sod all left in Stoke, Wigan, Blackburn, Derby and plenty more places but better run, more successful football teams.
And plenty of northern cities rely on big numbers of public sector jobs, not just Sheffield.

 

[boo radley]

You could be on to a great point here Len and others who said its a wider problem.
I live in S25( Dinnington Anston Laughton). I have always lived here and went to school in Sheffield. I was very proud of Sheffield and surrounding area. I used to love going in to the city.
Now i only ever go to Sheffield to see my Team. I used to love the night life the shops and was even proud when the Tram was built. I used to park at the bottom of the parkway in that car park walk up the steps and in to MY CITY over the roundabout where the tram runs.
We have some supposed to be great things in our city - Institute of sport and other great sporting venues, a rich past and herritage. We all know facts about being the greenest city (vegitation wise), Peak district on our doorstep, Meadowhall/hell love it hate it, Full Monty? are proud to be called the Steel city. I am sure that when we go to other parts of the country or abroad we are proud to come from Sheffield and will defend against anyone Knocking it.
So why does it all seem so fragile and on the edge.
The craving and frustration we feel as Blades for our teams success does seem to be part of this fragile vunerability. We have a great big arena and are shit scared of Leeds building theirs.
We seem to be a city of little individual groups that never quite make a community status. So after we had our Steel industry killed and our pits we still after all this time have not got our drive together.
one good point that has been raised lately, Our massive student population and all the good that that brings. we are the city that retains most after graduation because they love it (and no they are not all scroungers).
Maybe what i said was all crap but it is how I feel onthe points brought up.

 

[Pittsburg Blade]

Sheffield has some cracking businesses, but increasingly they are in overseas ownership. QUOTE]

Every major company is owned by the shareholders and run from London, New York or Dusseldorf etc. Doesn't mean to say investment isn't there for well run companies. There might be just a lack of talent for attracting the investment.
By the way, a search for SIG on google will only find lots of hits for SIG Sauer etc. They can only be found if you specify SIG Sheffield or SIG plc.

 

[Casper]

As somebody who has spent the last 20 years advising predominantly large businesses in Sheffield and beyond, I have to say that is tosh. Sheffield has some cracking businesses, but increasingly they are in overseas ownership. To pick an example that isn't, SIG has a turnover of approx £3bn. There is certainly wealth in this city, and I am afraid you are typical of the people, usually those that have left, who talk the city down. It doesn't punch its weight economically, but it is nowhere near as bad as the sorry picture you paint.

I can only comment from my own personal bubble. I travel all over the uk with work, and the difference between Sheffield and virtually every other major city obvious for all to see.

If you want IT training for example, you go to anyone of probably 12 - 15 cities, is Sheffield one of them?.....No. Just look at the traffic queues of Sheffielders heading out of our city on a morning and returning in the early evening.....then go to Leeds, Newcastle, Bristol, Edinburgh etc and see if its the same.

Nah, im still proud of my roots, but i think as a city we have been let down big time.

 

[alcoblade]

As somebody who has spent the last 20 years advising predominantly large businesses in Sheffield and beyond, I have to say that is tosh. Sheffield has some cracking businesses, but increasingly they are in overseas ownership. To pick an example that isn't, SIG has a turnover of approx £3bn. There is certainly wealth in this city, and I am afraid you are typical of the people, usually those that have left, who talk the city down. It doesn't punch its weight economically, but it is nowhere near as bad as the sorry picture you paint.

Yes, agreed. I think it's moved forward very well over the last decade, but from a very poor base. And people love the city. Student retention is one of the highest, if not the highest in the country.

I'm not "technically" from Sheffield but I'm really proud to declare myself so.

UTB

 

[Kenilworth]

As somebody who has spent the last 20 years advising predominantly large businesses in Sheffield and beyond, I have to say that is tosh. Sheffield has some cracking businesses, but increasingly they are in overseas ownership. To pick an example that isn't, SIG has a turnover of approx £3bn. There is certainly wealth in this city, and I am afraid you are typical of the people, usually those that have left, who talk the city down. It doesn't punch its weight economically, but it is nowhere near as bad as the sorry picture you paint.

Think that proves my point. You only mentioned one business. Several others in foreign ownership. Attitude of people who have left the city because they felt there was no prospect of earning a decent living there. Hmmmn I think you are deluding yourself. As much as I admire your role and your devotion I feel you are pissing in the wind and those in power who have had the control of the city in their hands over the last 30 more years have royally screwed your pooch.

Look at Vancouver. Works for EA Games. UK main office for them is in Guildford. Why not Sheffield?
There is a huge games company in the midlands founded by two brothers who employ many people in highly skilled jobs that pay a good wage. My impression of Sheffield is that it would prefer to get a government department or shopping centre to employ people. All well and good for good steady jobs but the real prosperity comes from indigenous private industry. That is the net contributor. That is where the money is made and remains in the UK economy. Foreign ownership takes the profits away and Govnt or tertiary industry is a sink not a source of real wealth.

Good luck in your job. I really hope you do well but it's a bit like the contrast between the commercial department at Man Utd compared to that at SUFC. You may passionately believe in it but you never going to aspire to the same level are you?

Sorry to piss on your parade but I think you need new glasses.

 

[alcoblade]

The award for most patronising post of the year has just been bagged.


UTB

 

[bricktop]

There is still passion in the city.

This is a prime example, the perpetrators should be awarded the freedom of the city

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/top-st...m-so-hated-voters-spit-at-me-115875-22677401/

 

[bladeinspaceandtime]

I have to say that I feel a little sad and embarrased when I walk round Sheffield. The Moor is a complete dump and the rest of the city centre isn't much better...the money thats been squandered over the years by the city council (Hole in the Road, Town Hall extension etc.) borders on criminal.

 

[Nick Jansky]

Good luck in your job. I really hope you do well but it's a bit like the contrast between the commercial department at Man Utd compared to that at SUFC. You may passionately believe in it but you never going to aspire to the same level are you?

Sorry to piss on your parade but I think you need new glasses.

Well actually, the "beyond" bit is where the majority of my work is, not in Sheffield. I travel throughout the UK, but work with some world class businesses in Sheffield as well. So you haven't pissed on my parade at all, I am well aware of how the business environment in Sheffield compares to elsewhere. And its certainly not as bad as you make out.

I moved away from Sheffield too, and lived in the south for 12 years. Very nice, but its not Sheffield. I could earn a lot more money in London, but not for me, thanks. Sheffield is a great place to live, I prefer the way of life here. I no longer work for the Man Utd of my profession, granted, (although it was the Arsenal that I worked for, rather than ManUre) but it suits me, ta. If that means that I am symptomatic of Sheffield's parochialism, then great, but there is a lot more to life than simply scrabbling after every penny you can.