Wilder and youth

[Bladeinleeds]

First of all - let me clarify this isn’t a criticism of wilder. The results more than bare out that it’s worked out. That’s should go with out saying...

However, looking at the stats last season we didn’t give a single minute to a player under 23 that we own. That has to be a worry

Obviously the reason for some of the sales I.e Adams, DCL, Ramsdale, Brooks were forced on us either by the player or our league 1 position

However, Was it a mistake to let the likes of whiteman, Reed etc go so early on in their careers. Wouldn’t a loan have made more sense so that we wouldn’t be left with Lundstram as our only cover across midfield? These would certainly be in and around the squad now - and actually whiteman in particular has been doing well in league one.

Just feel we could use these numbers as there doesn’t really seem to be anyone else of note coming through to bolster the squad.

Don’t know what other people’s thoughts are?

 

[knowsnowt]

Bloody hell. Read the thread title and thought this was going to be about a sex scandal!
Phew!

 

[Liaminho9]

First of all - let me clarify this isn’t a criticism of wilder. The results more than bare out that it’s worked out. That’s should go with out saying...

However, looking at the stats last season we didn’t give a single minute to a player under 23 that we own. That has to be a worry

Obviously the reason for some of the sales I.e Adams, DCL, Ramsdale, Brooks were forced on us either by the player or our league 1 position

However, Was it a mistake to let the likes of whiteman, Reed etc go so early on in their careers. Wouldn’t a loan have made more sense so that we wouldn’t be left with Lundstram as our only cover across midfield? These would certainly be in and around the squad now - and actually whiteman in particular has been doing well in league one.

Just feel we could use these numbers as there doesn’t really seem to be anyone else of note coming through to bolster the squad.

Don’t know what other people’s thoughts are?

I'm sure Pinchy will be along soon to respond.

"Reed" is one of his trigger words.

 

[Woodwardfan]

Tin hat firmly fixed - I sincerely believe Louis Read and Ben Whiteman would be good value in a P.L. squad of 23/25 and by now would have come back from loans at other clubs with loads of 1st team playing time. Whiteman was Player of the Season at Donny who made the play-offs.

Bringing youngsters through is cost efficient and morale-boosting. Chelsea have learned their lessons it seems and the pressure of short term results happens at all levels.

Well find it hard to make up the numbers this summer.

Are they good enough? That's a matter of opinion but I reckon they would not let anybody down, indeed Read could flourish in the P.L. I'd love to see him playing with our current players.

Post from this morning.

 

[Berkshire Blade]

Other than the obvious sales to Premier league clubs none of them were good enough for the championship let alone Premier league.

 

[coolhandluke]

Other than the obvious sales to Premier league clubs none of them were good enough for the championship let alone Premier league.

Nailed it .

 

[Scooter_mcgavin]

Just in case Reed didn't come up in his filter......

Little Louis.

 

[Silent Blade]

First of all - let me clarify this isn’t a criticism of wilder. The results more than bare out that it’s worked out. That’s should go with out saying...

However, looking at the stats last season we didn’t give a single minute to a player under 23 that we own. That has to be a worry

Obviously the reason for some of the sales I.e Adams, DCL, Ramsdale, Brooks were forced on us either by the player or our league 1 position

However, Was it a mistake to let the likes of whiteman, Reed etc go so early on in their careers. Wouldn’t a loan have made more sense so that we wouldn’t be left with Lundstram as our only cover across midfield? These would certainly be in and around the squad now - and actually whiteman in particular has been doing well in league one.

Just feel we could use these numbers as there doesn’t really seem to be anyone else of note coming through to bolster the squad.

Don’t know what other people’s thoughts are?

Ok we should have taken more faith in our Academy players and stayed in League 1!

 

[Stretch]

Wilder went on record to say that young players had to work very hard to get into his teams. I am guessing that none have yet worked hard enough.

He just likes to work with experienced players, nothing wrong with that. When the odd gem does come that is too good not to play, that might be different, i.e Brooks.

 

[Stretch]

Wilder went on record to say that young players had to work very hard to get into his teams. I am guessing that none have yet worked hard enough.

He just likes to work with experienced players, nothing wrong with that. When the odd gem does come that is too good not to play, that might be different, i.e Brooks.

