We are not having a Director of Football?

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CaptainMorgans said:
I think it's wrong to give the others the benefit of the doubt.
They didn't come good when they needed them to & now we're relegated.

Oli McBurnie in particular has been a huge let down. He shows once every 5 or 6 games that he can be decent at the level, then he regresses into a non-entity. £20m we paid, & I don't think he's scored any more than a handful of goals.

Mousset? I don't even know where to begin on that one.
Although, at least he did have a purple patch. However brief. And that purple patch directly contributed to a decent points return. What's happened either side of that...
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I excluded Moose due to that purple patch. He possibly justified his fee over those few games with the points gained. We should have cashed in last season realistically
 
Millhousesblade1889 said:
I excluded Moose due to that purple patch. He possibly justified his fee over those few games with the points gained. We should have cashed in last season realistically
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He's the only one I could make any sort of argument for. But he's been absolutely diabolical outside of that run of games. Completely unprofessional. I can't wait to see the back of him.
 
Hamburg Blade said:
This is worth re-quoting:



I don't know the inner workings of SUFC but the above seems to ring true with what we know.

For those who aren't interested in doing anything other than heap every ounce of failure of the signings on Wilder regardless, consider this - I'll give you a tenner and send you in to Harrod's, if you don't come out with a canteen of silver plated cutlery from Carr's, is that your fault or mine? If your answer is "Wilder was given a small fortune" then you don't know how much Harrod's charges for its cutlery. If your answer is "the streets of France are paved with cheap but extremely fine quality cutlery" then you need a dose of realism and fast.
People need to start applying some balance to the signings situation, Wilder is not blameless, but nor is he exclusively at fault. Some of the expectation of what he was supposed to have done is beyond ridiculous.
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Ok
So there's no such thing as a good footballer that is reasonably priced.

Except we know there is

Many clubs find them
One doesn't
 
Wilder said he couldn’t / wasn’t prepared to manage under a director of football (DOF)

In the last 24 hours the club have (reportedly) said it’s their intention not to appoint a DOF.

Wilder said that that the club weren’t sticking to its plan of keeping the current team together + adding a couple of loans for next season.

In the last 24 hours the club have (reportedly) said it won’t sell the best players (unless it’s a hard to refuse offer)

Wilder said that the owners weren’t prepared to upgrade the training facilities & had no money to repare the hole in the roof.

In the last 24 hours the club have (reportedly) claimed they will be upgrading said training facility.

Someone not telling the truth
 
Deaneandagana said:
Wilder said he couldn’t / wasn’t prepared to manage under a director of football (DOF)

In the last 24 hours the club have (reportedly) said it’s their intention not to appoint a DOF.

Wilder said that that the club weren’t sticking to its plan of keeping the current team together + adding a couple of loans for next season.

In the last 24 hours the club have (reportedly) said it won’t sell the best players (unless it’s a hard to refuse offer)

Wilder said that the owners weren’t prepared to upgrade the training facilities & had no money to repare the hole in the roof.

In the last 24 hours the club have (reportedly) claimed they will be upgrading said training facility.

Someone not telling the truth
Click to expand...
This was always the case. They even announced it last season before covid hit.
 
Deaneandagana said:
Wilder said he couldn’t / wasn’t prepared to manage under a director of football (DOF)

In the last 24 hours the club have (reportedly) said it’s their intention not to appoint a DOF.

Wilder said that that the club weren’t sticking to its plan of keeping the current team together + adding a couple of loans for next season.

In the last 24 hours the club have (reportedly) said it won’t sell the best players (unless it’s a hard to refuse offer)

Wilder said that the owners weren’t prepared to upgrade the training facilities & had no money to repare the hole in the roof.

In the last 24 hours the club have (reportedly) claimed they will be upgrading said training facility.

Someone not telling the truth
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I knew someone would get there in the end
 
Prince did say on skysports before that talk is cheap so someones telling porkies we will find out soon enough
 
Hamburg Blade said:
This is worth re-quoting:
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Why is it worth requoting? Didn't see the original post, but what makes it any more reliable than me explaining that ACTUALLY all transfers are decided by sticking pictures of all potential transfer targets onto the backs of ferrets then racing them around the Platinum Suite to decide who to buy?
 

Cassius Kray said:
Why is it worth requoting? Didn't see the original post, but what makes it any more reliable than me explaining that ACTUALLY all transfers are decided by sticking pictures of all potential transfer targets onto the backs of ferrets then racing them around the Platinum Suite to decide who to buy?
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Now you're being silly.

