Wow, the pressure of being at a "Big Club".

[alcoblade]

I think your bordering on being abit harsh here fella.

All I suggested was that some decent minded players, although you could argue there isn't many, might take a slight pay cut to play more regular football. Although it might not occur often, I can't see much wrong with that, evidently you can.

No, you didn't. You said;

"2 months is more than enough time to carry out what was required, and he hasn't done it."

I'm pointing out that it's you who's being incredibly harsh, given the real work limitations that Adkins has to deal with.

UTB

 

[Barney]

No, you didn't. You said;

"2 months is more than enough time to carry out what was required, and he hasn't done it."

I'm pointing out that it's you who's being incredibly harsh, given the real work limitations that Adkins has to deal with.

UTB

Other clubs seem to manage it, we might be a shit side but if things are as you say they are, nobody would be buying anyone below championship level unless they are out of contract, and I know for a fact that doesn't happen. So either our club is a massive exception to that or Adkins and the board have made some mistakes already this season.

 

[alcoblade]

Other clubs seem to manage it, we might be a shit side but if things are as you say they are, nobody would be buying anyone below championship level unless they are out of contract, and I know for a fact that doesn't happen. So either our club is a massive exception to that or Adkins and the board have made some mistakes already this season.

OK. Last try (I doubt you're prepared to see this).

We agree that the players need moving on - ergo they aren't good enough for the biggest most resourceful club in the league. The next step is likely downwards, for lower pay.

If you think those changes can be swept through in 2 months, and players "talked into" taking pay cuts, then we live in realities, and there's nowhere to go with this.

More sensible would be for you to accept that you've been a bit rash, and these things actually take a little longer.

UTB

 

[SandyMcBlade]

Maybe we will just have to do what most other teams do and use a few loan signings ?

 

[Barney]

OK. Last try (I doubt you're prepared to see this).

We agree that the players need moving on - ergo they aren't good enough for the biggest most resourceful club in the league. The next step is likely downwards, for lower pay.

If you think those changes can be swept through in 2 months, and players "talked into" taking pay cuts, then we live in realities, and there's nowhere to go with this.

More sensible would be for you to accept that you've been a bit rash, and these things actually take a little longer.

UTB

No we'll have to agree to disagree on this mate sorry.

 

[alcoblade]

No we'll have to agree to disagree on this mate sorry.

60 days it is then, to start a new job, fully assess then completely restructure a team with the right players in the right positions, having convinced your overpaid stars to move on and take a big pay cut.

I think given a little reflection, you'll accept that's utter bollocks. For now, goodnight. .

UTB

 

[Barney]

60 days it is then, to start a new job, fully assess then completely restructure a team with the right players in the right positions, having convinced your overpaid stars to move on and take a big pay cut.

I think given a little reflection, you'll accept that's utter bollocks. For now, goodnight. .

UTB

I knew you'd come up with something like that, it's so predictable, instead of just accepting we disagree.

What about if someone on the board who had a clue what went wrong with the catastrophe of the season before, could get things going before the appointment? A scenario beyond contemplation I know. Into the world of no sales that command a fee below championship for you then, enjoy it in there, tell me what it's like.

 

[metalblade]

Other clubs would give the unwanted player the option of being frozen out and training alone for the season and further damaging his career or accepting a move where if they are on less money we make up the difference as a golden handshake they get first team football and a few years security elsewhere and we save half a wage. Given that choice I'm sure players would soon be out looking for a new club, I mean Billy Blade will have taken a large pay cut to play here. Funny how it only seems to be Sheffield United who can't bring better players in and move on the dross innit.

 

[Barney]

Other clubs would give the unwanted player the option of being frozen out and training alone for the season and further damaging his career or accepting a move where if they are on less money we make up the difference as a golden handshake they get first team football and a few years security elsewhere and we save half a wage. Given that choice I'm sure players would soon be out looking for a new club, I mean Billy Blade will have taken a large pay cut to play here. Funny how it only seems to be Sheffield United who can't bring better players in and move on the dross innit.

Amen to that mate. Brilliant post.

