LBGT Campaign

[Ted Danson]

was it a gay thing then? I thought the ref might have been an Inca

 

[Bladepicker]

I feel a slight irony here that you brand anybody who has a faith a nutter and then talk about persecution? The Christian dominations have made massive efforts to be fair and inclusive with all areas of our society.

I've not done that though have I - just the one's with very conservative views.

However I do concede that anyone who believes in made up sky fairies is a little bit fruit da loop - but if they marry this with living a good life, fairness to all and the acceptance of others then far from persecution, I'd defend to the hilt their right to believe in their chosen deity.

 

[georgebernardshaw]

This LBGT thingy - how many of the buggers are there, for God’s sake?

 

[JayGreen17]

I think the solution is for the club to section off parts of the ground for everyone with a cause. I'm sorry to mention it to the LBGT's but there are multiple causes out there who think theirs is the most important. So in addition to the LBGT section, we could have an anti-fracking section, a vegan section, one for the environmentalists, the tree-felling protestors. Hell, we could even set up a Corbyn corner for Tyler. Me? Well, can we just set up a section for the I-just-want-to-watch-a fucking-football-match campaigners.

The reason for support / awareness groups is that there are still people with this sort of uneducated view point. Nobody is born an environmentalist ffs....I hope this is sarcasm and not a comment based on your intelligence.

 

[Rodley]

The reason for support / awareness groups is that there are still people with this sort of uneducated view point. Nobody is born an environmentalist ffs....I hope this is sarcasm and not a comment based on your intelligence.

If any vegan wants the pastry off my Balti Pie, they are more than welcome to it.

 

[JayGreen17]

For all I know I may be sitting next to a gay person at the match. I don't give a shit and it wouldn't bother me in the slightest. Why would he or she feel the need to inform me and everyone else in the ground of his/her sexual preference?

That's the whole point....you actually could be sat next to someone who is gay, lesbian ...but you will never know because even in general conversation he/she will tend to either avoid any subject relating to their general "life" or when talking about a partner will lie, due to fear of persecution bourne out of years of homophobic abuse... yes it still happens and although you may not care what their sexual orientation is this very thread proves that casual homophobia and racism is alive and kicking in 2017. Hence awareness and support groups...

 

[Tunstall Fred]

If any vegan wants the pastry off my Balti Pie, they are more than welcome to it.

I think all vegetarians should be shot,same as those who tow a caravan should be beheaded,a vegetarian caravan towing half and half scarf wearer should be hung drawn and quartered

 

[Sean Thornton]

I think all vegetarians should be shot,same as those who tow a caravan should be beheaded,a vegetarian caravan towing half and half scarf wearer should be hung drawn and quartered

What if they're a BL season ticket holder and you've only got 100 loyalty points?

 

[Rodders]

What if they're a BL season ticket holder and you've only got 100 loyalty points?

Give them a kidney punch LOLOLOLOL

 

[Rodders]

I know of gays personally who have been going to the Lane for years, one of whom is (was) a noted BM poster. I'm not aware of any of them being made anything but welcome at the Lane. If it was suggested to him that special arrangements should be made for LBGTs at the Lane he would suggest that special arrangements should be made for those proposing such idiocy. I don't know what we're arguing about here.

Would your gay friends feel comfortable holding hands with partners or kissing at a football game?

 

[More Bladier than thou]

Fucking weirdo’s them trannies, they should be castrated the lot of em.

 

[mablethorpe utd]

Fucking weirdo’s them trannies, they should be castrated the lot of em.

our injury list will mean a lot of backs to wall performances.

 

[Tunstall Fred]

Fucking weirdo’s them trannies, they should be castrated the lot of em.

I'm glad I have gone digital,if that's your attitude

 

[mosbolad]

Will you please just make your mind up Mossy instead of confusing the f**k our of me?
Does Bert squat or stand?

Well...... I'm pleased you asked his Greasiness! Unlike you, a 55 year old male (according to your profile), Bert has failed to assign his gender and age on his so I am left on the horns of a dilemma as to whether to suggest he squats or stands. But that's his business (for which I assume he sits ).......