It's Weasels #ITK
 
Good job it wasn't mink in the Platinum. A real corona-no-no.
 
Deaneandagana said:



Ok what’s it all about, even more confusing
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You and I know it as ‘media spin’ as the board want to influence public opinion back in their favour. I, for one, don’t believe a word of it and will make 3 predictions;

1. Berge 100% will be sold.
2. The manager, 100%, will not decide which players come and go. Van Winckel will decide as the Beerschot model.
3. The new facilities will only be funded if we get promoted back to PL.

And, of course, all the above will be achieved without the board breaking any of their promises as they will spin:

1. We had to sell as the price in this economic climate is too good to turn down
2. No official DOF role exists.
3. We still remain committed to delivering the new facilities (with no timeline in place)

Our owner worked for the Saudi Government and I don’t think I am exaggerating the point when I say the Saudi Government are one of the most highly proficient executors of delivering propaganda/spin in the developed world. What one says is very different to what one does.
 
JJBlade said:
Ok
So there's no such thing as a good footballer that is reasonably priced.

Except we know there is

Many clubs find them
One doesn't
Click to expand...
There are reasonably good footballers that are priced at a mid-range for the PL. The good footballers get bought by the top half clubs. If you find one at a reasonable price and keep him for a couple of years, you've done well.
The other clubs are fishing in the pond that has the reasonably good players who are good enough to avoid relegation. Unfortunately they all believe they are superstars going to play in the PL and want high wages, but that's how it is.
We were fishing in that pond but whenever we hooked a player, another club came and took him off us, so what we were looking for were reasonably good players who were good enough to avoid relegation that no one else wanted. They are around, clubs do find them, but they are hard to find and you often don't know until he's signed and played a few games.
I don't think we are completely alone in that scenario, but our wage policy seems to have been a major handicap. I think it was a mistake by the club overall, I'm not sure who decided on the policy, and I understand that we're not rolling in cash, but my point is that that is the situation we found ourselves in and it meant it was always going to be difficult to strengthen. We needed the core of the team to carry on performing above their level whilst we slowly found players that were good enough and could fit in.
However, this is all too complicated and nuanced, in fact I'm sure that what I've said is way too simplified, so people would rather just blame Wilder for crap signings and be glad he's buggered off.
 
Cassius Kray said:
Why is it worth requoting? Didn't see the original post, but what makes it any more reliable than me explaining that ACTUALLY all transfers are decided by sticking pictures of all potential transfer targets onto the backs of ferrets then racing them around the Platinum Suite to decide who to buy?
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Believe that if you want. Or believe that Wilder had complete control over signings, the board don't have a say, they just gave him a budget and said, "We'll sign off on whoever you can get for the money".
 
JJBlade said:
Ok
So there's no such thing as a good footballer that is reasonably priced.

Except we know there is

Many clubs find them
One doesn't
Click to expand...
Wilder has found loads of players cheap and found a tune out of them. Overall he's in credit. The players He's Signed or resurected is endless

Moore
K Freeman
Egan
Basham
J Wright
Baldock
JOC
Stevens
Norwood
Lafferty
Fleck
Coutts
Lundstram
Duffy
Sharp
Clarke
Mousett

All those players have had the best moments of their careers under Wilder. It's an incredible record
 
Hamburg Blade said:
There are reasonably good footballers that are priced at a mid-range for the PL. The good footballers get bought by the top half clubs. If you find one at a reasonable price and keep him for a couple of years, you've done well.
The other clubs are fishing in the pond that has the reasonably good players who are good enough to avoid relegation. Unfortunately they all believe they are superstars going to play in the PL and want high wages, but that's how it is.
We were fishing in that pond but whenever we hooked a player, another club came and took him off us, so what we were looking for were reasonably good players who were good enough to avoid relegation that no one else wanted. They are around, clubs do find them, but they are hard to find and you often don't know until he's signed and played a few games.
I don't think we are completely alone in that scenario, but our wage policy seems to have been a major handicap. I think it was a mistake by the club overall, I'm not sure who decided on the policy, and I understand that we're not rolling in cash, but my point is that that is the situation we found ourselves in and it meant it was always going to be difficult to strengthen. We needed the core of the team to carry on performing above their level whilst we slowly found players that were good enough and could fit in.
However, this is all too complicated and nuanced, in fact I'm sure that what I've said is way too simplified, so people would rather just blame Wilder for crap signings and be glad he's buggered off.
Click to expand...

