That 'think Liverpool' quote

[pommpey]

Irrespective of the phrase "game changing" the Princes money enabled Clough to spend. McCabe had clearly stated his days of throwing money at the club were over, hence the cheap option of Weird and his collection of mostly lightweight bargain basement signings.

I think he had to allow Clough to spend, to arrest what was a terminal death rattle. Given where we were, mid season and well in the shit, Clough was in a pretty shit position to bring in possibly who he really wanted. Hence the initial purchases. Brayford was a loanee, warming the bench elsewhere.

People also need to understand the"championship spending" quote regarding HRH wasn't made at the time he was announced, but some two and a half years later.

Do you not think that was made when people were asking about the GCI and why the Prince wason board. Seem to recall there were many on here saying he hadn't even been seen at a match forsometime and wondering if he was really interested given much of his input had been burned on exiting managersand failed attempts at promotion.

As Bush says, why invest at all?

Why not? The option is stagnation. That's where we were for too long.

pommpey

 

[pommpey]

'kin hell, he's out of bed again...

You'll have to wait for high tide and jettison topweight, like Tunstall for example.

See what I did there, folks?

Comedygold

pommpey

 

[Bert]

You'll have to wait for high tide and jettison topweight, like Tunstall for example.

See what I did there, folks?

Comedygold

pommpey

Aye aye, you're right Bert got it badly wrong there.... It should have been "he's out of his hammock again "

 

[pommpey]

Aye aye, you're right Bert got it badly wrong there.... It should have been "he's out of his hammock again "

pommpey

 

[Sean Thornton]

"I think he had to allow Clough to spend, to arrest what was a terminal death rattle. Given where we were, mid season and well in the shit, Clough was in a pretty shit position to bring in possibly who he really wanted. Hence the initial purchases. Brayford was a loanee, warming the bench elsewhere."





The level of the spending was obviously due to the Princes initial input. But as you say it was a neccesity because of the total bollocks Weir made if the job.






"Do you not think that was made when people were asking about the GCI and why the Prince wason board. Seem to recall there were many on here saying he hadn't even been seen at a match forsometime and wondering if he was really interested given much of his input had been burned on exiting managersand failed attempts at promotion."




There were many on here who were saying he hadn't been seen at a match who had ignored the press release and others posters telling them it was because of his government job. Ignored deliberately by a few in order to criticise him, saying he was no longer interested, despite proof he was still throwing cash at it. They'd be the ones I'd question. They were wrong. That's a fact.

Irrespective of the actual facts above, I've already suggested we've seen very little of that spending. Very little.





"Why not? The option is stagnation. That's where we were for too long"




The comment was about the Prince, as per Bush Blades post.




pommpey

 

[Kevincarterversion2.0]

The stupid game changing/Liverpool investment quote was always going to come back to bite McCabe/the board in the bum. McCabe has said a few stupid things in public over the years. Although I think big Clayton, Baldock and Stevens are good signings - we wont be able to go on forever just relying on bargins/Wilder's skills in the technical area/training pitch etc - if we have ambition to push for the PL. Cheap will only get us so far. I never will 100% trust our board, given past performance, so I am always bracing myself for some lunacy at some point. At least that have been more sensible in the last year and a half.

But, I dont think this has been by any means a disasterous window - the three players I mentioned are good signings - Blackman is also proving his worth. The main aim for me this season is to survive and try and finish as high as we can. However, the board will need to be a bit more ambitious with money, if we want to match the manager's ambition for the club. I think the jury is out on whether they will be.

 

[Snowman]

I am not satisfied with the lack of explanation of the sacking of Cluff. Similarly Wilson and even Blackwell. All three had the capability for us to move onwards (with the right investment) and all three went suddenly and without reason. McCabe has never commented on it, and the managers also. Why not?

pommpey

OK Pomps, I've read the above and the rest of the thread and also some other answers you gave to my queries. I think I get it. Is this correct?

McCabe has appointed:

1. Blackwell
2. Wilson
3. Weir
4. Clough
5. Adkins

In respect of 1,2 and 4 you considered that these managers were capable of moving the club forward with the right investment. They were therefore good appointments for which you would not criticise McCabe. As for 3, the jury was out and until he turned out to be a disaster you had no firm opinion. With regard to 5 you seem to accept it wasn't a bad appointment based on his record. You just objected that he was appointed at all on the basis that Clough shouldn't have been sacked.