What is a BLTG anyway? Bacon lettuce tomato with gherkins perhaps?

Why we should have sandwich themed corner flags is beyond me......

 

[PokerBlade]

It's not simply a message of welcome. It's a statement that Sheffield United now hold beliefs about sexuality and gender that no one had heard of a couple of decades ago.

It's good to be welcoming, but it's a philosophical position to hold that gender is a social construct or that gender is defined, not by the body, but the mind. When you fly that flag, you say you agree with this.

The thing is, there are people who use gender and sex interchangeably in conversational language. And that's fine for most uses. It's just not the usage that people are referencing when they refer to gender as a social construct. Mistaking the two is equivocation, not some abstract philosophical position.

Compare the roles expected of men and women in 1817 to 2017. Compare the roles expected of men and women in modern Britain to modern Saudi Arabia. Now, it's not what I'd call a "philosophical position" to say that those roles are all dramatically different for each of those societies. It's documented and abundantly evident. It's those changing roles and expectations that other people are terming "gender". And if you don't label those roles "gender" then I don't know what word to use but we surely need one if we're to have a conversation about any of this.

Actually, biological sex isn't even a consistent thing. It's constantly evolved with our growing understanding anatomy and biology.

That the meaning of words change over time, that societal norms differ across geography and history; that's not really disputable.

 

[Sean Thornton]

The thing is, there are people who use gender and sex interchangeably in conversational language. And that's fine for most uses. It's just not the usage that people are referencing when they refer to gender as a social construct. Mistaking the two is equivocation, not some abstract philosophical position.

Compare the roles expected of men and women in 1817 to 2017. Compare the roles expected of men and women in modern Britain to modern Saudi Arabia. Now, it's not what I'd call a "philosophical position" to say that those roles are all dramatically different for each of those societies. It's documented and abundantly evident. It's those changing roles and expectations that other people are terming "gender". And if you don't label those roles "gender" then I don't know what word to use but we surely need one if we're to have a conversation about any of this.

Actually, biological sex isn't even a consistent thing. It's constantly evolved with our growing understanding anatomy and biology.

That the meaning of words change over time, that societal norms differ across geography and history; that's not really disputable.

Listen to her.....

 

[Flatulent_Bob]

Where are they paid significantly less for the same role? It's my understanding companies have to pay the same man , woman, black , white if there doing the same job with the same experience. If not they could be taken to court. Why don't said women do that? Quite often the pay gap is calculated by people in different jobs with different experience to make the case. despite this the most well paid people iv known have been women.

As regards to maternity leave I could argue why are men not offered equal treatment and receive the paid leave. This just highlights how unfairly favoured women are in regards to raising children. As if men can't do it. Women arnt forced to take a long leave it's a choice after the leave for medical reasons.

If I had a business id hire/keep/promote whoever was best for the job. To think the majority of business owners don't do this is Ludacris. At the end of the day sexist or not greed has always come above prejudice.

It only serves to frustrate men who actually have no prejudice against women. Getting told there's not enough women in this or that. Well its only them who can change that, nobody's stopping them.

Your understanding is incorrect, women are in general paid 10% for the same roles as men on average but your comments around men being unfairly favored are laughable.
Power has come above prejudice, and men have had all the power, hence why the system is unfairly rigged.
Guys trying to counter that argument by picking at ways they believe women have it better instead of seeing and discussing the privilege they get is as pathetic as bringing up Islam as some sort of counter to the pain and suffering the Christian church has caused though its teachings. If there are valid points (and the paternity argument isn't) then it's something to be challenged, but it doesn't invalidate the original issue, which is in this case that women do not have equal rights in the workplace.

Why can't people just accept they have an unfair leg up with others in society due to absolutely no right they've earned, and they seem to want to defend the status quo rather than trying to make it fair for all.
Equal rights isn't about eroding what you have, it's about getting the same for everyone else, in that they're treated just as fairly as you are, and ensuring they're just as much as part of society as everyone else. You see is as unfair to you.
This isn't Women or Gay privilege that's being asked for, it's just equal rights. Privilege would be to have them in all positions of power for a few thousand years and dictating to the rest of us how we must run our lives.