 

[Bladeinleeds]

Ok we should have taken more faith in our Academy players and stayed in League 1!

I’m certainly not saying it would be correct to have relied on them to get us up....

But there is a difference between having some faith and no faith in the youth players. We could have loaned them out and seen how they developed.

By all accounts whiteman was poty at a promotion chasing club from league 1. To me that sort of performance offers at least as much as lundstram has shown.

Where are the players who could step in if the current midfielders get injured or suspended? The youth now are a long way off that as the players that were close to the squad have all been let go.

How much would Whitman go for now? I’m guessing rovers would want well over a million for him. As a 3/4 choice midfielder across 2 positions - it doesn’t seem ridiculous to have kept him around.

 

[Davalon]

No disrespect intended but Whiteman and Reed being in a 25 man PL squad is bonkers.

 

[finlaytheblade]

Wilder went on record to say that young players had to work very hard to get into his teams. I am guessing that none have yet worked hard enough.

He just likes to work with experienced players, nothing wrong with that. When the odd gem does come that is too good not to play, that might be different, i.e Brooks.

He does bring young players into training with the squad they have to impress him and Knill at 23 level .
,He like us would love to have a team full of academy players hopefully some will impress shortly.Slater &Dewhurst have gone to portugal with the squad so they are highly thought of.Both out on loan last season and will be the same this season unless they really impress like Brooks did ,that's not likely though.

 

[Nick Jansky]

I’m certainly not saying it would be correct to have relied on them to get us up....

But there is a difference between having some faith and no faith in the youth players. We could have loaned them out and seen how they developed.

By all accounts whiteman was poty at a promotion chasing club from league 1. To me that sort of performance offers at least as much as lundstram has shown.

Where are the players who could step in if the current midfielders get injured or suspended? The youth now are a long way off that as the players that were close to the squad have all been let go.

How much would Whitman go for now? I’m guessing rovers would want well over a million for him. As a 3/4 choice midfielder across 2 positions - it doesn’t seem ridiculous to have kept him around.

Whiteman, who I like a lot, will never be more than a mid to top end Championship player. I wish it was otherwise, but it isn’t.

Pinchy was entirely wrong about Reed. He will have a good L1 career but nothing more.

 

[8lade]

I thought Slater was ready for our squad last year, only 24 starts in a league 2 side prove I'm wrong again.

 

[Silent Blade]

I’m certainly not saying it would be correct to have relied on them to get us up....

But there is a difference between having some faith and no faith in the youth players. We could have loaned them out and seen how they developed.

By all accounts whiteman was poty at a promotion chasing club from league 1. To me that sort of performance offers at least as much as lundstram has shown.

Where are the players who could step in if the current midfielders get injured or suspended? The youth now are a long way off that as the players that were close to the squad have all been let go.

How much would Whitman go for now? I’m guessing rovers would want well over a million for him. As a 3/4 choice midfielder across 2 positions - it doesn’t seem ridiculous to have kept him around.

The majority of fans wants Wilder to keep looking for better players to improve the team and he is doing well at that. Our Academy have not been producing players like Walker, Naughton and Maguire etc since our Academy became category 2 and it is only the best of Academy rejects from other clubs such as Ramsdale and Brooks that are now doing well now. Both made their agents arrange transfers to PL clubs and Wilder's hands were tied behind his back.

 

[stringer]

No disrespect intended but Whiteman and Reed being in a 25 man PL squad is bonkers.

Reed wouldn't even have to be named in the 25-man, he's only 21

 

[Bladeinleeds]

The majority of fans wants Wilder to keep looking for better players to improve the team and he is doing well at that. Our Academy have not been producing players like Walker, Naughton and Maguire etc since our Academy became category 2 and it is only the best of Academy rejects from other clubs such as Ramsdale and Brooks that are now doing well now. Both made their agents arrange transfers to PL clubs and Wilder's hands were tied behind his back.

Agree, imo the academy needs another significant investment. Say £5m over the next few years in staff / recruitment / faculties etc in order to compete for the best players again.

That would hopefully help bring the next lot through

 

[Silent Blade]

Agree, imo the academy needs another significant investment. Say £5m over the next few years in staff / recruitment / faculties etc in order to compete for the best players again.

