Bassett Warnock and Wilder top flight Promotion "similarities and differences"

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SelbyBlade

SelbyBlade

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I never saw the Harris promotion as we were already in the top flight when I was a nipper.
I was just thinking about some of the parallels and the differences between the three promotions.

Wilder - Bassett
Similarity
Both promoted quickly from tier 3 to tier 1
Both had a definite style (Wilders more classy)
Both great personalities with a good sense of humour
Differences
Bassett's style became easier to combat as time went on
Bassett had an over reliance on Brian Deane which meant when he left we were relegated whereas Wilder already has striking options and most positions well covered,

Wilder - Warnock
Similarity
Both Blades (at time of promotion)
Leeds were dropped into the playoffs and didn't get promoted.
Both have a sense of humour
Differnces
Wilder still a Blade
Wilder not all about himself
Wilder creates a great rapport with just about every section of the club instead of telling fans not to come
Wilder has 30K attendance in Prem and in League 1 and Championship
Wilder doesn't blame the ref for any setback


Any others relating to Promotion and the chances of remaining in the Prem?
 



SelbyBlade said:
I never saw the Harris promotion as we were already in the top flight when I was a nipper.
I was just thinking about some of the parallels and the differences between the three promotions.

Wilder - Bassett
Similarity
Both promoted quickly from tier 3 to tier 1
Both had a definite style (Wilders more classy)
Both great personalities with a good sense of humour
Differences
Bassett's style became easier to combat as time went on
Bassett had an over reliance on Brian Deane which meant when he left we were relegated whereas Wilder already has striking options and most positions well covered,

Wilder - Warnock
Similarity
Both Blades (at time of promotion)
Leeds were dropped into the playoffs and didn't get promoted.
Both have a sense of humour
Differnces
Wilder still a Blade
Wilder not all about himself
Wilder creates a great rapport with just about every section of the club instead of telling fans not to come
Wilder has 30K attendance in Prem and in League 1 and Championship
Wilder doesn't blame the ref for any setback


Any others relating to Promotion and the chances of remaining in the Prem?
Click to expand...

Wasn't a massive fan of Warnock but don't we tend to forget that he gave the club back some pride when we were in a bad place. For all his faults, one of the great all time Managers of SUFC, certainly gave me some of my best days.
 
SelbyBlade said:
I never saw the Harris promotion as we were already in the top flight when I was a nipper.
I was just thinking about some of the parallels and the differences between the three promotions.

Wilder - Bassett
Similarity
Both promoted quickly from tier 3 to tier 1
Both had a definite style (Wilders more classy)
Both great personalities with a good sense of humour
Differences
Bassett's style became easier to combat as time went on
Bassett had an over reliance on Brian Deane which meant when he left we were relegated whereas Wilder already has striking options and most positions well covered,

Wilder - Warnock
Similarity
Both Blades (at time of promotion)
Leeds were dropped into the playoffs and didn't get promoted.
Both have a sense of humour
Differnces
Wilder still a Blade
Wilder not all about himself
Wilder creates a great rapport with just about every section of the club instead of telling fans not to come
Wilder has 30K attendance in Prem and in League 1 and Championship
Wilder doesn't blame the ref for any setback


Any others relating to Promotion and the chances of remaining in the Prem?
Click to expand...

Warnock blamed everyone but himself not just the refs.
 
SelbyBlade said:
I never saw the Harris promotion as we were already in the top flight when I was a nipper.
I was just thinking about some of the parallels and the differences between the three promotions.

Wilder - Bassett
Similarity
Both promoted quickly from tier 3 to tier 1
Both had a definite style (Wilders more classy)
Both great personalities with a good sense of humour
Differences
Bassett's style became easier to combat as time went on
Bassett had an over reliance on Brian Deane which meant when he left we were relegated whereas Wilder already has striking options and most positions well covered,

Wilder - Warnock
Similarity
Both Blades (at time of promotion)
Leeds were dropped into the playoffs and didn't get promoted.
Both have a sense of humour
Differnces
Wilder still a Blade
Wilder not all about himself
Wilder creates a great rapport with just about every section of the club instead of telling fans not to come
Wilder has 30K attendance in Prem and in League 1 and Championship
Wilder doesn't blame the ref for any setback


Any others relating to Promotion and the chances of remaining in the Prem?
Click to expand...

