Ground extentions/Renovations

[Flatulent_Bob]

I wonder why Bournemouth (11k capacity) haven't already?

They need to check what events are going off at Alum Chine and Argyle Gardens to see if they'll be able to get the punters in on match-days.

 

[LoughboroBlade]

Closing the Kop and doing a full rebuild (which has always been my preference if it could be limited to under a year) would knock a third off capacity and the gate receipts. I don’t think that’s unmanageable with the money we’d get from the Premier League. Gate receipts wise we’d be talking of going from roughly £12m to £8m. Obviously plenty would be outraged from the change, but given the likelihood of a long stay in the Prem is I would argue very low, I’d (controversially it seems) be fine to see us build a proper single-tier stand there that we’d never have to do anything to again. We’re not going to ever do it without the Prem cash.

 

[Hodgesleftpeg]

They've got a job listing up on the website for a programme media person, good salary, mentions increased pagination so I doubt it.

That's going to cost us at least 50p more a game.

I hope not..

Doesn’t quite sound the same

“Programmes 3 quid................
and 50 p”

 

[Akinbiyi]

I hope not..

Doesn’t quite sound the same

“Programmes 3 quid................
and 50 p”

Bargain

 

[bromtom]

I hope not..

Doesn’t quite sound the same

“Programmes 3 quid................
and 50 p”

I'm going to try and get my crowd interaction suggestion going next season

We do the usual, programmes three quid, programmes three quid

Then the programme seller comes in three-fifty yer programmes

And we go boooooooooooo

Bit of bantz innit.

 

[S64 Blade]

Not a great deal in terms of facilities for supporters.
Enlarged media room under the south stand.
Bigger press box at the top of the south stand.
New floodlights.
New pitch (as always).
Some individual seats are being replaced.

That’s about it so far. I’d imagine for any large scale developments we’d have to stay up for 3 or 4 seasons first.

Has any consideration been given towards either (a) adding more turnstiles to the BL South Stand entrance (assume Kop on JS side is just as bad), or (b) introducing measures to get people in to the ground quicker?

I was sent a new, lime green season ticket the season before last, with an accompanying note saying that it was something to do with creating better access for the South Stand. If anything it has since gotten worse and I've seen no noticeable reason how/why the colour of the season ticket has changed anything.

*Not having a go at you, you just seem to be ITK with these things*

 

[bornablade]

Aston Villa closed the Holte end at the end of the 1993/94 season and by the start of the next season had 3000 seats operating. The full Holte end opened in the December. It is (was) the largest 'end' in English football.

I know the Holte end is a two tier stand but the time scale is impressive and we are 20+ years on with construction improvements.

 

[s4-blade]

Has any consideration been given towards either (a) adding more turnstiles to the BL South Stand entrance (assume Kop on JS side is just as bad), or (b) introducing measures to get people in to the ground quicker?

I was sent a new, lime green season ticket the season before last, with an accompanying note saying that it was something to do with creating better access for the South Stand. If anything it has since gotten worse and I've seen no noticeable reason how/why the colour of the season ticket has changed anything.

*Not having a go at you, you just seem to be ITK with these things*

There’s no work going on right now so I’d have to say at this point, no. The kop and John street do have concession only turnstiles (however I’m not particularly keen on that idea because all it will do is make the queues for the majority of people even longer).
One thing they could do is use the exit gates as turnstiles using the handheld machines stewards have to let in disabled supporters. All you would need is a couple of metal barriers.

 

[Berkshire Blade]

Aston Villa closed the Holte end at the end of the 1993/94 season and by the start of the next season had 3000 seats operating. The full Holte end opened in the December. It is (was) the largest 'end' in English football.

I know the Holte end is a two tier stand but the time scale is impressive and we are 20+ years on with construction improvements.

Think liverpool with their expansion of their stand seeing as how we'd likely do the south stand first as we could add boxes etc.

That cost a absolute fortune too. £114 million that brings in £12 million a year extra.

 

[GrayBlade]

Have you noticed Tottenham haven't spent a penny on players for the past two seasons? And coincidentally it coincides with their new stadium being built...

To be honest I wouldn't want to risk building a stadium or improving it until we are well out of the way from relegation threat at PL level (some where around Watford/Newcastle/Everton level). It would take a huge dint from our finances and could threaten the club competing on the football field.

I wonder why Bournemouth (11k capacity) haven't already? It's because they are well aware of the financial implications of building a stadium, and this could threaten their PL status, even though they are in desperate need of a new ground and arguably they are a well established PL team.

Remember, BDTBL will be the 12th biggest PL ground next season

A bit off the topic I know, but Spurs finishing 4th in the Premier League and getting to the Champion’s League final without recruiting in 2 seasons sort of knocks in the head talk of teams constantly needing to strengthen to succeed.

Maybe having a squad of players who have played regularly together and know each other’s game inside out is a bigger asset in the top tier than doing a Fulham and clearing the decks? Sort of confirms my own thoughts that we will only need 3 or 4 (quality) new recruits.

