A comparison regarding what to expect from Ched Evans next season

[1danewhitehouse]

Don't stop now -you're starting to get the hang of it (but maybe think about using capitals a bit)

I’d say he’s a little way to go yet. Needs to start using “end of”, “fact” and “nuff said” to properly make these points.

 

[1danewhitehouse]

My only issue with this is his ongoing fitness. His performance in the early part of the game against us showed he hadn't lost it, and he looked strong. I'd expect the lay off to cause ongoing fitness problems. Can he get over that? Whatever the fee, if he can't it's a waste of money that could be spent elsewhere. Future spending on players will tell whether it's a sound monetary deal.

I agree with this. There’s enough evidence to suggest the ability is still there. It’s all about whether he can reach a level of fitness and stay there. Hopefully, given the turnaround in Coutts this season, he’s in the best place to make that happen. Our game against Chessy showed he still had ability but he was blowing out of his arse before half time and went off injured in the 2nd half. That game alone shows both the reasons for optimism and the reasons to be cautious.

 

[1danewhitehouse]

I agree that it is uncertain, my main point is that this season's record shouldn't be the only thing we judge Ched's potential ability on.

I think Tammy Abrahams will be out of reach. Matty Taylor also looked good to me, but signed for Bristol City in January and hasn't yet adapted to Championship level. With Sharp and Clarke above 30, Lavery injury prone and Hanson probably not a regular, we need to keep looking at new strikers and I agree that Premiership loans is something we should consider.

I think he meant try to discover the next Tammy Abraham rather than signing him as he will of course be beyond our reach. Hopefully, we will still bring in a young athletic striker to compliment what we have.

 

[1danewhitehouse]

Forget whether we should take him back. Personally, after everything that's happened, I'm just gobsmacked that he wants to come back to us. If I was him (shudder) I'd want to put serious distance between myself and anything to do with that period of my life.

He’s had a lot of very vocal support from a lot of blades fans and more than likely, players, directors, staff etc. from that period. He's publicly expressed his gratitude for that support on several occasions. Immediately prior to the conviction was the best spell of his career. I can see the reasons for him wanting to come back. He probably considers our club home and I dare say, has a real affinity for the club.

 

[1danewhitehouse]

I agree that we can't judge him on this season,as I don't think he had a proper pre season along with not playing for such a long time...I think for the money we are reported to be outlaying it's worth the gamble,and with a full preseason I think he'll score goals in a footballing side.
Under Blackwell I don't think it suited him,and then again in the relegation season under 4 different Managers.
He did have a good spell or two at Norwich if I remember right in the Championship...again in a decent footballing side who create chances..that's why he flourished in Wilson's first season for me...CW and the way we play will suit him down to the ground.

I seem to recall him having a decent spell when Carver was caretaker. He played up front on his own under Speed and was out on the wing under Adams before missing the end of the season through injury. Still, he scored 9 goals in a dreadful team that was relegated which wasn’t too bad for a 21 year old.

The previous season under Blackwell it just didn’t happen for him at all. He didn’t seem to be able to forge a partnership with Henderson. We chopped and changed between Hendo, Evans, Camara and Cresswell and he just never really got going (after some promise on his first couple of appearances).

 

[1danewhitehouse]

I think we need to get a perspective on this.

I'm more concerned about the overall recruitment policy than the signing of Ched. If that's right then we'll do well whatever Ched turns out to be.

As for Ched - his physical injuries are less important than his mental ones. A player can get over an ankle injury (usually) and that's not a reason for him to fail. But how the lad is set up mentally to come back from the self-induced hell he's been through is another story.

He needs total support from the fans to overcome this. Put aside your prejudices about morals and all that other shite and back the manager who is backing the player.


That's the best way forward for the club.

I think the vast majority will be right behind him. Even those who have doubts about the signing, most will be hoping he comes good and will be rooting for him I reckon. Only a small minority seem to have such a strong issue with him that they feel they can’t root for him.

 

[1danewhitehouse]

I don't think you've quite grasped the point I was making, but let me agree with you on some things...

You are saying is that it's the physical injuries that have kept him out of the team - and I agree with that 100%. You're also raising doubts about his fitness levels and whether he can stay fit enough to make a positive impact on the team - and I think that's something none of us, not even Ched himself, know the answer to - and that for me is "the risk" in this signing. However...

You're then suggesting he's got a track record of being injury prone. In the three seasons he played for us before going down, the least number of games he played was 35. I don't think that's bad or unusual tbh. In fact he played 35, 36 and 42 games for us in those three seasons. We're not talking Laurent D' Jaffo or Jon Ebrell here. We're talking about a player who will play the majority of games of in a season, so I think you are being a bit unfair painting him as some kind of crock who has always been injury prone and using that to support your argument. And the comparison to James Wallace just shows that you've got a very negative view about Evans, not based on any facts.

