New stadium at the Lane?

[blade too long]

Post 325, you said there wasn't one.

i said there wasnt one to fill the gap between 38k highbury and just short of 61 k emirates
emirates

it was a gamble based on what theyd seen at old trafford

they had no proof it would fill

 

[Sean Thornton]

i said there wasnt one to fill the gap between 38k highbury and just short of 61 k emirates
emirates

it was a gamble based on what theyd seen at old trafford

blade too long said: ↑
but why was there a waiting list for the new stadium when there wasnt one before for highbury"

Why do you lie?

 

[blade too long]

blade too long said: ↑
but why was there a waiting list for the new stadium when there wasnt one before for highbury"

Why do you lie?

the last few years for highbury were to get emirates seats

Arsenal took a big gamble
they started planning the new stadium in 1994 , and made the decision in 1997 and put in planning for the Emirates in 2000 after raising the money

in the years leading up to making the decision they got averages of 35 k 37 k , not full houses
no waiting lists to say theyd fill a 61 k stadium
just a belief they would

which is what we need

its not a lie its what happened

 

[Sean Thornton]

the last few years for highbury were to get emirates seats

Arsenal took a big gamble
they started planning the new stadium in 1997 and put in planning for the Emirates in 2000

in the years leading up to making the decision they got averages of 35 k 37 k , not full houses
no waiting lists to say theyd fill a 61 k stadium
just a belief they would

which is what we need

Well firstly, the averages just before the Emitates were high 37s and 38k's. Which could be put down to some away tickets not being sold, something you have no idea about but pooh pooh it without any evidence.

But we've been here before. You clearly said there was no waiting list at Highbury. Which was the point I made and which you have chosen to ignore and go off at a tangent rather than admit you don't know what you're talking about, but simply make things up and ignore corrections to your nonsense.

Batshit crazy.

 

[blade too long]

Well firstly, the averages just before the Emitates were high 37s and 38k's. Which could be put down to some away tickets not being sold, something you have no idea about but pooh pooh it without any evidence.

But we've been here before. You clearly said there was no waiting list at Highbury. Which was the point I made and which you have chosen to ignore and go off at a tangent rather than admit you don't know what you're talking about, but simply make things up and ignore corrections to your nonsense.

Batshit crazy.

no the whole arguments about should united go ahead and expand , bigger kop etc

when Arsenal were where we are now
they decided to look at expanding highbury , max 48 k or run the gamble of building the Emirates

its about when the process starts , not the last couple of years when the fans can see it being built , obviously the waiting list would grow then

but why
theres tangible evidence its there

when ARSENAL FIRST PLANNED IT YOU SHOW ME ANY REPORT THAT SAYS THEYD GOT PROOF OF BEING CERTAIN THEYD FILL IT around 1994 to 97

which is like where we are now

your usual pedantic bull crap

its about belief
they believed

 

[Sean Thornton]

no the whole arguments about should united go ahead and expand , bigger kop etc

when Arsenal were where we are now
they decided to look at expanding highbury , max 48 k or run the gamble of building the Emirates

its about when the process starts , not the last couple of years when the fans can see it being built , obviously the waiting list would grow then

but why
theres tangible evidence its there

when ARSENAL FIRST PLANNED IT YOU SHOW ME ANY REPORT THAT SAYS THEYD GOT PROOF OF BEING CERTAIN THEYD FILL IT around 1994 to 97

which is like where we are now

your usual pedantic bull crap

its about belief
they believed

YOU SAID THERE WAS NO WAITING LIST AT HIGHBURY

YES OR NO?

 

[blade too long]

YOU SAID THERE WAS NO WAITING LIST AT HIGHBURY

YES OR NO?

not when it was planned and started

end of

it was born out of ambition in the mid nineties
not a waiting list

which was my point
not when the foundations started to appear 9 or 10 years later

im trying to compare how its started
not the last minute rush

 

[super_pig]

you know they call the Emirates 'the library'.. right??

 

[Sean Thornton]

not when it was planned and started

end of

it was born out of ambition in the mid nineties
not a waiting list

which was my point
not when the foundations started

FFS.

