Whiteman

[Bladeinleeds]

Gets the winner tonight....

He's got a terrific scoring record tbf

 

[Grizzly blade]

Right place right time....it's a knack that can't be taught.

 

[s4-blade]

Gerrimback. Giimarun. Whiteman and Brooks in midfield giemallarun.

 

[Bladezz]

Future looks very bright for us at the moment!

 

[derfblade.3]

 

[Ricky]

Future looks very bright for us at the moment!

Only if their contract situations are in order.

It should be high on the priority list.

 

[Blade56]

Whiteman, Blackman are we going for a full Pantone team?




Edit, before anyone points it out I know technically black and white aren't colours.

 

[Blade58]

Whiteman
« on Today at 09:57:10 PM by GazLaz »

Houghton who?? This lad is absolute class. So positive with everything he tries to do.

Logged
mushRTID[/paste:font]

Re: Whiteman
« Reply #1 on Today at 09:58:15 PM by mushRTID »

Hes quality. Him and Rodney are going to boss this league.

 

[Blade58]

"If Whiteman carries on like this I wouldn't be surprised to see the Blunts take him back in January."


"Fingers crossed we try and sign him if in the right position hopefully Sheffield united will be a position to not need him back"


" You never know? He would be a class signing for us."

 

[Ricky]

Someone should let them know they have zero chance of signing him permanently.

If we sell him to anyone it will be someone with a lot more money than Donny and more money than us.

 

[Pinchy]

You never get tired of talking shite do you ?

I never get tired of having a sense of humour. Try it.

 

[Pinchy]

Future looks very bright for us at the moment!

It does indeed. It will also, unfortunately, produce the usual knee-jerk and entirely predictable Bringimbaknow; Gerriminteam responses from the deep-thought regulars.

Of course, by far the better course is for the lad to continue his development, getting regular "game time" (horrible Junior Computer Manager phrase) at Doncaster, exactly as Tufty hoped and intended.

We should be able to get by to the end of the season. We have one or two half-decent midfielders.

 

[mosbolad]

 

[Pinchy]

I believe you may have mentioned that before? The good news is you can rest easy. One of the many functions I so selflessly and altruistically perform on here is to deal with such people appropriately...

 

[FriethBlade]

Don't you think that CW and AK might just have the tiniest inkling about what we need?

For whatever reason that neither you or I are privy to, they have chosen to send him out on loan in L1 to improve him. Given that (apart from a few potentially career destroying minutes under Adkins), all his footy has been played in L2, maybe they want the lad to develop and learn?

Maybe you are right though and they are clueless. Gerrimin and play Brooks from the start too (once he's signed his £20k per week contract). It's the Bladesway.....

Slightly missing the point...one of the reasons Id suggest they chose to send him out on loan is they thought they were signing at least one if not 2 holding midfielders in Leonard and Lenihan.

 

[Pinchy]

Tufty doesn't acknowledge "holding" midfielders. In fact such terminology "does his 'ead in" so he certainly wouldn't entertain any such thoughts. He doesn't allow players to do half a job. Quite right, too.

As for Linehan, he's wanted as a RSCB in any event.

We will sign Lenny in due course; probably Lenny as well. It's not Jim White Day just yet.

 

[I should coco]

Slightly missing the point...one of the reasons Id suggest they chose to send him out on loan is they thought they were signing at least one if not 2 holding midfielders in Leonard and Lenihan.

Putting aside the fact that Lenihan is a centre back, I don't think I 'missed the point'. CW wouldn't send a lad out that he thought he might need, without already having the new player here. The Leonard deal has dragged on for many weeks so it would be silly to assume it will definitely happen.

BW has gone out because CW sees him as not featuring in at least the first half of the season. He was not so much surplus to requirements as just not up to it yet, in CW's view.

Hopefully the loan will improve him further and he will come back a better player. That does not make him a regular Championship starter though.

 

[Fulwood Blade]

Tufty doesn't acknowledge "holding" midfielders. In fact such terminology "does his 'ead in" so he certainly wouldn't entertain any such thoughts. He doesn't allow players to do half a job. Quite right, too.

Indeed he doesn't. CH's should be able to defend and do the job they came into football to do !

Be interesting when CW eventually finds 2 CH's he can trust - we sort of defend with 3 + GK at present. As he had the right players at Northampton and 2 decent CH's for that division, he still employed fullbacks that pushed on. My feeling is he now has these at United with Stevens and Baldock. Lenihan "may" have been one of those 2 capable CH's - perhaps he sees JOC as the other?

