Against the sacking?

[Revolution]

How do you know? Genuine question.

Someone ITK said this in a post over the last 24 hours, and someone else slightly less ITK told me last week he thought (but wasn't 100% sure) there was no such clause.

That's all hearsay, of course. Might not be true.

 

[Darren]

Someone ITK said this in a post over the last 24 hours, and someone else slightly less ITK told me last week he thought (but wasn't 100% sure) there was no such clause.

That's all hearsay, of course. Might not be true.

Fair enough. My hunch is that if United were having to pay out - what, a million - to Adkins and his team, they would have given him the benefit of the doubt and allowed him to carry on at least to the start of next season. The almost immediate post season chop makes me think that the finances were unlikely to have been a consideration.

But as you say, all speculation.

 

[itsinyerblood]

That was 25 years ago so I think you should look in the mirror first

Here she is in 2015, 2 years younger than me (she was born in 1952) and I think she looks great.

View attachment 17396

You're just a horny, lecherous troll BOSS, come out of that closet and embrace your inner perv.

 

[Bladesway]

Yes but he's the immovable object that unfortunately we have to live with.
But there was tangible divide in fans opinion last season, in the stands, in the bars and on social media. The "blind faith brigade" versus the "constant moaners" with the poor folk stuck in the middle who just wanted to watch a game of football.
It might be nieve of me, but let's just give Chris a break and stop the comparisons with previous managers. I would be happy to never see the names of Adkins, Clough, Weir and Wilson on this forum ever again.

Who is not giving Wilder a break? He starts with all the good faith in the world doesn't he? I don't care if he is a Blade, or if he understands the "Blades Way" etc etc. In fact I don't think any of that matters. Apart from a small band of wankers who opposed Wilson I think all our managers have started with the complete support of the fan base. However, to say don't mention the previous managers is to forget the past. Usually it is those who go "yeah but he was rubbish" etc etc, when the truth is they can't all be bad. Common sense dictates something more than the manager is wrong. The players seem to have it cushy. Even when a manager (as Clough did) gets them out of the club they know that they will generally outlast the manager and continue to under perform until their contracts are up.

We are an utter basket case of a club and there is clearly in my opinion a cancer within the club that isn't the manager. I can only pin this down to one man because he has overseen it all. The rise and catastrophic fall of this club. He took shitloads of praise when it was going well but seems to teflon the blame onto anyone else.

 

[Bladesman]

What it ultimately comes down to is McCabe does not have a vision for the club. There is no vision, no due process to implement it, no infrastructure for sustainable success.

I found it enlightening when he said at the fans forum that he doesn't have a strategy defined yet for when you get to the Championship. What vision!. His strategy is simply getting out of this 'blessed league' by whatever means possible and worrying about it later. Whether Adkins deserved more time or not and whether Wilder steps up or not, that is not a recipe for success in the long term. Even if you get promoted, you will tread water in the Championship until you have people at executive level with a coherent long term strategy accountable for delivering year on year improvements.

Interesting times ahead, you will learn a lot from your player recruitment. You need quality through the spine of your team, you essentially have an unproven manager with half a squad of players, many of whom have so far proven themselves unable to lift the club out of this league. It is a blank canvas, that is an opportunity. But it begs the question, why going into (what I believe is) your 6th season in this division are you starting again at square 1? It is because there is no one at executive level responsible for coordinating a coherent long term strategy.

Treading water in the Championship, that's what we were doing before we got relegated to League 1. As soon as the comments of "we have to cut our cloth" started circa 2009 we were on a downward spiral from then on.

Now we have two owners that obviously want promotion I assume but clearly have two different ways of going about things.

At the moment it seems to me we could go the right way, the wrong way or the Kevin McCabe way which is the wrong way just faster.

 

[him behind you]

Simply not possible in today's game. The TV money is going up so fast, that periods of 'stability' (i.e. standing still) will see you left far behind. We're already so far behind most teams in the Championship it's worrying - and our 'friends' at S6 could really add to our woes.