 

[blade too long]

FFS.

ffs yes
its supposed to be how a club decides when or if they can expand
Arsenal did it on seeing old traffords pull , and man utds income increase
not on some mythical waiting list

yes one grew when the stadium went ahead , but the decision was taken prior to that

but my only argument is the decision was not originally taken on 25000 people clammering to get tickets in 1997

we are argueing now , should we risk it
if we built a new kop and people saw it demand would grow on seeing it


same thing

 

[FATTYFOULKE]

for sake of repeating:

THE KOP SEATS ARE SHIT FOR ANY ONE OVER 6 FEET TALL !

It is of low rake and does not hold any future (built on earth) for a club that should/has ambitions to get back to the premier league.

It needs dropping when finances are available and rebuilding from scratch - with all the problems of capacity that brings.

The underneath could have decent facilities that can (hopefully) allow kopites to buy beer/food at decent prices and drink/eat in relative space.

For the ones that went to peterborough recently, there was probably MORE space under the stand we had (for 2.500) than what is presently available under South stand for 8,000. SS is a fucking nightmare when it's full - certainly designed in/for the 70's and not for now.

UTB

The planned extra 3000 seats are at a steeper rake. If you really are that uncomfortable move up there.

 

[Keen Blade]

Fuckinell , we are not back to Arsenal/Highbury/Emirates are we lads ?

you two should commission a remake of this grand old film :

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Arsenal_Stadium_Mystery

FFS , BTL please give up on this Arsenal business , the Gooners are one of the biggest names in football in a capital city of 9m people.

We are SUFC in an unfashionable , ordinary Northern town , we MIGHT touch 30,000 in the Championship now and again , IF we make the tickets cheap ,

we MIGHT put a few seats on the back of the kop , and install some better facilities for converting lager into piss ,

but in a 2-Club city with the Premiership just a dream , the maxim of "build it , they will come" is a dangerous mistake that sensible fans hope McCabe will not make , despite his previous tilting at windmills with crazy World Cup bids.

The team is the only place to spend big money , until we actually look like we can survive more than 5 minutes in the Prem.

 

[nopigfansintown]

Personally I see the South stand being done first. My rationale is that we currently have segregation issues on the away end and G and H of the South stand and John Street, that can be resolved if we have more seats.Many fanbases in the Championship or Premier League would take up full allocations, if tickets were reasonably priced, in a similar way to that they used to be on Leppings Lane, Swillsborough. We also do not then need to consider giving blades fans tickets on the Bramall Lane end ,as they would be provided for on the extended new South. The South stand regularly sells out, even in league one, as well as the corporate facilities on John Street. These punters pay more for attendance than those on the Kop, so the business plan would be sounder - so long as we stayed in the Championship or Premier league. There is currently more of a need to provide higher priced tickets, corporate facilities and access all the away seats, than there is to provide better facilities and cheaper seats on the Kop. There has been an interesting debate, with some similarities, at Anfield in the last few years. They decided that their new main stand would mainly cater for higher paying fans, rather than those on their 25k waiting list, as the stand would be paid for in five years. It would also keep demand high for high cost tickets due to there being more demand for all tickets than is met by the current supply. The Liverpool owners will not improve their version of the Bramall Lane end (Anfield Road) as the business model doesn't stack up. The price of general admission tickets, in a stand with no corporate facilities, does not add up and would require a long term loan.
This all presupposes that stadium renovations are being considered as investments, not just a gift to the football club. It also doesn't factor in other revenue streams that could be accessed by renovations of the Kop or South stand.

 

[raul]

The only thing I find more incredible than the notion that Arsenal had funding for the Emirates approved with nothing more than "We're ambitious" to convince Financiers to invest is the concept that someone would actually believe they did.


But then again.......

 

[I should coco]

The only thing I find more incredible than the notion that Arsenal had funding for the Emirates approved with nothing more than "We're ambitious" to convince Financiers to invest is the concept that someone would actually believe they did.

Don't be silly, of course they had a well worked business plan.

It consisted of one sheet of A4.

On one side it read "Build it and they will come".

On the other side it said "Please turn over"

 

[Sean Thornton]

Don't be silly, of course they had a well worked business plan.

It consisted of one sheet of A4.