If that is correct, at this point we have Pomps appeh with McCabe for appointing 1,2,4 and ambivalent on 3 and 5. That is 3-0 to Appeh McCabe.

On sackings, you believe that McCabe was wrong to sack 1,2 and 4 and you object to the resultant spunkin of muneh on settlements. You I believe have to accept the sacking of 3 as being correct and as I see it Adkins you don't seem to have a view on. Appeh McCabe 1 - Spunkin Pomps 3.

Half time score Appeh McCabe 4 - Spunkin Pomps 3.

On Investment GCI or otherwise, whatever anyone says you are firmly of the opinion that McCabe and Prince have not invested sufficiently in the team despite having the resources to do so. Nobody will ever convince you otherwise despite pointing to the published accounts. Your take on the issue is that there was insufficient investment partly because McCabe spunked the muneh on (to you) needless pay offs to 1,2 and 4, but 3 and 5 may have been necessary. Although that might be 3-2 to Spunkin Pomps, Spunkin Pomps claims the 4-1 because Adkins wasn't given the resources and therefore that was McCabes fault. 60 mins gone in the game and it is Appeh Mcabe 5 - Spunkin Pomps 7.

Further, on investment you consider that the Desso was a waste of money when it could have been spent on the team. Same with the training facilities. From Pomps a very definite thunderbolt high into the top right hand corner of spunkin to make it Appeh McCabe 5 - Spunkin Pomps 8.

Then we come to the Liverpool quote. Pomps accepts that it was not as stated made by McCabe. It was Phipps and was made in a different context to the usually accepted "we're going to chuck money at it". Appeh McCabe gets one back, but Spunkin Pomps counters that on his public pronouncements such as on investing in the Championship and special signings McCabe is disingenuous. Appeh McCabe 6 - Spunkin Pomps 9.

Appeh McCabe slices through Spunkin Pomps back line three times in time added on to rattle three past Spunkin Pomps with the appointment of Wilder, the backing of Wilder for the 100 point season and the holding of the season ticket prices for 2017/18. Pomps asks the ref to consult the lino maintaining that the first two were lucky because McCabe was just going for the cheap option again with Wilder and Wilder's brilliance is nowt to do with McCabe. Even tries to get the third overruled because McCabe is Spunkin muneh away by not charging a competitive rate to the fans which could end up being invested in the team. Ref rules out 2 goals very controversially.

Final score Appeh McCabe 7 Spunkin Pomps 9.

Is that about it? Closer than I thought.

 

[Esablade]

We spent much more than what we earned and the owners had to make up the shortfall. That's fact.

That happens at pretty much every football club in the land...

 

[Esablade]

Unfortunately, 'game changing' is a vague enough term for us to spend several days arguing over its definition and how to quantify it. That's kind of pointless.

It's not vague at all.

We haven't seen game changing investment as McCabe stated we would upon promotion to the Championship.

 

[pommpey]

OK Pomps, ..

Your edited highlights failed to show:

1. Murphy. Sold - sorry, 'we couldn't stop his undisclosed sale' when he was on a recently signed three year contract and the previous season's top scorer. I think that one belongs to Spunkin' Pommpey.
2. As assured by many on here, the FA Cup money paid for Desso. Okay, I'll buy that, rather than 'Murphy money'. But why buy Desso when our backline was outstandingly shit and leaking goals? I'll have that one as well.
3.The 'proof' that Desso did what it did (reduced injuries, got us playing better, cured world poverty and split the atom) is shat endwards by us winning away on cowfields and said cowfield teams coming to BDTBL on Desso and beating us. That's one for me as well.
4. Finally, no mention of the blessed phrases 'Game Changing Investment' and something alluding to big money when promoted. I don't think the first has been fulfilled and the second one is open to debate. One all, if you like.

Note: I have not contributed to the 'McCabe Must Go' thread because, contrary to popular belief, I don't think his exit from the club is in any way beneficial. As said previously, he's not bent, or malevolent in any way. He wants the best for the club. Its how he goes about it which irks me.