What I mean is the players that Wilder was allegedly complaining about missing out on have all come from Championship clubs.

Add to that Maupay last season

These players do exist, even Championship clubs find them
 
Millhousesblade1889 said:
Wilder's rubbish premiership signings:

Max Lowe
Oliver Burke
Ravel Morrison
Jack Rodwell
Jack Robinson
Callum Robinson
Panagiotis Retsos
Richairo Zivkovic

I'll give McBurnie, Brewster, Ramsdale, Freeman and Moose the benefit of the doubt they could come good.

Wilder was a great wheeler dealer in the lower leagues and still an extremely good coach/ man manager but he was terrible with money to spend. Then just blamed the board when everything went wrong on the pitch, we created absolutely nothing this season.
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Your list hardly represents "money to spend" imo. Certainly not at that level. Slight argument for C Robinson.
 
JJBlade said:
What I mean is the players that Wilder was allegedly complaining about missing out on have all come from Championship clubs.

Add to that Maupay last season

These players do exist, even Championship clubs find them
Click to expand...
They exist but you still have to be able to afford them. My analogy with Harrod's was to point out that if you don't have the money for them, it's not the fault of the person you've sent in to buy them if he comes back empty handed. We were fishing in the lesser of the PL quality ponds but even so were always going to be out-bid if someone else wanted him. We don't have an extensive scouting network either - blame who you want for that - but even if we did, everybody knows that when a PL club comes sniffing, the price rockets, pound signs appear in the player's eyes and agents try and start a bidding war.
This idea that it was a piece of piss to bring in top class players, particularly foreign players who are cheap as chips, and it was all Wilder's fault for not doing so, is nonsense.
 
Millhousesblade1889 said:
Wilder's rubbish premiership signings:

Max Lowe
Oliver Burke
Ravel Morrison
Jack Rodwell
Jack Robinson
Callum Robinson
Panagiotis Retsos
Richairo Zivkovic

I'll give McBurnie, Brewster, Ramsdale, Freeman and Moose the benefit of the doubt they could come good.

Wilder was a great wheeler dealer in the lower leagues and still an extremely good coach/ man manager but he was terrible with money to spend. Then just blamed the board when everything went wrong on the pitch, we created absolutely nothing this season.
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Harsh on Lowe.
Moose - no benefit from me - he has played 60 odd games for Bournemouth and 40 odd for us now - he is very much the "modern" footballer. When he can be arsed, he looks great, when he cannot be he is just interested in spending money and driving (and crashing) his Lambo.
 
Hamburg Blade said:
There are reasonably good footballers that are priced at a mid-range for the PL. The good footballers get bought by the top half clubs. If you find one at a reasonable price and keep him for a couple of years, you've done well.
The other clubs are fishing in the pond that has the reasonably good players who are good enough to avoid relegation. Unfortunately they all believe they are superstars going to play in the PL and want high wages, but that's how it is.
We were fishing in that pond but whenever we hooked a player, another club came and took him off us, so what we were looking for were reasonably good players who were good enough to avoid relegation that no one else wanted. They are around, clubs do find them, but they are hard to find and you often don't know until he's signed and played a few games.
I don't think we are completely alone in that scenario, but our wage policy seems to have been a major handicap. I think it was a mistake by the club overall, I'm not sure who decided on the policy, and I understand that we're not rolling in cash, but my point is that that is the situation we found ourselves in and it meant it was always going to be difficult to strengthen. We needed the core of the team to carry on performing above their level whilst we slowly found players that were good enough and could fit in.
However, this is all too complicated and nuanced, in fact I'm sure that what I've said is way too simplified, so people would rather just blame Wilder for crap signings and be glad he's buggered off.
Click to expand...
The other option would have been to change the style of football to something more akin to Burnley. More direct where you sign the unfashionable head it and kick it type defenders instead of trying to play out from the back. You look at Brighton, who’ve spent a fair amount and whilst they play attractive football, they’re still in a relegation battle. We kind of ended up doing that once teams started to press us properly from the front but we don’t really have the players to make it work.
 
Deaneandagana said:
Guess we’ll never know as 1 party is now subject to a NDA.
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Not unless the Prince comes through with these promises.

In which case...

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