See what your saying but if we keep changing just because we've not had a very good season, and spend money on compo rather than improving the playing staff, my worry is that we'll never get out of this mess unless we're simply lucky enough to stumble on something that works. We'll never know but if we'd given Wilson or Clough another season to try to finish the job we may already be up .

 

[flash-blade]

I find it mind boggling that people would have given Adkins more time, players didn't like or get on with him, the performances showed that and were lack luster and downright pitiful at times (the players are a disgrace), he had a full season and took us to our worst finish in 33 years. His interviews were one's of delusion, his signings/loans were bobbar (Billy apart). Personally I've never been so down as a Blade, that was lifted yesterday and McCabe and co have done the right thing for once. Roll on next season as we will get our Sheffield United back.

 

[Alfreton14Blade]

Well best of luck. I contest most of what you say but neither you nor I need to persuade each other otherwise. You are happy with today's events, it doesn't affect me as its not my club. I have made my points clear and you disagree with them and I don't feel the need to keep going back and forth to convince you otherwise and vice versa.

I hope you do get to enjoy a better season next year, you have had a terrible season, I agree partly due to Adkins under performing here in trying but not impossible circumstances. I maintain the belief that you will struggle with McCabe in charge and maintain that any success you do have will be by luck rather than judgement, by bumbling along until you get it right as you say, a crapshoot as I said in my original post.

I think a club of your size should be looking to do more than bumble along but its your club.

Yeah, as you say, we're coming at this from different angles so not going to substantially agree.

But, just on the "bumbling along" point -

(i) as I say, I reckon that's what most clubs do. Then they get lucky with a manager who's a proper fit for them in their circumstances & situation. It's what Wolves, say, did when they appointed Kenny Jackett - no great change in (or establishment of) philosophy, just the right man, doing the right things, at the right time. It's what Ipswich did with Mick McCarthy after stagnating for quite a few years. Hopefully, Chris Wilder will prove to be our "right fit" in a way that Nigel Adkins certainly wasn't.

(ii) as I said too, I reckon there are the inklings of a strategy for the future being put in place, with a renewed emphasis on youth. It's something that's easy to be cynical about (especially bearing in mind our recent history) & to explain away as a cost-cutting exercise. But, to my mind, & whatever the motivations for it, it is the right way forward. Even so, it depends on having the right manager to make it work.

Here's to Chris Wilder. And to an ongoing club strategy.

 

[northsomersetblade]

I am a Saints fan and whilst I was disappointed at this turn of events, it was clear to me that it was coming. Adkins has undoubtedly under-performed this season and with a board like yours, it was inevitable. I think Adkins would have got you promoted next season but instead you start again and your incoming manager will get one shot at it by the looks of the statement on your official site. It looks like the strategy from here it may be about to become a crap shoot with a different manager at the helm until you strike lucky. Last season it was a progressive manager with a bloated squad not adapted to his methods. This year its an unproven manager with u-21 players looks like the way ahead. One day, one of these things will work, surely?!.

From an outsiders perspective it is very clear there is a huge issue at Board level and for me, the issue starts with Kevin McCabe. I watched in disbelief at the Fans Forum as he glugged on a beer, said the terrible failure under his watch was all bad luck, players, managers and staff's fault, made undermining comments about current management, recruitment staff and signings. He made blanket statements such as 'no loan signings' as if simply because some of the signings this year were bad. Unprofessional, reactionary, buck passing and hiding his failures behind other people. It reminded me of the dark days of fans forums before Southampton went into administration. Not quite as bad but it wasn't far off.

Watching him inflate as he said the players signed this season would not get past the technical board now and getting a round of applause for this buck passing gesture said everything about the culture at your club from board level down and why history keeps repeating itself. Scapegoating, buck passing, reactionary thinking, myopia, with periodical sacrificial blood letting to keep the rightly angry fans of his own neck. I'll be honest, I felt as sorry for Nigel having to try and manage in that culture as much as I do for your fans for watching the sum product of it on the pitch each weekend.

