Coronavirus - a real season spoiling threat?

[Oldun]

Really like your post. Gives a fascinating insight into what those at the coal-face, treating the infection, are dealing with.

I travelled to Switzerland today, I was supposed to attending an infection Congress, I chaired it last year but this time I am just here as a delegate. It was cancelled a week ago due to an infection! (Coronavirus).

I have other business here so I kept my travel plans as they were. In any case, it’s not a bad place to spend a few days. Bright sunshine here and 18c. (Amuses me when people think Switzerland is a cold country! It is, in the mountains, but it’s generally much milder than the UK).

Manchester airport was deserted though - never ever seen it like that before!

This makes quite difficult reading, but gives a first hand account of how things are in Italy. It’s a pretty graphic and scary account.

 

[Blade 1971]

A friend of mine I went to school with emigrated to Italy thirty years ago. He works as a doctor at a hospital in Bozen, South Tirol. They are currently experiencing the start of the more serious wave of cases, but are nothing as bad yet as in, say, Milano.

He says it is like nothing he has ever known because doctors that have never really seen themselves as making large-scale decisions about life or death on an industrial scale are increasingly placed in a position to just do that. The mild cases are just that, mild. Then there are cases that a person will clearly survive with certain discomfort, if only they are given the beds or the respirators. And then there are tons of people who need more service than can be offered to all. So you are having to chance it with several patients each day, knowing your decision who gets machinery for how long will have severe consequences for the ones without access. Death being one of those potential consequences.

That does not yet touch on the ethics of quarantining healthy people who carry the virus on the staff if civilization in the hospital is stretched or breaking down. He says that there are now areas of Italy where doctors who carry it or have mild symptoms still work in order to stem the ballooning figures. It IS a horrible situation, the like of which he has not experienced before, having been born in the late sixties.

Now the Italians may have been tardy or unprepared. Unlike other countries they also probably never knew patient 1, let alone patient 1 to 100. So they could not contain it early or trace it once it raised its head.

But he is awaiting his own test result today as a colleague tested positive. So his advice was to take it seriously early on as the hard cases of the ones who do not make it are nasty deaths. They are in pain breathing, with their lungs filling up with slime that you need to get out with machinery or you literally die of not having enough oxygen in your body.

In his words, it is not as much the disease itself as the flood of same symptoms of something normally relatively rare or contained that strangles the life out of the staff and the system.

While the numbers are still low, personally, I would limit my non-vital fun. I probably would currently forfeit the movies. I walk or cycle to work even on grey and horrible days, rather than public transport. But the stuff that makes my life happy and is needed to compensate for the pain of existing - notably, taking the kids to their various fun activities and sports, the odd concerts I have tickets for and the Blades matches - I will only stop engaging in if I either have first hand experience of the kind of squeeze my friend describes or the state takes the decision out of my hand.

Thanks for posting this. Hope your friend is OK.

 

[Maidenhead]

Fine, but I don't understand what you're saying about "on a football forum" if it isn't that the opinions posted here are pretty worthless.

Which in the real world they most definitely are.

(Mine included)

 

[guancheblade]

6507 People in Britain killed themselves in 2018, that's nearly 18 a day.

The "Corona Virus" has so far killed 2 people in Britain.

I wish people would take stock of what they are panicking about.

Every mega killer at one point had only killed just "2 people"

It's early days, but the potential for disaster is significant. Being dismissive will only guarantee this thing causes maximum damage.

 

[blade too long]

The average age of those that have died is 81.
Just ban senior blades. . Sorted

 

[blade too long]

Can someone explain to me why 20 to 30k gathering outside at a football match once z fortnght is a danger but 30 to 40 thousand visiting Meadowhall every dsy isnt.
There's more contact made when people are trying on clothes and shoes others have handled or contact from a tussle in Asda or Morrisons for the last hand sanitiser

 

[raimond]

Just realised I typed A when I meant D, I’m deficient in D. FFS.

The furniture shop?