 

[Bartleby]

I'm pretty sure you can sell players without their contract being up, otherwise everyone would leave on free transfers.

they are called contracts because they are contracts - ie contractual, requiring some money to be paid to somebody somewhere if they are broken / terminated early

 

[Barney]

they are called contracts because they are contracts - ie contractual, requiring some money to be paid to somebody somewhere if they are broken / terminated early

FFS not another one. I can't be bothered to go through it all again but what is your point here? I do understand the meaning of the word contractual i'll have you know, and it doesn't stop another club buying the player. If it's the decreased wages thing you're getting at see metal blades post above, explains it better than I can.

 

[Rodders]

FFS not another one. I can't be bothered to go through it all again but what is your point here? I do understand the meaning of the word contractual i'll have you know, and it doesn't stop another club buying the player. If it's the decreased wages thing you're getting at see metal blades post above, explains it better than I can.

So what if no clubs make offers for these players, how do they get sold then?

 

[Barney]

So what if no clubs make offers for these players, how do they get sold then?

They don't. But if we put them up for a very minimal amount, if not practically free for all I care, just to get them off our books i'm sure clubs will come in for them providing they can negotiate the right wages or the situation described by metal above occurs.

 

[Borbokisfreekick]

No, you really can't.

The player has to agree to the deal. If the contract doesn't match or better what they have ( and they won't for the players we want to offload) , then they don't leave.

UTB

we could just pay up their contracts and tell them to bugger off - like we did with Marcus Williams.

Expensive short term, but less damaging long term.

The board have got a massive dilema - stick with the shit we have and not go up, by their mantra, they would then have to sack Adkins, meaning another pay off..

Invest about 1.5 to 2 million pound to replace our central defense, keeper and center midfield.

Spend a little bit less than the above, and cancel/pay up the contracts of the shit.

Either way, if they are serious about promotion, there is still a lot of spending to do. And unfortunately for Adkins he only has 1 year to get us up or he's out of the job and we go through all this again next year.

 

[Bartleby]

FFS not another one. I can't be bothered to go through it all again but what is your point here? I do understand the meaning of the word contractual i'll have you know, and it doesn't stop another club buying the player. If it's the decreased wages thing you're getting at see metal blades post above, explains it better than I can.

My point is that it costs you to terminate early/break a contract, that's all, it didn't seem apparent to me from your post that that you got that. And don't you FFS at me! FFS to you too!!

 

[Barney]

My point is that it costs you to terminate early/break a contract, that's all, it didn't seem apparent to me from your post that that you got that. And don't you FFS at me! FFS to you too!!

Don't worry mate I know how it works.

 

[Bartleby]

Don't worry mate I know how it works.

cool!

 

[grafikhaus]

The pigs manager did it less time than Adkins has had. Cotterill managed it for Bristol City last year in the close season. Wigan have signed 15. No sense of fair play is needed, he and the board should have been ruthless in cutting the dross. All he had to do was watch a lot of our games from the end of last season as part of his 'due diligence'.

Exactly. A manager needs to make an immediate statement of intent or the bus has already departed. I remember a certain team last season (Gillingham) bringing in a new manager (Justin Edinburgh) and they immediately reversed a shocking run by winning their very first game (against, would you believe it? - Sheffield United.) Ditto Paul Sturrock at Yeovil - bad run, new manager, stopped the slide against Sheffield United. I detect a pattern is emerging here.

But don't worry, NA. If it all goes tits up, it'll be the fan's fault.

 

[Lord Bos of Eckington.]

First, we ain't that big, Second, we don't have a barrel of money. Third, get used to it!

We may not have a barrel of money . But , wouldn't it be nice , at this moment in time , to have Woodard and Currie , with Eddie Colquhoun .

Especially Eddie.

UTB

 

[grafikhaus]

We have Clough to blame. That's another story.

No, we have a board who constantly repeat the same managerial recruitment policies ad nauseum.

 

[1980]

I mentioned this when I first joined this forum as an opposition fan.

That relegation to Division 3 usually does us (Millwall) some good from time to time.

We always use it as a springboard. Since I've been a Millwall fan we've got promotion to the top flight, finished in the Championship play-offs & got to a FA Cup final or a FA Cup Semi-Final all within a couple of seasons of getting out of the Third tier with a rebuilt side.