Feels a tad like a go at Warnock, as per the post from crucialkneeligaman Warnock gave a lot to the club and some of my best memories, I will never forget the 2 - 1 against Leeds in the cup, or the semi finals against Forest/ Arsenal & Liverpool, plus some the best Characters and Players, Morgan, Jags Page, Tonge, Brownie, Alison, Peski, Kozluk, Paddy and so many more...

Yes his insistence on blaming everyone and everything for a loss was annoying and at times embarrassing, still gave us something to feel proud about.

Chris Wilder is a much different Manager, hopefully one that will be at the club for a very long time, he has given us something no other manager did before him, a new sense of identity, Innovators and creators, finally starting to lift the preconceived ideals of every other supporter, "Sheffield United, well they are a lump it up the field Long ball team"

Now we have people sitting up and taking notice, being mentioned with the likes of Pep and Beilsa as an innovator of the game, and rightly so.

So how this promotion feels different is that we go into the Premiership knowing we are forging a different route, last time felt like everyone was waiting for us to get battered and even before a ball got kicked many thought Warnock might not be the man for the job in the Prem.

This time I look forward to every game, last time I did not, and worried how we would fair, this time I feel like we can compete and hold our collective heads high.
 
One of the major differences between Wilder and Bassett and Warnock is the style of football.

We all know that Bassett's style was direct and although it wasn't pretty, it was effective for a while. Occasionally there were moments of skill or good play but for the most part it was basic stuff (maybe Garth Crooks has been watching old clips of us from 1991?)

I always felt that Warnock's style was Bassett+. Still quite direct, balls into the channels etc but a little bit more sophisticated.

Wilder's style is light years away from both of them. I don't think I need to explain it here but our style of play is modern, unique, effective and very good to watch.

If I could simplify it, I'd say that when I've watched us under Wilder and we've not played well, it's still by and large entertaining to watch, whereas when we played poor under Warnock and Bassett, it was truly awful to watch.
 
Sheffield United reluctantly gave permission last night for Portsmouth to speak to their manager Neil Warnock regarding the vacancy at Fratton Park created by the dismissal last week of Alain Perrin.

Warnock, who celebrates his 57th birthday today, has been the first choice of Portsmouth chairman Milan Mandaric since the sacking of Perrin but promotion hopefuls United resisted his overtures.

Now they have relented and a statement from Bramall Lane read: "After a long discussion and careful consideration Sheffield United have reluctantly agreed, conditional on suitable compensation, to make Neil Warnock available to speak to Portsmouth.

But along came Harry Redknapp and poor Neil had to stick it out with us. We achieved promotion that season, but this didn't help matters, after that, I thought 'does he really want to be here at BDTBL?' ... I recall many a FH Phone-In giving Warnock pelters, not just for this, but for the football we played. That promotion season was at times exciting, but don't let us fool ourselves into believing we were watching Cruyff's technical football.
 
crucialkneeligaman said:
Wasn't a massive fan of Warnock but don't we tend to forget that he gave the club back some pride when we were in a bad place. For all his faults, one of the great all time Managers of SUFC, certainly gave me some of my best days.
Click to expand...

Quite a lot of my mates started going again under Warnock and they’ll all say ‘because he gave us back our pride’. Yeah he’s a gobby prat at times and made some poor decisions but he gets as much grief as failures like Clough and Adkins.
 
SelbyBlade said:
I never saw the Harris promotion as we were already in the top flight when I was a nipper.
I was just thinking about some of the parallels and the differences between the three promotions.

Wilder - Bassett
Similarity
Both promoted quickly from tier 3 to tier 1
Both had a definite style (Wilders more classy)
Both great personalities with a good sense of humour
Differences
Bassett's style became easier to combat as time went on
Bassett had an over reliance on Brian Deane which meant when he left we were relegated whereas Wilder already has striking options and most positions well covered,

Wilder - Warnock
Similarity
Both Blades (at time of promotion)
Leeds were dropped into the playoffs and didn't get promoted.
Both have a sense of humour
Differnces
Wilder still a Blade
Wilder not all about himself
Wilder creates a great rapport with just about every section of the club instead of telling fans not to come
Wilder has 30K attendance in Prem and in League 1 and Championship
Wilder doesn't blame the ref for any setback


Any others relating to Promotion and the chances of remaining in the Prem?
Click to expand...

Wilder has been backed in the Prem, unfortunately in his few seasons in the top flight, Bassett wasn't backed at all, in fact the shoe string budget he had seemed to get less and less as the seasons passed.