At Reading it was all Nigel Adkins fault apparently when they finished 7th in the championship under him. Since sacking him they have finished 19th and 17th. Fans got what they wanted but it was clear to an outsider that sacking him would not make a blind bit of difference. Reading were a horribly run club and had nowhere near enough quality players. Fans blamed him but it's gotten much worse since he left and why wouldn't it? They replaced him with worse managers and worse players for the lesser able managerial replacements to work with. Without being disparaging, from an outsiders point of view it is the same at Sheffield United at this present time. Your group of players is average and your board are seemingly stuck in the dark ages. Today you have chosen to remove the only group in the club proven to Premier League level (1 defeat in 12 when we disposed of the same Adkins and his team at Southampton) and you seem to be about to replace him with a less successful manager who has spent most his managerial career around the conference and league 2 and if the fans forum is to be believed, your unproven U-21's will make up a large part of the squad next year, let's hope they are good.

You simply have to get it right this season with player recruitment and hope for your new management group to raise its performance levels, as at this present there is no culture of success at this level, little quality and few track records in the club and thus, at this time there is no reason why you should expect to succeed next season. For me appointing a less successful manager is not a great start, you are a gambling on an upturn in his managerial fortunes but that's not to say it can't work, sometimes magic happens, the face fits, fans and players get behind him and momentum builds. In other words, a lucky crapshoot.

The huge thing going for you this season is that there is a clean slate with so many players bad players off the books this summer. Make no mistake the players and the board are your main issue, with so many of the players going that's half the battle and if you replace them with a smattering of genuine quality and a manager who gives them a kick up the behind, then in this league, that might be enough.

Excellent post Bob, don't tell anyone on here but I am a bit of a closet Saints fan, I used to go down the Dell when I lived in Shirley and they had Shearer and Le Tissier playing. What a player he was, Shearer had his good qualities as well

 

[Nick Jansky]

I think NA got an incredibly bad deal. It was always going to take a lot more than 12 months to sort out the absolute car crash, ability, wages & personality wise, that our squad has developed into over many years.

CW smacks of the cheap option who will do as he's told - I wonder what his salary is, compared to NA's? - but he "gets" the club, (as did Micky Adams) so that's ok. Not an inspiring CV though.

Another 3 year deal - I would love to know how much it has cost us to pay off managers & coaching staff over the last 9 years. Hope I'm wrong, but I expect us to be spinning the roulette wheel of desperate short termism once again in a year's time.

 

[Bob Scratchit]

Yeah, as you say, we're coming at this from different angles so not going to substantially agree.

But, just on the "bumbling along" point -

(i) as I say, I reckon that's what most clubs do. Then they get lucky with a manager who's a proper fit for them in their circumstances & situation. It's what Wolves, say, did when they appointed Kenny Jackett - no great change in (or establishment of) philosophy, just the right man, doing the right things, at the right time. It's what Ipswich did with Mick McCarthy after stagnating for quite a few years. Hopefully, Chris Wilder will prove to be our "right fit" in a way that Nigel Adkins certainly wasn't.

(ii) as I said too, I reckon there are the inklings of a strategy for the future being put in place, with a renewed emphasis on youth. It's something that's easy to be cynical about (especially bearing in mind our recent history) & to explain away as a cost-cutting exercise. But, to my mind, & whatever the motivations for it, it is the right way forward. Even so, it depends on having the right manager to make it work.

Here's to Chris Wilder. And to an ongoing club strategy.

I accept you're happy to bumble along. As I said I think a club your size should do more than bumble along so we disagree on that, though it's odd that I seem to have more ambition for your club than you do. Mick McCarthy and Kenny Jackett are not role models to me, though I can see why that would appeal to you the state you're in right now. It's just I would be asking more questions about why we are in that state, why am I clinging on for the stars to align for the Kenny Jackett experience. We obviously have different perceptions of what a modern club should be run like.