The thing is we have always had that luxury. Because Millwall are a big enough club at this level to attract some of the better players, but not so big that we are weighed down by expectation at the start of every season.

In fact I would guess that we are one of the few sets of fans around that dont have this 'we belong in so and so league' football view. We neither look down on playing Colchester or look up to playing Leeds.

I noticed another thread about looking at what the other clubs have down in the transfer market. For us it simply mentions Steve Morison & Jordan Archer (from Spurs, not Liverpool for the poster's information).

I assume to support the argument that we are looking at either proven quality from a higher level, or at players who must have pedigree due to being on a big clubs' books.

However, this leaves out the signings of Tony Craig from Brentford. A solid defender who knows what Millwall is all about from coming through our academy. And Romeo from Gillingham and Christian Mbua from Brentwood Town - two youngsters with raw potential. But who probably will not feature much.

Not a recent signing, but a player who I think will play an important part in our season is Lee Gregory - a striker from non league.

The point is that without the pressure of being a big club Millwall can steadily rebuild with steady players, exciting youngsters and hungry players from lower down.

Our current team should be in and around the play-offs...that's a hope, rather than expectation though. However, they will get better and when we do eventually go up (will always do) it will be with a team that's grown together and that has the talent to step up (see Sheringham, Cahill, Grabban as examples in past).

Sheffield United dont have that luxury as a big club - so this expectation may be strangling your chances of completely rebuilding from scratch in a positive way.

The poster that posted the thread about other clubs' transfers is barking up the wrong tree Imo - it's not about a scatter gun policy of only getting proven players...it's about carefully and thoughtfully building a team with skill and character and a desire to grow together and do well for a club that's given them an affinity.

 

[mattbianco1]

If George Long starts against Chesterfield it will be almost criminal negligence.

Adkins needs a full fitness assessment of Howard on his desk 9am Tuesday morning, if it says his fitness cannot be relied upon a new goal keeper needs to be at the club Thursday at the latest.

Nigel Adkins will play his get out of jail free card tomorrow. He can drop Long along with many other players. THEN, on Saturday can pick Howard after he played "very well" in midweek.

 

[Bladesince59]

We've lost a game. Manager goes from "Hero to Zero". Some fans making sweeping statements re "Doom and Gloom". One or more even talking about giving us up.

But: Sky Bet still have us as favourites. There are still some 45 games to go.

This is the first time our new manager has seen some of our players not defend set-pieces and players who had impressed him so far. Friendlies arranged before he joined us did not test us in that key area.

Isn't it obvious that the new manager is having a good look at the squad. He needs to give all the players the opportunity to perform and to earn their place in his squad. For some the alternative is unemployment so please don't tell me they don't care.

He has signed two strikers and a wide midfielder to date. Why not defenders? Well he must have judged that the strikers previously at the club were not good enough just now; McNulty, Adams, Higdon, no others don't forget with Done injured, so that is fair enough.

He must have detected that there was some value in our defenders, particularly with the forthcoming return of Kennedy and Brayford in due course. Today he learned a lot and in any case who is to say he is not awaiting the release of a couple of Premier League or Championship players on loan and who he knows very well?

The simple fact is that we have lost 3 points and our manager knows he needs probably 3 defenders before January 31st. I think Basham is one of those defenders, but others prefer him in midfield, that is a prime example of the sort of decision our manager has to make. Another is George Long and I fully agree with him having the opportunity to show the manager what he can do; the lad's whole United career is at stake and he had been OK in pre-season. Added to that Howard's career record and fitness record is modest at best, so it was, and is, a worthy test but now he has started it he has to give him some game time to prove or disprove himself.

Somebody said recently that Adkins is delighted with the quality of the squad he inherited. All of a sudden we all know that is not the case. Adkins tries to spin a positive weave on things but he was critical last night and rightly so. But he is weeks into his tenure here, literally weeks. There's a long way to go, even for this season and certainly beyond.

I think we need 3 defenders (and a goalkeeper) well before January 31st.

 

[BladeFisher]

45 games to go.

sorry.

48 at least (Football League Trophy, League Cup, FA Cup).

 

[Large Mendonca]

I mentioned this when I first joined this forum as an opposition fan.