For me we have a manager still searching for his ideal formation based around 4 defenders with FB's that push on. It is getting frightening and exciting as to where CW & AK are taking us.

UTB

 

[FinchleyBlade]

Got a Mansfield season ticket holder as a friend and he absolutely raves about this lad, was gutted they couldnt get him back.

Sounds like a better prospect than Brooks from all I've heard and seen.

 

[JohnDenver]

Got a Mansfield season ticket holder as a friend and he absolutely raves about this lad, was gutted they couldnt get him back.

Sounds like a better prospect than Brooks from all I've heard and seen.

Must be worth £20m then.

 

[1danewhitehouse]

Apart from league cup cameos you won't see much of Brooks before Christmas. It would have been better letting him play at Chesterfield rather than sitting on the bench here. That's if you follow the same logic for justifying Whiteman staying at Doncaster.

I think part of the reasoning for keeping Brooks was also that the Ricky Holmes and Jay O Shea deals fell through meaning Wilder thought we needed a bit more there. Maybe Wilder is still confident of landing Leonard or Lenihan to play that role? If not, he might regret loaning Ben out and we might see him back in January.


As for how much we see of him, I think it depends on how he does with the League cup cameos. Maybe he can force Wilder's hand? I think he might get runouts when we're chasing a goal in a tight game as he can offer something different. Probably not when we're defending a league like last Saturday though.

 

[1danewhitehouse]

No, it doesn't 'prove' it.



So because two exceptional young players did well 8-9 years ago, we should immediately blood all young players just in case they might be good enough?

FFS, you are going to make me sound like Pinchy here; "Gerramin, gerramallin"

I think you’ve gone a bit Pinchy there in terms of the straw men he likes to build. I don’t think anybody has suggested we do this with all young players. Just the ones who have been highly impressive both in our U23s and whilst out on loan. I’m not making a case in support of either stance but there is a big difference in believe Ben Whiteman should get a crack at our first team and “giveemallarun”. Personally, I’m pretty relaxed about the situation. If he comes back in Jan, I think he gives us more depth of a decent calibre. If not and he’s playing regularly for Donny and doing well, I’m OK with that too.

 

[1danewhitehouse]

Yes. Maybe Tufty and his team have watched them carefully, compared them with Whiteman (who they know well and will have watched regularly whilst out on loan) and decided they have more to offer?

Controversial, I know.

An entirely valid point and we can’t pretend to have more information upon which to base our opinions than the management. But, on the flip side, we have 3 players for 2 positions. I would be more than comfortable having a young lad that has excelled in League 2 and at U23 level and made a promising start at Donny as a 4th back up option. But whether that’s best for his development is debatable. We also don’t know how far the budget stretches. If we can afford to have 4 good quality senior pros for the 2 CM positions then fine, leave the lad out on loan to continue to develop.

 

[1danewhitehouse]

Incidentally at what age do you cease to be "one for the future" and become too old to improve ?

I reckon there’s a scale and it varies somewhat from player to player but broad brush terms I would say.


18-20- need to be knocking on the door of the first team squad.


21-23- need to be establishing ones self as a first team regular.


24-27- probably the final stage of development where, hopefully first team regulars become really key players and sometimes move on to bigger and better things. Thinking of players like Fleck, O Connell or for the “bigger and better things” people like Stevens, Baldock etc. I’d say most players are at, or very close to their peak by 27-28 (with the odd exception of course)

 

[I should coco]

I think you’ve gone a bit Pinchy there in terms of the straw men

Hmmmm, I see what you are saying. I'd exaggerated for effect but please forgive me as I don't to be accused of having straw on my hands.

there is a big difference in believe Ben Whiteman should get a crack at our first team and “giveemallarun”.

There is, but this assumption that any decent prospect should play is a bit insulting to CW IMHO. He knows what he has and has decided not to risk Whitmeman for whatever reason. Obviously I want Whitmeman to do well an be playing for us in the Prem in a few years, but to suggest he must start now, implies we know better than CW. We don't!

If he comes back in Jan, I think he gives us more depth of a decent calibre. If not and he’s playing regularly for Donny and doing well, I’m OK with that too.

I can't really see it. If we are doing really well then CW will want a better player to push us on to the Prem. If we are middling, then BW is better at Donny getting games rather than warming our bench. Only if things go tits up (e.g. injuries) then he might be recalled, or god forbid we are struggling, and then that is probably not the right time for a youngster.