Today you hear from McCabe that you will be cutting your cloth this season. Wilder's already had loan moves ruled out by McCabe on account of them being 'costly and not bringing value', i.e McCabe can't sell them if they do well. He's already made it clear that the U-21's will play a prominent role, don't get too attached as if they do well you know they will be off. I think its starting to sound very much like a cost cutting exercise if you ask me, why do you have to suffer that with a club your size? With a fanbase as loyal as yours? If I was a Blades fan I would be sick of McCabe.

 

[PeteBlade]

Jesus! Are all the fucking Adkins luvvies gonna turn into the Clough apologists of last season? Can we not for once forget about all these failed managers and get behind the club.

OR we could actually look at WHY all these managers keep failing and target our frustration at the cause and not the symptoms.

 

[PeteBlade]

Not ran through 6 pages but let me just mention this; for a bloke who thinks psychology has a lot to do with everything, he cocked up big style. His first cock up was not learning we are SHEFFIELD UNITED not just Sheffield. He then did not get to know what we the fans want and concentrated on his footballing philosophy instead of a bit of both.
He then makes statements that ilude to fans not knowing what they are talking about. What kind of disrespectful psychology is that? NA should have realised that although fans can sometimes talk a lot of crap it is disrespectful to those who have been watching football for years. I'm sure there are many who can read the game well that would not be able to get a message over as a Manager.
If he'd have learned about our club he may well have made a better go of it.
WE ARE SHEFFIELD UNITED COYRAWW AARRRH.

If he read only this forum he'd realise that a lot of fans have absolutely no idea what they're talking about.

 

[Sheffsteel]

People attacking McCabe use a back to front argument.

Instead of criticising his decisions, it seems most agree his decisions are valid and worthy at the time.

However as the end result is poor then all of a sudden that means the initial decisions must be poor.

That makes no logical sense.

It's like me taking over SWFC and trying to sabotage them, so I go out and deliberately appoint the worse manager and worse players. But then if that team gained promotion then the logic is that I must be a great chairman with a great business model.

 

[PeteBlade]

People attacking McCabe use a back to front argument.

Instead of criticising his decisions, it seems most agree his decisions are valid and worthy at the time.

However as the end result is poor then all of a sudden that means the initial decisions must be poor.

That makes no logical sense.

It's like me taking over SWFC and trying to sabotage them, so I go out and deliberately appoint the worse manager and worse players. But then if that team gained promotion then the logic is that I must be a great chairman with a great business model.

No they don't.
People often argue that his decisions are awful at the time he makes them.
For example 90% of fans could have told you that appointing Bryan Robson was an awful decision.
Or that selling James Beattie would seriously hamper our chance of promotion.
Ditto Nick Blackman.

The last thing we need is an apologist for McCabe, he's the ONE constant in our decline.

Him and Gary Sinclair.

Unless you're blaming everything on Gary Sinclair?

 

[Barney]

People attacking McCabe use a back to front argument.

Instead of criticising his decisions, it seems most agree his decisions are valid and worthy at the time.

However as the end result is poor then all of a sudden that means the initial decisions must be poor.

That makes no logical sense.

It's like me taking over SWFC and trying to sabotage them, so I go out and deliberately appoint the worse manager and worse players. But then if that team gained promotion then the logic is that I must be a great chairman with a great business model.

Spot on.

 

[Alfreton14Blade]

I accept you're happy to bumble along. As I said I think a club your size should do more than bumble along so we disagree on that, though it's odd that I seem to have more ambition for your club than you do. Mick McCarthy and Kenny Jackett are not role models to me, though I can see why that would appeal to you the state you're in right now. It's just I would be asking more questions about why we are in that state, why am I clinging on for the stars to align for the Kenny Jackett experience. We obviously have different perceptions of what a modern club should be run like.