 

[bongleblade]

I do agree that we need to improve facilities though... and I do believe this could be done in pre-season, maybe make the kop facilities

A bit off the topic I know, but Spurs finishing 4th in the Premier League and getting to the Champion’s League final without recruiting in 2 seasons sort of knocks in the head talk of teams constantly needing to strengthen to succeed.

Maybe having a squad of players who have played regularly together and know each other’s game inside out is a bigger asset in the top tier than doing a Fulham and clearing the decks? Sort of confirms my own thoughts that we will only need 3 or 4 (quality) new recruits.

Yeah I agree with that to an extent... it's amazing to think the levels they are reaching with good management and sticking with there (already top class) players.

Although then again, you could argue if they recruited they could be challenging for title with L'Pool, they've both reached similar standards in the past except Liverpool have pushed on by adding to their squad with some exceptional signings (VVD, Allison to name two stand out ones...)

 

[stringer]

I do agree that we need to improve facilities though... and I do believe this could be done in pre-season, maybe make the kop facilities

Yeah I agree with that to an extent... it's amazing to think the levels they are reaching with good management and sticking with there (already top class) players.

Although then again, you could argue if they recruited they could be challenging for title with L'Pool, they've both reached similar standards in the past except Liverpool have pushed on by adding to their squad with some exceptional signings (VVD, Allison to name two stand out ones...)

Wasn’t van Dijk signed because of the extra revenue brought in by the new stand? Sure I read that somewhere

 

[BigBed]

Why don't the just take the roof off and cut the posts down to table height and put a wooden top on them?
That way, most are happy.
No restricted view on the kop, tables to enjoy your pie or pack up, and entertainment for the rest of us when it's pissing down.

 

[S64 Blade]

There’s no work going on right now so I’d have to say at this point, no. The kop and John street do have concession only turnstiles (however I’m not particularly keen on that idea because all it will do is make the queues for the majority of people even longer).
One thing they could do is use the exit gates as turnstiles using the handheld machines stewards have to let in disabled supporters. All you would need is a couple of metal barriers.

That was my thoughts also. Or those temporary turnstiles that they use at the arena, festivals etc. At times last season there was no passing access up or down Bramall Lane, due to the queue to the South Stand. I think the number of turnstiles for the stand as a whole is suitable, the issue is, is that a fairly large majority of people either go to town or London/Ecclesall Road before games, meaning that access to the BL end of the South Stand is probably skewed.

 

[s4-blade]

That was my thoughts also. Or those temporary turnstiles that they use at the arena, festivals etc. At time last season there was no passing access up or down Bramall Lane, due to the queue to the South Stand. I think the number of turnstiles for the stand as a whole is suitable, the issue is, is that a fairly large majority of people either go to town or London/Ecclesall Road before games, meaning that access to the BL end of the South Stand is probably skewed.

That’s true. Kop is usually not too bad

 

[Sean Thornton]

With our joint owners in Court, and the general consensus that neither have a pot to piss in PL wise, talk of a US hedge fund that we have very little knowledge of and unnamed “Chinese” investors, where do people think the funds will come from for major developments at this moment in time?

 

[grafikhaus]

But any serious upgrade wont start until we've had a few more years of parachute payments and promotion money

Know what you mean, but more seasons in the PL don't equate to £170m times 'X'. Players wages, agents fees etc. mean that very few (about 6) are ever firmly established at the top level.

If we keep delaying things, revenue wll be lost and construction costs will go up. Without going mad, I say 'let's fix the roof while the sun's shining' starting with the kop. A well-designed, well-planned structure, with all steelwork pre-fabricated shouldn't take more than 3-4 months. £5m tops.

 

[LoughboroBlade]

where do people think the funds will come from for major developments at this moment in time?

The Premier League cash? If we’re only planning to have £20-30m of it going on the team, that does leave some funds.

 

[Sean Thornton]

The Premier League cash? If we’re only planning to have £20-30m of it going on the team, that does leave some funds.

Is that including fees and wages?

 

[stringjunior]

The Premier League cash? If we’re only planning to have £20-30m of it going on the team, that does leave some funds.

Wages will account for most of the rest unfortunately

 

[stringjunior]

Is that including fees and wages?

Don't come around here with your dirty common sense talk Thornton

 

[Killamarshblades]

The Premier League cash? If we’re only planning to have £20-30m of it going on the team, that does leave some funds.

Our present wage bill will most likely double due to promotion clauses. We dont know the 18/19 season figure but a guess of £25m wont be a million miles away, therefore a wage bill could be £50m before we sign anyone. Add in another £20m of signings and say another £5m in wages and we are at £75m before we take into account small ground updates, probably more non football staff, agent fees etc etc. Out of the initial expected £100m for next year it doesnt really leave much, especially as we are likely to have made a loss for 18/19

 

[Sean Thornton]

Our present wage bill will most likely double due to promotion clauses. We dont know the 18/19 season figure but a guess of £25m wont be a million miles away, therefore a wage bill could be £50m before we sign anyone. Add in another £20m of signings and say another £5m in wages and we are at £75m before we take into account small ground updates, probably more non football staff, agent fees etc etc. Out of the initial expected £100m for next year it doesnt really leave much, especially as we are likely to have made a loss for 18/19

The total wage bill 17/18 was just shy of £19m. Increases, bonuses etc. £25m estimate this year, Chris needs to spend his five million wisely....