 

[mosbolad]

Indeed. Let’s use one example to castigate an entire group. Burn the trannies! /s

I thought he had only had himself castigated, I didn't realise it was a group effort?......

 

[mosbolad]

You can still have sex with blokes and define yourself as straight. Obviously if all you ever did was sleep with blokes, some might raise an eyebrow at that straight definition, but if you occasionally have sex with a bloke (Either as part of some group thing, or one on one) then ithat does not necessarily mean you are bisexual. Some straight guys sleep with other men simply because it's easier to score.

I fear I have lead somewhat of a sheltered life Highbury, having read that......

 

[Pollingtonblade]

what is it with vegetarians and their veggie sausages and burgers? I’m a meat eater but don’t go round making carrots and sprouts out of beef.

 

[snootyfenooty]

That's the whole point....you actually could be sat next to someone who is gay, lesbian ...but you will never know because even in general conversation he/she will tend to either avoid any subject relating to their general "life" or when talking about a partner will lie, due to fear of persecution bourne out of years of homophobic abuse... yes it still happens and although you may not care what their sexual orientation is this very thread proves that casual homophobia and racism is alive and kicking in 2017. Hence awareness and support groups...

What a load of tosh. Do you really think its normal to open up to a complete stranger about you personal life. Sexual orientation has got nothing to do with it.

The reason for support / awareness groups is that there are still people with this sort of uneducated view point. Nobody is born an environmentalist ffs....I hope this is sarcasm and not a comment based on your intelligence.

Me sarcastic? Never...
Intelligent? Maybe, maybe not, I'll leave others to judge.
A sense of humour? Definitely.

 

[snootyfenooty]

Would your gay friends feel comfortable holding hands with partners or kissing at a football game?

One of them would, no problem. The other probably not. Then again I can't remember the last time I saw a straight couple snogging at a football match either.

 

[PokerBlade]

Your understanding is incorrect, women are in general paid 10% for the same roles as men on average but your comments around men being unfairly favored are laughable.
Power has come above prejudice, and men have had all the power, hence why the system is unfairly rigged.
Guys trying to counter that argument by picking at ways they believe women have it better instead of seeing and discussing the privilege they get is as pathetic as bringing up Islam as some sort of counter to the pain and suffering the Christian church has caused though its teachings. If there are valid points (and the paternity argument isn't) then it's something to be challenged, but it doesn't invalidate the original issue, which is in this case that women do not have equal rights in the workplace.

Why can't people just accept they have an unfair leg up with others in society due to absolutely no right they've earned, and they seem to want to defend the status quo rather than trying to make it fair for all.
Equal rights isn't about eroding what you have, it's about getting the same for everyone else, in that they're treated just as fairly as you are, and ensuring they're just as much as part of society as everyone else. You see is as unfair to you.
This isn't Women or Gay privilege that's being asked for, it's just equal rights. Privilege would be to have them in all positions of power for a few thousand years and dictating to the rest of us how we must run our lives.

Agree with all of this. I'll add that getting reliable data on pay is very difficult. Many people may have noticed their employers have a policy against discussing your contract with your co-workers, and there are a lot of easy ways to make getting data on the "same work" almost impossible. For one, wages are negotiable. There's research that suggests women are less inclined to negotiate as hard as men do (which may be for a few reasons). Then there's also bonuses varied by the individual, different job titles for very similar roles, etc. etc. It's not hard to pay two different people two different wages and justify it.

And the main thing I'll address is the old argument that employers would always hire the best. Here's the reality: for most roles there are a number of qualified candidates, often with little between them. It's not as easy as imagining that for a given position there will be one stand out applicant in the pile that's the obvious choice. Employers pick people based on how likable they were in interviews, whether they know anyone who already works there that vouches for them, whether they fit in best with the office culture. I can go into further detail, but those things can often favour men over women and it's not because the boss is necessarily some aging sexist who thinks women are for fetching coffee, filing paperwork, and looking pretty.