Today you hear from McCabe that you will be cutting your cloth this season. Wilder's already had loan moves ruled out by McCabe on account of them being 'costly and not bringing value', i.e McCabe can't sell them if they do well. He's already made it clear that the U-21's will play a prominent role, don't get too attached as if they do well you know they will be off. I think its starting to sound very much like a cost cutting exercise if you ask me, why do you have to suffer that with a club your size? With a fanbase as loyal as yours? If I was a Blades fan I would be sick of McCabe.

Er, I'm not happy to bumble along. I just said that that's the reality for most clubs. Your club's meteoric rise is the exception & far from being the rule. In saying that, I'd very much love for us to do what you've done, but without going into administration in the first place. And no, you're not "more ambitious for my club than I am", you're just speaking theoretically from the luxury of an outsider position, rather than having to be realistic about the situation we happen to find ourselves stuck in.

Don't really see why you'd belittle Kenny Jackett's achievements btw - a proven success at Swansea, Millwall & Wolves (in the case of the latter, having done a superb job at a club rapidly turning itself into a basket case).

Of course we've got to cut our cloth. We're on our 6th season in Division Three and counting. No luxury of parachute payments any more, no Championship tv money. We've got to go toe to toe with other Division Three clubs & fight our way out. That's why we're employing Chris Wilder and not Mauricio Pellegrini. We haven't got the luxury of being "a club our size" any more, not to any appreciable degree.

Tbh, I'm sick of being sick of McCabe. No more excuses, we are where we are, & we're reliant now on very good management to get us out of this Division. Like Swansea did it.

 

[CarlMcBlade]

OR we could actually look at WHY all these managers keep failing and target our frustration at the cause and not the symptoms.

Yes but now ain't the time vent our spleen. We have new manager and hopefully a new team will follow. Wilder won't come into this job cold. He probably knows more about what the lane job entails than anyone else out there. If he's willing to pick up this poison chalice, he get my vote.

 

[PeteBlade]

Yes but now ain't the time vent our spleen. We have new manager and hopefully a new team will follow. Wilder won't come into this job cold. He probably knows more about what the lane job entails than anyone else out there. If he's willing to pick up this poison chalice, he get my vote.

But we always have a new manager. If we don't vent out spleen when we have a new manager we'd never do it!

 

[Bob Scratchit]

Er, I'm not happy to bumble along. I just said that that's the reality for most clubs. Your club's meteoric rise is the exception & far from being the rule. In saying that, I'd very much love for us to do what you've done, but without going into administration in the first place. And no, you're not "more ambitious for my club than I am", you're just speaking theoretically from the luxury of an outsider position, rather than having to be realistic about the situation we happen to find ourselves stuck in.

Don't really see why you'd belittle Kenny Jackett's achievements btw - a proven success at Swansea, Millwall & Wolves (in the case of the latter, having done a superb job at a club rapidly turning itself into a basket case).

Of course we've got to cut our cloth. We're on our 6th season in Division Three and counting. No luxury of parachute payments any more, no Championship tv money. We've got to go toe to toe with other Division Three clubs & fight our way out. That's why we're employing Chris Wilder and not Mauricio Pellegrini. We haven't got the luxury of being "a club our size" any more, not to any appreciable degree.

Tbh, I'm sick of being sick of McCabe. No more excuses, we are where we are, & we're reliant now on very good management to get us out of this Division. Like Swansea did it.

I would have preferred we didn't go into Administration, not sure why you seem to think I wanted that! Worst time in our history and as you say, nearly ended up with terrible owners. I shudder at the thought of getting taken over by SISU.

Yes you have to cut your cloth, but what on earth are you doing down there for 6 seasons, I think McCabe is to blame but you are right, it will take a strong manager to sort it as McCabe won't make the changes for long term success throughout the club anytime soon.

Sick of being sick of McCabe explains the emphasis you place on the manager a lot! I can understand that. All the best this season.

 

[Ballinpigpubs13]

Against the sacking ? Hell no.