 

[Ball_Sup (Phil)]

Can someone explain to me why 20 to 30k gathering outside at a football match once z fortnght is a danger but 30 to 40 thousand visiting Meadowhall every dsy isnt.
There's more contact made when people are trying on clothes and shoes others have handled or contact from a tussle in Asda or Morrisons for the last hand sanitiser

The UK have shut down neither football nor shops
Italy have shut down both

 

[Oldun]

The UK have shut down neither football nor shops
Italy have shut down both

And we will shut both down in the near future.

 

[blade too long]

The UK have shut down neither football nor shops
Italy have shut down both

But Italy have the highest oldest age group . The average age of those who have died is 81 . Life expectancy in italy is 85 compared to 80 here so they are going to have more deaths

 

[Ball_Sup (Phil)]

But Italy have the highest oldest age group . The average age of those who have died is 81 . Life expectancy in italy is 85 compared to 80 here so they arecgoing to have more deaths

Sorry. I thought your previous post was going down the path of "why are they closing football, but not Meadowhall?"
I was explaining they're not. I've misunderstood

 

[Roygbiv]

 

[Roygbiv]

But Italy have the highest oldest age group . The average age of those who have died is 81 . Life expectancy in italy is 85 compared to 80 here so they are going to have more deaths

The number of deaths is also down to the fact they are no longer treating anyone above 60 due to being overwhelmed as younger people are neededing treatment and have more chance of survival.

'Healthcare on brink of collapsing': Doctors share stories from inside the Italy coronavirus quarantine

I'm just back from Italy and "enjoying" my first day of self-isolation. Getting a real picture of how bad the situation is, especially in Lombardy and the north, has been really difficult for TV news because movement is so restricted, access to the overwhelmed hospitals impossible and the...

www.itv.com

 

[blade too long]

Sorry. I thought your previous post was going down the path of "why are they closing football, but not Meadowhall?"
I was explaining they're not. I've misunderstood

No I want to know in a country where 68 million people are huddled togethrr how on earth are we going to stop gatherings of any sort. How many is too many . 30 k in a stadium made for 30 k or 200 in a packed Nandos. Made for 150. Do we put ourselves in more danger trying on a pair of shoes in an empty shoe shop someone else has handled. Was 10 to 15 k fans outside the Mestella in Valencia crammed in bars watching the game . Surely was more practical to let them in

 

[Sheffsteel]

The average age of those that have died is 81.
Just ban senior blades. . Sorted

It’s not even average 81 year olds who are dying....every person who has died in the UK already had health problems before catching the virus.
I heard someone say the other day it’s almost like a natural culling of the weak and elderly.

The people who need protecting won’t be healthy enough to attend matches....however there could be plenty of carriers who will no doubt come into contact with vulnerable relatives or working in hospitals or care homes passing it on to the vulnerable.

The simple answer is to close down anywhere we’re theres a large crowd but where do you draw the line?
Football matches fair enough but what about all airports? what about train travel/ the London Underground?
What about shopping centres? What about night clubs? What about large pubs?

Think it’s important to study the implications of any action.
Ive heard it mentioned matches should be played behind closed doors but an expert said the virus was difficult to catch outside.
If matches are televised then isn’t that more dangerous as more people will watch the match in the pubs? As I said should all pubs be closed down?

 

[Hamburg Blade]

Can someone explain to me why 20 to 30k gathering outside at a football match once z fortnght is a danger but 30 to 40 thousand visiting Meadowhall every dsy isnt.
There's more contact made when people are trying on clothes and shoes others have handled or contact from a tussle in Asda or Morrisons for the last hand sanitiser

Because we're all quite happy to see Meadowhallers die, horribly and slowly. It's a deliberate trap.

 

[blade too long]

You cant in a country with 68m people get the neccesary 200 meter space between everyone so they cant pass on a virus.
Hospitals are full of people . How many are in Hallamshire hospital in a 24 hour day.
There's going to be contact there . We should just carry on as usual and be pragmatic about it. People will die. But people die every day. It may come as a shock to some but it's a neccesary evil .