I just wish he'd stop treating the fanbase like a bunch of mugs and stop bullshitting. We've had it for years and the years of squad depletion and unsuccessful struggles to stop the slide has been deleterious on club reputation and has split the fanbase. It's finally stopped not because of some canny masterplan to appoint the best manager we have now since Bassett (better, dare I say, than Warnock) but because he has serially appointed and fired what appears to be (if we believe his and his adoring supporters accounts) misfiring duds. I don't think Wilson was that, nor Clough either.We don't know why they went still, and again, are broadly split on the reasons why.

I'm not after scoring anything on the bloke running the club. What I'd like him to do now is give us the confidence we will build on what was a fucking outstanding last season and survive the first few years at this level, and not just 'make do' with the likes of Basham and Carruthers and acquisitions from lower divisions who are more risk than asset, and work toward replacing people like Sharp when he is injured or only has three quarters of a season in his legs. Not much to ask for. Maybe that fulfilment is in the players we have signed and lies in the gift of Wilder. I hope so. But I am not at the moment that confident.

pommpey

 

[Snowman]

Your edited highlights failed to show:

1. Murphy. Sold - sorry, 'we couldn't stop his undisclosed sale' when he was on a recently signed three year contract and the previous season's top scorer. I think that one belongs to Spunkin' Pommpey.
2. As assured by many on here, the FA Cup money paid for Desso. Okay, I'll buy that, rather than 'Murphy money'. But why buy Desso when our backline was outstandingly shit and leaking goals? I'll have that one as well.
3.The 'proof' that Desso did what it did (reduced injuries, got us playing better, cured world poverty and split the atom) is shat endwards by us winning away on cowfields and said cowfield teams coming to BDTBL on Desso and beating us. That's one for me as well.
4. Finally, no mention of the blessed phrases 'Game Changing Investment' and something alluding to big money when promoted. I don't think the first has been fulfilled and the second one is open to debate. One all, if you like.

Note: I have not contributed to the 'McCabe Must Go' thread because, contrary to popular belief, I don't think his exit from the club is in any way beneficial. As said previously, he's not bent, or malevolent in any way. He wants the best for the club. Its how he goes about it which irks me.

I just wish he'd stop treating the fanbase like a bunch of mugs and stop bullshitting. We've had it for years and the years of squad depletion and unsuccessful struggles to stop the slide has been deleterious on club reputation and has split the fanbase. It's finally stopped not because of some canny masterplan to appoint the best manager we have now since Bassett (better, dare I say, than Warnock) but because he has serially appointed and fired what appears to be (if we believe his and his adoring supporters accounts) misfiring duds. I don't think Wilson was that, nor Clough either.We don't know why they went still, and again, are broadly split on the reasons why.

I'm not after scoring anything on the bloke running the club. What I'd like him to do now is give us the confidence we will build on what was a fucking outstanding last season and survive the first few years at this level, and not just 'make do' with the likes of Basham and Carruthers and acquisitions from lower divisions who are more risk than asset, and work toward replacing people like Sharp when he is injured or only has three quarters of a season in his legs. Not much to ask for. Maybe that fulfilment is in the players we have signed and lies in the gift of Wilder. I hope so. But I am not at the moment that confident.

pommpey

Fair do's Pomps. I concede that at the moment I am confused as to what we have or haven't got in the kitty and if I knew then at least I could form an opinion on whether we were capable of investing for a Championship future or whether we are scraping by again.

 

[Pedro's Winger]

I don't think that was what happened though. We signed a lot of players under Clough and spent a lot of money. That's documented in the accounts. We spent much more than what we earned and the owners had to make up the shortfall. That's fact.

'very little went on players any different to what any club United's size would expect.' is a matter of opinion and is thus subjective.

Likewise, it can be argued that before the Prince's investment we were heading towards L2 and were transformed into FA Cup semi finalists, just missing out on the playoffs and having a record breaking run of games. That was certainly game changing, albeit not game changing enough.

Unfortunately, 'game changing' is a vague enough term for us to spend several days arguing over its definition and how to quantify it. That's kind of pointless. But if the Prince didn't genuinely believe that the money he was going to invest was going to make a significant impact; to get us out of L1 and challenging for the PL, why on earth did he invest it?