On one side it read "Build it and they will come".

On the other side it said "Please turn over"

The security offered for the loan was a vhs video of Field of Dreams and a photograph of a full Old Trafford.

 

[I should coco]

The security offered for the loan was a vhs video of Field of Dreams and a photograph of a full Old Trafford.

VHS or Betamax?

Come on Sean, it's these little details that are important.

 

[Sean Thornton]

VHS or Betamax?

Come on Sean, it's these little details that are important.

Yes.

Betamax as I said.

 

[Tunstall Fred]

One can only imagine the reaction of some,spending money on seats that will be hardly used,if Desso is anything to go by

 

[blade too long]

The only thing I find more incredible than the notion that Arsenal had funding for the Emirates approved with nothing more than "We're ambitious" to convince Financiers to invest is the concept that someone would actually believe they did.


But then again.......

it was all self financed , they couldnt get any help with grants ,, theres a sign others didnt think it was viable when it was first mooted

 

[Sean Thornton]

it was all self financed , they couldnt get any help with grants ,, theres a sign others didnt think it was viable when it was first mooted

Yet again, nonsense. Made up nonsense at that.
The funding banks are named in the link.


http://www.arsenal.com/155/unhoused.../arsenal-confirms-funding-for-stadium-project

 

[blade too long]

Yet again, nonsense. Made up nonsense at that.
The funding banks are named in the link.


http://www.arsenal.com/155/unhoused.../arsenal-confirms-funding-for-stadium-project

from the history of the stadium

Financing for the project proved difficult as Arsenal was not granted any public subsidy by the government. The club therefore sought other ways to generate income, namely by adopting a policy of buying football players for low transfer fees and selling high, as well as agreeing sponsorship deals. Arsenal recouped over £50 million from transfers involving Nicolas Anelka to Real Madrid and Marc Overmars, in a joint deal with Emmanuel Petit to Barcelona. The transfer of Anelka in particular helped fund the club's new training ground, in London Colney, which opened in October 1999.

 

[Sean Thornton]

from the history of the stadium

Financing for the project proved difficult as Arsenal was not granted any public subsidy by the government. The club therefore sought other ways to generate income, namely by adopting a policy of buying football players for low transfer fees and selling high, as well as agreeing sponsorship deals. Arsenal recouped over £50 million from transfers involving Nicolas Anelka to Real Madrid and Marc Overmars, in a joint deal with Emmanuel Petit to Barcelona. The transfer of Anelka in particular helped fund the club's new training ground, in London Colney, which opened in October 1999.

And this paid the £390m total cost?

 

[Sean Thornton]

From thexsame article, which you decided not to post.......for whatever reason.

"Although Arsenal secured a £260 million loan from a group of banks led by the Royal Bank of Scotland in April 2003"

 

[The_Green_Man]

Still very anti-office block!!!!

Give us an improved Kop that makes good of the room that sits behind it......and then put proper corners in that blend!!

Via la "Old Bramall Lane".......

 

[Leonardo Green]

Anyone saying keep the current kop seats is just selfish.

 

[blade too long]

From thexsame article, which you decided not to post.......for whatever reason.

"Although Arsenal secured a £260 million loan from a group of banks led by the Royal Bank of Scotland in April 2003"

Where are you coming from ?
I originally posted they tried for a grant , didnt get one so self financed

all youve done is put up the list of those they self financed with

and called me deluded when I put in sequence , what occurred
all youve done is post some link to the banks they used after having to finance wholley themselves

 

[vorpal blade]

When the stand is used for sitting in, doesn't all that ironmongery get in the way and spoil the view?

 

[Leonardo Green]

View attachment 23950

When the stand is used for sitting in, doesn't all that ironmongery get in the way and spoil the view?

only a problem when we get in champs league.

 

[Sean Thornton]

Where are you coming from ?
I originally posted they tried for a grant , didnt get one so self financed

all youve done is put up the list of those they self financed with

and called me deluded when I put in sequence , what occurred
all youve done is post some link to the banks they used after having to finance wholley themselves

I didn't realise you didn't understand what self financing meant. @rauls point still stands though, did these lenders back the scheme based on "build it and they will come" without any business plan based on actual known realities.