 

[Alfreton14Blade]

I would have preferred we didn't go into Administration, not sure why you seem to think I wanted that! Worst time in our history and as you say, nearly ended up with terrible owners. I shudder at the thought of getting taken over by SISU.

Yes you have to cut your cloth, but what on earth are you doing down there for 6 seasons, I think McCabe is to blame but you are right, it will take a strong manager to sort it as McCabe won't make the changes for long term success throughout the club anytime soon.

Sick of being sick of McCabe explains the emphasis you place on the manager a lot! I can understand that. All the best this season.

Cheers. Best of luck to you too. Saints are a fine club (regardless of the administration issue).

 

[Lord Bos of Eckington.]

I think NA got an incredibly bad deal. It was always going to take a lot more than 12 months to sort out the absolute car crash, ability, wages & personality wise, that our squad has developed into over many years.

CW smacks of the cheap option who will do as he's told - I wonder what his salary is, compared to NA's? - but he "gets" the club, (as did Micky Adams) so that's ok. Not an inspiring CV though.

Another 3 year deal - I would love to know how much it has cost us to pay off managers & coaching staff over the last 9 years. Hope I'm wrong, but I expect us to be spinning the roulette wheel of desperate short termism once again in a year's time.

Adkins got a good deal at BDTBL . The bad deal is that he got himself the sack . I wouldn't say Wilder was the cheap option with Charlton , Forest and Blackburn being on the radar for his managerial services .

My worry putting all the "he's a blade" shit to one side , whether or not he can handle the pressure and expectations of such a esteemed club. Adkins was unfortunately past his sell by date . Wilder is the main man , united together , and all that .

He knows what the remit is - promotion and I am confident he will deliver with the right players .

UTB

 

[boo radley]

If he read only this forum he'd realise that a lot of fans have absolutely no idea what they're talking about.

I wonder who you include in that, me, you?
In his interview, he probably realised McCabe does not either when it comes to employing the right manager. He probably thought; I can make a killing here because they don't realise I'm not the right person and I don't know what I'm doing these days. Maybe I just dropped lucky in the last jobs but whatever I got right it's gone and I don't know how to do it these days but they really don't recognise that. Still at least a good contract even if I do get the bullet after a year.

 

[PeteBlade]

I wonder who you include in that, me, you?
In his interview, he probably realised McCabe does not either when it comes to employing the right manager. He probably thought; I can make a killing here because they don't realise I'm not the right person and I don't know what I'm doing these days. Maybe I just dropped lucky in the last jobs but whatever I got right it's gone and I don't know how to do it these days but they really don't recognise that. Still at least a good contract even if I do get the bullet after a year.

Me, you, most on here.
In reality we don't know an awful lot but like jumping up and down and getting angry at shit.

 

[alcoblade]

Me, you, most on here.
In reality we don't know an awful lot but like jumping up and down and getting angry at shit.

Exactly this. The only thing certain about a manager is a track record. Employ one and give him time. Forget just about everything else, it's just noise.

Of course, this never happens. The burger flippers know best.


UTB

 

[CarlMcBlade]

But we always have a new manager. If we don't vent out spleen when we have a new manager we'd never do it!

The fans anger was clearly displayed at the Scunny game. But McCabe always deflects the blame towards the manager. Then to satisfy the fans thirst for blood.. He sacks em
McCabe is pretty much fireproof really.
I do applaud the boards swift actions regarding Adkins/Wilder. But McCabe's next big appointment should be a new dynamic CEO, who is both vocal and visible generally keeping all us mugs in the loop.

 

[boo radley]

Me, you, most on here.
In reality we don't know an awful lot but like jumping up and down and getting angry at shit.

So am I to take it that you know shit all then Pete?

 

[PeteBlade]

So am I to take it that you know shit all then Pete?

I know virtually shit all, yes.

 

[zablade]

But McCabe's next big appointment should be a new dynamic CEO, who is both vocal and visible generally keeping all us mugs in the loop.

Jim was vocal and visible , but the first time he was really honest with us after January he was then gagged by the club.