 

[coolhandluke]

I think you’ve gone a bit Pinchy there in terms of the straw men he likes to build. I don’t think anybody has suggested we do this with all young players. Just the ones who have been highly impressive both in our U23s and whilst out on loan. I’m not making a case in support of either stance but there is a big difference in believe Ben Whiteman should get a crack at our first team and “giveemallarun”. Personally, I’m pretty relaxed about the situation. If he comes back in Jan, I think he gives us more depth of a decent calibre. If not and he’s playing regularly for Donny and doing well, I’m OK with that too.

Funny thing opinions . It's exactly at the point that you're ok that I have a problem ( maybe I'm just an argumentative twat )

Whiteman is 21 and for me this is the age where we as a club should be definitively making our intentions known about individual players . Do we bring him back in January to challenge for a place in the starting 11 because we think he's good enough . Or do we put him on the transfer list and start listening to offers for him because we don't think he's good enough ? Only in extenuating circumstances should be be extending his loan at that level untill the end of the season because the jury is still very much out on whether or not he'll make it at our level .

We need a clear and unambiguous blueprint set out for all of our Academy graduates and one that's in the best interests of the Club and the player . We can't just extend their loans indefinitely , decisions need to be made .

 

[1danewhitehouse]

Funny thing opinions . It's exactly at the point that you're ok that I have a problem ( maybe I'm just an argumentative twat )

Whiteman is 21 and for me this is the age where we as a club should be definitively making our intentions known about individual players . Do we bring him back in January to challenge for a place in the starting 11 because we think he's good enough . Or do we put him on the transfer list and start listening to offers for him because we don't think he's good enough ? Only in extenuating circumstances should be be extending his loan at that level untill the end of the season because the jury is still very much out on whether or not he'll make it at our level .

We need a clear and unambiguous blueprint set out for all of our Academy graduates and one that's in the best interests of the Club and the player . We can't just extend their loans indefinitely , decisions need to be made .

I agree a decision will have to be made but don't think it's the end of the world if that decision comes next summer. Some mature a little later than others. Matt Lowton for example. If he came back in Jan, I suspect he'd be an OK squad player at worst. But the remainder of the season with Donny might see him improve on that status a little.

 

[adebo]

I wonder if wilder might be at donny vs Southend to do a comparison.

 

[1danewhitehouse]

Tufty doesn't acknowledge "holding" midfielders. In fact such terminology "does his 'ead in" so he certainly wouldn't entertain any such thoughts. He doesn't allow players to do half a job. Quite right, too.

As for Linehan, he's wanted as a RSCB in any event.

We will sign Lenny in due course; probably Lenny as well. It's not Jim White Day just yet.

We’re getting back into unnecessarily labouring a point on semantics that’s been done. Whether you refer to them as holding/ defensive or central midfield players, we’re talking about the Fleck/Coutts role as opposed to the Duffy/Carruthers role. We currently have Fleck, Coutts and Lundstram for those 2 positions. Tufty wants another. Leonard would be a natural fit. Lenihan can by all accounts play there (Blackburn fan recently commenting that he’s better as a defensive midfielder than CB- possibly an issue that divides opinion much like our own Bashambauer) but he may prefer him at CB in which event Basham would be freed up for the midfield role if required. So signing either of those two would go a long way to covering us in that position.

 

[BushBlade]

We’re getting back into unnecessarily labouring a point on semantics that’s been done. Whether you refer to them as holding/ defensive or central midfield players, we’re talking about the Fleck/Coutts role as opposed to the Duffy/Carruthers role. We currently have Fleck, Coutts and Lundstram for those 2 positions. Tufty wants another. Leonard would be a natural fit. Lenihan can by all accounts play there (Blackburn fan recently commenting that he’s better as a defensive midfielder than CB- possibly an issue that divides opinion much like our own Bashambauer) but he may prefer him at CB in which event Basham would be freed up for the midfield role if required. So signing either of those two would go a long way to covering us in that position.

Notwithstanding semantics, I think our two CM's are expected to be more rounded, box to box really. Both are expected to defend and both to get forward into dangerous areas. Neither 'sit' in a Makalele style, because we play three at the back. I believe (from what my mate from Southend has said) Leonard is that type, strong in the tackle but with a good passing range and a shot on him. I know little about Lenihan but assume he'll be cover for the centre of defence and an option in CM when we want to shut up shop.