That relegation to Division 3 usually does us (Millwall) some good from time to time.

We always use it as a springboard. Since I've been a Millwall fan we've got promotion to the top flight, finished in the Championship play-offs & got to a FA Cup final or a FA Cup Semi-Final all within a couple of seasons of getting out of the Third tier with a rebuilt side.

The thing is we have always had that luxury. Because Millwall are a big enough club at this level to attract some of the better players, but not so big that we are weighed down by expectation at the start of every season.

In fact I would guess that we are one of the few sets of fans around that dont have this 'we belong in so and so league' football view. We neither look down on playing Colchester or look up to playing Leeds.

I noticed another thread about looking at what the other clubs have down in the transfer market. For us it simply mentions Steve Morison & Jordan Archer (from Spurs, not Liverpool for the poster's information).

I assume to support the argument that we are looking at either proven quality from a higher level, or at players who must have pedigree due to being on a big clubs' books.

However, this leaves out the signings of Tony Craig from Brentford. A solid defender who knows what Millwall is all about from coming through our academy. And Romeo from Gillingham and Christian Mbua from Brentwood Town - two youngsters with raw potential. But who probably will not feature much.

Not a recent signing, but a player who I think will play an important part in our season is Lee Gregory - a striker from non league.

The point is that without the pressure of being a big club Millwall can steadily rebuild with steady players, exciting youngsters and hungry players from lower down.

Our current team should be in and around the play-offs...that's a hope, rather than expectation though. However, they will get better and when we do eventually go up (will always do) it will be with a team that's grown together and that has the talent to step up (see Sheringham, Cahill, Grabban as examples in past).

Sheffield United dont have that luxury as a big club - so this expectation may be strangling your chances of completely rebuilding from scratch in a positive way.

The poster that posted the thread about other clubs' transfers is barking up the wrong tree Imo - it's not about a scatter gun policy of only getting proven players...it's about carefully and thoughtfully building a team with skill and character and a desire to grow together and do well for a club that's given them an affinity.

A sobering post that matey, especially the part i've highlighted. Regardless of what happens this season, we have to quit the "hire and fire" culture, which is what many have said on here. I was in agreement for replacing Clough with Adkins, although that may cost us another year down here, I have more confidence in Adkins doing better in the Championship (if we ever get there!!).

 

[super_pig]

And unfortunately for Adkins he only has 1 year to get us up or he's out of the job and we go through all this again next year.

not necessarily.. it depends how he goes about his job.. we just want the team to 'try' hard.. if they put in 100 percent and just miss out on promotion then people will have sympathy for his position.. if he starts acting like a grade A p888k like NC then yes the fan pressure will mean he will go

 

[Bartleby]

I hope Adkins can build us a new team.

so do I but it'll take probably longer than this season for a total rebuild and there isn't the patience left in the fans for that, and another season in this league. Also I get the impression a total clear out was maybe not part of the brief given what's been said so far.

So then the pressure will build and the abuse at games will get worse if we don't do well (he already got some at the Hull game that caused him to turn around I gather) , and he'll get the sack. And he'll take his money from his 3 year deal. I was wondering why he keeps banging on and on and on with this "if we can be united" stuff and I then I thought that is his way of preparing for that possibility, as he hands the poisoned chalice back.

 

[SB_90]

the way i see it is that sheff utd is the toughest job in 3rd tier & possibly in the top 5 out of the 92 clubs in terms of pressure (excluding obvious top 5 chelsea arsenal man utd/city & liverpool) along with leeds hull portsmouth middlesbrough. because i was saying at work last season that in a way i feel sorry for clough because any other L1 managers got promoted would be lauded talked about the great job he's done. expectations are so high that there would be muted celebration 2nd place is the bare minimum & 3rd or lower is a failure as clugh found out

 

[Bartleby]

got to a FA Cup final

more than we have done in the last 80 years!

Sheffield United dont have that luxury as a big club - so this expectation may be strangling your chances of completely rebuilding from scratch in a positive way.

you've hit the nail on the head - great post!

 

[Mustela Putorius Furo]

48 at least (Football League Trophy, League Cup, FA Cup).

well you could also add 2 or 3 play-off games into that if you think we'll follow our usual route to faiure