I think it's not surprising that after a long time out of the game he hasn't managed so many games this season. I think it's a small miracle he's kept himself fit enough to even be under consideration for a career in football ever again.

When you say, "Evans has shown no signs of mental strain" - I wonder what you are basing that on and how you are qualified to know such information? I believe that he has been through some serious mental trauma because of what has happened to him and has doubted whether he will ever be able to play football again.

He needs to be physically fit - of course. And he needs to be mentally fit too - and have support from our fans.

I think you make some valid points re the mental strain but one thing is for sure. We won’t need to worry about him being motivated to succeed here. He was absolutely flying in a team gunning for promotion only to have it devastatingly ripped away. He thought he would be coming back to it 2.5 years ago but for one reason or another it hasn’t happened. He’s been keen to get back here ever since the day he left and will be busting a gut to be a success.

 

[1danewhitehouse]

Well, in 2009-10 Evans had an 8 game spell out injured.

He had a similar spell in 2010-11.

He missed the first 6 league games in 2011-12

He hasn't played this season since early March.

No, he's not an Ebbrell. But in every season except one in which he's been a regular, he's broken down and missed significant time in March/April. That's interesting. Also, more importantly, he's injured now. We have a terrible record when it comes to signing injured players. They tend to keep getting injured...

You might be right about mental trauma. I don't know (I hear, anecdotally, that Evans is not very bright, but I have never met him myself). That has not been reported as being a reason why he's missed games this season.

The end of 2010-11 and start of 2011-12 was the same injury. He ruptured his Achilles shortly before THAT night in May 2011 and came back around September.

 

[Revolution]

Injections in the ankle. Could be similar to the issues Leon Clarke has had this season where he needed a good rehab period to get it right. By all accounts Chesterfield have rushed Ched back at every opportunity so perhaps it's just never had the chance to settle down.

If I read the stats right he's been out 4 times: twice for a fortnight, once for a month, and the current layoff which is approaching 8 weeks.

 

[Revolution]

The end of 2010-11 and start of 2011-12 was the same injury. He ruptured his Achilles shortly before THAT night in May 2011 and came back around September.

Yes I know, although he did play in the penultimate game (when Barnsley relegated us).

 

[1danewhitehouse]

If I read the stats right he's been out 4 times: twice for a fortnight, once for a month, and the current layoff which is approaching 8 weeks.

That is probably about right. But we tried bringing Leon back in the autumn for a bit before he was laid off and given injections again and given a lengthy spell to get right. Maybe this is what's now happens with Evans? I hope so and that he will be healthy in time for the start of pre-season. If he can get a good pre-season under his belt then hopefully he will be OK. All speculation of course.

 

[1danewhitehouse]

Yes I know, although he did play in the penultimate game (when Barnsley relegated us).

Right you are. Just checked and he came on for the last 20 mins. Never knew that. I was on my stag do that day and was absolutely obliterated.

 

[Champagneblade]

The OP raises some good points.

You could argue the 28-32 age is when players are at their best and Hughes was coming to the end of that whilst Evans is just reaching it.

A full pre-season behind him instead of playing catch up would do him no harm either.

Outside the football arena I've nothing to add, given his legal status is that of a free man. Question is only his ability to bounce back.

His desire to succeed will no doubt be extremely high and he was a hard working player, especially in the 35 goal season. He may have got 'just' 7 goals, but he looked very dangerous in the game against us, but what this also showed is that Chesterfield spend much more time defending than attacking and he's probably having to take the ball with his back to goal for them far more than bearing down on it, given the team's lack of quality.

I can see where Wilder is coming from to a point. If the team doesn't have sufficient firepower, we are not going to prosper next season. Wilder is smart with funds and he probably accepts he's not going to be able to buy a mainstay striker to play all the matches. If he did he may be looking at 5-10m minimum. As it is, he has options to rotate - Sharp has done well this year, but you can see him having games where it just doesn't happen against better defenders next season. Big Leon has shown in the last handful of games than even if he is not a regular, on his day, he can make a game changing contribution. Lavery has shown that he can unsettle teams with his pace and started to finish one or two before his injury. Hansen will clearly add that physical card all successful teams need to be able to play. All of these can chip in. Then Evans brings something different - he's still got a powerful shot for one. First game of the season Chesterfield scored after he rattled the bar with a free kick. We don't have so many who can ping them in from distance or be lethal from dead balls.