That would hopefully help bring the next lot through

You mean we should spend more money on our Academy to become Category 1? Not sure if £5M will be enough.

 

[Bladeinleeds]

You mean we should spend more money on our Academy to become Category 1? Not sure if £5M will be enough.

Yeah. That’s the route I would go.

Even at £10m that investment would have been paid off by just the sell on fees of maguire and Walker alone. It’s a no brainer to me.

I also think it’s worth a substantial investment in the foreign scouting network. That would be worth far more longer term than what an average championship midfielder costs these days

 

[Ball_Sup (Phil)]

You mean we should spend more money on our Academy to become Category 1? Not sure if £5M will be enough.

Out of interest Silent Blade , what would you do about/with The Academy? Leave as is? Upgrade to Cat 1? Stay Cat 2 but spend more on recruitment? coaches? facilities? How would you call it?

 

[Silent Blade]

Yeah. That’s the route I would go.

Even at £10m that investment would have been paid off by just the sell on fees of maguire and Walker alone. It’s a no brainer to me.

I also think it’s worth a substantial investment in the foreign scouting network. That would be work far more longer term than what an average championship midfielder costs these days

We may not stay in the PL for more than one season and having a Category 1 Academy isnt a guarantee that we will produce another Walker/Maguire etc and it may take more than a few more years to do that.

 

[Silent Blade]

Out of interest Silent Blade , what would you do about/with The Academy? Leave as is? Upgrade to Cat 1? Stay Cat 2 but spend more on recruitment? coaches? facilities? How would you call it?

Not sure, the EPPP has made things unfair.

 

[Ball_Sup (Phil)]

Not sure, the EPPP has made things unfair.

I'd be tempted to take the following position;

Developing youngsters for the Premier League is a very difficult, long term, potentially expensive & potentially fruitless project. Therefore, I wouldn't upgrade to Cat 1. I'd try to exploit the profile Premier League Status gives us - "send little Jonny to Premier League Sheffield United for his Development". I would allocate a bigger budget & spend that on a) the salary for a hands off, Nick Cox type strategist, b) beefing up recruitment at the younger age groups c) identifying a small, core of 15/16 year olds from other clubs/Academies & "buying them in" to get a quality, core to build up from.

At the moment, I feel we're living off scraps.

 

[Nick Jansky]

Yeah. That’s the route I would go.

Even at £10m that investment would have been paid off by just the sell on fees of maguire and Walker alone. It’s a no brainer to me.

I also think it’s worth a substantial investment in the foreign scouting network. That would be worth far more longer term than what an average championship midfielder costs these days

I agree. He talks about leaving a legacy, those two things would go a long way to securing the future.

 

[Nick Jansky]

I'd be tempted to take the following position;

Developing youngsters for the Premier League is a very difficult, long term, potentially expensive & potentially fruitless project. Therefore, I wouldn't upgrade to Cat 1. I'd try to exploit the profile Premier League Status gives us - "send little Jonny to Premier League Sheffield United for his Development". I would allocate a bigger budget & spend that on a) the salary for a hands off, Nick Cox type strategist, b) beefing up recruitment at the younger age groups c) identifying a small, core of 15/16 year olds from other clubs/Academies & "buying them in" to get a quality, core to build up from.

At the moment, I feel we're living off scraps.

Nick Cox’s parents are our neighbours, moved up here from Watford just after Nick did to be near the grandkids, really lovely couple. Nick Cox is impressive and has been a massive loss to us. Still very fond of the Blades though.

 

[Sean Thornton]

Just in case Reed didn't come up in his filter......

Little Louis.

"Read" is causing a glitch in the system.

 

[Woodwardfan]

Just in case Reed didn't come up in his filter......

Little Louis.

Taller than Fleck and he's a United Giant!!

 

[Scooter_mcgavin]

"Read" is causing a glitch in the system.

Not quite like Maupey!

 

[BushBlade]

I think the priority has to been staying in the league and the bulk of the money spent on that. That doesn’t preclude improving the facilities as, I understand, the first team use them.

If we do manage to stay up for a couple of seasons, our net transfer spend should reduce so, in theory, we should have a bit to spend on properly upgrading the academy.