If we'd had no prince and no comments about thinking Liverpool or gamechanging and just acquired the players we did, no-one would have noticed any difference.
No doubt a bit of investment helped ease the burden on McCabe but no-one outside United would have looked at the club and thought they're now moneybags or spending significant money on players.

 

[BushBlade]

If we'd had no prince and no comments about thinking Liverpool or gamechanging and just acquired the players we did, no-one would have noticed any difference.
No doubt a bit of investment helped ease the burden on McCabe but no-one outside United would have looked at the club and thought they're now moneybags or spending significant money on players.

I think that without the Prince's investment we wouldn't have got Clough or the players he brought in and could well have been relegated. Which is a matter of opinion. My opinion differs from yours, I've already explained why and I'm not going to repeat myself. It's not really a big issue unless people want to make it a big issue.

 

[Rodley]

I think that without the Prince's investment we wouldn't have got Clough or the players he brought in and could well have been relegated. Which is a matter of opinion. My opinion differs from yours, I've already explained why and I'm not going to repeat myself. It's not really a big issue unless people want to make it a big issue.

No one ever wins an argument on da interwebZ

 

[PeteBlade]

If we'd had no prince and no comments about thinking Liverpool or gamechanging and just acquired the players we did, no-one would have noticed any difference.
No doubt a bit of investment helped ease the burden on McCabe but no-one outside United would have looked at the club and thought they're now moneybags or spending significant money on players.

Yeah, no one really bitched and moaned about absolutely everything before the Prince joined us...

 

[Sean Thornton]

If we'd had no prince and no comments about thinking Liverpool or gamechanging and just acquired the players we did, no-one would have noticed any difference.
No doubt a bit of investment helped ease the burden on McCabe but no-one outside United would have looked at the club and thought they're now moneybags or spending significant money on players.

The difference with no Prince and with Weirs signings we would have been relegated. I'd say that's a big difference.

 

[Tunstall Fred]

No one ever wins an argument on da interwebZ

Nonsense,we have somebody on this very thread,who never ever loses an argument on the internet,

 

[I should coco]

Nonsense,we have somebody on this very thread,who never ever loses an argument on the internet,

Ahoy there!

 

[Revolution]

The difference with no Prince and with Weirs signings we would have been relegated. I'd say that's a big difference.

This is almost certainly correct. I suspect Clough would have struggled ed to keep us up without the signings he was allowed to make.

Not that it matters but it has never been clear to me whether the Prince was brought in expressly to help us buy our way out of trouble, or whether the timing was a coincidence. Do you know Sean?

 

[Sean Thornton]

This is almost certainly correct. I suspect Clough would have struggled ed to keep us up without the signings he was allowed to make.

Not that it matters but it has never been clear to me whether the Prince was brought in expressly to help us buy our way out of trouble, or whether the timing was a coincidence. Do you know Sean?

No idea. Like most I was taken by surprise at the time although I have read on here it was announced at a corporate do some months earlier including comments that weren't actually made until 2016, so I have my doubts about that claim. I'd be surprised if HRH thought he'd have to spend around £17m just to help get us promoted though.

 

[I should coco]

I'd be surprised if HRH thought he'd have to spend around £17m just to help get us promoted though.

I'm sure McCabe would have told him (and genuinely believed), that spending £2-3m in that division would get us up the following year. If HRH had the merest inkling about the 'Adkins decades'* he'd have run a mile.



* I know it was only 11 months, it just felt like half my life.

 

[The Crab]

I'm sure McCabe would have told him (and genuinely believed), that spending £2-3m in that division would get us up the following year. If HRH had the merest inkling about the 'Adkins decades'* he'd have run a mile.



* I know it was only 11 months, it just felt like half my life.

I know what you mean, fucking hated Geese after his time. Then again, I've always thought Geese are Bastards.

 

[1danewhitehouse]

Honestly.

It's time to forget this "think Liverpool" quite was ever uttered.

It's just a stick to beat.

Ill advised at the time ? No doubt.

Time has moved on. So has the game. And the financial side is just plain madness. It WILL end in tears for some.

UTB

Agreed. It was a while ago and the lack of context can skew that point. Perhaps we should focus on this summer's McCabe comments of "substantial" and "competitive" budgets or "special signings"?