Gerritspentontground

 

[Sheffsteel]

Closing the Kop and doing a full rebuild (which has always been my preference if it could be limited to under a year) would knock a third off capacity and the gate receipts. I don’t think that’s unmanageable with the money we’d get from the Premier League. Gate receipts wise we’d be talking of going from roughly £12m to £8m. Obviously plenty would be outraged from the change, but given the likelihood of a long stay in the Prem is I would argue very low, I’d (controversially it seems) be fine to see us build a proper single-tier stand there that we’d never have to do anything to again. We’re not going to ever do it without the Prem cash.

I’ve already explained this several times. Some of our fans aren’t thinking this through, no one has yet come up with the reason why a rebuild is better, apart from 2 inch more knee room. The sums regards a full rebuild are financially short term and long term suicide, so won’t happen.

The bolt-on design will take 1 playing season + the close season, with the capacity hardly effected.
A Kop rebuild would mean closure for at least 2 seasons. The current home capacity of 28K would reduce to about 18K.
So an immediate problem is how do you decide which season holders will effected receive a ground ban for 2 years
Or what about every single current season ticket holder receiving a 50% ban and told they can only attend 50% of home games.
You can bet some that have rarely missed a game for years wont accept it, there would likely be demonstrations.

Also a stand rebuild with a steeper rake and more leg room means (by definition) capacity will be reduced.
Even if we try to join it on the South stand, again capacity is reduced because currently it goes well past the corner flag.

One advantage of a new rebuild would be more conference/ banqueting facilities.
However there’s a saturation point and also adequate parking would be required.
Don’t forget we intend to incorporate a massive amount of corporate/ conference/ banqueting facilities in the South stand.

I think the club might wait to see what developes regards rail seating/ safe standing, then do it in one go.
Also I would think the priority is becoming an established PL club before any stadium expansion is done.

 

[nopigfansintown]

It'd be a fitting legacy from a season in the prem and make us more competitive when we eventually got back up. We're in a better position this time compared to the last few times we've made ground improvements. It also makes us more attractive to investors etc when they look at the potential bottom line. It also makes Bramall Lane more attractive to people who can bring non football related income. I think it's a sign of sound stewardship to look after the longer term interests of the club rather than fly by night players.. That being said, with the way the parachute payment system works there's an argument for going big on transfers in year one to ensure you get three years, rather than the two years payment you'd get for immediate relegation.

 

[nopigfansintown]

Wasn’t van Dijk signed because of the extra revenue brought in by the new stand? Sure I read that somewhere

The new stand has brought in somewhere between 30-35 million over the last two seasons (over 20 million last season) It will bring in 20 million plus this season too due to replicating the Champions League run. I don't know what that has done for player acquisition as they have to pay back the debt on the stand (over 100 million) and on the new training ground in Kirby (50 million). Their net spend on player sales is pretty low under Klopp (around 90 million) and could be put down to consecutive Champions League qualifications; lucrative Champions League runs; lucrative player sales; Increased revenue from the new stand, and increased revenue from improving league finishes (both in payments from the Premier League and the share of Uefa prize money). It's the general improvement in revenue that's allowed the club to to invest imo.

 

[LoughboroBlade]

I’ve already explained this several times. Some of our fans aren’t thinking this through, no one has yet come up with the reason why a rebuild is better, apart from 2 inch more knee room. The sums regards a full rebuild are financially short term and long term suicide, so won’t happen.

And I’ve explained the reasoning before why a rebuild would be preferable. I’ve also said that if we followed the sort of logic you state we’d have never built any of the last stands, or would never build anything fully new ever again. I do get that it would be much cheaper and much easier to do the bolt-on for the Kop. I just think it’s an enormous missed opportunity to do something far better and far more long-lasting. The fact the bolt-on gradient would be different to the main Kop gives a bit of an indication of the issues with the current one. A compromise would be to re-layer the current surface to adjust the gradient to make it steeper and reduce the visibility issue, then allowing the bolt on at the back to be a seamless extension.

We may as well just not build anything ever again though.

 

[Blade56]

Weers web cam?

 

[Blade56]

Why don't the just take the roof off and cut the posts down to table height and put a wooden top on them?
That way, most are happy.
No restricted view on the kop, tables to enjoy your pie or pack up, and entertainment for the rest of us when it's pissing down.

I remember a night match at Blackpool (Bob Hatton played in that one). I was a steward on the HQ coach and told everyone away end was covered so leave waterproofs ont coach. When we got inside thy had sold the roof to a scrap dealer just a few posts left. We all got feckin soaked and I wasn’t very popular ont way home.

 

[finlaytheblade]

The lower section of the kop would be ideal for rail seating
( standing ) which will be allowed in the near future I'm sure.The top half and the bolt on new section could be done with minimal effect on the capacity. The roof obviously has to come off, all this could be done in sections so as to minimise the effect on the overall capacity but when done would bring it up to modern day standards.
I'm no retired builder or architect but it sounds reasonable to me.
I await with bated breath to be shot down !! !!