Also the talk about the style of football. We play on billiard tables these days compared to back then. Look at the highlights of any Bassett game, the pitches (irrespective of where they are) are an absolute joke. All passes were percentage passes unless they were in the air cos the pitches deviated the ball here there and fucking everywhere.
 
Lazarus said:
Sheffield United reluctantly gave permission last night for Portsmouth to speak to their manager Neil Warnock regarding the vacancy at Fratton Park created by the dismissal last week of Alain Perrin.

Warnock, who celebrates his 57th birthday today, has been the first choice of Portsmouth chairman Milan Mandaric since the sacking of Perrin but promotion hopefuls United resisted his overtures.

Now they have relented and a statement from Bramall Lane read: "After a long discussion and careful consideration Sheffield United have reluctantly agreed, conditional on suitable compensation, to make Neil Warnock available to speak to Portsmouth.

But along came Harry Redknapp and poor Neil had to stick it out with us. We achieved promotion that season, but this didn't help matters, after that, I thought 'does he really want to be here at BDTBL?' ... I recall many a FH Phone-In giving Warnock pelters, not just for this, but for the football we played. That promotion season was at times exciting, but don't let us fool ourselves into believing we were watching Cruyff's technical football.
Click to expand...

Has anyone ever actually said ‘we played good football under Warnock’?
 
what sounded like a interesting thread. actually turned into Warnock bashing which has been become "cool" because people have issues with him 12yrs after the event.

warnock was a fantastic manager at the time. in 1999 we were on our knees if wasn't for his reign we wouldn't have modern sheff utd that we have now. attendance under 10,000. high wage £2,000, he took to 2 semi finals & play off final, PL promotion. the 03 play off semi final is potentially the greatest game Ive seen live. then there was 2 Leeds games, Arsenal, Liverpool & then v wednedsay, 4 wins. 1 defeat in 9, he did double over Wednesday. I never get all this Warnock bashing he great me some amazing moments at blade that I will never forget or be embarrassed to say I enjoyed

as i said about Pulis no stoke fans were moaning when they playing in a FA cup final & in Europa League
 
John Harris produced 2 very good teams to win promotion to the top division, both played good football, but were quite different. The first time, the team was built on a really good, experienced defensive unit, with outstanding individuals such as Joe and Graham Shaw, and Hodgy. The second time round, it was much more of a flair team, with Currie, Woodward and Salmons in particular being capable of creating havoc. On each occasion they promised much, but failed in the end (lack of investment?) to progress to being a consistently top 10 team. Plenty of contrasts with the other managers discussed on this thread; let's hope the next contrast is with Wilder, who establishes us as a top 10 club...
 
Time can certainly affect memoires.
Bassett played long ball yes, but bearing in mind the (lack of) money made available to him he had to work with what was available to him within his budget so missing out the average quality midfield to get the ball to the exceptional front two worked at the time and while it was not pretty it was exciting for the most part.
Warnock was similarly restricted by the budget but while we did lump it at times we also played some decent stuff and the Brown/Tongue midfield wasn't the worst I've seen.
CW has had to get us where we are on comparatively low budgets but playing much more attractive football, but now we are here we have the luxury of PL money available way beyond anything Bassett, Warnock and Harris could ever have dreamed of and a boardroom that, despite the ongoing ownership saga, ahave given CW the sort of backing he needs to stand a chance of consolidating our PL status.
Tactically CW is a class above the other two and he represents our best chance of becoming an established top flight club, but don't dismiss what Bassett and Warnock did out of hand. While both Bassett and Warnock both ended up being relegated there were some fairly exceptional circumstances at the end of both those seasons. I for one enjoyed the previous visits to the top flight and look forward to this visit hopefully being for much longer.
 
You Fill Up My Senses said:
Time can certainly affect memoires.
Bassett played long ball yes, but bearing in mind the (lack of) money made available to him he had to work with what was available to him within his budget so missing out the average quality midfield to get the ball to the exceptional front two worked at the time and while it was not pretty it was exciting for the most part.
Warnock was similarly restricted by the budget but while we did lump it at times we also played some decent stuff and the Brown/Tongue midfield wasn't the worst I've seen.
CW has had to get us where we are on comparatively low budgets but playing much more attractive football, but now we are here we have the luxury of PL money available way beyond anything Bassett, Warnock and Harris could ever have dreamed of and a boardroom that, despite the ongoing ownership saga, ahave given CW the sort of backing he needs to stand a chance of consolidating our PL status.
Tactically CW is a class above the other two and he represents our best chance of becoming an established top flight club, but don't dismiss what Bassett and Warnock did out of hand. While both Bassett and Warnock both ended up being relegated there were some fairly exceptional circumstances at the end of both those seasons. I for one enjoyed the previous visits to the top flight and look forward to this visit hopefully being for much longer.
Click to expand...
It’s worth pointing out that Bassett couldn’t have done what Wilder is doing and nor could Wilder if he was a manager in 1990.