You look at Jordan Rhodes as a good comparison. He's probably had at least the career Ched should have had. Yet on the same level, Evans was a far superior player. He scored a much greater variety of goals. Rhodes scored 39 goals with 3 assists in 45 matches. He spent 3,782 minutes on the pitch, so a goal every 97 minutes and a goal contribution every 90. He's cost about 10m and he'll be in close to 40k per week. Evans scored 35 in 42 appearance and with an impressive 11 assists. He spent 3,335 minutes on the pitch so a goal every 95 minutes and a goal contribution every 72.

I can't see the fee being 500k, maybe rising to that based on add-ons. That said, a good pre-season and a manager who plays the way we do and attacks and it may even look a snip compared to what the other lot paid for a poacher.

To me it just comes down to this - I implicitly trust Wilder to do the right thing. He's earned that. If this is the right move in his view, then it has my backing, whatever lingering doubts I may have.

 

[Bergen Blade]

Yes, but we knew that anyway.
.

I've seen loads of fans and news items such as this one below that do seem to be judging him based on the current season at Chesterfield:



I'm not certain at all how he'll do and don't feel qualified to assess him based on one performance. But I trust Wilder and his team will have comprehensively studied him and tried to look beyond his goal tally of this season. Maybe they've even looked at Lee Hughes' career record after being out for a lengthy period.

 

[DronnieBlade]

Ched and sharp will work perfectly imo, cheds like a done type player but stronger and with a better eye for goal.

I reckon lavery will learn a lot from him as well.

Imagine ched muscling his way past defenders, if they go to him they leave sharp in the 6 yard box, if they leave him he'll get a good shot off.

If he can regain full fitness it could be a very effective partnership

This.

UTB

 

[Revolution]

I've seen loads of fans and news items such as this one below that do seem to be judging him based on the current season at Chesterfield:

View attachment 26234

I'm not certain at all how he'll do and don't feel qualified to assess him based on one performance. But I trust Wilder and his team will have comprehensively studied him and tried to look beyond his goal tally of this season. Maybe they've even looked at Lee Hughes' career record after being out for a lengthy period.

I trust Wilder too. I hope he has bought into this.

But Lee Hughes' post incarceration record will tell you nothing about how Evans will fare going forward.

And looking at his most recent performance and injury history is probably the most important analysis you can do.

 

[Gavlar]

Karma, irony and fate have yet to raise heads fully in this saga.

I wrongly predicted early in the charge up the table that we would need at least a point from the chezzy game and Evans would score the only goal condemning us to the play offs.

Ok, so what happened to fate, irony and Karma?

Maybe, just maybe we are only part way through the saga. Picture this, pigs miss out on play offs this year, we are int Championship next season and maybe we make a late run and Ched scores the winning goal to overtake the pigs for promotion ont last day............. I'll leave you to think about that

What if fate, irony and karma are all total bollocks constructs we invented to make ourselves feel better when things go wrong?

 

[BushBlade]

What if fate, irony and karma are all total bollocks constructs we invented to make ourselves feel better when things go wrong?

Like beer and drugs?

 

[Gavlar]

Like beer and drugs?

No cause they are real.

 

[Gavlar]

I agree that it is uncertain, my main point is that this season's record shouldn't be the only thing we judge Ched's potential ability on.

I think Tammy Abrahams will be out of reach. Matty Taylor also looked good to me, but signed for Bristol City in January and hasn't yet adapted to Championship level. With Sharp and Clarke above 30, Lavery injury prone and Hanson probably not a regular, we need to keep looking at new strikers and I agree that Premiership loans is something we should consider.

Fair enough.

I agree we need new strikers, but think we can cast our net a little further and get someone better than Ched, unless he can reclaim his pre prison form.

Time will tell of course.

 

[Dnblade]

I seem to recall him having a decent spell when Carver was caretaker. He played up front on his own under Speed and was out on the wing under Adams before missing the end of the season through injury. Still, he scored 9 goals in a dreadful team that was relegated which wasn’t too bad for a 21 year old.

The previous season under Blackwell it just didn’t happen for him at all. He didn’t seem to be able to forge a partnership with Henderson. We chopped and changed between Hendo, Evans, Camara and Cresswell and he just never really got going (after some promise on his first couple of appearances).

Yes,that was 9 goals in a relegation outfit,serving under 4 Managers,so I agree it's not to bad a return considering the turmoil and changes in style of play,being played out of position...Remember him looking decent for Norwich before that when they came to the Lane,and I think he scored against us at Carrow Road that season,so he wasn't really a total failure at that level.

 

[BushBlade]

No cause they are real.

Religion is the opium of the masses.

 

[BushBlade]

Fair enough.

I agree we need new strikers, but think we can cast our net a little further and get someone better than Ched, unless he can reclaim his pre prison form.

Time will tell of course.

I suspect a loan of a young kid from a PL academy. He'd hopefully give us something we couldn't otherwise afford, pace and technique.