 

[Rodley]

Cancel Euro 2020 for a year and postpone league games for a few weeks

 

[Oldun]

You cant in a country with 68m people get the neccesary 200 meter space between everyone so they cant pass on a virus.
Hospitals are full of people . How many are in Hallamshire hospital in a 24 hour day.
There's going to be contact there . We should just carry on as usual and be pragmatic about it. People will die. But people die every day. It may come as a shock to some but it's a neccesary evil .

Wow! It’s 2 metres not 200. And we can stop all non-essential visits to the Hallamshire. And yes we do all die in the end but it’s great not to die if we can help it.

 

[Ball_Sup (Phil)]

 

[hidesbehindapseudonym]

It’s not even average 81 year olds who are dying....every person who has died in the UK already had health problems before catching the virus.
I heard someone say the other day it’s almost like a natural culling of the weak and elderly.

The people who need protecting won’t be healthy enough to attend matches....however there could be plenty of carriers who will no doubt come into contact with vulnerable relatives or working in hospitals or care homes passing it on to the vulnerable.

The simple answer is to close down anywhere we’re theres a large crowd but where do you draw the line?
Football matches fair enough but what about all airports? what about train travel/ the London Underground?
What about shopping centres? What about night clubs? What about large pubs?

Think it’s important to study the implications of any action.
Ive heard it mentioned matches should be played behind closed doors but an expert said the virus was difficult to catch outside.
If matches are televised then isn’t that more dangerous as more people will watch the match in the pubs? As I said should all pubs be closed down?

Yes pubs will be closed down and all games behind closed doors. The sooner the better.

 

[Bruce Wayne]

Yes pubs will be closed down and all games behind closed doors. The sooner the better.

 

[Paulus]

According to the figures from Italy it's killing about 7% of infections which is extremely serious. Are the figures right? well the deaths probably are, the number of cases less likely, let's hope so in any case. One possibility that might be making it worse in France and Italy is smoking. It was always the case that even when smoking was really common here it went up another level in those countries and even today smoking is still more common there.

 

[YES Blade]

Cancel Euro 2020 for a year and postpone league games for a few weeks

Fuck that! I’ll lose £100s in flights I’ve booked, which I won’t need!

 

[Bruce Wayne]

According to the figures from Italy it's killing about 7% of infections which is extremely serious. Are the figures right? well the deaths probably are, the number of cases less likely, let's hope so in any case. One possibility that might be making it worse in France and Italy is smoking. It was always the case that even when smoking was really common here it went up another level in those countries and even today smoking is still more common there.

I'm fucked, still on 20 a day. I thought lung cancer was a shitter.

 

[Berkshire Blade]

Life is about to change. Games behind closed doors, pubs banned from showing games is just the start.

And it'll be back in the autumn too.

 

[Klaatu Barada Nikto]

View attachment 73575

Good, but doubtless people will moan that a football game is more important than containing/delaying a pandemic.

 

[Bruce Wayne]

No point going on is there

 

[FallowfieldBlade]

According to the figures from Italy it's killing about 7% of infections which is extremely serious. Are the figures right? well the deaths probably are, the number of cases less likely, let's hope so in any case. One possibility that might be making it worse in France and Italy is smoking. It was always the case that even when smoking was really common here it went up another level in those countries and even today smoking is still more common there.

The figures are right but they’ll be way way more people with it.

Think it’s more like 1% still very very bad as it’s probably gonna affect millions

 

[YES Blade]

Good, but doubtless people will moan that a football game is more important than containing/delaying a pandemic.

The reason I get the arse about football being behind closed doors is the lack of consistency.

I can do my job from home, but the government aren’t telling employers to make this mandatory. So I’ll be in the office interacting with people from all parts of the country, but I’m not allowed to go to football!

If it’s such a big deal put the fucking country on lockdown! Don’t cherry pick which aspects of life we can and can’t do.