All but the very best defenders were kick it and head it types, the pitches were appalling. The academies have been trying to produce ‘technical’ players, in all positions, for ten years or more, with huge amounts of investment behind them. Every player that comes through the academy system is technically good, it’s a question of finding those with the right character and personality, who’ll fit in, do as he’s told and work hard for the team.

Where Bassett and Wilder are similar, is in recognising what qualities are needed for a specific role and how to blend a group of players so the whole is greater than the sum of its parts. They both have a way of playing and found players that suited their systems perfectly.
 



You Fill Up My Senses said:
Time can certainly affect memoires.
Bassett played long ball yes, but bearing in mind the (lack of) money made available to him he had to work with what was available to him within his budget so missing out the average quality midfield to get the ball to the exceptional front two worked at the time and while it was not pretty it was exciting for the most part.
Warnock was similarly restricted by the budget but while we did lump it at times we also played some decent stuff and the Brown/Tongue midfield wasn't the worst I've seen.
CW has had to get us where we are on comparatively low budgets but playing much more attractive football, but now we are here we have the luxury of PL money available way beyond anything Bassett, Warnock and Harris could ever have dreamed of and a boardroom that, despite the ongoing ownership saga, ahave given CW the sort of backing he needs to stand a chance of consolidating our PL status.
Tactically CW is a class above the other two and he represents our best chance of becoming an established top flight club, but don't dismiss what Bassett and Warnock did out of hand. While both Bassett and Warnock both ended up being relegated there were some fairly exceptional circumstances at the end of both those seasons. I for one enjoyed the previous visits to the top flight and look forward to this visit hopefully being for much longer.
Click to expand...
I would just add the observation that though Wilder has spent a fortune this year by our standards, it is nowhere near what many of the other PL clubs have spent. We need several years in the PL, or a billionaire owner, to compete financially. Harris, Bassett, Warnock and Wilder have all had limited resources; Bassett had the least?
 
In defence of Warnock, he had a lot of bad luck. Decisions that didn't go our way that should (Blackburn away springs to mind). Saying that, he did sign some absolute shit ... Driftwood, Davis, Luton Skeleton.
 
BushBlade said:
Has anyone ever actually said ‘we played good football under Warnock’?
Click to expand...
Although I only had negatives for Wanock in my post I was talking about promotion and staying up chances. The triple assault season actually had some good football with Tonge Nuddy Browny McCall as well as the more direct players such as Chief. It worked and was a phenomenal season for football entertainment. The OP didn't start out as a Warnock bash but the positives from Wilder really do contrast with Warnock.
 
I can only guess at how good a Bassett team with investment and retaining their stars would have been. He didn’t just lump it up, he believed in getting it wide and putting quality crosses in. That’s where it comes from today, although now they look far more for gaps on the deck.
The best football played under Warnock was when McCall was influencing tactics. We seemed to win and get the ball down better like today.
Maybe we can only compare at the end of the season. A lot of water ...
 
Took him 6 years to get us up was it? Lucky not to get sacked before the cup run, remember coming out of the Walsall home game thinking he’d be on his way.
It was always all about him, he used the big Blade tag to serve a purpose and tried to leave his beloved Blades at a critical moment.
Yes we had some great times but as a manager and a bloke and a Blade, Wilder is a different class.
 
All were great at the time and that for me is all you can judge them on. Don't get me wrong I love a bit of skill but I watch sport for the excitement. I have seen some epic 0-0 draws following the Blades over the years, but switch off watching whichever 2 top team cancel each other out. I came to Sheffield with us in the third div so top flight football was superbly exciting under Bassett. I had moved away from Sheffield by the time Warnock came on the scene but my wife switched to being a blade because again it was exciting to watch. Now we have both the skill levels and the excitement with potentially our 2 most exciting players (Mouset and Morrison) haven't even started. The stick that Vinny Jones and Monty get these days are also unwarranted for me as they enabled others to do their thing, somebody had to do Glyn Hodges workload.
 
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