 

[HighfieldBlade]

https://www.sufc.co.uk/news/2017/december/rainbow-corner-flag/

So if the club supports this how is it when you register a family/friend on your account for online ticket sales
you have to state their sex............and there are only two options?

There are more than 2 options. But the others are all hidden agenders.

I'll get mi'coat....

 

[Booker4]

Maybe because there are only two genders, male and female?

This propaganda being shoved down our throats does not belong in football. Football is a sport and a form of escapism for many, not a political and social tool to push a radical far left agenda onto society.

I agree totally. However, in fairness to United, we have to be seen to back this type of thing, otherwise you end up with loads of negative press and we've had enough of that! It could well lead to investigations etc and threats of withdrawing sponsorship. Sound familiar?!

I do not subscribe to this at all, but its the modern western world sadly.

 

[Booker4]

Not saying it is true of anyone on here before anyone shouts me down, but I see some views at times of those Britain First type idiots (especially the Christian nutters) and I find it very ironic that if it wasn't for the ban on beer and bacon they are practically hand in hand on sociological standpoints with ISIS

I'm a Christian Bladepicker but definitely not a Britain First type, not sure where that comes from?! I am also a leftie but also not a fan of the LBGT campaign, but that usually gets me labelled as a bigot. It's funny that I never hear a Muslim or a Jew also told they're a bigot too?! You noticed that too?!

 

[Booker4]

I find it quite ironic that you use the term 'Christian nutters', yet don't use the term 'Muslim nutters' to denounce those who wish to see homosexuals killed and have actually made it illegal to be a homosexual in many of their counties....unlike Western Christian nations or these Britain First 'Christian nutters' who as far as I'm aware don't hold any of these views or practices.

Indeed, isn't that what they protest against to begin with?

Perhaps the gay rights lobby should focus their campaigns on countries that don't actually have any gay rights? Maybe start with the ones where gay people are thrown off roofs?

Thank you! My point entirely!

 

[PokerBlade]

I'm a Christian Bladepicker but definitely not a Britain First type, not sure where that comes from?! I am also a leftie but also not a fan of the LBGT campaign, but that usually gets me labelled as a bigot. It's funny that I never hear a Muslim or a Jew also told they're a bigot too?! You noticed that too?!

I find it absolutely bizarre that you've never heard someone criticise a Muslim like, for instance, Anjem Choudary for his utterly backwards way of thinking about society. You've also managed to miss out on the whole ISIS thing. Those guys haven't been too popular. And you've never heard anyone say anything bad about the state of Saudi Arabia, and never heard of Richard Dawkins, Christopher Hitchens, or Sam Harris. Or Tommy Robinson. Or Donald Trump.

Really weird.

 

[PokerBlade]

Thank you! My point entirely!

What point? That because stuff sucks harder elsewhere we should forget about doing anything at home? Can you imagine applying that line of thinking to anything else? Forget the NHS, at least we don't die of malaria. Forget old people, life expectancy is way above what it is in the third world.

We are capable of both caring about gay marriage rights in Northern Ireland and also the abhorrent treatment of the LGBT community overseas too.

 

[Booker4]

I find it absolutely bizarre that you've never heard someone criticise a Muslim like, for instance, Anjem Choudary for his utterly backwards way of thinking about society. You've also managed to miss out on the whole ISIS thing. Those guys haven't been too popular. And you've never heard anyone say anything bad about the state of Saudi Arabia, and never heard of Richard Dawkins, Christopher Hitchens, or Sam Harris. Or Tommy Robinson. Or Donald Trump.

Really weird.

ISIS doesn't represent the average Muslim does it?! So having a pop at ISIS is hardly having a pop at Islam as a faith as a whole. Of cause I've heard of the people you've mentioned and often people that criticise Islam are shot down in flames (Trump deserves that most times to be fair!) but Christianity is definitely fairer game. Every day I go to work I hear someone saying JESUS CHRIST and that's just a minor thing. If someone blasphemed against Allah and a Muslim heard it, I think the person who said it would be reprimanded. That's just one comparison.

And no I haven't gone to my HR, before you suggest I should have, because I don't want to go down that line. I could speak to them personally and say I'd rather they not do it, but I know no offence is meant.